Chamakh Hopes As Arsenal Seek To Capitalise On Financial Folly

Can you feel the relief, the anticipation? A proper football match takes place this afternoon (or tonight depending on your timezone, might even be the morning for all I know) and no, I don’t care that it is a friendly since it signals that the season is upon us. Almost. The tour party mixed youth and experience so you would expect the starting – and finishing – XI to reflect that. Off the pitch, the reaction is almost a no-win situation for Arsenal. Handsome victory? Meh, expected against relatively poor opposition. Anything less will bring forth a microscopic and forensic analysis of the failings, fuelling more criticism of the lack of transfer activity this week.

One player missing is punk legend Jimmy van Pursey. He continues to teach the 1970s anthems to the kids, he’s down with them, drawing on his own working class struggle against The Man. Hoping to pull his family clear of the poverty stricken life that fate has dealt them is not proving to be easy, the Oil City Sheikhs are closing the wallet until some of the freeloaders at City are removed from the wage bill.

Fair play to Emmanuel Adebayor as he refuses to buckle; it lays bare the folly of a spendthrift squad-building policy with the real danger for the club that they will be left with a dozen cases of Winstone Bogarde, players who feel the wealth offered by their current contracts exceeds the lure of playing every week for a lesser salary.

One player hoping that current pacesetters Juventus will squeeze some more money from the boot of the rusting Fiat 125 in the car park is Marouane Chamakh,


Yes. If I am staying here with Arsenal, I will do my best for the team and give the maximum.

That’s my boy, the attitude is right. Although I am not too sure whether his hookah pipe has something a tad illicit in it as his reality perspective seemed to dip a little as the conversation went on,

Last season was difficult. We were playing with just one striker and that striker was the best player in Europe. There was not a lot I could do. I was upset because thought I could have played more but football is like that. Sometimes you do not have a chance. I hope this season I will play more than last. I have not spoken with the manager but I will soon.


In the first six months after signing I had lots of games but after that I only played a few. Now I hope this season will be good for me and the club.


Yes, I need more confidence. But to be confident I need to play more. I am determined to stay.

It is something of a chicken and egg situation. Arsène saw that Chamakh’s confidence had gone but in order to play, Chamakh needs to be ready and able to offer an alternative goalscoring solution. His solitary goal last season came at Blackburn, his first since his hat-trick against Orient in the FA Cup. Those are damning statistics.

With the additions of Podolski and Giroud, I would suggest that the chances of him playing are reducing further. Whilst the German is more used on the flanks, he has the ability to play centrally and I suspect he is likely to be ahead of Chamakh in that pecking order. It is far from certain whether the public statements reflect his private thoughts; I doubt that they do, his self-awareness seems to be more acute than that. In terms of maintaining squad harmony, the Moroccan has shown himself to more astute than former Arsenal captain, Robin Rotten – he’s moved from Sham 69 to the reformed Pistols for £20 and a signed Sid Vicious handwritten bass chord tab of No-one Is Innocent

Elsewhere, questions remain about Arsène’s involvement in the club’s transfer policy remain with a player he knows nothing about – Santi Carzola – once more heavily linked with a move to Arsenal. Curiously enough, it all ties in rather nicely with the ongoing financial woes of oil-rich Malaga who now have until July 31st to settle their debts with Villarreal or face a ban on all transfers. The monetary issues of the Spanish nation will not be solved by all Spanish clubs paying their tax bills but given the level of indebtedness reflected in Barcelona’s latest accounts, it might help along the way?

Jack Wilshere‘s close allies are optimistic – perhaps overly so – that he will be back sooner than Arsène’s observations earlier this week and to be honest, I wonder if JW has been at the JD to believe he might be back in August / September. He might be back in full training but surely the club will hesitate to bring him back into action that soon, erring on the side of caution with a stress fracture must be the right course of action. In any case, someone has to keep Tomas Rosicky company in the medical room.

’til Tomorrow.

Posted on July 24, 2012, in Arsenal, Football, Premier League, Soccer, Transfer Gossip and tagged , , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 406 Comments.

  1. Who is the author?

  2. I love the way people read so much into pre season friendlies. As you suggest YW, one slip at the back and ‘what was the point of appointing Steve Bould’? Sack the board etc. One hat trick and we’ve got the greatest striker the world has ever seen. The reality? These are fun and diverting.
    I prefer to revel in any positive and rationalise away any negative, but then I’m a fan so of course I would do that – who could call themselves a fan and do otherwise? For instance the first touch Chamack showed to create his chance at St Mary’s the other day was so sublime that I’ve decided we have a ready made replacement for RVP should we decide to sell him.

  3. Limestonegunner

    Reposting from yesterday’s post:
    I’d say Bayern is a good example. Sustainable, high commercial revenue, lower ticket prices from their new stadium, and a new improved tv deal for the Bundesliga. They attract some of the best players in the world and pay them a competitive wage on revenues quite similar to our own. They do this by having an unequal wage scale that included a number of talented younger players like Alaba, Badstuber, Muller, and now Shaqiri. In the CL final or semifinals frequently the last several years and perennial league winners, apart from the last two seasons. There are differences between our league circumstances but their performance in Europe is telling. They are really competing and they pay their best players big big wages.

    How about Juventus as second example? They are back and undefeated league winners with a new stadium. They are the ones reportedly offering RvP 190K per week plus a 19 million euro transfer fee for a player in his final year–this after their undefeated season! They ate going for it in Europe. They are run now in a sustainable way. Lots of solid players on reasonable wages but some top class stars bought in and paid handsomely like Pirlo from Milan and perhaps our own RvP.

    So those are two examples of clubs in Germany and Italy that are succeeding, sustainable and paying their best players competitively high wages above Arsenal’s scale to keep or recruit top players.

  4. LK signed long term contract??

  5. So no Rosicky and Jack Wilshere till January then ?? Suddenly the midfield doesn’t look so creative anymore

  6. What the fuck is a Sham69? Apart from that….

  7. it’s on the official now. Damn happy about it!

  8. arsenalandrew

    So here we are on the cusp of August and RvP is NGY – Not Gone Yet.

    Strange in some ways.

    Had Citeh been tapping him up back in January(?) as has been suggested round these parts, then you’d assume they would have had all their ducks in a row come July so that a swift swoop for the newly emerged antichrist would have taken all of us by surprise.

    Strange in other ways.

    It’s been further suggested that Citeh apparently ‘have’ to offload (Tevez, Adebayor?) before they can buy thanks to FFP. Is this the same FFP I keep reading that has no teeth and won’t make an iota of difference to the game? And yet it suddenly appears capable of making Mankini choke on his pasta.

    Steve Strange days indeed. (Sorry, Frank).

  9. Chamakh staying.I would rather keep Bendtner

  10. So the club says to Kozzer, ‘how would you like a new contract to hang about the place till you hit 30?” The Kos says, “sure thing, do up the paperwork and get back to me” – Ivan slides into the next seat to Kos on the plane to KL with his briefcase in tow – “sign here please Mr K” – Kos takes a look “man thats a sweet deal” ~signs on dotted line.


  11. arsenalandrew

    Evil – is this the good news Ivan was foretelling a few weeks ago?

    That sounds almost flippant doesn’t it but it IS great news!

  12. riproarringred

    Sham 69 is a punk band who took their name from some graffiti daubed.

    The band were from Walton & Hersham,

  13. Andrew – it would be good enough for me if it was.

  14. Sham 69 is actually a false sexual act, a pretence at mutual oral stimulation of the sexual organs. It remains unclear as to why two people should decide simultaneously to pretend to stimulate one another in this way.
    I love ‘Call My Bluff’ who’s next? Frank Muir?

  15. i doubt its FFP arsenalandrew but rather the 25 man squad rule

    Santi Corzola heavily linked this morning – AA23 replacement>?

  16. @Martin 9:50am
    Rather Bendtner than Chamakh? Bendtner’s got a problem between the ears – thinks he’s so good the team should be built around HIM. But his stint at Sunderland showed he’s got talent but not enough to make it worth having him piss off the rest of the squad.
    Sell him now.

  17. Limestonegunner

    Guardian says we’ve agreed terms with Cazorla. As far as I understand it, the problem is that Malaga is quite disorganized and in financial trouble since their director died in the spring and the Qatari owner hadn’t sent money and doesn’t serm to be paying attention to it. Ramadan has just started and things tend to slow down during this period. Does Arsenal even have anyone to negotiate with?
    But maybe this will come through which would be really great. Bravo Arsenal!

    Great news on Koscielny–excellent!

  18. That would make more sense, Deise. Still surprising that Citeh haven’t got themselves sorted out by now; just imagine if they lose Robin to Juventus – or worse, Arsenal!!!

    I’m DELIGHTED Kos has re-signed – for me, one of the very best defenders in Europe. Seriously.

  19. Thought it was Super Nic who got the hat trick against Orient?

  20. It is prudent not to rush either way on RvP. More interesting deals come about late in the window. And maybe, just maybe, he and Arsenal are in fact still talking about talking and not doing anything rash. AW: Well Robin we got 3 offers and frankly cannot accept any of them, the best is an insult to “the best player in europe”. Can your people talk to their people and keep us posted? Or make me an offer Robin.
    RvP: Huh?

  21. LSG – if that’s really true about the Qatari owner not sending money then that would be a somewhat prescient warning to the other oil-based clubs dotted around.

    What would happen to the Little Mancs if their Sheik lost interest one day and forgot to post the cheque? Or COULDN’T send the weekly food parcel.

    After all, it’s not as if the Middle East is in any way an unstable part of the world …

  22. LSG,

    We can’t compare AFC to Munich or Juventus. One club has no deomestic rival worthy of the name. Oh, Dortmund have been a ‘Big’ team since Paul Lambert was playing for them, but they still a much, much, smaller club.
    Juve? Oh boy where to begin. I’ll try to keep it short. The Glaswedgie Rangers of the Serie A are still lucky to be a club. I guess, when you spend your time arguing over whether past titles are legit, that anything is possible. If RVP is a Goner, I would laugh and laugh if AFC flogged him to the Old Lady.


    Football was fucked a long time ago. I gave up carting about the Contractors the day Freddie L left and said that West Ham would finish above AFC because they were spending some funting moolah! Regardless of the mystery injury (only diagnosed when he went to play Soccer) which ruined his form, the poor lad probably felt obliged to make such a stoopid statement because his new employers were quite clearly insane. Or fast on their way to bankruptcy. Or making money disappear. Magic. That’s what it was! Freddie was befuddled.

  23. Did Cazorla play as a LB for Spain at one time or am I completely wrong?

  24. Oh I see….. Just coincidence that 1969 happened to be a vintage year for Babycham.

  25. Limestonegunner

    AA, some mischievous thoughts there!

  26. I am getting a bit excited about Cazorla — and I usually avoid transfer gossip and all that like it’s the plague. But Cazorla seems to tick all the boxes, has had consistent goal production and is very flexible (can play across midfield and even had some games at defensive/central mid last season). Furthermore, he seems to have his head screwed on the right way round and the right morals. He refused Madrid in 2008 when they wanted to buy him. How many players would’ve done that?

    All in all, if we get Cazorla and no one of our major players departs, I feel that the squad is set for the season.

  27. I can still see RvP playing for us next season – I know I’m now in a minority of one btw, before you all rush to the slaughter!

    But his age and injury record might not make him quite as desirable as he would ideally want. He still might find his best offer and options end up being with our club.

    We still don’t have a clue as to what his website update actually meant.

    To me, AFC currently look like one of the most ambitious clubs on the planet. Maybe the reality check RvP could be getting these days may help him see things in a similar way.

    Arsene playing hardball with him will either net us an unexpectedly high transfer windfall way beyond his true valuation (based on age/injury record) OR the retention of one of the world’s best players.

    Fascinating times; I only see us doing well out of this, one way or the other.

  28. Speaking of 69…any bloke who can get Brigitte Bardot to sing this has got to be the coolest geezer on the planet. This is entirely about BB you understand and is no way a reference to the Gainsbourg One who is even now incarcerated in the dungeons of YW Towers…no way at all.

  29. @AA
    Agreed. I don’t think we will be bullied into settling for less than what we see as Robin’s true worth. So either it’s lots and lots of money or he stays for another year, which will be important for the two new strikers to get time to settle in. Presently, it’s all win-win as far as I can tell.

  30. consolsbob – i read that – but havent we just recently signed up with another telco company – airtel or something? Maybe thats another factor?

  31. I think that that is entirely possible, arsenalandrew. Make that two. Changed my mind again.

  32. That’s interesting Bob; I wonder if a new sponsorship deal is Ivan’s exciting news?!!

    Someone like BT, maybe?

  33. Hooray – welcome back Frank!!!

  34. Limestonegunner

    Find, one can always find differences because every situation is unique, and in the discussion comparisons were asked for. Materially on the relevant point of wages and revenues, the two clubs I offered are good and relevant examples. Competitively the leagues are different but they both compete for players and have to do so by paying wages in the same market as we do. Also of interest is the European record since that competition transcends the individual league situation. It will be interesting to see how Juventus do in Europe next year for that reason. That’s why they are going after a top striker and offering high wages and a sizable fee to get him. Personally, if we have to lose RvP, and I am not sure we necessarily must, I’d much rather sell him to Juventus–better to laugh at him there than cry with him in our league.

  35. Sensational Arsenal

    Umm, was today’s post and one a few days back (“Dutch auction…”) written by Pedantic George?

    I do love the sarcasm Yogi has allowed himself on these two posts.

  36. Limestonegunner

    Agreed Evil, if we hold our nerves as we are doing it is possible to take some advantage out of either scenario. I’m in favor of making the most out of the advantage that helps Arsenal on the pitch, though.

    Arsenal, Arsenal!

  37. Yes, Diese but I think Airtel operate exclusively in Africa. I could be wrong, of course.

    Oh, and for those hkeeping awake with the outcome of my complaint to the BBC re lineker and co, I have news but it will have to wait until I get back from a day out at the mill pond with Nos. 1 and 2 grandsons.

    Suffice it to say, for the moment, that it is all good news. Apparently Gary is a witty so and so and no malice was intended. The pundits are not biased and, even if they were, the BBC doesn’t care about such things in sport.

    All in all, all we could possibly hope for from the BBC. Hurrah!

  38. I get it now Frank. It’s a bit like when Chris Morris did his paedophilia special on Brass Eye. Took me a while.

  39. SA

    >Umm, was today’s post and one a few days back (“Dutch auction…”) written by Pedantic George?


  40. Limestonegunner

    Just replacing 02 wouldn’t be exciting news, unless it was a very big increase in the sponsorship.

    One Ivan Gazidis!

    Btw, AA, that minority is not so small perhaps. This could still shape up as a fantastic summer. Keep our players, add two strikers and a midfield creator like Cazorla and voila!– ready to challenge!

  41. In 7th heaven my man Koscielny has extended his contract, way to go boy, some could learn from you!!

    We have a game today around 4. Already thinking of an excuse to get off work early in order to watch it but first let me find out if it will be on telly. I have really missed the boys in red!!

  42. You bet he’s gonna give his all. Chamakh nis playing to making a bundle of bucks when his contract is up. Let’s see what happens,

  43. Daily blog on the goings on with the Arsenal pre season tour. I liked the bit about Bould and his positional training –

  44. mattgoonerknight


    I don’t usually start my posts with the obligatory “great write up…”, as I feel it’s a given, but I just thought I’d say keep up the great work, as I do look forward to reading every day. Done.

    Limestone, the Carzola link is in YW’s post.

    For a transfer gossip story It’s a really interesting read – a new twist on the oil-pitfalls of sheikh sugar-daddry!

    Agreed terms, ai? Debts must be settled by July 31st. Still a week for Daddy to get his Barclaycard out then. Hmmmm

  45. Limestonegunner

    AA at 10:08, exactly! The best plan is to foment revolt in the Emirates and Qatar; honestly if Bahrain had been allowed to fall ( But how could US and Saudis let the people undermine the Bahraini monarchy?!) last year the Gukf states could all have been in major trouble. No reason it can’t happen. Destabilize those little oiligarchies and football clubs are the last things they’ll be worried about; die right on the vine without their cash miracle gro food.

    Frank, your mission, should you choose to accept it…

  46. Sensational Arsenal


    I do know that. My comment was a light joke on the tone of these two posts.

  47. It’s Ramadan for the muslims so I hope the sheik behind Malaga is too pre-occupied with that and will let that deadline pass. Cazorla just seems like such a good fit!

  48. Well that’s my point Limestone – the club will have known the O2 deal was likely to lapse and markets ARE changing.

    Suggesting BT as a new sponsor is a punt on my part – but as a player they have recently successfully bid for EPL contracts (starting 2013) and are looking to ramp up their exposure commercially as their technology investments kick in and they ARE looking to take on Sky in certain areas, at least.

    A big sponsorship from them would make a lot of sense – but still just a wild guess on my part.


    Bob – you are such a tease. Quite shocked at the news Linekar is allegedly a ‘witty guy’ – is there any actual evidence of this?

    Have a great day with the grandsons!

  49. mattgoonerknight

    Firstlady | July 24, 2012 at 10:36

    It’s on ESPN, but otherwise it’s being live streamed on arsenalplayer!

    I cancel ESPN when the season ends / when our games dry up. I have to check the schedule to see when to renew it again.

  50. Sensational Arsenal

    Airtel is based in India. I think they have the largest customer base in the country. They went into africa because there was a market there.


    If their ratings are to be believed, he’s been one of the best players in the Spanish league last season. He does seem to have a Theo-esque liking for turnovers but otherwise his numbers make for fantastic reading.

  52. Consolsbob Airtel operates in most African countries, I was abit chafed last year since they were sponsoring Man united in Kenya and didnt think they were a perfect fit Airtel being red and white just like us, it is quite a shame the Airtel- Arsenal deal is in some of the East African countries but not in Kenya.

    All in all there are more pressing matters at hand concerning Arsenal, like how many strikers we will have come 18th and who Wenger is going to buy if he is making any more additions or sell and the “bestest” of the news is Diaby is back!!

  53. Cazorla could be a fab signing but who`s this voila Limestone mentions,
    Italian playmaker? makes things happen out of nothing?

  54. Evil – Cazorla has been a top player for the past 5 seasons, getting in ahead of the likes of Villa, Silva, Xavi, Iniesta for the player of the year on a couple of occasions. I always thought Villa and Silva were a perfect fit for Arsenal footballing style- Cazorla is another in my opinion – i hope its true and we get him

  55. Matt thanks for the information, I am not on Arsenal player but if it is on ESPN so it will probably be on supersport (for those in Africa, it is the best thing since sliced bread as they show most of the football games).

  56. Arteta for captain?

  57. Limestonegunner

    MGK, didn’t realize the linked article was the Guardian one.

    But on the subject, I found this one especially interesting about AC Milan refunding season ticket money to some fans upset by the sale of their two best players, not because of legal obligations but out of moral consideration for the club’s relationship to its supporters. What do we think of that? Of the fans’ reactions (not so much anger at the players but the exec and owner for selling them) of the clubs’ discourse about moral obligations to their fans? We are facing a similar situation, but I am still hopeful we might not sell and in fact be demonstrating just how ambitious we are, as AA pointed out. But I can’t see IG/SK refunding any money if we do sell again this year. Much better to keep the team together.

    This should be a much bigger story.

  58. Since Steww can talk of 69 on ACLF then maybe i can share this with the ladies,enjoy .

  59. mattgoonerknight

    I’ll have to plead ignorance on this one and reveal that I’m not ever so familiar with the qualities of Cazorla.

    If bought and brought in, would the intention be for him to play at the top of the mid-field three?

    I realise some of you above have said he is versatile, but there presumably is a particular starting spot that he has been earmarked to specifically fill?

    In short, would he be our new AM?

  60. Limestonegunner

    Evil, that’s what I was getting at above. He might just forget about the club entirely until August 20th or thereafter. No food or water during the 40 plus degree days, lots of naps, late night prayers–should be the last thing on his mind! Let’s seal the deal now!

    AA, got it. One Ivan Gazidis!

  61. Limestonegunner

    Haha, Lbc!

  62. That would be a hell of a precedent, Limestone. I’d be amazed if there is not already a clause in ticket/season ticket contracts which states players may come and go throughout the life of the ticket and the sale of such is not player dependent.


    From Twitter:

    “Laurent Koscielny: Made more interceptions (91) and more tackles (85) than any other centre-back in the Premier League last season.”

    And that, in one of the toughest most competitive leagues in the world.

    As I said earlier, I truly believe he is one of the very best CBs in the world – and may yet get better, of course.

    If you want your captains to lead by example then there are worst choices I can think of …

  63. I assume the reason why Koscielny didn’t travel with the rest of the guys to Asia is to show Robin how it’s done. I sure hope the dutch man will follow the lead of probably the best defender in the Prem.

  64. mattgoonerknight

    ESPN and the Torygraph jumping over the Grauniad’s story.

  65. I’m on to it, Limestonegunner

    Four Lions was hilarious was it not, Steww

  66. Well done bob for keeping up the good fight with the beeb over their orange cretin of an employee,until an on-air apology to the professor is forthcoming I’ll continue to boycott motd along with the majority of talkshite shows, piers Morgan, the Sunday people(wally without a brolly headline) for their total disrespect of our leader.Great news about kos!, hurry up theo, what you waiting for?!

  67. Limestonegunner

    AA, that’s the point. Milan say it isn’t a legal issue and dismiss the court suit. What is interesting is that they acknowledge a moral obligation of some kind with their fans.

  68. @LG
    I guess one of the reasons for the refund is that Italian fans are probably a bit more passionate than our ordinary English football fan with the ultra culture that’s prevalent there.

  69. Limestone – yes, I take your point. But irrespective of legal compulsion or a voluntary refund, it’s still a helluva precedent! And of course, players DO come and go throughout the life of a football club, it’s what happens.

  70. mattgoonerknight

    Interesting LSG,

    We’ve lowered the bottom end prices on tickets this season so I’d imagine the powers that be would point to that as giving something back to the fans. Nothing like a free lunch, though!


    It would be ample reward for Kos for signing on the line, but may cause some friction between him and Vermaelen, the current VC and next in line.

    Wouldn’t want a sequel to Kolo versus Gallas.

  71. What I’d like to see is how many people will actually end up taking the refund. I can’t imagine it will be many in all honesty.

  72. It’s also nice to see that the judicial system in the UK seems to work at times, with Brooks and Coulson being charged.

  73. Limestonegunner

    RvP are you watching? Arsenal is making big moves to keep one of Europe’s best defenders, bring in one of Spain’s best creative threats, and has bought two top strikers. Steve Bould, legendary defender and new first team coach, is working the defenders hard. The club is parading half naked men on its website to delight and make new fans across the world. Now what is that if not serious ambition!?!?!

  74. Limestonegunner

    Evil, yes, the supporter culture is different and I too doubt many will take the ST refund.

    MGK, good point about the ticketing change, and that is some genuine progress for fans.

    AA, yes, that’s why it seems very newsworthy to me!

  75. Trying not to get too excited about the possibility of Cazorla. The story’s written by Lowe and Hytner in the Guardian, which hardly bothered to cover the Podolski and Giroud transfers. So the devil on my left shoulder is whispering “Arsenal in crisis after Cazorla snub”.

    Listening instead to the angel on my right shoulder, which has noticed that the story ends “Meanwhile, striker Nicklas Bendtner is in talks with Galatasaray”.

  76. Matt – I think either out of TV or Kos would make admirable captains; two of the most committed and effective guys in the squad.

    LimestoneG – very good – maybe you should quickly build a website and make your 11.25 post your first announcement!

    You can then populate the rest of it with your best posts of the last year or so, give it some history, maybe. If not actual credibility, obviously.

  77. Hmmm, if Malaga fail to settle their debts by 31st July, apparently they would/could lose their champions league spot.

    If they DID lose it, presumably it would go to the Spuds?

    So we REALLY do want to conclude the deal for Cazorla.

    Ideally by lunchtime.

    If not elevenses.

  78. Limestonegunner

    Arteta for captain, I say. We’ve had leaders by example but may benefit from a talker, which apparently Arteta is. Vermaelen fits the bill but may not start. Sagna as well but won’t be fit until later in the season.

    AA, lol! (as the kids say!).

  79. Limestonegunner

    No way it goes to Spuds. My guess is to 5th place Spanish team.

  80. Arteta would be my first-choice, too, but with TV being vice-captain I don’t think it would set the right kind of example of overlooking him for the captaincy. And maybe he will learn a new trick or two that will turn him into a bit more balanced player that will allow him to start ahead of Mertesacker (presuming everyone is fit and not injured … have I jinxed us now?) But Arteta should definitely become vice-captain.

  81. Ateeb turns up very late these days, by my time, when the brain is in arrest mode but last nights post was very interesting. He has refined his thesis somewhat; it is now an issue of paying the superstars at the going rate, whatever that is, at the expense of Stan’s profits.

    Quite an interesting concept. Their is a major problem which he needs to address. Unlike showbusiness, by the time you become a superstar in football you have already hit your peak physically, usually around the time Wenger must consider whether to cash in or not.
    ZimP argued very persuasively we have no facts but if AFC offered Robin a bumper salary plus bonuses and other perks over a long term contract, at age 29 would that make goodbusiness sense? We all know that a lot of movie studios have gone bust splashing superstar salaries on actors/actresses whose popularity is on the wane. And that is not even a team sport with a very different business model.


  82. Koscielny! Always felt it took great mental strength to play in our defence. You could have it much easier in a less attacking team. Not exposed as often nor subjected to the kind of scrutiny and criticisms of our lads each time a goal is conceeded. Here’s to players who don’t look to take the easy road, and to our hopefully settled back pairing of Kos and Vermaelen. In it for the long haul.

  83. Markus – yes, agree. Also, Kos came into the side at a time when our defence was relatively low on confidence and borderline laughing stock in the eyes of the media – in other words, the worst possible time, in my opinion.

    LImestone – ha ha – no, you HOPE for a 5th placed Spanish side to get into Europe ahead of AVB’s absentees and triers!

    Am I the only one bemused by the media’s relative silence on Modric’s AWOL activities? Imagine if RvP had not been left behind by Arsene but had also gone AWOL?


  84. Notoverthehill

    Yogi, I agree it does require forensic examination all this transfer drivel, especially printed in The Guardian!

    Paying a visit to Malaga, I find that the club is now in Venezuela. After more than 20 days on holiday, Santi Cazorla is on “red alert” for the forthcoming resolution or revolution?

    Malaga have not paid €3.5 millions due to Villarreal and have therefore been reported to the Football League (FLP). Malaga also owe a small amount for Hamburg for a Dutch player, Mathijsen. Cazorla and Mathijsen have both stayed behind to train in Malaga. The reason being “not match fit”.

    The non-payment of VAT is interesting as Cazorla was from Villarreal and Mathijsen from Hamburg. That would mean 2 VAT returns are overdue?

    I need to go through other Spanish newspapers to verify what is what. One of the Guardian “reporters” is unreliable!

    Perhaps Sheikh Al-Thani has no further need for a bolt-hole in Spain?

  85. Turnovers? TURNOVERS? The only bloody turnovers I’m interested in come filled with apple. When the hell did turnovers become footballing statistical parlance?

  86. That Guardian article on Cazorla says we’ve been experimenting with Gervinho in the middle. Would make sense with Podolski on the left. Would playing Gervinho in the middle get the best from him? He likes to take defenders on all right but what about his pace from the wide positions. Interesting option to have.

  87. Limestonegunner

    Totally true, AA on both points. I am working it hard to avoid the thought of Spuds in the CL. But no country gets more than 4 participants now under UEFA’s changes after Liverpool’s CL win and poor league finish. So Spuds can’t be a fifth English team. Platini’s head would explode first!

    And yes, Modric antics–what are Spud supporters saying about him? The only Spud I know out here is my former boss. But ZP doesn’t want us to talk about these things, so mum’s the word!

  88. Suggest you add Turnovers to your list of prescribed words, YW (if you haven’t already).

    Unless preceded by apple, of course.

    Or possibly a nice strawberry?

  89. Expect you are right, LSG – it just felt like the spuds fell out of the CL by the back door so how irritatingly fitting if they somehow got back in it by the same route.

    One can only assume Spuds supporters/media etc are resigned to Modric going to a new club and that this makes his AWOL perfectly acceptable.

    A terrible start for AVB however, hardly a ringing endorsement, is it? Their US money-spinning tour also thoroughly disrupted …

    As Frank would say – ‘oh dear’.

    Or possibly – ‘oh dearie me’, even.

  90. Limestonegunner

    Noticed that too, Markus. Wonder about that. I like his pace and trickery outside and cutting in at the top of the box or at the line behind the defense. A Player needs a lot of composure in the centre of our attack. Also it is a very crucial position and he’ll be at ACN again, so I have some doubtful thoughts. But it is an interesting possibility. If Gervinho can play there then why not give AA a go?

  91. If RVP is gone and Cazorla is in then i reckon Giroud is first choice centrally with any from Poldi, Gerv, Cazorla, Theo, Ox the supporting trio behind him. I reckon Poldi comes in second as the central striking option in place of Giroud with again any from Gerv, Cazorla, Theo and Ox in the supporting 3

  92. And this (literally) just in: my ordered Arsenal jersey has arrived. Time to go to the city centre and get Koscielny’s name printed on it.

  93. Lime. Please feel free to start a “Modric thread”. I like him, a fine player, just don’t care really.

    I thought responses to YW’s Diaby post were a mite muted. I note Wenger said “He is the first name on the French team selection”. In other words “are you guys kidding me?”. Well, we know all about the injury problems, but it was not all that different with Robin, and look what he just did. Someone compared him with Yaya Toure and they are similar in that they dominate and attack in similar ways.

  94. I think people are a little hard on Aaron. He’s only 21, or is it 22, and not yet the perfect midfielder. What I noticed last season was the work rate, coming off that long lay-off, and a slight downturn in performance at the tail-end; he played 44 games last season. I think he’s going to surprise, then shock a few people when they are reminded how good he always was. Amongst the younger players, I rate him the bestprospect, most likely to succeed long-term.

  95. Carzola, if true, for me is the long-term Yossi role/replacement or in another way, a similar role to a earlier goal-scoring Rosicky.

  96. Cazorla is the upgrade on Nasri!

  97. I think we need another striker who has proven himself in the league. What’s the craic with Dempsey – did he go to Liverpool or what? I think that he would play well with the players we have.

  98. What I wan’t to know is why in the hell did Modric sign a SIX year deal at a club he is unhappy at.

    Also, I can’t read or say Cazorla’s name properly. I read it as Carzola every time.

  99. AVB spent the last pre season at the Bridge trying to lure Modric away from Spuds and to the great Babylon on the Broadway

    And this season AVB finds Modric being lured away again – and he is not happy

    And people don’t believe in God

  100. Markus

    Same reason that Fabregas did.

  101. Limestonegunner

    Kind of reminds us about somebody else who left for a big club in Spain…

  102. Limestonegunner

    More than a little hard on Ramsey. Abusive, ungrateful, forgetful and will likely regret it if they have a conscience.

  103. Limestonegunner

    Anicoll, one of the best proofs yet. Where’s GA?! 🙂

  104. Another nice post yogi, thanks again

    I am happy that chamakh wants to stay. As things stand I don’t see him being first or second choice central striker so the situation for him is not that much different. He will get some chances and he needs to take them. We often talk about players needing a “run of games” to play well but squad players rarely get those runs of games so they need to be able to impress when they do get a chance. If they can’t then their value as squad players and their chance to actually get more playing time is very limited. Hopefully chamakh will make the most of what playing time he gets.

    Don’t know a lot about santi carzola but sounds like an excellent buy if he can play in the AM role effectively. I have still never met a transfer rumour that I don’t love so let’s get him. Hope we don’t wait till we sell a few players because we need him to hit the ground running and waiting until mid or late August is not the best way for him to be able to do that

  105. “The band were from Walton & Hersham”

    What the fluck were they singing about in “Hersham Boys”? I was a teenager in North American suburbs and didn’t have clue what they were singing about: cockney cowboys in corduroys?
    Was it selfagrandisement and glorifying gang culture? or just stupid nonesense?

  106. Any links to live text commentary?

  107. Philmar

    It was a social commentary on the desperation of living in council estates in an affluent area, being on the outside looking in, living on your wits.

    Oh, alright it was stomp along nonsense.

  108. Limestone @ 9:21

    Thanks for re-posting that. Very well said as always. Unfortunately most are ignoring even though it’s the single biggest issue facing the club now and perhaps forever.

    No team can expect to compete in the top level of European football if they can’t pay the competitive wages for their top players. We have come closer then one would expect because of Arsene but even he can’t take us to the top without being able to keep his best players. Being able to pay top wages to a couple of players and being self sustainable should not mutually exclusive if the management gets the formula right and it’s wage scale right as you point out. There may be some years that you don’t make a profit but our owners could afford to do that in some circumstances. The first thing that needs to be done is to fix the wage scale and make a legitimate run at keeping RVP. I think we could afford the latter if we do the former, but fixing the wage scale will cost some money in the short term. I think we will compete for and probably keep our CL spot even with the squad we have without RVP. Kudos to Wenger and Ivan for getting Podolski and Giroud when they did. They knew all along what was in RVP’s mind. However if we could keep RVP and bring in someone like Carzola and may be even m’vila we would be legitimate title contenders I think. That plan would cost some money on the short term but it could change the whole dynamic of us being a “selling club” and could completely change the balance of power in the league this season and perhaps for many seasons to come. It depends on your expectations I guess.

  109. arse or brain

    frank@ 9:34 jesus how young are you !

  110. Curses, I missed the line-up!

  111. mannone

    jenks verm JD Gibbs

    Arteta AD Le Coq Santos

    Gerv Chamackattack

  112. That away kit looks much better on the pitch than in the early studio shots.

  113. Good effort there from Chamakh

  114. Looks hungry doesn’t he Gadget?

  115. Isnt it just my luck, still held at work, I got out to 4 spots near my office and all are showing some local game. text commentary it is then, those watching please update us!

  116. Commentators getting on my nerves. It’s almost like the season has started!

  117. Evil – switched to a foreign language station on Sopcast after 10 minutes. Couldn’t stand it.

  118. pedantic george

    “If football attempts to chase the clubs that are bankrolled beyond their earning capacity, that cannot go bankrupt because of the ambitions and mean of those owning them, to placate a few players in the attempt to win one of the few trophies available, then it is doomed”

    Is what I would have said and how I would have said it.Had I been as able as Bob.
    For me that is it .In the proverbial nutshell.
    Ateeb,It turns out that Bob and ZimPaul tried harder on my behalf.Perhaps you should follow your own advice.

  119. Is it me or does Le Coq look a little, well, ahem is ‘buff’ the word I’m searching for?

  120. thanks Steww for the stream, my internet connection is useless and it keeps breaking off every seconds

  121. Diaby took a heck of a tumble. Got straight up again. Good to see. the bloke he ran into on the other hand …

  122. “Find, one can always find differences because every situation is unique, and in the discussion comparisons were asked for. Materially on the relevant point of wages and revenues, the two clubs I offered are good and relevant examples. Competitively the leagues are different but they both compete for players and have to do so by paying wages in the same market as we do.”

    I agree Limestone. We CAN compete given the stadium we have. But will we? The problem is the ‘ol Bag and Munich are run by proper football people that want to win titles rather than generate profit/reduce debt. They’ll take bigger risks and sign established stars to big contracts. Juve operate in a league with big spending Milan (owned by megalomaniac Berlusconi) who could afford Robinho, Ronaldinho ect. and Inter who somehow could afford big wages for Ibra, Sneijder ect. We are owned by near absentee owner who treats us as a profit generating franchise, a small division in his bigger business enterprise.

    I expect the next few years we’ll only be able to gloat about how we reduced a stadium debt from X millions of pounds to Y millions of pounds while managing to sell players for a greater value than the ones we purchased. We’ll brag about how we’ve maintained Champions League qualification for aeons all the while playing exciting football. Achievements unparalleled in Europe. Hopefully we’ll always have Spurs around to make us feel better should the trophy cabinet not grow.

  123. Diaby manages to combine elegance and power. It’s a thing of beauty really.

  124. “Is it me or does Le Coq look a little, well, ahem is ‘buff’ the word I’m searching for?”

    Dexter is the one to ask. He seems to have a heightened interest uh I mean knowledge of the player’s physiques. 😉

  125. Thank you, YW.

    Looks like the pitch is terrible.

  126. Le Coq just did some gardening. Could’ve planted spuds in the trench he made with his sliding tackle.
    Philmar – I meant he looks like he’s been to the gym. I don’t have quite the same fascination in the players’ physiques as some.

  127. Where is Santos playing? I mean within the formation? He seems to be everywhere. Our secret midfield weapon maybe?

  128. “Since Steww can talk of 69 on ACLF then maybe i can share this with the ladies,enjoy .

    George and Dexter will be all over that one!! 😉
    Jeez that is safe for work but it sure is difficult explaining to co-workers how my love of Arsenal logically extends to viewing photos of them in the pool.

  129. Smart marketing Philmar.

  130. “Philmar – I meant he looks like he’s been to the gym. I don’t have quite the same fascination in the players’ physiques as some.”

    Understood….due to my interest in medical; science I only like looking at them to see how the surgeons scars have healed. And Dex will probably claim he’s interested in the art of body tattooing since his days as a Royal Marine.
    And George? he’ll just call me a cunt 😉

  131. Philmar that is exactly why I said it is for the ladies 😀

  132. Santos misses a sitter, after turning up in the centre forward position!
    In other news how quick is Gervinho looking? Lightening.

  133. Our attacking midfielder Andre Santos nearly put Gervinho in there.

  134. Gary Steven Robbat comes on for Malaysia. Named after Gary Stevens. The Australian Rugby league player.

  135. Our right sided midfielder Andre Santos storms into the box. Good save by the keeper.

  136. Gibbs drops as everyone else steps up. Plays opponent onside. Steve Bould makes black mark in note book. Gibbs swallows hard.

  137. From the txt commentary so far Santos getting plenty of chances, Steww you may be right,he could be our secret weapon.

  138. FL
    So far today I’ve seen him at DM central AM, left and right wing. He’s inventive hard to get past, unafraid to shoot and skilful. Fuck it let him play where he likes

  139. pedantic george

    Steww should you not be preparing your ad libs?

  140. “Gibbs drops as everyone else steps up. Plays opponent onside. Steve Bould makes black mark in note book. Gibbs swallows hard.”

    Hehehe, if only commentators could do what you are doing now instead of feeding us their bullshit opinions.!

  141. At half time I’ll run through them George, then after the match I’ll get them word perfect. Just waiting for the infinite number of monkeys I keep in the shed to finish writing the ad libs, spontaneous remarks and off the cuff observations.

  142. Have to say, that was a sensational goal!

  143. Fuck a duck. Hell of a strike. Don Vito has looked really good so far but he didn’t sniff that.

  144. Goal of the season no question. Ahem.

  145. Blahblah, not good enough without RVP, Wenger needs to buy, lucky if we make top 4.

  146. maybe it’ll encourage Arsenal to actually play with a bit of attacking focus in the 2nd half

  147. Fuck!!my stream decided to work just as the goal was going in!!!NKT!

  148. pedantic george

    That was Le Coq at fault.
    Easy this criticising malarkey.

  149. It been abit pedestrian from Arsenal. Malaysia want the win while we don’t really care. Diaby looks alright though. Here’s hoping

  150. I assume everyone is being tongue in cheek criticising the desire of players in a training exercise?

  151. “So we REALLY do want to conclude the deal for Cazorla.

    Ideally by lunchtime.

    If not elevenses.”

    I put in a call for you and consider it DONE!!

  152. You are right Steww, it is a training exercise but even in training you want to perform as best you can. I don’t think we can argue that Arsenal have looked very pedestrian, even if this is just an exercise.

  153. Good goal.

    Entertaining game for a warm up.

    These supporters are great!

  154. Sorry i was just texted by my source that it is not quite done, but close.

  155. philmar – quotes? Anybody involved in either club actually contribute to the article? I really think everyone would be a lot happier waiting for the new season and then having a look to see who we’ve bought.

  156. Miami
    I didn’t expect them to look as sharp as a team just at the end of their season. But actually Gibbs Santos and Gervinho to name three off the top of my head look really quick, really up for it. Malaysia are parking the bus, playing on the break, we’re playing patiently and probing. It’s all good.

  157. New team for part two. Wonder if we’ll see many turnovers?

  158. Steww, I think Santos has looked great and poped up often enough to have scored twice… needs to work on his composure in front of goal 🙂 Gibbs and looked good with pace going forward, and Diaby tidy enough. I am concerned by Chamakh who just seems to be drifting along, good when he attacked the ball but for a player playing for his Arsenal future I want to see a little more.

  159. Yennaris, Bartley, Miquel, Song, Aneke, Eastmond, Ryo, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Walcott and Afobe all on.

  160. Miami – point taken. MC has a languid style.

  161. Was neither tongue in cheek nor criticism from my end. A mere observation, sir

  162. Always going to be difficult to score without the players you expect to be the top 3 – 4 goal scorers. Playing a strong defense so that should be solid. If TV5 is going to be captain I expect that Arsene has him and Kos projected as the starters. Who will start between TV5 and BFG will be our most interesting single personnel decision in preseason. Gibbs or Santos a close second. IMO. I like BFG and Santos but I suspect it will be TV and Gibbs. Time will tell.

    Surprised Fabianski is on the bench and not playing. If he is on tour I guess you assume he is staying but if he and Wojo is number 1 then I would expect Fab to be playing. Still think he could be a number 1 GK and a pretty good one. If not, I hope he can find a good place to play because I still think he is a good player but he has not been the best fit for a back up.

    Good news about Diaby, made it thru a half and may be if we manage him with kid gloves he can slowly work his way back into the squad.

  163. The OX looks right up for it.

  164. Afobe… want to see him to the deed, huge rising star in the Arsenal youth system

  165. OK Gadget, each to their own, seems a little unfair to criticise them is all when part of the reason they are playing is to get fit and sharp.

  166. “philmar – quotes? Anybody involved in either club actually contribute to the article? I really think everyone would be a lot happier waiting for the new season and then having a look to see who we’ve bought.”

    Nope. Looks to me like Malaga sheikh will probably ante up the money at the last moment and relishing the free publicity his team is getting while the ‘crisis’ deadline approaches.
    Poor Andrei is looking for employment in the middle east and Bendtner is looking for love in Turkey.

  167. Brilliant quick thinking from Ryo and BA. I like it. Unlucky not to score.

  168. philmar – we don’t know any of that is true. Why bother repeating it? If anyone wants made up garbage the tabloids have their own websites.

  169. I would agree Steww. The Malay team look as though they have other priorities. They look like they want to win, where as for us it’s a nice exhibition

  170. That would have been a great goal for the Malaysian kid, right there. Unfortunate.

  171. We’re definitely practising a different kind of style this half. First half obviously sent out to keep the ball move it in front of the defence, probe for openings. This time the flyers are on and they’ve been told to move it fast, run straight at ’em. Interesting tactical stuff going on.

  172. the one concern I have from this game, is that like the EPL when we have teams “parking the bus” we do have trouble breaking teams down. The malay side are doing a great job and sitting very deep… we need to find that hole through and exploit it

  173. Steww:

    “We’re definitely practising a different kind of style this half. First half obviously sent out to keep the ball move it in front of the defence, probe for openings. This time the flyers are on and they’ve been told to move it fast, run straight at ‘em.”

    Can’t watch the game but I definitely like the idea of whats behind door number 2.

  174. “Arsenal have looked very pedestrian,”

    Hardly surprising in that heat having travelled 14 hours to get there and not exactly a quality pitch. This is all about fitness, a win would be a bonus. Nice to see Song continuing where he left off last season with the quality through ball.

  175. Bill – only my ill educated personal take on it of course. But Ryo, Ox, theo all supporting young Afobe it’s pretty fast. Creating chances too.

  176. What a fuckin ball from Song! Aneke has to put that away…good to see our maestro is up to his old tricks.

  177. Miami Arsenal, you are reading far too much into this game. We are hardly going to be playing this Arsenal team in the PL and I expect the players to be fitter than this when the PL starts so they would be playing at a higher tempo and with much more urgency.

  178. Another thing. While people are bemoaning our strength in depth vis a vis the midfield I think Arsene sees something in The Ox played more centrally.

  179. Steww:

    You are the best commentator I have and you are certainly educated in the ways of Arsenal. Love to see us use a more direct style when the situation calls for it. Thanks for your comments.

    Agree with Passenal @ 4:18.

  180. With all of the attacking options we have going for us these days I think we may see the Ox play in the hole a lot this season…this looks great to me:

    ——————–Back 5———————-
    ———————The Ox———————

    Lots of options!

  181. As a spectacle the many changes in personnel break things up a little.

  182. This commentator already spewing the bull shit…we may be a mid table side without RVP…will they ever learn…

  183. Don Vito has kept the score down here.

  184. nearly a beautiful play…Miyaichi should have struck it on the bounce…

  185. Thomas Eisfeld looks a tidy player.

  186. It is a pre-seaon friendly.

    It is in other words an utterly meaningless exercise apart from player fitness underlined by the absence of certain players from the travelling squad.

    I could be more cynical in saying it is simply a marketing / PR exercise as we travel half way around the globe to play a side of a level equal to about Championship or below.

  187. oooooo yeahhhhh!!

  188. All true Steve but it’s great to watch The Arsenal isn’t it? Any Arsenal side.

  189. Super Sub!

  190. What did I say? Thomas Eisfeld is a tidy player!

  191. Nico Yennaris impressed me when he came on against United. Felt he should have ben given more chances after that with both Sagna and Jenkinson being injured. In anycase, the RB position is well stocked

  192. Beautifully worked goal…what do you know, a ball from Song to open up the defense!

  193. Vision from Song but NY did really well too.

  194. Excellent ball from Song and once again Eisfeld shows his quality in front of goal.

  195. that was a very clinical finish from Eisfeld…good to see.


  197. Miami – absolutely. Not seen him much but those who have seem to say good things.

  198. Quite a cruel end to the game for Malaysia but Miquel’s run was snogabble

  199. 1 nil down – 2, 1 up

  200. Oh dear, I bet those ESPN commentators won’t like the taste of eating their own words one bit.

  201. lol…there it is…

  202. All that time wasting through substitutions came to this for the cunt Malaysian manager!

  203. great interchange between Aneke and Miquel…the youngsters look good out there.

  204. Song is so important to us. Anyone who moans about him not sitting back in front of the defence is missing the point.

  205. Bould and Wenger just struck exactly the same pose. There’s a budding bromance if I’ve ever seen one

  206. Another comeback then.

  207. you have got to like the size and presence of both Afobe and Aneke

  208. Cool. Right, I have to get off and practise my ad libs.

  209. A run-about followed by a decent nasi goreng anybody?

  210. hehe the boys look knacked

  211. I totally agree Steww…Song is our secret weapon…great passes coupled with the ability to keep the ball in midfield and break up play effortlessly. We are always talking about who is going to fill the creative role and Song is always overlooked. I really can’t wait for proper football to return.

  212. I am not sure what people mean by “freeing up” Song, when he is very, very effective actually sitting back. Why does he need to be freed up?

  213. Oh no. We scraped past the Malaysian IX. We stand no chance this coming season. Wenger out! Cheque book out! Spend, spend spend!!!!!!!

  214. @Georgaki
    Full agreement. We need a GK, a centre half, a dm and a striker or otherwise we can be lucky to finish in the top half of the table.

  215. Steww @ 4:39.

    That’s the point of wanting another “DM” so Song can move forward and do those things for us without leaving us disorganized in the back. Doesn’t that make sense?

  216. Small steps – a satisfactory result

  217. 50 Shades of (Seeing) Red

    Well I just switched on the stream for literally the last 5 minutes expecting to have to start writing ‘Wenger out, Samba, Parker in, black bags etc’ when we score two perfectly decent goals.

    Just watching them play is like a drug passing through the body – and I’m not talking paracetamol or aspirin, just to be clear.

    My first glimpse of Bouldy on the bench – to Bouldy go will have a whole new meaning from here on in, I’m sure.

    Almost bad enough to qualify for your show’s weekly ‘joke’ Steww – assume your ad lib stream has been signed off by now?

  218. I am waiting for the time when we get to see a midfield three of Song, Arteta, and Wilshere. I have a feeling they will completely dominate games if they all stay healthy. Throw the Ox in the mix and we have some exciting possibilities.

  219. Oh no I thought I was on Le Grove!

  220. Interesting choice of Eastmond at CB for second half – has he played there before? Or was it jusr to give him a run-out?

  221. jusr = just

  222. Again ateeb chats some bullshit and has the temerity to tell others to “try harder”? Insane in the membrane man.

    No, of course RvP doesnt want mega money, he just wants over £200k a week. What could possibly be wrong with demanding that?

    Idiotic doesnt even cover it. It is clear ateeb hasnt got a clue, he may as well post on le grove with this nonsense he spews.

    The club have offered him the best deal in its history’ for a soon to be 29 year old with a horrendous injury record. Him leaving may be a negative, for me, it will represent a bigger negative than the actual event, but I would rather he left than us bankrupt ourselves trying to keep apace with those clubs that do not need a business model.

    The spurious accusation about Stan scooping up all the profits is rubbish and more proof ateeb is just throwin mud around in the hope some of it sticks.

    Just like a doomer

  223. 24°C and 81% humidity.
    If you’re wondering why some of them looked a little sluggish.

  224. Georgiaki

    Me too some times. 🙂

  225. Hey chaps, its too nice to sit in front of a monitor. Go and make the most of the sunny weather!!!

  226. Agree Dex, many have been accusing the club of only operating for profits when in fact Stan has not taken any money out of the club yet. No proof of that. The financial statements are there to be seen.

  227. Nice work out. Polite 2-1. Shit pitch. Great to see the youngsters….real talent. Look out anyone who plays us for real.

    Oh and whoever the fuck the ESPN commentators are they can fucking well fuck off because they are right fuckers.

    Arsenal! Arsenal! Arsenal!

  228. I still agree with Ateeb

  229. Sorry Bill been busy. The point being missed is he isn’t a DM so doesn’t need a replacement to allow him to do anything. He’s been doing what he does for ages now and doing it very well. Our midfield don’t stick to rigid roles. It’s not our way.
    Why I am I having to explain this on an Arsenal forum?

  230. You can do what you want frank, like be a rude sad cunt for instance.

  231. ateeb talked a load of bollocks, with zero evidence and slated a few of the decent posters on here.

    No wonder you still agree with him.

  232. Limestonegunner

    Off the pitch, everyone at Arsenal are working hard at it too: Stephen Hughes in studio and he said “very much so” only once! Good studio commentary.

    You folks on the dodgy streams and ESPN broadcast all are making a big mistake not getting Arsenal Player–watched the match with a perfect stream and had pro-Arsenal commentary the whole time with Adrian Clarke. Remember, Robson is gone! Why suffer the ESPN jokers? It’s not that costly for a whole year plus red level membership. Really worth it now if you have high speed internet.

  233. The other hole in the argument to pay the “going rate” (Is that now €1 million per month NETTO by the way? – PSG & Zlatan – allegedly) is that it gets you into deep do-do with cunts like Adebayor still determined to milk his contract and not move on unless they buy him out. City are now finding themselves lumbered with a wagon load of unwanted players all being paid the “going rate” who don’t want to move elsewhere and take less. Perfectly understandable and maybe OK for a business which has a bottomless pit of money stolen from the Russian/Arab peoples. But it’ll all end in tears.

  234. LSG;

    Haha! Sounds good. I should have it for free, will check it next time man. Have a look at the espn website article about the match. There are comments there that would make you think we are in a relegation dogfight! never mind just played a pre-season friendly 1000s of miles away and erm, won it to boot!

  235. I agree with you re Arsenal Player LSG. I only caught the second half, but so far the new commentator Nigel Adderley is yet to irritate me!

  236. Or, LG, you can watch it on a stream and not listen to the commentary.

  237. arsenalandrew

    Thanks to all those who provided running commentary on the game – v entertaining.

    Ready made source of ad libs for tonight’s show Steww!!

  238. Sahil @ 5:03:

    No one has accused Stan of embezzling. What’s frustrating is that he could well afford to help move us through these tough times. The clubs ultra conservative approach is damaging the club a lot more then taking a loss in one year would. David dein, lady nina , danny fizman each made more then $100 milllion profit on their investments in arsenal. Stan probably will make hundreds of millions of dollars from his investment in the club and he should be enough of a fan to be willing to take some short term risk for the long term good. Another option if he did not want to take any short term loss would be Issuing rights as Usamov suggested which could bring in a lot more money without adding debt as (Someone correct me if that is incorrect). The downside is that Stan’s shares would decrease in value. Do you really care how much money Stan or PHW make? Would you rather see them sit on top of their pile of money and watch their investment grow in value or see the club be given a better chance to succeed? You may not think that RVP deserves what he is asking for but he certainly has more of a claim to earning his big payday then Stan or PHW. IMO

    Frank @ 5:04:

    “I still agree with Ateeb”

    I agree with Frank!

  239. Miami – how’s the new handgun?

  240. Notoverthehill

    Yogi, I have been trawling through some of the Spanish newspapers, even Twitter, I kid you not!

    It appears that Abdullah Bin Nasser Al Thani could have bought Liverpool FC but decided to settle in the Costa del Sol, Malaga. Ghubn Abdullah is a young executive of 28 years in whom the Sheikh has entrusted with the management CF Malaga as a “hobby”.

    The dispute appears to be with an interview by the President of the Association of Spanish Footballers (AFE), Sr Luis Rubiales. gave in Malaga FM – Radio Marca. The players are (were) owed 35 – 40% of their June salaries. Rather similar to Barça, who have achieved a record profit of €49 milliones this past year. Sorry Yogi, I have gone native at times!

    The Federation of Peñas Malaguistas has denounced the campaign of harassment and ended with these words of Mahatma Gandhi “First they ignore you, after laughing at you, then…”.

    Alas, no linking of Cazorla with The Arsenal.

  241. Eisfelds goal

  242. Deflection goal

  243. funniest bit was when the espn commentators said liverpool have more chance of winning the title than us. really? a team that is in europe only because they won the mickey mouse cup?

    oh well, every year before the season starts, the journalists like to make their predictions., you will always find liverpool in the top 4. they apparently believe if u keep going for it, eventually it will happen….

  244. Nice way to start the preseason. Great that the young guys scored the goals.

  245. “”Sahil @ 5:03:

    No one has accused Stan of embezzling. What’s frustrating is that he could well afford to help move us through these tough times. ”

    Exactly. Saying the team is run to generate profits is not akin to saying he is skimming the profits to for things like paying off debts (Glazers).
    Does anything prevent him accessing the club’s profits in the future through dividends? “

  246. Right so – first run out for a lot of players, dodgy pitch, humidity through the roof no doubt, most everyone got a run out, no one got injured, 2 got goals – job done …right?

  247. Limestonegunner

    Forget dividends, that’s Mickey mouse stuff. What about his 50% share with the club in the separate sub-company for Arsenal Media? What happens to all the current and future revenues when Arsenal can sell games over the Internet and so forth. Doesn’t he get half of those lucrative potential profits right there?

    I’d like to know more about that part of his Arsenal stake. That happened, I believe, very early on in his Arsenal interest. What did he and the club put in to create that venture? Is his subsequent majority stake in shares of the club a move to insure his position as half owner directly of the media venture? Would be worth serious “forensic examination”, YW or Notoverthehill–please investigate that sometime when it is a slow news period.

  248. Americas-based Spanish-language sports reporter Diego Balado, of Fox Sports and Univision, has just claimed on Twitter that Cazorla will leave Malaga for Arsenal

  249. DEise;

    Do you think Cazorla could play as a more central AM? I know he is classed as a winger, but just wondering.

  250. Stan has not lied to us or cheated us as far as we know but I have always said i want our owners to be fans who want the club to succeed on the pitch and are willing to risk some of their eventual profits to help us when needed. I dont expect them to bankrupt themselves but they dont need to do that. We should see a significant jump in revenue in a few years if our management does its job with the commercial contracts. Winning something would make that job easier and some money invested now might even bring back a significant reward in the next few years.

    Perhaps an overly melodramatic analogy but what Stan is doing now seems a bit like Nero sitting on his pile of gold and played the fiddle while Rome was burning.

  251. LSG;

    To my knowledge, this mediarights deal that was struck a few years back was precisely what preceded all the foreign ownership man. Apart from the suage daddies, all the other (mainly US) new owners seemed quite attracted to that prosective windfall.

  252. -chamakh needs to be sold on even if rvp doesnt stay..

    -i still think we need some midfielders…

    -and having kozzer and TV signed up for the next 5 years is top top stuff..
    finally, some good fucking news..and im hearing theos next?

  253. Bill’

    I have given up trying to keep on explaining to you what is happening at the club. Why Stan is the majority share holder and why he is simply carrying on what the board decided a while back.

    If he is to pump in some of his own cash, then it would represent a huge change in thinking. It isnt impossible, but given we have been through the worst in financial terms, i can’t see it happening.

  254. Just got home from the game. Really happy to get to watch the Arsenal play again. Turnout was smaller that last year’s, I’m guessing maybe the high 30s touching 40k. This probably due the Muslim fasting month having just started and the late kick-off time on a week day. The game ended close to midnight, local time.

    Overall, had a good peek at the youth team which played with more desire and urgency compared to the 1st line-up which is understandable. Song was the most eye catching player from the Arsenal side but Bartley and Aneke’s physique really stood out. All the goals were pretty good as well.

    The atmosphere was quite fun as fans were cheering for both sides. The only negative points was the Malaysian coach’s time wasting tactics with the substitutions. Otherwise, it was a good night out and all the fans left the stadium in good spirit.

  255. Limestonegunner

    They do, Dex, and that’s the sort of thing that worries me because I want all of that coming directly to the club. You can see why they are interested: for all the talk of football collapsing, in the worst economy for nearly four decades if not more, the PL broadcast rights are rising massively again, bringing 30 million more for each club. The international rights are shared out equally but Liverpool already last year suggested this should follow the domestic formula or some other formula. That’s what the media venture is all about, planning to sell the games over the Internet to the Malaysian fans whose emails they are busy collecting right now!

  256. Dex – froam what i have seen of Cazorla he is equally adept with either foot, so much so that i cant really tell if hes right footed or left, but i assume he is right footed as thats the foot he takes corners with!. I’ve seen him make 5/10.30 yard passes with either foot. He tends to take most of his teams set pieces, good corner taker and hits a mean free kick. Hes well able to hold onto the ball in tight spaces and also play fast one-twos. He seems to start from the left/ inside left. I would have no doubt he could play centrally

  257. arsenalandrew

    Bill “… like Nero sitting on his pile of gold and played the fiddle while Rome was burning.”


    You actually think Arsenal are going down?

    To me, we look stronger now than has been the case since at least the Invincibles were in charge of the EPL and quite possibly since before AFC started building the new stadium.

    I’m talking about on the playing side, organizationally, financially …

  258. Limestonegunner

    Dex, haven’t seen much of Cazorla but I do watch the odd la Liga match and was interested to see Malaga v. RM last season and looked to me like Cazorla played much through the middle and looked creative on the ball, strong on the ball, and a good passer–seemed real AM material and didn’t play like a winger way out wide or to the touch line–he was creating chances with through balls on the floor through central defense. I’m hoping this goes through.

  259. Let youtube show you his magic –
    I hope we get him

  260. Limestonegunner

    I have to say that his is an occasion when I would appreciate the insight and views of Gainsbourg. He watched a lot of football n other leagues and the youth international tournaments and had some perceptive things to say about players I often knew very little about, like Shaqiri a couple of seasons ago before he got huge attention with Basel’s performances in the CL that got him a quick move to Bayern this coming season.

  261. Limestonegunner

    I only say that because other than Deise, no one else on here seems to know all that much about how he plays, but Evil’s link above gave some interesting stats.

  262. Actually airtel is a telecom co in India n they are advertising man u soccer school right now. So I wonder if they would spend to link up with the Arsenal at the same time.

  263. Dex @ 6:33

    I understand your point but what I am asking for all along is a change in thinking. . The absolute dogmatic demand to making a profit every year is great for a fortune 500 company but not the best way to run a football club. The purpose of a football club to win things and not make huge profits for its owners. No one suggesting that we run ourselves into administration but flexibility is needed.. That’s the main point Ateeb has been making.

    Stan stands to make literally hundreds of millions of dollars. How in the world can you be indignant about players wanting to be paid more and then shrug your shoulders about that? . The biggest risk ownership is taking right now is that they might get tendonitis in their wrist from writing a few checks, but they can certainly afford to hire someone to write for them until they recover.

  264. Relegation looms as Arsenal lose to fail to beat almost fail to beat Malaysian XI.

  265. AA

    As I said that’s an overly melodramatic analogy. But if we really are stronger now we can feel safe to take a few risks to help give us a better chance to succeed on the pitch. No?

  266. Apologies if that made even less sense than usual. Strikethrough didn’t work on “lose to” and “fail to beat”.

  267. re Cazorla – if you take the Spanish national team he can play in the Silva position, the Iniesta/Xavi position or the Pedro position seamlessly. I’ve always wanted Silva at Arsenal but i’ll happily take Santi

  268. Thanks Deise/LSG.

    Just seen this quote from Wenger; “We are not close to signing Cazorla. We are still working that out.”

  269. Yeah, he sounds excatly what we need man. He can also play in a multitude of positions. I checked on and they have him playing all across the midfield, AMl/AMR/CAM as well as DM!

    JJ; there’s those midfielders you were asking for! 🙂

  270. Bill;

    We are about to sign Santi Cazorla man. For a sum anywhere between £10m – £18m. Is that not good enough on top of the other 2 signings?

    Oh and SSN have now lumped in Theo with RvP to make them the EPL’s most potent attacking duo. Obviously because Theo’s situation is not sorted out. When he signs a new deal we won’t be hearing any of that, of course!

  271. Dex

    Hope you are right about carzola. I have to admit I will be more then a little surprised and pleased if it happens. Go Arsene, go Ivan, go Stanley. However I do need some to whine about so I will find something else 😃

    I would be interested to know how you can justify in your own mind being so upset about player wages but happy not care about what the owners stand to make. Seems like the opposite is more reasonable but I guess to each their own.

  272. “Stan stands to make literally hundreds of millions”

    Says who Bill? More baseless nonsense I am afraid. Unless he is about to sell up for a huge profit and it hasnt broke in the UK as yet?

    I am not sure van persie ‘just’ wants a few extra quid in his piffling pay packet, TBH.

    Oh and we have already offered him the biggest deal in the club’s history )according to AW) Or we havent even discussed financial terms and it isnt even about that (RvP).

    So how you and other misguided must try harders can categorically claim we need to offer him ‘the going rate’ to secure his services is quite baffling.

  273. pedantic george

    Ha ha Dexter .You are so right.When Theo signs he will revert to being inconstant with no end product.

  274. Bill; I am not indifferent to what the owner/majority shareholder does with the club. But he is doing precisely what the board were doing in order to stay afloat during the precarious move.

    If he saddled us with the debt of other clubs, then that would be of great concern to me.


    A bit of perspective

    LSG, I wish you would give it a rest about Stan’s money. Your point is made, but making it over and over again is turning you into another Bill and one is more than enough. Stan is only the majority owner because Danny Fiszman died and the board needed someone who was willing to buy into the self-sustaining model in order to keep Usmanov at bay. Stan is not a Sheikh or an Oligarch with bottomless funds and the need to clean his money and name via a vanity project. He is a businessman who no doubt runs his business the way real businesses are run. Accept the reality of the Arsenal business model and move on.

  276. Bill; Sorry to labour the point (again). But I saw Stan buyin up the majority shares as part of the board’s attempts to keep Usmanov out. i might be wrong on that. But thats how it looked to me.

  277. Getting Santi Carzola is huuuuggggggeeeeeeee coup!
    He is an exceptional player who definitely gives us something different from what we already have.

    Missed the live bcast of the friendly, glad the young guns pulled it thru.
    I must say I kinda like the white outline around the numbers @ the back…fresh.

    Kos re-upped…
    Theo set to stay…
    Santi on his way…
    Nico & the young ‘uns eager & focused…

    ..Let the fools be hating.

    understand the envy,
    we have AW.

  278. corr: Getting Santi Carzola is a huuuugggggge coup!

  279. arsenalandrew

    Bill – you DID qualify your Nero analogy and clearly didn’t intend it to be taken literally.

    Nonetheless, you are making quite a leap in as far as you feel able to make judgements on matters of financial risk and fiscal prudence over and above that of the professionals we have in place who are actually running the show.

    The problem with making such leaps is that if you are wrong as a result of not having full access to all the background information, you can stand to look pretty foolish.

    If there are quick and easy wins available to the club by following a given route then I’m pretty confident we would be going down that route.

    I certainly don’t feel confident about commenting on this sort of stuff but playing devil’s advocate for the moment (not my favourite phrase btw), I’d be concerned that the club, each season, would become accustomed to working on the basis of a deficit which would then be topped up – or corrected – by the owners.

    The idea that this sum might not need to be as high as those currently floating Oil City et al is neither here nor there; once you set off down that route, it’s a slippery slope.

    Glasgow Rangers has been all but destroyed by a failure to manage sums a fraction of the figures associated with the Sheik’s toys.

    I further suggest to you that there are high numbers of big clubs that now no longer have a clue how to run their businesses within budget.

    It’s a skill I’d prefer AFC never to lose.

  280. Goodness, now Bill is at it? Don’t encourage him Dex. I am sick and tired of reading about business and money. Isn’t this supposed to be an Arsenal i.e. football blog? The Arsenal are back, they’ve just played a game. Although a meaningless friendly wasn’t it just great to see them on the pitch again?

    I missed the first half, so how did Abou look? Did anybody notice any tactical differences? I was a little concerned in the second half at the number of long balls attempted. That was not very Arsenal-like and I wondered if that is a new tactic or an adaptation to the quality of the pitch since it was so hard to get the one touch passing going on that surface?

  281. Anyways, RVP does not “deserve” the “going rate”. I don’t know about anyone else but I find it strange that a player who had one great season is seen as level with Ronaldo and Messi who have done it for seasons. I know he was injured but dat is life! over the last 4 seasons RVP has averaged less goals than Rooney per season, don’t even mention Messi and Ronaldo.

    Suppose RVP does not have a similar season?

    As far as Arsenal, it is Sagna that should be getting the best money. Class and Consistency personified.

    I also cannot understand why the players should get all the money and if the owners have a dime in reserve or in their pockets itis a problem. The thinking to me is that it is all about the players BUT, if the clubs are not run properly, where the heck are the players going to play? I would not put my money on them (the players) forming a league that would be profitable, they would pay themselves the “going rate” and end up bust to backside.

  282. AW, on being close to new signings…
    No [we are not close]. Maybe we will sign a Malaysian player?

    wtf..we lose Robin and NOW he wants to sign a malaysian?????
    might be time to fire this he going senile or what?
    Maybe we should replace Wenger with Stewart least he lives on planet Earth’s Euro-reality..

    Frenchie now in love with asia…tsskk!

  283. Limestonegunner | July 24, 2012 at 10:22 am
    I agree with you , but I can’t compare Bayern Munich to any other club. Their context is unique. The Old Lady? I don’t know if I can be bothered to truly think about that discredited club. Why should anyone take them seriously? Not me. If Juve were that desperate for a World Class striker and desire to compete with the methane blowers they could’ve plumped for Ibrahimovic! I’m with you, and the rest of the inisible minority. Keeping the world’s best striker (Messi is simply a football god) would not be a terrible outcome.

  284. arsenalandrew | July 24, 2012 at 7:43 pm

    Glasgow Rangers no longer exist! Kaputt. The end. It’s over! Someone bought the registration of some of the players, or something like that, and maybe the ground. And so, this new club were asked to join the third or fourth tier of the Fitba league.

  285. So Stan’s share purchase was an altruistic act? He did it to help out the club by maintaining the business model and to keep Usmanov out. He would rather be doing other things but he could see that Young Mr Grace and the supporters were in dire straits and so he…..fixed it for us.

    So we all support St Stanley who saved the club and got us into third place last season, and we hate RvP.

    Have I got that right?

  286. Passenal is right, as usual.

  287. I think you might have drifted too far in the direction of wherever it is you have been drifting , Paul-N.

  288. Notoverthehill

    Yogi, we can now see why Sid Lowe was in the bye-line!

    It would seem that 2 Spanish teams are after the CF Malaga, Champions League spot! Patience is a great virtue, and as I thought the Spanish publication AS printed The Guardian nonsense.

    Source apparently was this: Sería

    The question is: would The Arsenal tap up a player who has a contract with CF Malaga? I do not believe it!

  289. I enjoyed the match plunditry too, thanks.

    I also enjoyed my lucky prophecy the other day: Amla. I told you all that missed half chance (when on 40 not out) was serious News.

  290. Naaah. I have been watching RvP very carefully for eight years. He is not a one season wonder. He is most certainly world class and would have been recognised so long ago but for injuries. Doesn’t make him less world class now. Just because you think he is greedy does not mean that he is not world class.

    Frimpong in trouble thanks to responding to some Spud _ _ _ once young footballers got into trouble in pubs and nightclubs, now it’s because of Twitter, sign of the times I guess.

  292. That is quite alright Frank. With all due respect, i am not the one who has been making things up and drifting back and forth.

  293. arsenalandrew

    Finsbury – that’s right, and apart from a huge ground and vast support, the rest is gone.

    Interestingly, only time will tell if Rangers’ demise leads to further collapse north of the border …

    Again, the point is, in this instance, an entire league has been threatened as a result of ill-advised dabbling in numbers considerably smaller than those figures tossed around with gay abandon by the Mancs and their ilk.

  294. Dexter at 7:26 pm

    “Stan stands to make literally hundreds of millions”

    Says who Bill? More baseless nonsense I am afraid. Unless he is about to sell up for a huge profit and it hasnt broke in the UK as yet?

    I agree with Dex. Between Bill and Ateeb my head hurts. Yin and Yan.

    The nonsense that Stan is sitting on a pile of profits is simply cheap political propaganda. Are you guys going to change the laws of capitalism? Stan had to borrow 300Million from Deustche Bank to buy out Lady Nina, Peter Hill-Wood et al. He is no oil sheik pissing away his country’s patrimony. To expect him to cough up more cash to finance the operating needs of an already profitable club is simply laughable. But why make a few facts get in the way of populist thinking?

  295. Passenal.

    It’s only redundant and boring when it’s something you dont like to hear.

    I have an idea for a new and interesting topic. How about the awful media and cheating refs and how unfair everything is for Arsenal. 😄

    The topic of club finances is redundant and boring, but it is the single most important thing that will shape the clubs future direction. I agree it’s dry but should we really avoid it especially in the summer when almost everything is about money and transfers etc. etc.?

  296. Frank, I did not say that RVP was not world class. I said he does not deserve to be paid like Messi and Ronaldo because he has given only us one wonderful season. Yes, it was injuries but I believe consistency should have its say.

  297. Here we go, for all the boiling Vat enthusiasts:

    Sevco Scotland Limited, trading as The Rangers Football Club.
    Otherwise known as Newco Rangers. According to gospel of Wiki.

    So, no one knows what they are called. “The club formerly know as Club 12″ how about that? It will be intreresting to see if they get stripped of baubles, and then insist upon holding onto them. Then we can chuck them inot the basket along with the Juventus.

    Hack: ” Arsenal aint won nuffink! It’s a disgwace! Right that’s next months Arsenal news boss, how about something else…di you all hear about ” *thwack*. Yup. He bit the hand.

  298. pedantic george

    RVP is a very good player,verging on great.He is also a bit of a prick,verging on cunt.

  299. Arsenal Andrew.

    We do wrapped up in hyperbole sometimes to make a point. Bottom line is I want the club to win things and I want our owners to want the same thing and I think the course they have chosen is overly conservative and dogmatic and it’s hurt the club and benifits only a few people at the top of our food chain. Enough said for today.

  300. AW,
    on being close to new signings…
    “No [we are not close]. Maybe we will sign a Malaysian player?”

    “..*cough*cough*…i mean a Malaga player…?”

    lol..that guy!

  301. AW is universe-class!

  302. Eisrep nav Nibor’s love-polarity’s been reversed till the picture’s clear and definite.
    I speaketh NOT his eman on this day.

  303. Oh I’m not drifting, Paul-N. far from it. I am hurtling from one possibility to the next as each day of this saga goes by. Never in doubt about RvP world-classness though. Never in doubt that we would be better with him in than out.

    Today though I learned that the Board are great and that Stanley is a saint. Just trying to get used to these ideas. Board good. Turn up at football ground to watch products of Board.

    Waaaan Board…there’s only waarrraaannn Board…there’s only waaaran Board

    Stanerley Kronky…clickclickclick…Stanerley Kronky…clickclickclick


    This isn’t working for me, sorry.

  304. “The Old Lady? I don’t know if I can be bothered to truly think about that discredited club. Why should anyone take them seriously? Not me. If Juve were that desperate for a World Class striker and desire to compete with the methane blowers they could’ve plumped for Ibrahimovic!”

    Maybe they did. Maybe they were outbid. Maybe Inter didn’t want to sell to a rival.

  305. or it may have come down to “Ibra, your next team won’t buy you unless you come to terms with them. You’ve worked in the great cities of Amsterdam, Barcelona and Milan…….would you prefer to go to Paris or ugh, Turin?””

  306. Frank, I am not drifting at all, I am just calling this rubbish how I see it.

    Well RVP was a saint for you, wasnt he?

  307. pedantic george

    The trouble is that despite Robin’s greatness as a player ,his actions might have made it better without him.One bad Apple and all that .
    There cant be no doubt a large number of the fan base have , at very least,lost their love for him.

  308. Round and round the argument goes. Just another day on ACLF 🙂

    People will nitpick and focus on semantics, just to make a point and to be seen to be winning an argument. For instance, how anyone can question the FACT that Stan is at Arsenal for the money (short or long term) is beyond me. What the heck other reason is here for? His deep love for ‘soccer’ and trophies?

  309. Last thing, If we do sign carzola along with giroud and podolski before we sell anyone that would certainly be a big step in the right direction for the club. IMO

  310. I jumped the gun earlier when I said we signed Cazorla. We’ve come to terms with him but not with Malaga. who have a deadline of July 31 to settle their debts. Considering the wealth of the owners and the more than €150m poured into the club over the past two years, the owners reluctance to ante up this cash is baffling. i suspect he’ll (owner al Thani) find the cash in a pocket of a dirty thobe (Arab apparel) while on the way to the wash. He’s probably enjoying the little press his team gets outside of Malaga.

  311. ” For instance, how anyone can question the FACT that Stan is at Arsenal for the money (short or long term) is beyond me. What the heck other reason is here for? His deep love for ‘soccer’ and trophies?”

    Well as his other sports franchises attest, we know it sin’t for the trophies, that’s for sure.
    So what about the pies? Maybe his rich wife has him on a strict diet and this is the only way to eat junk out of eyesight of her.

  312. if all thats owed is less than 10m…logically, Santi ain’t leaving Malaga.
    Thanks for downgrading my high there Philmar

  313. pedantic george

    henristic .Good point.The only question is whether or not he is good for the club or not.

  314. “Stan stands to make literally hundreds of

    I mean, why is this statement the least bit controversial? Is Stan not a businessman? Like Passenal just said, he’s not a sugar-daddy like Abramovich et al. Unlike these guys, he’s going to try his darndest to make money from Arsenal and chances are, he’ll succeed. Especially if the mediarights thingy works out.

    Unfortunately his making money doesn’t necessarily require that we win trophies or progress better than we’ve been doing. He’s fine with not changing anything, except maybe ticket prices.

  315. ‘ I’d be concerned that the club, each season, would become accustomed to working on the basis of a deficit which would then be topped up – or corrected – by the owners.

    The idea that this sum might not need to be as high as those currently floating Oil City et al is neither here nor there; once you set off down that route, it’s a slippery slope.’

    i agree with andrew

  316. “Last thing, If we do sign carzola along with giroud and podolski before we sell anyone that would certainly be a big step in the right direction for the club”

    yes it is a biiig step but it doesn’t vector in what I feel is the proper direction.
    Personally i felt we needed to improve the defense if we were interested in challenging. 8th best defense doesn’t win titles and guarantees battling for CL spots. Praying freak injuries don’t re-occur and that Bouldy will mould them in to a coherent screen seems like a cost effective solution…but what if Szchesny goes down? And Song could be in Africa or a long period and there’s also an adaptation/rest period after the African games.

    I support all the moves thus far but we really need a reliable backup and Defensive MF. If we are just playing chicken with Rennes over Mvila and buy him later in the window then this could be the best summer we’ve had in a long while (even IF we sell van Purse)

  317. I didn’t want to get drawn into this boring conversation again, but who said anything about altruism Frank? I said he’s a businessman, but he was considered the lesser of two evils as he was willing to support the self-sustaining model.

    Bill, it’s not what you say, it’s the fact that you say it again and again that I find redundant and boring. I must return to the scroll button again since I have lost all interest in this topic.

  318. Lol Philmar,
    Great theory, except he hardly goes to games. How will he get said pies? 🙂

  319. pedantic george

    “He’s fine with not changing anything, except maybe ticket prices.” Objection ,Hearsay!

  320. Notoverthehill


    DO NOT confuse Arsenal Broadband Ltd (including Arsenal Media) with Arsenal Media Inc.

    The latter is in your backyard, Montréal?

  321. i think as a businessman, stan would be in full agreement with the self-sustaining model, since it meant he wouldnt need to pump in any more money than is necessary.

    i think given a choice, i would want neither usmanov nor stan. but stan seems to be the lesser of two evils…

    i think we have values at this club we want to uphold.

  322. With apologies to Passenal, my tuppence worth:

    Henristic – For instance, how anyone can question the FACT that Stan is at Arsenal for the money (short or long term) is beyond me.

    If we take this as a FACT, we should note that he is currently paying out no dividends to himself or any body else (so no short term profits on the club). Presumably then, he intends to make his money from the share price, when he eventually sells up.

    As far as I can see nobody has suggested a sensible way for Kroenke to invest more money that will not jeopardise his potential long-term profit. Rights issues will dilute his holding, and outstanding loans will reduce the value of the club and thus the share price.

    So we find that that the people banging on about paying the market or “going” rate for players are asking Kroenke to simply fund their dreams to his own detriment, whilst they pretend to understand economics.

    If Kroenke gave Wenger £200m to strengthen the team, how can he get it back out without damaging his original investment? And if he can’t then it’s a gift not an investment, and some people really need to get real about the way successful business ventures are run.

  323. I think we need to keep the excitement about Cazorla in check. There appears to be a power vacuum at the club as the owners seem to have either lost interest or the club has fallen down their list of priorities and the guy who was in charge died recently, so I’m not sure who Arsenal would be negotiating with and whether anyone has the mandate to sanction the sale. I fear another Mata situation might be brewing, so I am certainly taking my own advice!

  324. Philmar @ 8.40
    Sorry if my flippant remarks were misleading. I hope ‘into the basket along with the Juventus’ worked. Though I don’t imagine many footballers would agree with what I think of Juve, and would play for them if given the option. As for ibrahimovic, he’s a good footballer and I would enjoy an AFC victory over his PSG team.

  325. Blackburn northerner – you are a nasty, evil, egotistic person. We shall not pray for you. Twat!

  326. Umwhat?

  327. pedantic george

    OMPas.Best to worry about your own clear lack of self esteme ,rather than my ego.

  328. arsenalandrew

    Has the site gone totally random?

    Who’s next to lose their prayer status?

  329. Limestonegunner

    Passenal, I’ve mentioned the issue of the Arsenal media company and Kroenke’s ownership of it maybe one or two times previously in three years. It doesn’t strike me as excessive, especially when it might be relevant to a discussion about our finances and what ownership can do within a self-financing model.
    I think you agree exaggerating somewhat.

    But I understand your frustration with the enervating subject.
    I don’t like talking about it either, but I do care about the club. Arsenal have made such a point of pride about it and AW’s less expensive approach as have many fans, including you, that it is part of Arsenal talk in a profound way. We all have to be concerned if even a penny goes out of our club’s possible revenues because we know that not even a penny is coming in from the owner. That’s why the costs of Kroenke’s ownership need to be examined. The 4 million or so in legal and other fees the club paid for his takeover of majority shareholder, the question of whether he has taken a loan to finance his share purchase and how that is financed, and above all the current and future revenues of Arsenal Broadband LLC or whatever it is called. I think you have to accept the sad fact that these issues are of such importance to supporters of our club now. I don’t accept lesser of two evilism. It’s still evil.

  330. Limestonegunner

    I won’t Notoverthehill, but I am glad you are looking into it further. Please let us know more about what you might find. Cheers! Btw, between Montreal and Toronto in the beautiful thousand islands area and north eastern shore of lake Ontario!

  331. ““Stan stands to make literally hundreds of

    I mean, why is this statement the least bit controversial? Is Stan not a businessman? ”

    I don’t think anyone is saying he should not make a profit. I think what people are saying is that they’d prefer instead of him eventually making (pulling a number out of my hat) 200 hundred million that he decides 150 million is enough and that 50 million of the forgone profit be used to buy players…you know, invest in the competitive fortune of the team and go for a trophy or two. Some people hold the soon-to-become-romantic notion that the team exists to win trophies rather than reward investors and pay employee salaries.

    I think the people suggesting Stan should spend more of the profit to re-invest in the team are the flip side of the people calling RvP a greedy bastard. Both sides expect either the player or the owner to not be thinking only in their narrow self interest but rather in the interests of the club. But of course that’s wishful thinking of people who aren’t in the position of either owner or player. Who really knows what me or you would do in that situation?

  332. FFS,
    At least we are agreed that he’s here for the money 🙂

    The truth I find the kind of owner who wants to make money from a football club as worrying as the sugar daddy type. Football is a notoriously difficult business to make money from, especially in Europe.

    The 2 recent American owners (the former liverpool guys and the Glaziers of manure) of this kind hasn’t turned out great. On the other hand, Berlusconi (presumably a sugar daddy type) hasn’t been that horrible for Milan.
    So the idea that Stan is necessarily our best option doesn’t quite sit well with me yet. We don’t know that he’ll not try to take dividends at some point in the future and I find it weird that people just seem to take his word for it.

    BTW, I’ve got no time for the Uzbek either, but that doesn’t mean I have to be ok with Stan.

  333. pedantic george

    Philmar .The team exists to play football and compete.

  334. FFS,
    At least we are agreed that he’s here for the money 🙂

    The truth I find the kind of owner who wants to make money from a football club as worrying as the sugar daddy type. Football is a notoriously difficult business to make money from, especially in Europe. Also consider that
    the 2 recent American owners (the former liverpool guys and the Glaziers of manure) of this kind hasn’t turned out great. On the other hand, Berlusconi (presumably a sugar daddy type) hasn’t been that horrible for Milan.

    So the idea that Stan is necessarily our best option doesn’t quite sit well with me yet. We don’t know that he’ll not try to take dividends at some point in the future and I find it weird that people just seem to take his word for it. I’m sure there are other ways he might choose the bleed the club if his fortunes outside Arsenal suddenly nosedives for example.

    BTW, I’ve got no time for the Uzbek either, but that doesn’t mean I have to be ok with Stan.

  335. pedantic george

    Henristic.Do you think we should disbelieve him on the basis that he might be lying .Or accept that he desarves to be trusted as up until now ,he has kept his word?

  336. A few questions: How much profit has the team made and how much has been put into the playing side of things. How much of the profit has gone into the board members/owner’s pocket? has any of the profit gone to fund anything else? When there is a profit, is it only supposed to go to players?

  337. Henristic – Whether we believe him or not is immaterial. He’s perfectly entitled to take a dividend if he wishes. And as far as I’m aware, he’s yet to be found out lying about anything.

    Paul – I thought somebody published the level of directors’ renumeration on this site a few days ago. I was also under the impression that the profits made by the club were retained to reduce the debt, rather than paid out as dividends.

  338. “Philmar .The team exists to play football and compete.”

    Fair enough. So what about football owners that earn large profits, do not re-invest the profits to make the team more competitive and choose to earn obscene amounts of money by increasing share value rather than trying to win trophies? Are these guys greedy cunts in your opinion?

  339. pedantic george

    Can you name some owners who have earned large profits and did not try to win trophies?Philmar?

  340. I have no particular wish for Stanley to put money into the club. I just think that we need to be more ‘innovative’, rather than ‘enervative’ in our approach to retaining world class players. I want to keep RvP. Don’t give a fuck what the supporters think. As soon as he starts scoring we will all be singing his praises. His job is to keep scoring goals. Stanley’s job is to keep RvP.

  341. pedantic george

    “As soon as he starts scoring we will all be singing his praises”
    Not all of us.Some of us have values that a few goals wont buy.

  342. Who are we talking about Philmar? Which football owners do this? Someone is not a greedy cunt simply because they won’t throw hundreds of millions of pounds into the pockets of some faithless and fickle footballers.

    Arsenal’s share price has risen consistently precisely because we are usually competitive in the big money competitions without jeopardising the long term financial stability of the club.

  343. I don’t need to. It’s a theoretical question. i just want your opinion.

  344. Limestonegunner

    A very good question Philmar. Hope people have read the 7amkickoff article from a couple days ago.

    In any case, if he really is a smart businessman and in it for the long term he might consider that Arsenal have lost three positions in that Forbes list of valuable sports teams and that it would help boost his club’s position to win a major competition every once in a while especially now ahead of the shirt sponsorship– it matters less in the US franchise system as there is no relegation and so much of the revenues are shared out in hockey, basketball, and gridiron. This is what makes you fans globally– and if that can be done playing an entertaining way with a couple big stars of the game without having massive operating debt year after year, so much the better. Fans will admire Arsenal for footballing success as well as its overall approach.

  345. Limestonegunner

    Exactly, Frank, where’s the imagination and innovation on that side of the club? We din’t need a sugar daddy. We need someone with boldness, acumen and such to match and make the most of the genius we have in AW.

  346. FFS Shoot, do you remember when?

    My issue is that people are saying things with authority, some very definitive comments about the board getting big money and all that.

  347. pedantic george

    Well It’s a rather stupid theoretical question.
    And therefore does not warrant an argument.

  348. pedantic george

    Or an answer even

  349. Oh well, if you don’t want to answer it that is your prerogative. But I didn’t expect that you’d hide from the question George.

  350. Limestone, and what tells you that Arsene is not in line with what is going on?

    Wenger said that he will do what is best for the club even though he wants to keep RVP.

    If I was to read your comment at face value, I would swear that the board is intentionally hogtying Wenger. Not only that, but that you have a recorderd conversation or something.

    The club jumping through hoops to keep RVP has nothing to do with boldness as far as I can see, it is succombing to the player. So United were bold in keeping Rooney?

    One more nail.

  351. How did “living the dream” work out for Leeds United? Was their one CL semi-final appearance worth over a decade in the lower levels of the English game? What of Rangers and Portsmouth, should we follow their lead?

    If my wife and kids moaned and moaned about the size of our house and the quality of our lifestyle to the point where I took on a mortgage and loans that I couldn’t afford, who would be to blame when it all went tits up and the house was repossessed? The kids for being “greedy”, or me for giving in to their demands to be spoilt?

    LSG – I’m sure Kroenke would be delighted for the team to win a trophy, however simply throwing money around is no guarantee of success. Was Liverpool’s CC victory worth the £100m investment that the team received? If Stan shovelled in £500m to better compete with City, what’s to stop City increasing their investment to £1billion? Leaving us no better of in terms of trophies, but facing a financially precarious future.

  352. You need to change the avatar from a meerkat to a chicken 😉

  353. Limestonegunner

    PG, if we go to Wigan away and RvP scores, I’ll cheer for the both of us, deal!

  354. Limestonegunner

    Meant to say, deal?

  355. Within the last two weeks Paul, sorry if that’s a bit vague.

  356. Limestonegunner

    Paul-N, I don’t think you have understood anything of what I said there.

  357. Maybe not, Limestone. Your comment at 10:36 seems to make it seem as if the owners and Wenger are not on the same page. The team is wasting the genius of Wenger. My question is what happens if all parties are on the same page.

  358. Have been reading todays posts. I do not understand the criticism of SK. He bought into the club and agreed (seemingly) to abide by the way the board ran the club, with AW having control of who we buy and who we sell. To complain that he does not inject a lot of money from his own pocket when at the same time he does not take anything out of the club, is to me a very hypocritical stance to take. Especially when almost all who post on here complain about the likes of City, with their endless finances. PG rightly stated that the team exists to play football and compete. However, Arsenal the company, must be run in such a manner as to be financially stable to ensure the future competitiveness of said team. One only has to look at Rangers, Portsmouth or Leeds to see how quickly things can spiral out of control. Rednapp was lauded by all and sundry in the media for leading Portsmouth to Cup final glory, only to abandon ship when he realised that it was a hollow victory.

    I tend to believe that a lot of the complaining comes from fans who never followed The Arsenal before AW came along and, let’s be honest here, revolutionised the way we play. “1-0 to The Arsenal” these days is a rarity, it was week-in, week-out back in the day. If we managed to win that is. These days we have a fantastic new stadium, which we paid for ourselves. All the while still competing in the CL every year. It seems to me there are a lot of spoiled Arsenal fans these days who simply cannot understand why we are not winning every year. And some seem to think that the answer is SK throwing money at the club. I for one disagree completely. Then again opinions are like arseholes, every one has one.

  359. Irish;

    As usual, you are a funny yet on the ball poster. I dont get it either man. Not sure why the likes of ex-regulars would want to slate the club in order to portray one hit wonder players as victims of slave labour. Basically we have the best squad in years but our erst while captain wants to know he can tell his kids how many trophies there are in the trophy cabinet, before he has actually won them.

  360. Dex – I agree with regards the squad. I had a quick glimpse of Santos marauding around the pitch today and genuinely burst out laughing! I like the looks of Yennaris (always have) Eisfeld looks pretty sharp when finishing. If RVP must go, let him go. An amazing player to be sure, but look at Ade when he left. Down hill for the most part. Same with most of those who chose money eh, I mean trophies, over The Arsenal. I would love it if Diaby had a monster of a year, I think both we and he deserve one.

    As for slave labor? Sign me up mate!! $50,000 a week and I will take on NB52’s mantle of The Greatest Striker Who Ever Lived!! I mean, it’s not like he set the bar too high, now is it? 🙂

  361. Thank you Irish. I have been hear thinking the same thing. It is funny how the coming of City and Chelsea have caused so many on here to change their tune.

    First and foremost, this was seen to be Arsene’s vision of how the club would go forward, but now all of a sudden Arsene is being hobbled by the board.


  362. hear?

    Yep, these slaves wear diamond encrusted platinum shackles.

  363. Paul-N – A few days ago it was being said that The Arsenal would have to spend $100m to stay competitive. I think it might even have been Sol Cambell. Such an arbitrary figure. And yet once it was in the media I heard it repeated over and over again. Add $5m to that and you could end up buying 3 Andy Carrols!! Fine if your name is Stoke Shitty but I would expect a more astute buying policy from someone such as AW. As far as being ‘hobbled by the board’, complete bollox as far as I am concerned. AW, the board and SK all seem to fully agree on the direction they want The Arsenal to go, even if RVP does not. AW is not a ‘quick-fix’ type of person. He has done the opposite and planned for the next 10, 15, maybe even 20 years of the clubs future. I for one will still be supporting The Arsenal in 2032, I doubt most of those complaining now will be around then.

    I wonder if C-bob could go tinker around with his helicopter and fly forward in time to see if I am right? Or does it only go bckwards in time?

  364. i am with you, bruh!

    another thing i read was that the board were willing to take less money for RVP than Wenger wanted and that was given credence.

  365. Arsenal fans started the, “one nil to The Arsenal” chant. We borrowed it from PSG supporters when we played them in the Cup Winners Cup semi finale 93-94 season. I have no idea where the PSG fans picked it up from. They where singing something like “Allez, Paris St Germain” to the tune of The Pet Shop Boys. By the way we one that 2-1 over two legs. A one all draw in Paris. Followed by a “one nil to The Arsenal” at Highbury. We then went on to meet Parma in the finale. You know the rest. Another great night for The Arsenal.
    As for the, “boring” tag it continues to mystify me. And now it gets propagated by Arsenal fans.

  366. Maceo – I remember hearing “1 nil to The Arsenal” long before the PSG game mate but yes, the boring tag always bothered me. Not so much these days it must be said 🙂

  367. Not in the English league and not about Arsenal. Other teams fans complained about us winning “one nil”. But they never had a song for it.

  368. It is late evening where I am so, with all due respect to Passenal, I have 2cts more to add to this “boring” subject.

    Unless someone going to lead a revolution to overturn the “capitalists” (SK and AU) who own over 60% of the club, I am afraid all this anti-Stan rhetoric is simply political posturing. Stan borrowed 300 million to save the former majority-owners of Arsenal from a hostile take over by the Uzbek. In return he agreed to pursue the self-sustaining policy that made the club so successful to date. He has agreed to take no dividends and to reinvest the profits into the club. AFC, next to ManU, is the most profitable football club in England.

    In light of the above, why the fook would Stan and the Board now agree to a lose-lose proposition of financing hyper wages starting with RVP? By giving RVP, at 29, Manchester City type salaries, would inevitably snowball over time into inflated salaries for the playing staff. That is the predictable consequence of “paying the going rate” (whatever that is) as some now argue. For sake of a trophy-run with no guarantee of success, I am yet to be persuaded that this is a policy that is good for the club in the long run.

  369. Limestonegunner

    As I said, we don’t need no stinking sugar daddies. Also never said he was hamstrung by the board; can’t know that. Making a great many assumptions, Paul-N, to fit into some polarized dichotomy. More than one or two ways to skin a self-sufficient cat, btw. 🙂

  370. Really enjoyed this video, make sure you have the sound on!!

  371. Limestonegunner

    I’d love to start a revolution against them. I was publicly in favor of plural ownership by fans of the club as was the case before either billionaire and said so before the takeover. I supported fan share but was prevented from joining it as a non-UK resident.
    So how do we do it, Shotta? We are ready to follow your lead. Or is this radical mien just political posturing?

  372. Irishgray, cracking find on the video. Roll on, the up coming season.

  373. Maceo – Cheers man, really enjoyed that one I have to say. Interesting that we stole the ‘1 nil to The Arsenal’ from PSG. Did a quick look onine, it appears their fans were not too impressed with our fans adopting the song as their own. While, apparently, completely ignoring the fact that it began life in the Bundesliga. Sounds a bit like the ‘Mexican Wave’. First seen by most football fans at the ’86 World Cup held in Mexico, hence the name. Although there are many different claims as to who first came up with it, most agree that it was Seattle who popularised it in the States and it spread from there.

  374. Here’s an old article I came across. If you think the FA in England, or for that matter UEFA, are inept, spare a thought for these poor bastards:-

    It has a short video link at the end which has some commentary on it, too funny 🙂 you really could not make this up!

  375. Zp,

    ‘When we make “definitive” statements without facts, it is rather silly.’

    I totally agree with that, except I am surprised that having said that you continue to support the line that is calling our captain all sort’s of names from Van Pursey to Cunts. Since you’re saying we don’t have facts, than why take the pessimistic and catastrophic account of this situation.

    With all due respect when it comes to playing arm chair managers, your comments have been verging on absurdity. You like the rest of the ACLF ‘old guard’ bar a few, have continued to make false and contradictory statements based on morals and ethics which collapse on their own weight when one considers that you don’t want to pay him what RVP deserves.

    Moreover you’ve also been lying to make your points. We DO KNOW how much the world class players are paid although we do not know how much he’s been offered. Judging from his character and class, I do suspect that he’s not been offered more than 130,000 which is a shame to his talents.

    It seems that you’re quite impressed by United’s dealing and I agree because they’ve been winning trophies as well while making profits. If you see how they operate, it’s clear that they are not static like us, but innovate and flexible just as Frank and others are asking for. You’ve always had this problem of romanticisng this ‘youth development’ thing, which frankly doesn’t work unless you have some experience as well. A case in point, is our shift in our approach over the last years.

    ‘As for the others, Chelsea, Liverpool, Spurs, Newcastle – we discount these “examples” of how “best” to do things because they finished lower than we did and under-achieved compared to the hype.’

    Well unlike you, I am not comparing ourselves to the lower teams, but comparing to the top teams in Europe. Most of you have grown a habbit of defending Arsenal’s policies and ‘lack of trophies’ by comparing to lower teams. I am looking towards the top teams in Europe, which is where we should be competing. And if you look around, without your profit-tinted glasses you’ll see that there aren’t just 2-3 players being paid a lot of wages, but every club has 2-3 players that are paid comparatively much more than the rest, which reflects the players talents. What is astounding though, is that given we have only one truly exceptional player who we can easily pay the amount of salary that he would get in any top club in Europe, I don’t see the problem. We don’t even need to pay the salary, but being innovative can pay him a signing on bonus etc.

    And that whole ‘age’ argument is utter nonsense. As far as football goes, I don’t think Robin is going to decline anytime soon, because he doesn’t rely on his pace too much. He’s an exceptional player.

    Moreover, if you’re all turned into greedy moneybags recently, I am surprised that nobody bothered replying to the suggestion that keeping him will bring more profits, from shirt sales to the image of the club. If he leaves, we’ll be without a world class player in our squad, who broke shit lot of records last season.

    And this hypothesis that all of you erect to stick to your profit-tinted views that paying Robin the right amount would lead to relegation and bankruptcy is nothing but a load of bollocks. It’s quite laughable as well, given that nobody has come up with one convincing argument about why we shouldn’t keep him or pay him as every world class player is paid. And let’s not talk about models, because to you the club is nothing but a company that should always prioritize profits over success. And lastly, spending money has led to success in teams around us. What is more pertinent is that we don’t have to spend too much insane money to succeed since we are in a strong position. We just need to start keeping our best players which we haven’t been able to do so. If that means showing flexibility on wages, so be it.

    And since you’re so proud that we finished on top of Newcastle, Pool, Spurs and Chelsea, which it seems you can’t praise enough Stan, you’re forgetting the player who actually drove the team to that position-sometimes completely on his own-was Robin. Without him we wouldn’t have finished where we did, and frankly speaking, without him I doubt we would be able to compete with the likes of United, City and Chelsea given that they were already stronger than us. What none of them had was Robin. And with the addition of Podolski and Giroud, we can really compete for the title, instead of finding ourselves 20 points behind them by January.

    It’s laughable that the profit tinted glasses gloss over the facts and undermine players in other teams, which have strengthened a lot in the last few seasons. Keeping Robin is a necessity.

  376. ‘I have all I need, more than I could ever eat in my football appetite. I feel priviliged. I feel sorry for City fans and Chelsea Daves, how hollow their ridiculous success. I don’t want that meal’.

    How about we approach this a bit differntly, which is also opposite to my own position over the last few years? Sure I too like the way we’ve approached football, but it’s not like we haven’t paid to buy players as well. So the only problem most of you find is paying more than this mythical threshold after which the club buying a player lacks class. Don’t forget we’ve bought a lot of players for a lot of money, although at a relatively young age. As for the youth development, kindly give me the names of the players who’ve gone through the Arsenal academy and are playing in OUR first team at the moment. We’ve bought players cheaper than some clubs, because we can attract them easily given the image of the club (which is slowly deteriorating as we continue to sell our best players and not win trophies). And where does this leave lower teams who don’t have sugar daddies? Should there always remain a gap between the likes of United, Pool and Us and the rest? Which good players would choose to go to smaller teams instead of the top three, that have historically been stronger than the rest? Of course teams pay more than us, that is how football works. So the likes of Castle, Spurs, and others have to pay more than us, which reflects the football hierarchy rather than any ‘immoral acts’ on their part. City had to pay over the top for those players because that is the only way they could succeed. So you’re saying the only teams who have the right to succeed are the historically top 3-4 clubs while the rest should eternally remain tied to their lower league players since they can’t compete with other clubs(attracting players either through capital or social capital (Image of club, managers etc). Just as you feel ‘out bid’ by the likes of City and all, we’ve been outbidding a lot of smaller clubs for decades. Just as Southhapton has lost great players over the years, such as Theo, Bale and now the OX. That is the reality of the situation.

    As for tapping up players, we’ve not operated any differently to any other clubs, Chamakh, Nasri and Arshavin were ‘tapped-up’ as are other young players, although we don’t do it publicly because that brings in competition. Let’s get honest with ourselves and stop this bullshit about how ethical business practices are and shit like that. We’re operating not too differently than others. What though is beginning to become clear is that we’re losing the ‘young players’ that we buy cheap when they’re touching their peak. Which is what we need to stop. As for enjoying football, I understand Bob’s comments about the abstractions of money, I too am not pleased about these things, but that’s the reality of our world. To me what matters more is the wish to see these young players have success with us rather than anywhere else. I am not just a supporter of Arsenal, but of the players on the pitch as well. And I’d rather watch Robin than any other striker in our team because that man has fought for us over the seasons and is beginning to fulfil his potential. If that means he is paid as much as any other world class player is paid, so be it. I couldn’t give a fuck about Stan’s profits and neither am I convinced about any of these bullshit arguments that we’ll go into administration if we pay Robin(or any other player that develops into a world class one in our team in the future) the wages that he deserves.

    It’s been horrifying that most of the ACLF have gone to curse our captain which is quite unethical and embarrassing for our club. We don’t know shit about what’s Robin been offered neither his demands or grievances with the club. He’s our captain and all you fucks and cunts should respect that until we find otherwise about the situation. If you want the club to succeed and want to see our best players playing for us, than stop with this bullshit nonsense about profits. To me, if Robin is asking for more wages, than his position is not too different from any of you, because you’re both fetishizing money.

    RVP Click click click………..!!!

  377. You are a star, Ateeb

    Having tried other ways this is the position I feel most comfortable with.

    Robin Van Persie….clickclickclick

    Robin Van Persie….clickclickclick

    Arsenal! Arsenal! Arsenal!

  378. Something on your mind, Atreeb, my brother?

    A few phrases there that don’t really resonate with my reading of the ‘debate’ over the last few weeks. A few more contentious ones as well.

    “..the profit tinted glasses..” Can’t say that many on here care tuppence for millionnaires making profits, more an understanding that that is what owners of businesses do.

    “You like the rest of the ACLF ‘old guard’ bar a few, have continued to make false and contradictory statements based on morals and ethics which collapse on their own weight when one considers that you don’t want to pay him what RVP deserves. ” I don’t think that because some attempt, in a benighted time, to live by certain principles, that your statement holds true. As for what RVP deserves, well, that is surely a matter of opinion.

    “Moreover you’ve also been lying to make your points.” Harsh words. To me it seems that whether we know, what ‘world class players’ are oferred or not, to pay such salaries is just ridiculous – unless you are on a mission to obtain bragging rights at the Russian Oligarchs Club or Oil States Futures. I won’t say immoral.

    “….we don’t have to spend too much insane money to succeed since we are in a strong position. We just need to start keeping our best players which we haven’t been able to do so. If that means showing flexibility on wages, so be it.” I think Arsenal; are doing that. Was RVP offerred more money to stay than we have previously paid any other player. That may be conjecture but is, I suspect, true.

    “’re forgetting the player who actually drove the team to that position-sometimes completely on his own-was Robin.” The last time I watched a match it was a team game. Further, no one can know the alternative future’s that may have existed if RVP had, say, been injured last season and replaced by another, possibly from outside the club. Also, he was in the team to do exactly what he did, what he was paid for. He wasn’t, like Stan, omn an altruistic mission.

    I really don’t understand why you are persueing this line with such venom. ACLF still seems a relative bastion of sense in an insane football world. As Irish says, people have opinions. No one here is running down the club or manager or team. Well, you are running down the club I suppose.

  379. Ateeb is getting behind the players, Bob. All of them. As to the green and pleasant land you describe as ACLF. I don’t recognise it. I had hoped it was edgier than that.

  380. No player is bigger than the club.

  381. I have just read your second post.

    A confusion of understanding of people’s points, perhaps?

    “..stop this bullshit about how ethical business practices are and shit like that. ”

    Personnally, I don’t give two hoots for most businesses, although you will conceed that some businesses are run ethically? I make no clkaim that Arsenal are one of those.

    It is my own ethics that I care about. I understand that to be true of others too.

    Following football at all gives me difficulties in that regard. There comes a point on the insane merry-go-round that is football when I can no longer stand the necessary convolutions to stay onboard.

  382. Putting words in my mouth, Frank.

    As for getting behind the players, I always have.

    When they kick the club, I lose interest in them.

  383. Surprisingly elusive notion that club thing, Evil

  384. Well supporters kick the manager and players all the time, so I guess a player taking a swipe at the ‘club’ or even disagreeing with the club ought to be acceptable. Probably depends upon the outcome. I would like to think that we can keep a player of that calibre in the squad once in a while.

  385. @Frank
    it shouldn’t be. Unless there is good reason — say, wages not getting paid or a player being treated unfairly (and I am talking now about things like racism from the staff, homophobia or being forced to share a room with Joey Barton) — a player should never openly go out against the club. Especially not, when that player is captain. And when the club seems to have been doing exactly what the player is saying they haven’t.

  386. Some supporters kick the club and the manager, Frank.

  387. To hell with it
    One ATTACKING MIDFIELDER and wee are set. Rvp can stay or leave.
    Lets model a good squad of players with no emphasis on superstars. No more of this crap every year. We will overcome any adversary.

  388. Good morning and good write up. YW
    for news and photos from Malaysian tour give. ARSENAL HEART a try
    nice video too

  389. Whether he has ‘gone against’ the ‘club’ or not will surely depend upon the outcome, Evil.If he stays and we win the EPL with his contribution we can hardly say that he has gone against the club. If he goes….well that might be a different story.

    he deserves as much. We all know what he is capable of.


  391. Robin Van Persie…..CachingCachingCaching

  392. Limestonegunner

    In all this wrangling over ultimate questions, some of the details that enrich our lives as gooners have been neglected without the usual obsessiveness.

    Let’s turn to the serious matter of AW’s new look specs. Yay or nay?! I just got new frames for the first time in 8 years, so I can empathize with the need for a change and how jarring it can be for all concerned. But I think it is a bit of an extreme on the fashion end for him. What happened to his contact lenses?

  393. Ateeb, is something wrong in your personal life. So you say that people should not call RVP names and then you call everyone names.

    It is RVP who put out a statement that put the club in turmoil.
    You have disrespected the club saying they have no ambition. Ambition by whose standard? and are you saying that you could do better? if so why don’t you contact SK and offer your superior knowledge and abilities.

    RVP issues are irrelevant, the right thing to do is not throw the team under the bus. A team that has stood by his crocked backside for years. If the club felt it was all good they would not made any comment right after. Obviously there was a need by the club to counter what he said.

    As far as what RVP deserves and people not wanting him to get paid it. How can that be taken seriously. First and foremost a player that has injury problems and has hardly played should not get paid along with those who have been doing it for years. Take a step back and you will see that it is a big risk for Arsenal to take or any team.

    Anyway, as has been said, most clubs are not financially stable, the clubs that pay the big wages are not run properly so how you come to this deserving argument is beyond me. Sickening stuff.

  394. What on earth is wenger keeping chamakh for? The guy looks more real to me than false.Lolss

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