Money And The Woes It Causes

Inevitably attention is being focussed on transfer budgets for the forthcoming window. That makes it sound like the panacea to all Arsenal ills is about to arrive. In truth all it heralds is the announcement of the financial results which will include the profits on the sales of Fabregas and Nasri. It is going to be the cue for a lot of navel gazing and tubthumping over the who’s, what’s and why’s of previous activity in transfer windows.

I am not going to defend the transfer policy, both the manager and the club got it horribly wrong last Summer. The form this season has suffered through not having replacements sourced before the sale of Fabregas and Nasri. It seemed there was an incoherence in the signings made; Benayoun and Park to compete with Arshavin and Gervinho? That is too crowded from that position, even allowing for the latter’s departure to the ACN this Winter.

The Mirror believe that the budget will be £50m, based on the profits of last Summer. It seems a believable figure. Certainly more accurate the £57m quoted by Steve Stammers in the yesterday’s Sunday Mirror.

In Arsenal’s history, this is a big pot. Relatively speaking it is not and there is a strong possibility that it is actually going to be smaller. The club has made it clear previously that contract extensions come from the transfer budget; this is where Arsene has invested heavily over the years. Some argue that it has been badly managed. Those criticisms come with the benefit of hindsight. Few complained when Fabregas was given his new contract a couple of years ago, most relieved that he had committed to the club.

This time, Robin van Persie and Theo Walcott look likely to benefit which will diminish the funds available to the manager. If between them, they were offered a combined increase of £75k per week over three years that removes £12m from the budget which is where the £50m does not allow the signing of some players demanded. Mario Goetze for example, is regularly appended to a fee of £30m. That seems to be out of Arsenal’s reach especially if they have to pay a signing on fee and agent for their involvement. That would boost the cost of that signing to around £37m at an estimate.

That juggling act is the source of contention and highlights why Arsenal need sales to bolster the transfer fund. Those who argue that we are a selling club, that this is a betrayal of the spin put on the move to the new stadium have fundamentally misunderstood how self-sufficiency works. You have to sell to grow; invest to reap the benefits, all the while balancing the books to comply with banking convenants and the like.

If the manager chooses not to invest, it is not that he does not want to, simply that he cannot. For example, there was no activity this Winter as there was not space in the squad without sales. Underlining how difficult the current situation is for the club is that Almunia had to be dropped from the 25 man squad to accommodate Henry for six weeks. That is of their own making.

Had there been a player or two moving on, the manager might still not have invested. Finding players who are available depends on the selling club wanting to deal and the player wanting to move. The former and latter are not mutually inclusive, particularly if an ego believes a better financial offer may come in the Summer. I read comments that note we should make the clubs an offer they cannot refuse. In other words, pay whatever it costs to get whomever. These will be the same people who are quick to criticise overspending on one player despite their initial clamour.

The point of the above is a reality bite to those who demand Hazard or Goetze or whomever is the latest fashion accessory in fantasy football world. One of them can be signed but that means selling more members of the squad and not replacing them in the same quantity. This season has shown us one thing; injuries mean we need quantity and quality in replacements.

It is crucial that we understand the business model of the club; it underpins the activity to support on the pitch performance. Arguably, the low level of commercial revenues now is manifesting in the current season. There are external factors to this but that cannot be ignored. However, those deals got the new stadium built at a time when financial deals with banks were in danger of collapsing. We cannot apply hindsight and how other clubs have generated new wealth in the meantime. The deals were needed at the time.

This might be something that KSE drive more robustly. Arsenal seem to have been slow to exploit the secondary sponsor markets. Emirates have stifled the chance to exploit other kits and equipment, denying Arsenal the chance to capitalise in the same way that United did with DHL. But this is just one example; United have three times as many secondary partners as Arsenal. They have a more established brand globally but Arsenal’s is not so bad as to justify that gap, surely?

That is not a cue for Usmanov’s supporters to tell us how great he will be. He has made offers, they are not denied but a rights issue had an ulterior motive on his part; it was not done primarily to help the club. PR speak about how much money he would spend to clear debt or give a transfer budget is vacuous; it is easy to make promises when you don’t have to deliver. It is why all politicians are hopeful of winning power.

Ultimately, Red and White want the same from Arsenal that KSE do. Profit. That offers a Return on Investment and I sometimes think we are too hung up on this. What is so wrong with the owners taking a dividend? Until you look at the now and realise that it impinges on the transfer pot.

This coming window is going to have to be busy. Arsenal cannot afford for it not to be. That point is some way off in the future and our focus must be on the pitch until May.

Over at Arsenal On This Day, a time when we fought Manchester United not each other.

’til Tomorrow.

Posted on February 20, 2012, in Arsenal, Football, Premier League, Soccer, Transfer Gossip and tagged , , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 495 Comments.

  1. and meanwhile, the Mirror is already making excuses for Spuds in case they lose this sunday.

  2. LoveTheWayYouPlay

    I agree that it is important to understand the financial side to understand Arsenal’s situation and be patient

  3. excuses excuses excuses – more of the same excuses for defending Wenger and the board.
    if money is in short supply then do you not question how it is spent. do you think giving djourou a new improved contract is the way to go???? we need to be getting rid of the dross , not improving their contracts – that is down to Wenger – no one else
    my other point is that if this is how the team responded at Sunderland to the bollocking they got from Wenger after Milan then there is no doubt he has lost the dressing room

  4. Wenger has made every arsenal fan financial literate and he uses finances as his excuse. Martin O’neil did not spend millions before changing the fortures of a sunderland team that was struggling under Steve Bruce.
    Wenger’s arrogance and know it all attitude is the problem with this team. How can Arsene say in the media that 4th is a trophy, what message is he passing to the boys? The team plays without passion and thats one thing money can’t buy rather its instilled in the player by the manager.

  5. robn

    Be a good chap and read the post before commenting. It saves people a lot of trouble in having to abuse you.

    Do you think they need that stress of having to find new ways to insult you?
    Do you think they enjoy it?

    Oh…

  6. Yogi.That is not what a lot of people want to be told.
    The truth is most inconvenient to their argument.
    Some will still insist that the £100 million liquid funds are asking to be spent on Hazard and his like.

  7. as for you mentioning that no one complained when Cesc got a new contract – are you for real ?????
    these are the players we want tied to long term contracts not Rosicky, Djourou et al
    cant actually believe you wrote that – shows how out of touch you are

  8. Azed

    Obviously he’s passing on a message you don’t comprehend; fourth is something that they have to fight for, to want to ‘win’, to want to play Champions League football. In that sense, I understand his use of the word ‘trophy’.

    The players ought not to need to have passion instilled in them; it is a characteristic of the winning mentality that is required.

  9. Great post robn.
    Yogi if Wenger is responsible for the success during his time, can you please tell me who is responsible for the failures of the last 3 seasons??

  10. I was bit too late with that post.Two halfwits beat me to the punch.

  11. robn

    I told you to read the post before commenting.

  12. I have never said AW is responsible for the successes on his own; you however want to pin the failures all down to him.

    The only person I have said was not solely responsible for the successes was David Dein.

  13. Yogi,shut the front door ffs

  14. unfortunately i did read your post – i really wish i hadnt as i cannot believe your views.
    saturday showed everything that is wrong with Arsenal
    do you agree that every pundit, ex player , journalist and many fans (think your AKBs are dwindling fast) are wrong
    it may be noble to follow the party line but you need to be cruel to be kind here

  15. Indeed PG, indeed. Stammers summed it all up with his £57m which was a lazy calculation, simply taking the cash from Nasri/Fabregas sales. Which has yet to be received. At least Cross understands that the £50m includes the profits on those sales.

  16. I understand what you’re saying about squad places having to be vacated before bringing in new players YW, but the reality is that there are plenty of squad places available. The likes of Park, Chamakh and Benayoun just aren’t being used. There’s three for starters. Arshavin seems to have fallen out of favour at the moment too. If you’re not going to play them you might as well deselect them from the squad and find them loan deals if you can’t sell them outright.

    When a large profit figure is released with the financial results there will be the usual outcry about being tight and not spending money. The question that any sensible fan will ask though is if the resources we have are being utilised to their fullest potential. Should we be rewarding underperforming players with contract renewals on what I presume are increased wages (I presume this as I have never heard of a modern footballer being happy to accept the same terms)? We all take on board the restrictions from the stadium build and associated sponsorship deals, to me this just means that we have to be even more careful when giving out big contracts to players and being ruthless with them if they aren’t doing the business on the pitch. After all, there doesn’t ever seem to be any loyalty the other way.

  17. Yogi ,it seems the inmates think they should be the doctors.

  18. robn

    You didn’t read it because you have serially misquoted it.

    Personally, I don’t agree with the majority of pundits who see the negative in everything. That sells in medialand and advertising cash is king. Bad news sells; good news doesn’t. Look at someone’s angle before believing their views entirely. And most of them flip flop between praise and criticism. Then look at the outlet for their angle. Then you get the sense of ‘licence’ applied to comments.

    Although to be fair, it is hard to find good news around the club at the moment. Even decent financial results are going to cause fallout.

    There is nothing about toeing the party line; if it were, I would not have criticised last Summer would I?

  19. all the things we took for granted …….

  20. I might not be the sharpest knife in the box but some people are just to stupid to grasp how stupid they are.

  21. “Over at Arsenal On This Day, a time when we fought Manchester United not each other.” – brilliant YG. Great blog all-around.

    I personally think we’ve kept some of that cash in the bank as part of a contingency plan. All this talk of us not reaching the CL next season? Think of the financial impact that’d have on the club, then we really wouldn’t have any money. Some people need to look beyond their noses and think about the long-term future of this club. Buying one or two “world class” players with that cash will not guarantee our future.

  22. Baafuor from Arsenal

    Arsenal football club wastes too much money on dross!
    We try not to upset the dressing room by paying everybody almost the same salary,thereby rewarding mediocrity.Its never done anywhere else.
    A player like RvP should be paid around £130k p/w,whilst players like Almunia,Fabianski,Squillaci,Djourou,Denilson be paid £35k.

  23. Block4,

    To sell, there has to be a buyer. Park is just a weird signing but in keeping with some of the transfer activity in recent years; Caballeros, Wreh, Jeffers, Bischoff to name but a few.

    Chamakh – he was never leaving in January with the ACN; Benayoun was, I think, the only panic buy of the Summer and he was on loan. The loanees going out: Bendtner, Denilson, Vela, etc., can only be sold during the season to those clubs loaning them or if they agree to the sale. Almunia, Squillaci? Need to find clubs; Arsenal have tried but couldn’t sell them.

    Don’t believe the guff that it’s easy to offload players. If they don’t have to leave, there is no pressure on the players to do so.

  24. Obviously, that should have been YW.

  25. Yogi this is why i blame the failures on him
    Our last trophy was won by playing defensively but now, every game is 4-3-3 for Wenger irrespective of the opposition.
    Any manager worth his salt knows that to play 4-3-3 you need mobile full backs, Arsenal lose all their full backs and Wenger still plays 4-3-3. He then complains about not having full backs.
    Every year for the past four season’s our goals conceeded has been on the increase, come summer, Arsene will tell us that it will be rectified like he has said for the past 3 years only to turn our worse.
    The major problem with arsenal is Wenger’s arrogance, thinks like set plays, defensive solidty don’t fit to his “idea” of football so he ignores them expecting the world to play to his ideas.

  26. Just Another Luke

    …and don’t forget the windows and remember the insect screens as well for any vents left opened inadvertently.

  27. Robn @ 10:06am

    It’s a bit presumptuous to mention your “other” point when you haven’t successfully made a first point.

    Azed @ 10:11am

    The same person who’s been responsible for the successes of the last three seasons.

  28. YW
    appreciate your excellent write ups recently.

    Spurs, Pool, Milan, Newcastle are upcoming opportunities whose results will frame the future of the club.

    Players and managers need our support NOW.

    Favorable outcomes and good play against Spurs and Pool…..might just be the stimulus to restore some hope for Arsenal and fans.

  29. Yogi’s Warrior

    Only hard to get rid of all those players because of the ridiculous wages they are on. Why are they on those wages? Who authorized them and why? Interesting how a year and a half ago Gazidis was trumped how 17 players have signed new long term contracts but we here little about that now.

  30. ” Few complained when Fabregas was given his new contract a couple of years ago, most relieved that he had committed to the club.”
    misquoted ?? dont think so ???
    we cant move the dross on because wenger has paid them too much money and no one wants them. was this the boards decision?
    what about not having a keeper for 5 years – is this acceptable?
    whilst i dont claim to be a financial guru i would like to ask you what is the point of AFC having unused profit? it doesnt benefit the team, club or fans. surely if the club broke even or made £1 profit but invested all the profit then at least we know the club were trying to improve themselves. unfortunately when you post profits of £50m and there are some serious problems in the team then question must be asked and answers needed

  31. 4th spot like a trophy?

    Did e really say that? please tell me that he didn’t and that it’s media bullshit.

  32. YW, I don’t think for a minute it’s easy to offload players, but surely some loan deals could be found if we want to make room in the squad, which was the real point I was making. And if we can’t get these players out at least on loan which in turn hampers our ability to compete then it must come back to some serious questions being asked of the manager’s transfer policy. I know, I know, wait until the Summer, but how many Summer (and Winter) transfer windows do we go through with mistakes being made before something changes? And by change I put everything on the table, from Silent Stan throwing some money the way of the transfer budget, to Wenger being told by those above him to spend what’s currently in the pot, to the commercial team coming up with something other than “wait until 2014” to sackings (management) and clearouts of the playing staff. The place we really don’t want to be is in a weak position in 2014 regarding renegotiating major sponsorship contracts because of declining performance on the pitch.

    That does come across as all doom and gloom, I like to think I am a level-headed type and can see both sides of the argument, but recent performances have been worrying. It seems like the players aren’t motivated to dig themselves out of the poor run of form they’re in at the moment. I do believe that the management team have a role to play here, but it ultimately comes down to the players, on Sunday they have to truly believe that they can take Spurs man for man and go out there busting a gut from the first to the last minute to get a morale-boosting win.

  33. robn,how did this stupid man manage the wages of the Invincible team?
    Did you complain the about squad players earning too much?
    He Bid £20 million plus for Reina.Was that not enough?
    Why am I talking to a dullard?

  34. Robn @ 10:34am

    Always good to find something in a post to agree with, so your comment that you’re not a financial guru is welcome.

  35. If there is one type of person I can abide,it is the fans who call the players “gutless” and “spineless”.
    But then again what do I expect from lowlife gutless spineless scum?

  36. Goonerton,he did say it.And that you don’t understand what he was actually saying(have you read Yogi’s post today?)comes as no surprise to me.
    How are you going to blame the board for this one?

  37. robn

    as for you mentioning that no one complained when Cesc got a new contract – is not the words I wrote therefore you misquoted me, do keep up.

    Dross. Depends upon whom you are referring to. See my previous comment to Block4, it covers most of it off. As for their salaries, it is AW’s budget therefore his choice as to what they are paid. As in most businesses, a manager is given their annual budget, they spend it.

    He is judged by criteria that we are not privvy to. On the pitch performance will be part of it but there will be budgetary constraints as well.

    Unused profits protect the club from losses which can happen. Even supposedly well-run clubs post them. Unused profits allow for investment over income for a short while, staving off administration.

    I don’t oppose questions but let’s be honest, it’s taken us four of your posts to reach this point so it can be – let’s be generous – protracted.

  38. I thought it would be quiet when I read the post.
    Might as well go and do some work.

  39. Yogi, I think you have missed the point. Step back and listen to the anger of FELLOW Gooners. Who fault is it ? Mine, Yours, no, it boils down to the Manager. I understand you try not to be sucked in buy the main stream media. But Gooners are angry and no amount gloss can change it. 4 nil up at half time to Newcastle, drew . 2 nil up at half time, at home to the scum, lose 3-2. Yogi come on mate it not good enough.
    Ps to all the Gooner out there, I know you maybe frustrated with some Yogi view, but at least Yogi has given us have a space to air our views, unlike some other blogs.

  40. pedantic george – your name is true reflection of your character

    did the invincible team not deserve their wages – the name you gave them clearly indicates that they did. no one would be complaining if we had those players on those kind of contracts. Plus those wages were based on Highbury not £3.5m per home game at the grove. Except you , you would be complaining cos you would rather see djourou and squilachi rather than campbell and toure

    as for merlot – how about something constructive, all you do is troll for comments and post abuse – get a life mate or give me a reasonable answer

  41. goonerton

    He has done on several occasions. Now it’s a stick to beat him with; sometimes people take things too literally.

  42. Franck

    I do listen, I don’t have a lot of choice 😉

    Don’t forget to mention the players as well. As much as the manager accepts his share of the blame, did he tell them to put in a crap shift in Milan? No but he tried to rectify it at half-time but that went wrong. You need to get past matches from last season. Surely there’s enough for you to complain about from this one…!

  43. Yogi, are you saying you didnt write that then?. but i copied and paste it directly from your blog
    have you not read what you have written?

  44. Loved the last line. Take note, you arsenal bashers. De-subscribe from here and join some chelsea or MC blog. You’ll find what u want there, money being thrown around randomly. Oh and btw, let me tell you that our manager’s ‘panic buy’ gervinho has scored more than two gentlemen who were thoughtfully bought at their respective clubs for £35m and £50m respectively in lesser number of games. Trolls.

  45. robn | February 20, 2012 at 10:14 am

    unfortunately i did read your post – i really wish i hadnt as i cannot believe your views.
    saturday showed everything that is wrong with Arsenal
    do you agree that every pundit, ex player , journalist and many fans (think your AKBs are dwindling fast) are wrong
    it may be noble to follow the party line but you need to be cruel to be kind here

    well, today shows everything that is wrong with ‘Arsenal fans’

  46. robn You really are a bit slow.
    Now try hard to understand this.
    It worked well enough in the past.So if his management of the wage bill is so bad why did it not manifest itself earlier.
    His way has benefits as well as drawbacks.But his way achieved something no other manager in history as achieved.
    So I ask why is it necessarily wrong now?
    Just because a non financial guru thinks it,does not make it so.

  47. As I murder an old Chinese proverb – we are unfortunate to live in interesting times.

    I admire Wenger greatly for sticking by the club and fronting it while the changeover / vacuum from above has taken place.

    We are all quick to forget that the decision was taken to build a bigger stadium before the petro-dollars entered football. We were realistically moving to keep pace with Man Utd’s increased revenues from expanding Old Trafford. If Abramovic et al hadn’t decided to move in, wages and transfers would have been far less than they are now and we would have a much stronger comparative squad.

    But we are where we are. The question is which direction does the current owner wish to take us? I understand (not from Sky Sports sources) that there is an agreement that expires in April, whereby Kroenke has been unable to remove or appoint any Director from the Board. Perhaps the next few weeks might signal where we go.

    Wenger is a great strategist. But the last couple of years he has been more of a firefighter having to contain short term crises. We need a long term strategy again for the post-stadium era. Self-sustainability is the best model, provided there is growth in revenues at the centre of it. Perception is key to this. Sponsorship, tv revenues, new media, global merchandising can only be sold on the back of perceived success (rather than actual). Unfortunately, we are perceived to be in decline and this has to be quickly addressed if self-sustainability can ever work.

    My guess is that major changes are about to take place and one of those will be a change of manager. Not because anyone else can do any better necessarily, but because the perception around the club must change.

  48. In my mind you still have not grasped the point that we are not in a position to sell players because Wenger has given average players such good contracts it is not possible to sell them. Who do you honestly think can afford the wages for the likes of Alumnia, Djourou, Walcott, Denilson, Diaby, Rosicky, Arshavin, Bendtner, Chamkh, Vela, Bartley,etc etc etc.

    Why? Because Project Youth means you MUST sell 4 or 5 players EACH year of the ones who have nearly made it but will not develop. You must make holes in an overall squad for the next generation of players to strive. Other clubs are willing to give these type a another chance. However keep them too long, believe in them and give new contracts and now the world knows the likes of – the list again are nowhere good enough so why would anyone buy them. Isn’t that the true meaning of our huge list of players out on loan? Loan players who realistically are going to play in the first team – I don’t think so – the loan players are the ones we cannot get rid of. I hope Ryo will be an exception but the other 17?

    I also have a problem with players like – the same list again having long contracts in the current climate. The likes of Djourou are one year contact players only – they need to play strong when they have the chance for the next year – they don’t like it? Then bugger off there are loads of bit part players who can replace you. There are only so many Barca, Man City etc who can give out the cash and they have lots of players already!

  49. korihikage – what is wrong with criticising when something is clearly wrong?
    if your kid was making the same mistakes/errors for 5-7 years, what would you do, keep saying its ok or make an effort to review whats going wrong and change things.
    so it hurts me even more that we are in this position as we have had warnings for several years now.
    obviously the pain of the last 7 years doesnt affect you

    who is the real fan here?

  50. robn

    Nope I pointed out that you misquoted me in your original comment. Just to make sure you understand it, OK:

    POST

    Few complained when Fabregas was given his new contract a couple of years ago, most relieved that he had committed to the club.

    YOUR COMMENT @ 10.09

    as for you mentioning that no one complained when Cesc got a new contract – are you for real ?????

    As you can see, you did misquote me. I said “Few” – you say I said “No-one”. I didn’t ergo you misquoted me and changed the inference in the sentence.

    Or do you want to carry on arguing the toss over it when I’ve proven you wrong already because I have the patience to keep this up all day.

  51. Alzation

    so you really believe that if wenger leaves now, and someone else comes in, everyone will perceive arsenal differently? everyone will say: oh look they are doing something now.

    wow, if only things were so easy.

  52. Apologies for my unkindness, Robn. I should have appreciated that you really believe the things you are saying.

  53. Aussie Gooner Dave

    Yogi, you’re article deals with the transfer funds available etc etc. This is not why we’re totally non-competitive at the moment. It is because AW has lost the ability to get his team to play for him. Regardless of the loyalty he has shown to certain players, the message is no longer getting through. In fact, I’d argue that it hasn’t for at least 18 months.

  54. robn

    of course you are the real fan. you are the greatest. now take out your cheque book and save us!

  55. robn.What if the parent is to stupid to understand what his child is doing.?

  56. Chinmay | February 20, 2012 at 11:00 am

    early contender for post of the day

  57. How long did it take for someone to say “Wenger has lost it”?

    Why do idiots never realise they are idiots?
    I suppose we may as well just tell them to fuck off .Because debate is futile.

  58. korihikage

    No, I don’t. As I said, I am guessing that there will be some major changes and that one of those will be a change of manager.

    Just changing the manager won’t make a blind bit of difference if everything else stays the same.

    I would rather Wenger stays myself as I don’t think anyone else could do better. I’m just speculating what the owner will do if he is looking to retain the self-sustainability model

  59. the players need to step up now.

    has wenger lost the players? i don’t know. i just know that he stood by the players all season even when they have been bad. the least they could do is show some guts and repay him for that faith. and stop hiding.

  60. pedantic george – very good point, i take it your talking from experience here, i would hate to be your kids

  61. Yogi’s Warrior

    “Few complained when Fabregas was given his new contract a couple of years ago, most relieved that he had committed to the club.”

    Is a complete straw-man argument by the way. No one complained when a once and a generation footballer was given a new contract imagine that. (For all the good it did, we still got shafted on the price).

  62. Hunter13

    It is good that you are trying to post, you’re learning some useful traits but capitals is too shouty.

  63. lew1234 – i tried to point that out but Yogi got all precious over the use of the word “no one” as opposed to “few”
    as if that is the biggest worry we have !!

  64. Alzation

    i don’t know what the board is doing. but frankly speaking, i am against both stan and usmanov. just that stan seems like the lesser of 2 evils.

    i think the first change we are looking for is keeping the players we want to keep. that will send out a different signal for once.

  65. Yogi,is my boy hunter in moderation?

  66. My oh my you are really off piste with this post… Look at Porto as a successfully selling club, very competitive yet they buy cheap and sell high… …we buy high, pay monster salaries and barely make even on some players loosing on most.

    As for buying a “fantasy player” and sacrificing signings… …it’s like the management at the club can’t see the wood for the trees, Larsson a former trainee who has undone us repeatedly was available on a free last summer. There are always committed players available but they don’t meet the criteria somehow. We pay Diaby a massive wage that makes Bogarde quake, your blog is as right as LeGrove is left but see the middle for what it is THE TRUTH and stop the excuses.

    I am a season ticket holder who cheers at every home and some away, I don’t support the Chavs, so just stand up hand on heart with you replies and be honest with yourselves.

    I still cheer but it doesn’t make me happy to see the lack of commitment on the pitch

  67. Yogi,
    In my last post before this, i stated reasons why i blame Wenger for our failures and they do not concern money
    We got out played by Fulham and Swansea and both teams did not pack the bus.
    We’ve conceeded more goals each season with respect to the previous ones for the last four seasons but you seem to blame every other thing in the world except the man responsible for coaching the team.
    Every year, we keep blaming injuries for failures yet people like you never for once question Wenger(his training methods, over playing players e.g jack).
    Check the starting line up for the last fours years and you will see the team has changed a lot but they have all crashed and bottled it in the same spectacular fashion. one common theme though is Wenger.

  68. Interesting read Yogi as always.

    I’m sure our kitty will be bolstered by the sales of Alumnia, Diaby, Denilson, Bendtner, Chamakh, Rosicky, Arshavin, Walcott?

    Players whose absence from the wage bill and transfer fee will offer us significant power in the transfer market.

    Imagine entering our negotiations with VP a few days after confirming the signing of Goetze. Wouldnt that be a beautiful position to be in.

  69. Essentially there are many players at the club who offer zero long term value. They are a core of players who have repeatedly let Wenger down and who have repeatedly collapsed in Feb/March

    Wenger needs to be as ruthless as he once was

  70. Jabba's Delights

    pedantic george | February 20, 2012 at 11:05 am

    Unfortunately mate many managers have gone a season unbeaten just not in the prem. AVB did the treble last year and an unbeaten domestic season. Sacchi did it with milan in seria a. GG was one game off doing it as was Jose.

    Sustained success is a better reflection of ability

  71. wenger needs a PR figure to put fans and media at their places and let him concentrate with his players and developing them.

    wenger knows what he is doing..and arsenal knows what they employed him for.

    the fans are babies and when babies aint happy……they cry..

  72. Baafuor from Arsenal

    “Fourth place is the first trophy”…Really?What is the point in qualifying for the Champions league any way?
    Sure we will make money,but for what?To make Stan richer?
    Because we never invest the money into the squad,neither can we win win the competition.

  73. @robn you know its not your money right`?and that you have no right as a fan? you dont own the club, you support a brand. football is buisnees, and Arsenal is not a non profit charity. People can argue as much as they want about “How football is not like any other buisness”. But in the end it really is. its about earning money. And that is why someone bougth Arsenal in the first place. To earn money.

    Consumers vote with their feet Robn, thats how it is… You can scream as much as you like, but if you aint prepared to laeve the club over this i doubt you will se any changes in policy.

    So has Wenger lost it? It does not really matter what Robn and the rest of us think. its a pure buisness decision based upon careful calculations of economic impacts on whterer he stays or not…

    Football is about results yes, but ultimatley PL football is about the final financial results in the board rooms. They are linked yes. but economic success are more important than success in the field. after all one needs economic success to even be on the field..

    Its the grand picture guys, but i dont expect people like Robn to understand that.. its complicaetd stuff indeed.. It requires the ability to see beyond the football field and see what really makes the football possible in the first place.
    Its the same for all clubs without a sugar daddy though. And it especially effects the PL due to the fact we got so many sugar daddys.. That creats uneven “playfeilds” if you like…

    But economy governs everything. its the blood that are flowing in the veins of modern football…

  74. @Baafuor from Arsenal we need to make money to even be able to field a team ? to pay our players? you think they play for free? out of loyalty to Arsenal?

  75. Jabba’s Delights | February 20, 2012 at 11:47 am

    avb did the trevble allright…what you ignore is that he took ferreira;s team …with ferreira;s foundations…with ferreira;s previous work……a manager jose mourinho calls his professor.

    sagghi …hmmmmmm such a team of nobodies that milan was huh …they only had baresi raijkard gullit van basten ancelotti maldini……pffffff small time players……

  76. Some issues:-
    1. It is not vital that we understand the clubs ‘business model’. An idiot can understand it.
    It is vital we CHANGE it. ‘Self sufficiency’ or, to give it its true title ‘snake oil’ is not only the sole reason we are in the mess we are, it is also a completely unsustainable lie. No CL means less revenue means less glamour means poor sponsorship deals in future. IF Kroenke really wanted a sefl sustaining business model, he would have ensured the club was financed over the past few years to ensure we could maximise our sponsorpship deals by remaining in the Cl Places. He didnt, purely because he wants to make money without invensitng any. If Arsenal miss CL football for the next two years, he wll sell

    2. Whatever one thinks of Usmanov, only an idiot would speculate that he will do anything different to any of the other mega rich owners(see city, Chavs, PSG, Anti etc etc etc).

    The ‘profit’ he will look for from Arsenal is not in terms of financial return. It is the respect, prestege etc that an individual gets from being associated with a huge and successful football club.

    In the current atmosphere it is ridiculous to try and ‘explain’ the alleged ‘business model’. It is a self imposed catastrophic burden that has ruined a great club, diminished a once great manager and divided the fans. If we lived in a utopia it would be fine, but we simply have to compete. Usmanov will facilitate that at a stroke, even if he is a very unsavory individual.

    Self sufficiency is out of time. It was a hideously sick prank. End it. now.

  77. @YW your blog is about to turn into a moan feast….

  78. Sustained success is a better reflection of ability

    well wenger has been delivering sustained success the last 16 years buddy …irrespective of the ability of his players at each given time.

    lol..you dont even know what youre talking about….ive busted you big time here on this one.

    will you admit it …..or beat around the bush like a snake ?

  79. Yogi you can only try to explain to those who have no wish to understand the problems facing Arsenal Holdings Plc.

    Those who wish to understand the problems MUST read the Arsenal Annual Financial statements. Notes to the Accounts, namely Note 1 Principal Accounting Policies , paragraph k refers to Players Costs and how they are accounted for. Group.Note 2 is Segmental Analysis, showing the split between Football + Property = Group Turnover.

    The crunch detail is available in Note 3 Turnover and Player trading!
    Year 2004/2005 NIL
    Year 2005/2006 £139,000
    Year 2006/2007 £544,000
    Year 2007/2008 £472,000
    Year 2008/2009 £3,589,000
    Year 2009/2010 £460,000
    Year 2010/2011 £735,000

    The costs associated with acquiring, extending and disposing of players’ contracts, including agents’ fees are capitalised and amortised over the life of the contracts.

    If the Fabregas’ fee has been paid then Valuer Added Tax at 20% has to be deducted from the Transfermarkt fee of £29,990 millions. The Nasri fee of course will be £24 millions + Value Added Tax at 20% which belongs to HMR&C.

    One has only to look at the Rangerstaxcase to know that the majority of football reporters are like Jabba aka Jim Traynor, as dumb as dumber!

    YW we support the team regardless of the results. Let the doomers and gloomers have their say, I do not waste time on their puerile nit-picking!

    WE SUPPORT THE ARSENAL, no ifs or Buts or maybes

  80. Yogi.
    I have involved myself in many thankless tasks in my life and been proud of a few of them. However I take my hat off to you. Day in day out you research and post and keep this whole wonderful ACLF project steaming forward. And when the ingrates that come here do so just to misrepresent you and attack our club and it’s most successful manger you react patiently and politely.
    I take my hat off to you sir and should we ever meet I owe you a drink.

  81. Yep, but he’s learning, he’s learning.

  82. The lunatic’s are trying to take over the asylum.

  83. Jabba's Delights

    Luke

    Spot on.

    If money is tight as yogi says and i agree with it makes it even more ridiculous that we keep hold of players whoose output is negligible. We need to sell a number of players to raise wage space and funds.

    If we are to use our youth lets agument that with some genuine quality added to some useful squad players. At the moment its tons of squad and youth players and very little top echelon quality.

    Almunia (free)30k, squilaci, (free)30k diaby (5m) 50k, denilson (5m)30k, rosicky (5m) 50k, walcott (12m) 60k, chamck (5m)50k, park (free)30k, bendtner (5m)50k, arshavin (3m)80k

    very very conservatively thats 40m raised in funds and over 20million off the wage bill. Add that to our our war chest left from last summer and the funds we would have available this summer and thats allot of money to make some improvements with.

    Thats conservative estimates as well

  84. Great post. More facts here than we get on the gutter press.

  85. Lew1234

    But the point is that CFs “disloyalty” now is being used as a brickbat with which to beat the manager. You can’t have it both ways.

    Robn for example, tells us he complained bitterly at the time.

  86. so the new board can sack the manager!!

  87. Matt | February 20, 2012 at 11:59 am

    heheh agreed ! i chose another way of saying same thing.

    ” The ones who sack capelos to hire rednaps and the ones who cant lay the grass properly in their national stadium want to critisise the work of arsene wenger”

    hillarious.

  88. and then the new manager can sack the players!

  89. Baafuor from Arsenal

    Poodle
    Yes we need to paid the players.So does all the other teams who don’t play in the Champions league.We would be fine if we didnt pay ridiculous wages to shit players.

  90. I can only come to the conclusion that YW must be a grand master in the art of Buddhism.

    it is the only possible explanation for the level’s of patience shown.

  91. robn

    No you didn’t. You got stroppy because you think you are right and insulting people is the way to get their attention. I pointed out that you misquoted me and you argued the toss that you didn’t. You were proven wrong.

    If it isn’t the biggest problem Arsenal face, why are you still going on about it?

  92. Nice. ‘Stroppy’. Good word. Used to say it to my kids. I was either Bolshy or facetious when I was a kid. I quite liked Bolshy once I’d worked it out.

  93. Trying to post on this blog to get an honest debate is as pointless as the YouTube discussion about the iPhone 3. You can’t reason only attack and gang up. Especially when one asks simple, clear and direct questions. Heil Pravda!

  94. Gunner8

    Porto is an irrelevance to Arsenal, different country, different league, different commercial environment. It really is. I wish for example, the UK had a former colony from which we could harvest players on the cheap.

    Larsson: Is he that good? Seriously. He might have undone us on two occasions but what of the rest? Is he genuinely a step above the rest? I genuinely don’t think he is. Committed players are all well and good but very few possess the technical ability that the manager believes is required. Or very few at the price he is willing / able to pay.

    Diaby’s a whole different ball game. Honestly, I don’t actually believe he will ever be fully fit. Certainly not in the manner people expect, anyway. Releasing him though is not the solution, financially. You have to pay him off, that means the full wages (plus bonuses he might reasonably expect and is contractually entitled to) in one go. That means eating into your transfer / contracts pot. So you’ve released a space in the squad but can only pay lower wages to a new player because you have less in the pot.

    The same applies to Almunia, Squillaci, all of those labelled dross. Pay them off, yes, by all means but don’t expect replacements.

  95. ‘Heil Pravda’ shows an excellent grasp of the principles of equality and diversity.

  96. Fantastic post, YW.

  97. JD

    How many managers have completed an unbeaten season in England? That’s the only criteria against which The Invincibles are judged in that respect. Portugal, Italy; mean nothing in this context. Nor does going close.

  98. Poodle

    About to. Surely it has already…

  99. Your point, Yogi, about the transfers during last summer as being essentially disjointed is well taken. It may well be, however, that the purchases of the players we acquired were indeed worked on for some considerable time and just gave the appearances of something worked out at the last minute. It was, nevertheless, very unusual. In fact, the whole summer was disjointed with Fabregas leaving as well as the other whose name I refuse to mention. No team in professional football can suffer the trauma of loosing a player the likes of Fabregas and not be tilted of its axis. Fabregas is a player of world stature in the midfield and we have not had anything like a reasonable replacement. Where does a team like Arsenal acquire a player like Fabregas without an outlay of money that is just not there under normal business operations-without a sugar daddy.

    Arsenal Football Club, in my humble opinion, is a club that has punched far above its wieght category for many years. Arsene Wenger has been the soul reason for Arsenal continuing an effort within the top five clubs in the Premier League which is an achievement beyond my comprehension.

    Thank you for the post Yogi.

  100. maybe a bit of music chills us all out….just trying…

  101. Poodle
    “They are linked yes. but economic success are more important than success in the field. after all one needs economic success to even be on the field.”.

    i would have thought that success on the pitch leads to economic success. With nothing to show on the pitch who is going to give us the big sponsorship deals we crave and will the fans turn up. We pay the most expensive prices in the PL and the product does not justify the outlay.

  102. Arsenal Football Club, in my humble opinion, is a club that has punched far above its wieght category for many years. Arsene Wenger has been the soul reason for Arsenal continuing an effort within the top five clubs in the Premier League which is an achievement beyond my comprehension.

    oh thank god there are arsenal fans with intelligence and appreciation !!!!

  103. Yogi’s Warrior

    Sorry I have no idea what you are on about. You made an assertion that few argued about Cesc Fabregas getting a contract extension to basically say no can call into question Bendtner, Alumina et al., being given contract extensions (and if I’m wrong in that I offer my apologies). That is I believe a straw-man argument as there is a big difference between a once in a generation player being a new contract and players who being (very) kind are not. Why has that got anything to do with Fabregas’s or any other players loyalty?

  104. Jabba's Delights

    Yogi

    So with your 50m that you mentioned and the conservative 40m that ive just come up with added to the maybe 15-20 we would have this summer anyway thats 100m with an extra 20 of wage space.

    Campbell, Myachi, Bartley Lansbrry add some depth. That i would say leaves us with 3 hugely pressing positions assuming we keep the same formation. attacking midfield centre, winger and striker with 100m in the bank to sort our all 3 positions.

    Not such a bad situation now is it. If the manager goes to the euros with his cheque book he should be sacked immediately as he wont have dont his job. Players need to be bought early no more patience look where that got us.

  105. Pitch and Economic success are not interdependent. Being on television often enough is exposure that advertisers want. They like the success but let’s face it, Arsenal are getting more attention now through failure than they do when times are indifferent. That coverage is something sponsors like: raising the profile of their brand. They may not like the trouble but know the storm will pass.

    Has it made Arsenal any more money. Not one jot.

  106. If the manager goes to the euros with his cheque book he should be sacked immediately as he wont have dont his job.

    seriously yogi …..lol…giving the platfrom to idiots to talk sh*t? ..lol..this boy doenst knwo what he is talking about….

    yes ok jabba…we will sack the golden goose that gave us a stadium…ahahha ..you lost it long time ago mate….

  107. hunter 13
    If Wenger knew what he was doing, we won’t have lost at sunderland.. heck we wont have lost the cc to a relegated team…
    In 96 when Wenger was appointed, the media when Arsene who? so did a lot of you here who are not Arsenal fans but Arsene’s fan.
    Martin O’neil did not spend 100million to change around the forturnes of Sunderland, he just instilled discipline, work ethics and basic defending skills in his team.

  108. Jabba's Delights

    hunter13 | February 20, 2012 at 12:21 pm

    we’ve had the 3rd or 4th biggest wages for a number of years so we’ve been achieving our minimum.

    Yogi

    The invincibles were wonderful but then so were utd treble lot in 99. Great seasons come and go sustained success is what truly great managers achieve.

  109. Interesting write up YW, as ever, very useful and helpful insights – and still the best Arsenal blog in (and out of) town, in my opinion.

    As with the onset of spring, weeks go by with the feeling of change in the air and if you wait long enough, it eventually arrives.

    And much as I rate this blog, it never fails to amaze me how much guff is written by so many based on so little.

    The speed at which speculation, supposition, guesswork and, sometimes, lies, become the new ‘facts’ is something one can only marvel at. The supposed precision with which myths are dressed up in, even the re-writing of the club’s history (not to mention the re-writing of the main post!!) on occasion never fails to impress.

    And as much as the newly self-appointed club sages might wish it to be otherwise, the simple truth is that, as with the arrival of spring, you can never be too sure exactly when change will be upon us or what gifts by way of new life and new possibilities it will bring.

    But one thing’s for sure.

    The opportunity, in the meantime, for those with such little knowledge to make maximum plonkers of themselves is practically without limit.

    That they should be prepared to do so in such an entertainingly public fashion and in front of the rest of us is something for which I, for one, am truly grateful.

    So, thank you YW for all your write-ups – often amazing but always thoughtful and balanced, more often right than wrong. But thanks also for providing a platform for those who like to come on and make comments based on the half-truths and the half-baked nonsense propagated by otherwise disinterested professionals put together sell the newspapers, the magazines and all the other forms of media air-time.

    You really shouldn’t, you know.

  110. YW, PG,
    Don’t have the time to join in, regrettably, but keep fighting the good fight.

  111. An interestng summary of the above points….

    Arsenal is, from the point of view of pure company law, the most successfully run club run in Britain (we are ….spit…self sufficient). Nobody disputes this. We are held up as a model to all and sundry.

    Yogis point above – even in the light of this – that, when compared to the mega money available elsewhere, this does not produce sufficient revenue to compete with the European powerhouses.

    Conclusion:- It is impossible for a club operating with a convenetional corporate mentality to compete in the inflated current football market. The conventional corporate mentality therefore does not work in football. In other words, as I said before, self sufficiency is a sick, self imposed torture. If only we were owned by the 10th biggest landowner in the United States and husand of the heiress to teh limitless walmart billions. He could just supplement our income with some investment…oh hang on…..

    And to anyone who dares say Arsenal have been punching above their weight…. Aresnal is one of three big clubs in England.To anyone who thinks otherwise there is no need to insult them by saying go and support someone else. IF you do not recognise where Arsenals stature is, you aren’t supporting Arsenal anyway, Just a self created image designed to bolster the reputation of a failing manager at the expense of the club.

  112. So Yogi,

    if no top 4 this year, then how much will we be on tv next year ?
    we may get more attention now than when we were indifferent . but we got even more attention when we were winning cups and titles or can you not remember those days ?

    success on the field has to be the first priority, surely?

  113. hunter 13
    If Wenger knew what he was doing, we won’t have lost at sunderland.. heck we wont have lost the cc to a relegated team…
    In 96 when Wenger was appointed, the media when Arsene who? so did a lot of you here who are not Arsenal fans but Arsene’s fan.
    Martin O’neil did not spend 100million to change around the forturnes of Sunderland, he just instilled discipline, work ethics and basic defending skills in his team.

    why? is it wenger;s fault that arsenal lost from sunderland ? i only saw song who was trying to win and vermaellen…the rest were nowhere to be seen.

    martin o neil ? …good manager no doubt ..but wenger is on a whole different level. i think martin ackowledged that himself.

    and listen it doesnt bother me if you want to make sepeartion between arsenal and arsene …youre the one who seems them as opposites…for me they are the same thing.

    if you can convince me that manager wenger is a bad manager for arsenal maybe i listen to you but you cant.

    in fact , i would say that wenger is too world class for what arsenal used to be.

  114. Robn,

    Where do you base your comment – most expensive tickets in the PL from?

    I have argued, based on fact, many, many times on here and other blog’s that this is simply not true.

    And I have proved it as well.

  115. Jabba's Delights

    Hunter

    Do you remember 4 years ago when our manager said he was going to the euro with his cheque book? He did nothing. It shouldnt be tolerated this time, we’ve seen first hand 2 years running what inaction or late action does.

    Contrary to your opinion wenger didnt build the new stadium

  116. Aresnal is one of three big clubs in England.To anyone who thinks otherwise there is no need to insult them by saying go and support someone else.

    three big clubs in terms of what?

    because i remember newcastle traditionally being richer than arsenal and always spending more….ever since the asprilia ginola years……..

    why are you insulting our intelligence then ?

    arsenal only had 10 league titles in a span of 100 years and a bit which equates to 1 per decade in average……

    WHAT KIND OF BIG ARE WE TALKING ABOUT HERE? lol ….

  117. YW – Nice post as always.

    An interesting subject is that of our transfer budget. But in all truth, I would imagine that nobody really knows how large/small our budgetr is. Especially not a few hacks from Fleet street. It could be £15M, or just as easily it could be £70M. Nobody really knows outside of the board and Arsene Wenger. As it should be.

    I would imagine it is fairly healthly though. We are a rich club and last years budget remains untouched.

  118. jabba i busted you half an hour ago and still waiting for your reply ……….

  119. @yogi

    I don’t think Porto’s model is exclusive as yes they use a former colony’s resources just as French teams do… …but look at newcastles purchases this season, small amounts spent yet they can reap the awards of sales this summer such is their want. We on the other hand have been spending a fortune on the “best” talent and players such as Walcott, Freeman, Pennant (a record £1mil for a youth player), & Denilson to name a few cost us fat more that we expected.
    Is Larsson the answer, probably not, but is he a better squad player than Park with a similar salary 100% that is the point I am getting at.

    I am all for a sustainable policy, but ours sometimes seems like fiscal madness.

    Oh and Stewwie thanks for proving my point

  120. hunter13

    You don’t do yourself any favours pal. The village idiot totem is all yours.

    When Wenger took over AFC we were the third most succesful club in English football history, with 1 European trophy.

    He will leave us, just as he found us.

    Great man, great work, but everything needs to end at some point.

  121. Jabba's Delights

    Matt | February 20, 2012 at 12:35 pm

    We have the highest average ticket price in europe not the prem. We are comfortably more expensive than chels and spurs

  122. I also find the limited resources argument futile, because we are constantly beaten by clubs with much much much less resources than us.

    Our record for the last 12 months is damming indeed – I believe its 54 games with 20 or so losses.

    Thats a full season -not all of this can be attributed to luck, refs, the pitch, the tide, chinese new year and all the other wonders we use on here to avoid the obvious.

  123. Conclusion:- It is impossible for a club operating with a convenetional corporate mentality to compete in the inflated current football market. The conventional corporate mentality therefore does not work in football.

    No i disagree.

    Though i will agree that arsenal’s rivals do not follow conventional business models, at some point they will have to pay for that. You present it as if the manner chelsea operates now is how they will operate forever. No that is a mistake.

    Now whether football is regulated correctly or not that is not wenger;s responsibility.

    What youre saying is that …”since everyone is evading tax..we should too”

    Neither can you demand that wenger does things wrongly just because football is a business where morattis perez and abramovics dont get regulated.

    Wenger and Arsenal are doing the right thing…….but football is still an arena for sharks and cunts, an arena full of corruption. here is where uefa steps in and starts clearing out the mess they created.

    You cant ask wenger to be corrupt…you should be proud that we have a manager and club that wants to achieve its success in the right manner, with hard work.

  124. Jabba's Delights

    Yogi

    Interesting your points on Larssen.

    The fact is a player with his qualities would be the perfect person to go and win consistently away on bog pitches. His dead balls might just have made our 2 year wait for chamack more worthwhile.

  125. We have the highest average ticket price in europe not the prem. We are comfortably more expensive than chels and spurs

    so what ? we have the best stadium as well!!

    its different going to a canteen and different going to an aaa class wine bar.

    who cares about chelsea and tottneham? i dont …….is that who you compare us with ?

  126. Very good point Andrew. A good laugh is always welcome in times of trial.

  127. Luke……you cant expect a club repaying its stadium to have a better squad than those clubs that dont have a stadium repayment to consider.

  128. Sustainability should, at all times be an aspiration. But an aspiration only. But if it gets in the way of competition, it should, no MUST be abandoned until such a time that self sustainability can be achieved. When aspirations get in the way of dealing with reality, problems are inevitable,

    And while in an ideal world, it would be nice for all clubs to be self sustainable, it is nothing short of suicde to ,completely of our own volition try to adhere to rules that every other club laughs at.

    There are those doom mongers who say ..’ah wait until the bubble bursts on these clubs’. Reminds me of the story of Chicken Little and the falling sky. …… (for the sky is falling read Man U going out of business)

    And the ironly of it is that Chelsea, in partiuclar, were the type of club that could easily have gone to the wall before Abramovich invested all of his money. Now, their profile is so high it simply will never be allowed to happen. Oh how the Chav fans must hate all that money threw at them.

  129. Yogi Warrior

    Interesting way of looking at it but not one that sponsors would share I’d say. While I’d agree sponsors want teams that are on TV, would they pay the same for a team that plays in the Europa League as they would a team in the Champions League? Sponsors also want to be attached to teams that win things (Well the ones that pay the money we would want do). See the Adidas comments about Liverpool lately (and before anyone says anything about the Warrior deal that only happened due to their connection with the Boston Red Socks and NESV). Will Nike pay us £25m a season, will emirates pay £25m a a season for a tem that doesn’t make the CL?

  130. Jabba,

    That may be true if you incorporate Club Level in to our average price – but how many other teams have a stadium that cater’s for that?

    A common mistake is comparing ours – that include CL and Cup games to a team’s who doesn’t.

    if a Chelsea or Spurs supporter purchase tickets to all home European and Cup games, in most cases their tickets are at least the same – if not higher.

    I have proved this before by providing details of my ticket vs. a Spurs ST holder.

    The majority who present the ‘highest ticket price’ bollocks – never compare apples with apples.

    It is one of the Doomer’s favourite line’s – and as per most of the bollocks that is spilt from their lips – entirely based on fiction to suit their agenda – not fact.

  131. Bob – Do you sit in block 108/109 at the Emirates?

  132. Jabba's Delights

    Arsenalandrew

    The simple point is that arsenal for the 4th year in a row look set to have a diminished return on the field suffering from the same problems.

    What i’snt in question is that this is club in difficulty. The only thing that should be in question is whether the manager goes or is kept on but told his performance wont be tolerated for another year and he must improve the clubs fortunes.

  133. Matt, unfortunately you for you, Spurs tickets include home games too.

    Spurs ST’s start at £660 – what about our frugal club?

    Regardless of the penny pinching differences you will try idenitify – the model which many choose to get aroused over is so heavily geared on matchday revenue, and with a constant air of negativity purported by consistent seasonal regression, sponsors will hardly be chomping at the bit to pay us extorinate amounts.

  134. What i’snt in question is that this is club in difficulty. The only thing that should be in question is whether the manager goes or is kept on but told his performance wont be tolerated for another year and he must improve the clubs fortunes.

    lol…..he must improve the clubs fortunes ?

    what has he been doing the last 16 years then ?

    hahaha what a silly kid…

  135. Jabba's Delights

    Matt

    The cheapets cost for a season ticket at arsenal this year was £951, at spurs 690 and chels 595.

    When you consider that many of our standard tickets are considerably more expensive than that you get the gist.

  136. Hunter13

    What dont you understand about fixed term repayments?

    Do you even know how much of the stadium we paid off last year? Do you even know how much is still outstandind?

    Or is it just a knee jerk excuse without looking at any detail?

    Care to comment on Gazidis’ comments about the stadium debt?

  137. robn

    I never said top four was unachievable. I think it’s the minimum target. Personally I care more about silverware than the balance sheet but neither to the exclusion of supporting the team.

    TV coverage is not linked entirely to on field success in the short term. Over time, yes but given global broadcasting rights are big growth area in that respect, Arsenal will not have a noticeable difference in TV matches. European revenues from ECL is a different matter but for one season it would not impinge to greatly.

  138. Cbob

    With laughter? Or in desperation?

  139. The cheapets cost for a season ticket at arsenal this year was £951, at spurs 690 and chels 595.

    lol ..well arsenal is about 10 levels above them two clubs you mentioned…dont let that get in the way though

  140. I sit where I can get a ticket Matt and when I can afford the trip from Devon. Why?

  141. Whatever suits the moment Yogi. I thought it was very good of Andrew to point out the ancillary service that your blog provides.

    For most of us it is a source of sense and reason in a sea of strife, a have. For others it is obviously a form of therapy. Andrew has reminded us that it can be that for us as well.

  142. Luke – Spurs ST’s do not include home European games – that is 100% fact – so not sure where you get that from.

    My cousin’s are Spurs ST holders and have confirmed that for me.

  143. Ah – OK Bob – A guy who sits close to me meet’s your description exactly – so although a long shot wondered if it was you….

  144. Gunner8 @ 12:37pm

    Are you suggesting that if we adopted Newcastle’s transfer policies we could aspire to their level of success?

  145. One minute you compare the average – now you compare the cheapest?

    Choosing things to suit your agenda?

  146. hunter13 | February 20, 2012 at 11:55 am

    jabba still waiting on this one ……….lol…….. hehehe …

  147. Matt – just have a look at thier official webpage, you’ll see they do. My spurs ST holder pal at work confirmed as much to me.

    To be fair, they do grades – the most basic ST comes with two home cup games.

    Regardless – there is still a huge margin.

    I bet our ST holders are delighted the Champs League qualifier eats up one of the European games.

  148. What would my description be exactly matt?

  149. Spurs ST’s start at £660 – what about our frugal club?

    and why oh why are you comparing us to spurs ?

  150. Anyway, nitpicking over ST costs is pointless.

    I’m more concerned about our inability to retain any of our genuine stars and to be falling further away from silverware on the dawn of the most long awaited commerical contract renewal in history.

  151. Just to provide fact’s to the argument – and I have posted this before.

    So my ST for this season – which is based on results and number of games from the previous season is £1150.

    This includes home FA Cup and home Champions League games.

    I sit in the Upper Tier, Row 8, about level with the edge of the penalty area.

    My cousin is a Spurs ST Holder – sits row 2 of the upper tier at WHL, close to corner flag – so a comparable seat.

    His ST is £895, but does not include home European games.

    European games are an opt in option – each game for his seat was charged at £72 – so for 3 CL games that would be £216.

    £895 + £216 = £1191.

    So for a comparable seat – measured on the same number of games, his ST is in fact more expensive than mine.

    But why let any fact’s get in the way of the Doomer’s agenda, and ruin one of their favourite quotes to bang on about when slagging the club?

  152. Sean Connery – circa 1963 – lookalike? As opposed to the Connery who turned up in Indiana Jones?

  153. Yogi,

    what makes you think we will get back in within 1 season? we can but hope but i see a Liverpool scenario where we struggle to get back
    plus we wont be able to attract star names and the one we have in RvP will be gone?
    if it continues into a 2nd or 3rd year how long till JW and WS decide to move on

    maybe we should rename the Stadium as “The Hallmark Stadium” as we are in a house of cards

  154. Surely that would be rude of me to say Bob!

  155. Matt | February 20, 2012 at 1:10 pm

    matt knows

  156. Bloody bang on Yogi!

    Of course you’ve had the benefit of me buying you a pint.

  157. Well said Gio “And to anyone who dares say Arsenal have been punching above their weight…. Aresnal is one of three big clubs in England”
    We have won the league more than any club bar liverpool and utd. We are a big club and Wenger did bring us into the 21st century just as Norris brought us into the 20th! UTA

  158. So my ST for this season – which is based on results and number of games from the previous season is £1150.

    ——

    Must have been delighted with 6.5% increase then

  159. Or Sean Connery in The Rock?? 🙂

  160. Do you people actually enjoy football? Because you certainly know how to wring the fucking life out of it. What joyless lives some of you must lead.

  161. Gunner 8

    We were the third most successful English club when Wenger took over.

  162. We were the third most successful English club when Wenger took over.

    No we werent

    we just had the third best statistic in the league titles won.

    its a bit different than saying we were the third most succesful ….

  163. 2nd best statistic……

  164. Whether you are happy with the increase is irrelevant, and there where many points made at the time about the reasoning behind it – so not going to go over that again.

    If you are OK with paying that for a ST, then you do.

    I thought I would just check again – and standard Spurs ST does not include home European games pricing – you have the cost of the ticket debited from your chosen account – so you may have a guaranteed seat – but you pay extra – as I said.

    But as I say – why let fact’s get in the way of a good moan.

  165. trophies are just a statistic

    a statistic that arsenal is doing badly the last 7 years but thats ok ..its not like we were any better the previous 125 years….

    and as we all know

    statistics change……

  166. Well, Yogi managed it Matt.

  167. FYI, all clubs cheapest season tickets.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/8621866/Premier-League-clubs-accused-of-exploiting-fans-after-season-tickets-go-up-in-price-by-seven-per-cent.html

    Comfortably highest, over £200 higher than the second place (Liverpool).

    @Hunter13, I have to agree with Luke, stop going on about stadium repayments. Any profit figures declared are after whatever debt repayments have been paid. Does your grip of finance extends to how much your Daddy gives you in pocket money?

  168. I was in area 134 for the Blackburn game.

  169. robn

    The same coin has two sides. You choose the one that shows the bad light, mine is a beacon of brightness since it contains hope. That is why you see a Liverpool-esque struggle and I choose to look for a Summer of action, improving the squad.

    >maybe we should rename the Stadium as “The Hallmark Stadium” as we are in a house of cards

    If only you put as much effort into your thoughts as you do your wit. Oh, you do…

  170. Luke you aint fair ….

    Matt nullified your comment and comparison on st between arsenal and spurs…

    and then you come back crying about 6.5% increase …lol

    will you admit that you got it wrong the first time then ? or do you wear skirts like jabba ?

    This is it,.,,,,,, your arguments get nulified yet you dont admit it…….why?

  171. And we had won the league twice in 25 years when AW took over.

    Imagine the current Doomer’s feelings about that…..

  172. @ Gunner8 | February 20, 2012 at 11:33 am

    “My oh my you are really off piste with this post… Look at Porto as a successfully selling club, very competitive yet they buy cheap and sell high… …we buy high, pay monster salaries and barely make even on some players loosing on most.”

    I am sure the value and cost of living / business in portugal is much much less than the UK. there could also be varying other factors as why english clubs pay more for foreign talent in terms of transfer fee and wages that their foreign counterparts – weather being one

    Azed | February 20, 2012 at 11:40 am

    “Every year, we keep blaming injuries for failures yet people like you never for once question Wenger(his training methods, over playing players e.g jack).
    Check the starting line up for the last fours years and you will see the team has changed a lot but they have all crashed and bottled it in the same spectacular fashion. one common theme though is Wenger.”

    Well for the last 15 yrs wenger has been a constant and look were we are now to then – If we do make the champs lg this season that will be an amazing acheivement considering harry has managed it once in his whole life and the spuds are having their best season in 50 yrs and 1 place ahead of us.

    as a matter of fact name me another club in UK that has grown from where we were and had some success and still stayed competitive in the same period without a billionire just pumping in the funds?

  173. The guy near me was certainly more senior than a 1960’s Sean Connery, so I was right not to comment – as I would of probably offended you Bob!

  174. geeGunner, is this “as a matter of fact name me another club in UK that has grown from where we were and had some success and still stayed competitive in the same period without a billionire just pumping in the funds?” a serious question??

    Answer: Manchester United. In fact they’ve had billionaires actively taking funds out of the club since the Glazers took over. They hadn’t won a title in over 25 years before Ferguson became manager.

  175. I spoke too soon about your mate PG, spoke too soon.

  176. Well, they haven’t started talking about VAT yet, Frank.

  177. Like I said Hunter – Doomer’s don’t let facts get in the way of their Agenda.

  178. And we’ve probably seen one another at the abortive meet up. We jsut didn’t know it.

  179. Ok if you can’t beat em. The joker who commented on ticket prices might be interested in the following piece of information. NorthWest average house price…£154,232. Greater London average house price £406,424. So at least in terms of property GL is just under three times more expensive. Applies to most stuff actually, council tax, food, transport. Are Arsenal ticket prices nearly three times higher than those of Big mancs, Little Mancs, Liverpool i.e. the big clubs in the NW? I don’t know and I sure as hell am not going to waste time finding out.

  180. No Merlot I’m not but the last two years their transfer policy has IMO been better then ours and not just regarding BA(free) vs. Park £2mill but Cabaye and Ben Arfa. It’s what Arsene Wenger used to do, buy proven talent from Europe not throwing a stone in the pond!
    Where are Newcastle in the league, not far off eh?

  181. Yogi’s Warrior | February 20, 2012 at 1:27 pm

    🙂

    remember..its for a good cause

  182. When I bought my first flat (apartment for you guys o/s of England) in Highgate a hundred years ago, I could barely afford it. ‘Jeeez’ said some that I know ‘why pay that sort of money, you could buy one for a fifth of that in a nice part of Manctown’. If you can’t figure out the rest go fuck yourself.

  183. Matt how will you explain it next year if awe don’t make the CL? Our ST’s will be by far the most expensive

  184. You are very obtuse, gooner8. There is but one other club in the country sited on a more expensive piece of real estate.

  185. Wow Hunter 13, were you bullied in school your psyche is messed up, you have nothing constructive to say just childish arguments then back up people to get some love which is so base. Try a bit harder, I am sure you could?

  186. @Hunter13, I have to agree with Luke, stop going on about stadium repayments. Any profit figures declared are after whatever debt repayments have been paid. Does your grip of finance extends to how much your Daddy gives you in pocket money?

    luke has been proved wrong……… agree with him all you want.

    as for your comment on finances …i think i would rather trust the knowledge and expertise of the people who planned this project who happen to have degrees on such subjects and are specialised in that field , than listening to babies (fans) being unhappy.

    and when my dad built us our house i wasnt crying to him like a spastic demanding playstations and ferraris …….. 😉 …i appreciated the fact he put a roof over our heads …..

  187. Geegooner you are missing my point entirely it is that we are not a successful selling club. I for one have no problem with being one so long as it’s done right and not the Ajax way.

  188. no gunner8 i just dont appreciate people with no authority on finances thinking they know better than all those people at arsenal with their phds and master degrees….

    likewise i find it very difficult to accept any critique for wenger from the people who cant lay the grass properly in their national football ground.

    😉

  189. Frank so average Chelsea housing price £2.4mil anerage Islington £935,000 seriously stop this AKB/Doomer bullshit and just have a point?

  190. Ok Matt, steady on. We had actually won the league twice in the previous 9 years when Wenger took over. And he took over a team which had been to two European finals in the previous three years. And which had Bergkamp and the best back four in business.

    The team he took over was in at least as good a shape as it is now (in my opinion it was signfiicantly stronger). It is purely fanciful bias to suggest otherwise.

    And can anyone tell me how many time Arsenal have gone more than 7 years in thier entire 125 year old history? II think this would be an interesting fact for all of us to know as it will put our current position into perspective.

  191. You think that comparing like with like is bullshit? You clearly are unable to see the point.

  192. Got me there Frank, but what’s the point? Evertons real estate is more than Liverpools but they don’t compare?

  193. to put it simply ……..i dont believe the english ( wenger;s and arsenal’s fiercist critics) have a big enough chip on their shoulder to dictate to wenger how to run football clubs, coach players, manage a team etc etc.

    Its like listening to an eskimoe trying to pass advise on a german about engineering.

    like listening to samantha fox trying to give seminars to celine dion in vocals

    its a bit silly if you ask me.

    i could never go to schummacher and give him advise on how to drive cars …so how come you people think you can tell arsene wenger how to run football clubs ….?

  194. Ok let us help you out. How much do you think it would cost for Chavski to build a new stadium in Fulham (btw their current ground is in Fulham)? Whilst you are there do you think that it is possible that that might have an effect on their ticket prices?

  195. Azed | February 20, 2012 at 12:27 pm
    hunter 13
    If Wenger knew what he was doing, we won’t have lost at sunderland..

    Applied logic PG says

    If Fergie knew what he was doing United would not have lost at home to Blackburn

    Azed is now the proud owner of a pointy hat with a D on it..

    Hunter ,take a breath ,I am vouching for you here.

  196. Yogi – you’ve dragged me in because your post deserves fulsome praise. It’s bright, honest and for me very much hit the mark.

    I have seen a few Gooners who I thought rock like – not AKBs but AITRMFTJs (you figure it out) – reach breaking point this weekend. I’ve had a few arguments. Sad times.

    Here is what I think is important – whether we agree as fans or not – the situation is rather clear to all. The manager is not going to be ousted, he has the honest backing of the board, and whilst some venting is understandable we should accept the situation and do our job as supporters. Anything less is damaging and serves as delight for the many bastards who really want us to fail.

    Everyone who is a Gooner is truly privileged and should be grateful to support a team doing something unique and brave. We have a big picture ethos and I still think it will pay off long term.

    I do believe mistakes have been made, but whining will change the square root of fuck all.

    Patience is a rare quality these days but it does pay dividends.

    Dig deep and do your bit.

  197. Sorry I should have used the correct punctuation or a thesaurus…

    Stop all this AKB/Doomer crap, you are all as bad as each other like children get behind the bloody team we have sp*rs coming on Sunday!!!!!

    Right it’s been golden, but have to get some kip as I’m in Hong Kong for work and need to get my energy back after a wicked LKF weekend before heading back to my beloved Islington on Sunday. Come on you reds!

  198. Hunter – “i just dont appreciate people with no authority on finances thinking

    Heh, you don’t see the irony in your statement?

  199. geegunner
    Who was Wenger before he managed arsenal? Wenger has not done more for the club than the club has done for him.
    Like i said earlier in my post which you akb’s will always ignore is
    1)Any manager worth his salt knows that to play 4-3-3 you need mobile full backs when we lost our full backs, how did Wenger react?
    2)Man utd have played Valencia and Carrick in defense lots of time this season, they’ve played Rooney in midfield this season but are still challenging for the title(Fergie adapts).
    3)A brillant manager can take a team of average players and do wonders but Wengers know it all attitude is blinding him to the realities of life.
    4)You akb’s say the doomers want to bankrupt the club but you guys forget that increasing the contracts of players like Djourou will do that faster.

    Everybody falls down once in life its the way you react after the fall that matters. Wenger has fallen and instead of getting up you guys(including Wenger) are telling us he WAS once standing.

  200. Well these are my thoughts I would like to share…

    I recall both bankers and governments making statements (lies) to the effect that the financial system was essentially intact and strong enough to withstand market “fluctuations” before the 2009 string of linked collapses signalled a deeply exposed and dangerous Western financial system, built on too much money already lent or invested in mortgages and commercial property, government bonds, credit cards, and speculation in futures and currencies, without a hope of return – if it were ever called in, all at once, as dominoes fell. But the second worst case scenario happened, and is being paid for now by governments bailing out banks and some companies by getting its population to pay the bill. It’s all dressed up of course, but these essentials are not in dispute.

    Wenger and Arsenal’s caution is deeply admirable. I’m surprised that the story of Rangers hasn’t been more widely publicized, because it is a far bigger story than a couple of Arsenal losses on the field. It is yet another signal, one of many to come I believe.

    It comes down to simple things. How are many/most top flight football clubs able to keep on competing in an inflated player transfer/wages market being manipulated to extract more value? Basically by assuming (and producing figures) that future earnings, I assume mainly rising TV sales rights based on previous growth (in this case the stupendous growth of EPL “franchise”), will cover current exposure; and on that basis borrowing or finding the investor to bank on those figures.

    So far so good for about 10 years with the odd hiccup. But it is spiralling and anyone can see that. Yesterday’s 10m players are now 15m, and so forth, and tomorrow will be 20m. Just look at the average values of purchases.

    It’s one massive gamble. Looked at another way, it’s a web of deceipt and chicanery across the entire football industry, and many, many fingers in many, many pies. You and I will pay for that gamble sooner or later, but we will pay a little less. Wenger and his board and management are attempting to insulate Arsenal, that much is clear.

    Wenger’s financial premise is I feel more simple than people imagine. If you purchase an over-valued asset (a player), and the market collapses, you cannot recoup the investment and your plus balance sheet risks being wiped out. That’s technically called insolvency. It is a big risk. If player X bought for 35m is only worth say 15m in a real market, your books are showing false net asset value. If this were to happen across a group of clubs or leagues at any time, signalled by fears over falling liquidity (say, TV and stadium revenues) and inability to service loans, the lenders would move in, since there are clauses to protect them. If the assets cannot protect the club because they are wrong on the balance sheet, and assets cannot be sold to produce liquidity, the club is in deep trouble.

    Ireland knows this story so very well with its property bubble. It’s a big ponzi scheme. We are living through a bubble of inflated and illusory asset value of players. It’s collapse is inevitable.

    On matters football, a simple thought. Wenger must be tearing his hair out I decided. Arsenal’s game rests on imposing its method on opponents; this is how we win. This takes tremendous team and individual concentration and ability to keep playing your own team game. I have a feeling in both recent losses, the players on the field, for whatever reasons took fright and stopped playing and imposing their game (you have got to believe). You cannot do that.

  201. but george are you reading what theyre saying ? lol …

  202. goonerandy | February 20, 2012 at 2:04 pm

    no andy i dont…i aint the one trying to give advise to arsene how to run his football club…some others are doing that ….

  203. @Hunter13, no-one is saying that the people who planned the “project” don’t know how to do that while running a profitable business. No-one. What is in question though is how the proceeds of that “project” have been used and whether they have been utilised as fully as they could be. That’s all. Paying back stadium debts is irrelevant as we make considerable profits after all running costs are taken care of.

    And bandying about statements about trusting knowledge of people with degrees, masters degrees, phds etc. is even more ridiculous. There were probably more people with degrees (and better) in the square mile than anywhere else in the country and look how that turned out.

  204. Azed | February 20, 2012 at 12:27 pm
    hunter 13
    If Wenger knew what he was doing, we won’t have lost at sunderland..

    Applied logic PG says

    If Fergie knew what he was doing United would not have lost at home to Blackburn

    Azed is now the proud owner of a pointy hat with a D on it..

    Hunter ,take a breath ,I am vouching for you here.
    ——————————————————————————————————————-
    Fergie in the last 7 years has won more trophies than Wenger in 16 years
    Who knows his stuff among the two?

  205. Fergie in the last 7 years has won more trophies than Wenger in 16 years
    Who knows his stuff among the two?

    yes lol..and has spent hundreds of millions to do it ..and has even placed the clubs assets as collateral and is risking united’s past and future to win a trophy or two….their days are numbered.

  206. Dross= Squillaci and Djourou two CB;s who would give Ceasar ans Stephanovs a run for their money

    Diaby 16 mins game time this season to go with the previous 5 seasons where he has been injury prone

    Chamakh 1 league goal in a year

    Park no league starts

    Arshavin lazy and dis-interested

    They are not on low wages are they?How many millions would we save on the wage bill by getting rid of these deadwood?

  207. Azed,it does not stop you being the stupidest poster since………….err…………….. Spectrum.
    You dont see the stupidity of you statement?
    No,I feel you cant.
    Sad,very sad.Someone paid good money for that keyboard you are sitting at.

  208. Arshavin lazy and dis-interested

    That is rich coming from a lazy un-interesting chap like you.Martin.

  209. Block4 | February 20, 2012 at 1:27 pm

    “geeGunner, is this “as a matter of fact name me another club in UK that has grown from where we were and had some success and still stayed competitive in the same period without a billionire just pumping in the funds?” a serious question??

    Answer: Manchester United. In fact they’ve had billionaires actively taking funds out of the club since the Glazers took over. They hadn’t won a title in over 25 years before Ferguson became manager.”

    What i said was –

    “as a matter of fact name me another club in UK that has grown from where we were”

    from where we were – i far as i know Man utd were already ahead of us as they won the prem on a few occasions, had just given debuts to their golden generation and were the richect in the lg at the time. Thats hardly comparing apples with apples and you have to point to the most successful team in the last 15 yrs and the history of the football league to validate your point! and even if you include man utd its pretty hard to come up with an alternative.

    Like someone said earlier – we have been punching above our weight for yrs – like Roy jones jr in his middleweight career unifying the haevyweight div with tyson, holifield, lewis in there as competition. – it is a massive acheivement that get right up my nostrils to see like minded people not show any appreiciation at all for what is a remarkable achievement.

  210. pedantic george
    Azed,it does not stop you being the stupidest poster since………….err…………….. Spectrum.
    You dont see the stupidity of you statement?
    No,I feel you cant.
    Sad,very sad.Someone paid good money for that keyboard you are sitting at.
    ————————————————————————————————————————
    This is coming from someone who thinks a man who has failed in the last 7 years is a success…
    Dude you must really have low expectations in life and i must say, its not a crime to aim higher than 4th.

  211. So was the business model to sell our best players every summer?

    Winning trophies and competing for the title instead of 4th place will keep our players and attract better ones.What player wants to join us if we are in the Europa league

    Why would RVP and Jack stay when the club is showing no ambition on the pitch

  212. geeGunner, you need to indicate a starting point. I took my starting point as before the respective managers took over. If you can actually pinpoint the start of “where we were”, just a year will do, not an actual date, then we might be able to debate the point. The vagueness of “where we were” is not helping. I mean, if we went back to, say, 1935, then we were the biggest, most successful team in England and we aren’t at the level now that we were then. See?

  213. George

    Name me an Arsenal player more Lazy than Arshavin?

  214. geeGunner

    Like someone said earlier – we have been punching above our weight for yrs – like Roy jones jr in his middleweight career unifying the haevyweight div with tyson, holifield, lewis in there as competition. – it is a massive acheivement that get right up my nostrils to see like minded people not show any appreiciation at all for what is a remarkable achievement.
    —————————————————————————————————————–
    Dude our wage bill is 8mil less than untd, what do you mean by punching above our weight?

  215. Sorry but I have to post this from this morning.Hope you don’t mind Bob.For “Jabba” read many of todays posters.

    “consolsbob | February 20, 2012 at 8:32 am
    Jabbba doesn’t actually make that point Henristic. He had a go at me for saying that i’d rather support Arsenal in the Championship than play football like Sunderland in the Premiership.

    That does not make me a fan of Arsenal’s current style of play or a new fan. It makes me a detester of the kind of anti football built only on ‘committment’ and running around a lot.

    He is one eyed. He wants to win and only win. I’ve supported Arsenal over the reigns of 7 managers and a couple of caretakers. None played liked Arsenal do now, some were pretty poor and some were very good.

    None of that affected my support. It might have made be less enthusiastic about standing on a cold, wet terrace on occasion but it was still Arsenal on the pitch.

    No, it’s jabba who only wants Arsenal to do one thing. Win trophies, any way they can. That means playing like Stoke and/ or with the Uzbek’s money if necessary.

    He claims that this is caring about the club. It is not. It is caring about himself.”

    Trouble is those who I am aiming at are to thick to understand who Bob is saying.

  216. Martin

    There are plenty of supporters lazier than Arshavin…

  217. Well statistically,Martin ,all of them bar Arteta.
    He covers more ground per minute than all others on average.
    So ?

  218. Winning is great, and what sport is ultimately about. But you support who you support, through thick and thin. I am with bob, I would support Arsenal if they were in the Conference. Although we would have to reduce the price of the Chikcen Balti pies if that were the case. And the temperature of them whilst they are at it.

  219. Jabba's Delights

    George

    BOb said he would rather the club were relegated than play bad football. I dont need to respond to such a shite comment.

    I want arsenal to be succesful and challenging. There are many many people in this world who finds our football booring as fuck. The football is about stopping the opposition scoring and scoring more yourself we arent every good at either. As an arsenal fan you should want them to be

  220. I would support Arsenal if we were in the Blue Square whatsit too.

  221. Jabba's Delights

    Goonerandy

    Bob is saying he would prefer us relegated than to play bad football. Poodle last night said he is a good football fan first and for most then an arsenal fan. The are precisly the type of fans who stop supporting our great club when our manager inevitably leaves and we bring in a less astetically pleasing manager.

    These are the supporters who would have taken no joy in our 1993 cup double or cup winners win the next year.

    I will be a season ticket holder at arsenal until the day im to old to get into the ground no matter what division or how shit the football we play is. Some of you should get on board with that theory of support as some of yours appears awfully vain

    The aim of the club should be to win trophies in a sustainable way.

  222. As it happens 14 times out of 14 years in the ECL and its equivalent is surpassed by only one other manager. Martin O’Neill knows …..

  223. Jabba's Delights

    Frank

    so would i but many of your little minions on here only like us and support you as they love our football and conseqyuintly our manager. These are not the same people qwho would support us if a defensive authoritarian was the next man brought in…………..they arent supporters

  224. The words of a friend of mine. He likes football. Supports Plymouth. Might lend perspective to some.

    “I have had my faith in football restored. A completely unexpected 4-0 away win can do that kind of thing.

    But I have to say, hats off to Accrington Stanley. Apart from being kind enough to let us win, they lifted my heart – they’re only still here because people really care. They went bust in 1962, re-formed in 1968, and finally got back in the league in 2006 – there was a little notice round the back of the dugouts saying they were built and paid for by the supporters club.

    As a day out, it pretty much had everything. Terracing. A dodgy keeper. A striker on loan from Burnley who seems to be 5’7″ tall but also about 3’2” wide – Alex MacDonald resembles Spongebob Squarepants in terms of proportions, and crucially he can score goals. Being so cold I couldn’t feel my feet even while wearing two pairs of my thickest socks. I was in the burger queue at half-time when a bloke walked past carrying a bucket of whitewash and a paintbrush, presumably to re-mark the pitch, and I thought ‘this is proper football’. And then they ran out of Bovril. Grr. We were singing “two-nil and we’re freezing cold” and promptly went and scored from a corner, and then a conga developed around the away end.
    There was even a sudden hailstorm of biblical proportions, apparently triggered when the fourth official held up his board for three minutes of injury time. My favouite bit was a lovely lower-league moment from early in the second half, when a long ball went a couple of feet the wrong side of the touchline, landed in a puddle with a beautiful dramatic splash… and just stuck there. Without bouncing or anything.

    In short, this is football, this is Plymouth Argyle, and I bloody love it.”

  225. JD

    You’re logic is well, entirely noticeable by its absence. The conclusions you draw from statements are just breathtaking in depths of lunacy even by the standards of posters today.

  226. Jabba's Delights

    Frank

    The problem is with your stat is that our wages have meant we always should qualify for the cl. you state things are impossible for us now as clubs are richer but the same was true 10 years ago then it was impossible for other clubs to compete with our finances. Why should it be see as such an amazing achievment, look what we did with those 14 years , 1 final and one semi.

  227. Jabba's Delights

    Yogi

    Which one.

  228. What the fuck are you wittering on about now?

  229. Money and the woes it does INDEED, YW.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDYGlDV4ldo

  230. Fucking hell I just found myself listening to a fellow called Sting. It was horrible.

  231. Thanks for that Jonny. I go and watch Chelmsford City when I can (tough game against Weston-Super-mare tonight), these Plymouth supporters don’t know they’re born!!

  232. Actually that music was not unpleasant, Aman. Sting can’t be the fellows only name though surely. Sting Smith? Dave Sting?

  233. @ Block4 | February 20, 2012 at 2:24 pm

    look what i said in the above paragraph –

    “Well for the last 15 yrs wenger has been a constant and look were we are now to then – If we do make the champs lg this season that will be an amazing acheivement considering harry has managed it once in his whole life and the spuds are having their best season in 50 yrs and 1 place ahead of us.”

    15 yrs was mentioned – pls re-read if your not sure

  234. Wenger would probably be the first to admit that last summer didn’t go according to plan. Barca not paying up early and paying what we felt was value for Cesc. Wenger also didn’t predict Nasri betraying him and time wasn’t on his side to make corrections, we all know this.
    What can we do as fans, cry like babies or hope for the best??

    Question for all Arsenal fans, would you rather be a deluded fan or a bitter fan??

  235. Gordon Matthew Thomas Sumner…aka Sting, Frank

    The quality of the slapbacks here is so @ par with Yogi’s informative write up.
    Kudos to all those trying to educate the trolls

    “No grenades required today dear, Frank & the RASERs’ve got this covered!”

  236. Azed | February 20, 2012 at 2:04 pm

    “Who was Wenger before he managed arsenal?-

    The guy who had managed great players like hoddle, weah, henry, thuram etc and won the lg title with monaco and had got to latter stages of the euro cup. he was well known!

    Wenger has not done more for the club than the club has done for him.”

    whats your point? no one said that he had!

    2)Man utd have played Valencia and Carrick in defense lots of time this season, they’ve played Rooney in midfield this season but are still challenging for the title(Fergie adapts).
    – for a start were not man utd (30 mil berba sat on the bench) 18 mil phil jones and 10 mil ( chris smailling) 20 Ssomething million de gea in goal. 2nd – song played in def, so has le coq who is a def mid and verm outta position – whats that not adapting?

    the rest of your points are not worth responding to.

  237. @geeGunner, if I can make sense of that ramble, you are saying we are in better shape than 15 years ago. Financially, undoubtedly. Footballistically (to use a turn of phrase), only if we qualify for the Champions League this season which is 50-50 at the moment. We have absolutely hit some great peaks between the two. What Spurs have or haven’t done is irrelevant other than they’re another team to finish above in our division.

  238. can we all agree on the basics first ?

    1) wenger is a qualified manager and a professional for the last 30 + years
    2) arsenal was never big nor rich
    3) fans are simple people who view football as an escape
    4) fans are babies and when babies aint happy they cry
    5) arsene wenger knows more about football than every journalist in the world
    6) a company is defined by its proftis and losses.
    7) the policy of a company is a directive that comes from the top of hierarchy
    8) when you gamble with youth and production lines not everyone will turn into a cesc
    9) before wenger arsenal was known for “boring boring arsenal”
    10) since wenger took the club there has been a meteroic rise in club;s value as well as prestige.

    just the basic …yes?

  239. Wenger is a victim of his own success. He has made too many fans arrogant

  240. Azed | February 20, 2012 at 2:26 pm

    Dude our wage bill is 8mil less than untd, what do you mean by punching above our weight?

    have you got a source for that, it would be nice to see it?

  241. Hunter/ why do you dislike the English?

  242. Yogi:

    Interesting post. I understand your frustration with a segment of the fans but there are so many things that are difficult to understand and I think that the fans of any club in the like Arsenal would be upset with the results we are seeing on the pitch and the whole mess that seems to be our financial situation. Does not excuse some of the behavior.

    The biggest problem with the whole issue of the clubs finances is that no one has any idea what is the truth.. When the stadium was first built we were told that it would not affect the clubs financial and transfer budget and not influence our results. When that turned out to be wrong we were told that the financial spigot would open when the stadium debt was brought down and the property was sold. Now we are arguing that we will have to wait until 2014 when we can renegotiate the commercial deals. For at least 2 years everyone associated with the club (the boss, PHW, and IG included) has been telling us that there is plenty of money available and Arsene could buy players if he felt they were needed. Arsene said himself a couple of years ago that the financial constraints were no longer a problem. Supposedly the club has made a few big money offers for players. Now we are suggesting that all of that was a smoke screen and the club really has to make big sales every season just to get by. What in the world are we supposed to think at this point?

    Add to that the fact the club has paid off a very manageable stadium debt at an accelerated rate taking more money out of the transfer coffers and the only logical explanation is the board wanted the balance sheet better in order to improve their own profits from selling the club. These things do not give one much confidence in ownerships commitment to the future success of the club on the pitch. Silent Stan does not give much confidence either.

    The other part of your post that I thought was interesting.

    “If the manager chooses not to invest, it is not that he does not want to, simply that he cannot. interesting was the quote.”

    That goes completely against what the club and the manager himself has said. It also goes against many of the things we have seen. I don’t think anyone would argue that the club has used all the resources available. Its all a confusing mess.

  243. Also spy i am 100% confident that a lot of the criticism arsene and arsenal get has been instigated by rivals and haters …….

    if i am THAT wrong….please show me.

    😉

  244. Jabba's Delights

    Jeff | February 20, 2012 at 3:24 pm

    I would rather be a fan that makes sure we dont make the same mistake again.

    The club struggled mightily to sell tickets last year but ended up doing so. Anyone who has been around the Emirates this year knows that thousands upon thousands of these fans dont turn up on any given day. Its goign to be an incredible struggle convincing these people to sign on again and if you think red members are going to pick up the slack yuour mistaken.

    The club is going to be forced to be less conservative this summer. If they ask the manager to move upstairs and bring in a qulity replacement i think many will be happy however if they keep wenger but force him to change his methods in the transfer market and with our wages i think you will have a very very very delighted majority.

  245. The biggest problem with the whole issue of the clubs finances is that no one has any idea what is the truth.

    im sorry …how is that information important to the fan ?

    is the fan some tax regulator or some cop to check the company;s finances and give us his approval ?

    lol…..

  246. Youi really are a bit dense Jabba. Your statement (and your spelling) :

    “…The are precisly the type of fans who stop supporting our great club when our manager inevitably leaves and we bring in a less astetically pleasing manager.

    These are the supporters who would have taken no joy in our 1993 cup double or cup winners win the next year. ”

    Well I can’t speak for Poodle who, with me, this was aimed at, but my point was actually the opposite. I always have, do and always will support Arsenal, whatever happens to the club.

    I also remember the piss up after that second cup win in 1993. I seemed pretty happy, I think.

    No Jabba, it’s you. It’s you who makes your supportt conditional not those on here who continue to support constantly. Yesterday, today and tomorrow.

    Thick and thin, Thick and thin.

    You are so far up your own arse that you can’t see the light.

  247. The club struggled mightily to sell tickets last year but ended up doing so.

    From one nonsense to the other .

    I guess them 40k people on the waiting list dont count ……

  248. @geeGunner, if I can make sense of that ramble, you are saying we are in better shape than 15 years ago. Financially, undoubtedly. Footballistically (to use a turn of phrase), only if we qualify for the Champions League this season which is 50-50 at the moment.

    I actually think the stadium move was a massive achievment and given the fact that highbury was about 38,000 capacity – do you think we could have competed staying there?
    also coming runners up in the europen cup final is a massive achievement in our history unless we think like Man utd, barca or real fans and curse our team insisting thet should have won the dam thing and the runners up medals represent failures

  249. Oh, welcome back Jonny. Another Argyle fan? Excellent.

    Zimpaul. Excellent post. pearls before swine.

  250. Spy? …did you miss my reply to your question ?

    [He did because I deleted it. You’re learning how to contribute and then forgetting as quickly. We’ll train you. We will. – YW]

  251. Jabba's Delights

    Jeff | February 20, 2012 at 3:33 pm

    Or maybe he let his own success go to his head.

    Your talking about a manager who has won 4 league titles and 6 cups in 30 years of management. You forget that he has got a club relegated before and was sacked from monaco for failing maintain standards leaving them 17th in the league.

    This is not a manager beyond criticism.

    He has made the most utterly applaing attempt at improving our defence over the last 3-4 years and most of his buys are more hit than miss lately. The squads mental strength is abysmal and has been for years and we have still yet to develope any sort of variety in our play.

    The are honest assesments of our side and our manager. Its his job to sory it out football is a results business and ours arent good enough.

    I blame the board for not spelling it out to him that the aim of the club isnt to come 4th but to be genuinly competative and improve the side.

    Glazidis will be taken to the cleaners this year at the AST meeting he wont be allowed to come up with the same excuses as he has for 2 years.

  252. @Bill | February 20, 2012 at 3:45 pm

    “When the stadium was first built we were told that it would not affect the clubs financial and transfer budget and not influence our results.”

    I dont think the financial crisis had started then – that affected their overall projections.

    to be fair i dont think that the financial landscape has settled enough for everyone to know exactly where they are and make plans for the future. again it is a noticeable that in a period of finacial and political turbulence ( euro) we have managed to pay of a significant amount of debt while remaining competitiive.

    “the only logical explanation is the board wanted the balance sheet better in order to improve their own profits from selling the club.” i disagree – that is a basic function of business- to balance the books become more efficient and make a profit (no hidden agenda just good practice – whether your selling or looking for investors.

  253. geeGunner
    Man utd have played Valencia and Carrick in defense lots of time this season, they’ve played Rooney in midfield this season but are still challenging for the title(Fergie adapts).
    – for a start were not man utd (30 mil berba sat on the bench) 18 mil phil jones and 10 mil ( chris smailling) 20 Ssomething million de gea in goal. 2nd – song played in def, so has le coq who is a def mid and verm outta position – whats that not adapting?
    ——————————————————————————————————-
    haha if adapting means we are 17pts behind the champions then yes we did.
    30mil Berba sat on the bench while home grown Wellbeck is delivering..not bad if you ask me. Whats up with you guys and the cost of a player? 30mil Berba(top scorer in the league once) has won the league three times.
    Funny enough with all the millions Fergie has spent, our wage bill is just 8mil less than untd while their commercial revenue continues to dwarf ours.
    How do you explain Rooney 30Mil, Berbatov 30Mil, De gea 18Mil, Carrick 16Mil, Anderson 18Mil, Nani 18Mil, Rio 30Mil and yet our wage bill is only 8mil less than untd?
    Oh and that is from a club that claims financial prudence.

  254. Jonny welcome back from?

    Something to note: SirAF to bless his cotton socks, is the 500th shareholder of Accrington Stanley!

  255. Spy? …did you miss my reply to your question ?

    [He did because I deleted it. You’re learning how to contribute and then forgetting as quickly. We’ll train you. We will. – YW]

    {deleted it? did i say something wrong or offensive? …if i did i apologise but….on the contrary …you should have left it appear cause now people will say their own things without knowing what was said and under which context.}

    isnt it funny that the people who know the least about football want to tell a guru like arsene how to run his football club?

    would you not laugh if the greeks were giving advise to japan about technolgy and finance ?

    why should it be any different with these english journos and wenger ?

    whats wrong with what ive said..i fail to see my mistakes … master jedi…..open my eyes…. 😉

  256. That £8m figure is incorrect (probably used Man Utd’s figure of 2010 v’s Arsenal’s 2011 figures). In 2011 Utd’s (£153m) wages were £29m more then Arsenal’s (£124m) (Remember that Utd’s figure includes bonuses for winning the league and reaching the CL Final).

    All figures taken from the excellent Swiss Ramble (just scroll down). The only place to resd about football finances.

    http://swissramble.blogspot.com/search/label/Arsenal

  257. They don’t have to hunter13. One thing that I continually see through your posts is the dislike you have for the English and in that reply, I – to use a quaint colloquialism – copped the arse over it.

    It’s one of those weird things I don’t understand. Not the disliking the English bit, God knows I’m English and I don’t like half the buggers. It’s why you support an English club.

  258. Thanks Bob.

    A break from the ACLF pages, notoverthehill.

    As bob will tell you I talk too much! ;0)

  259. How do you explain Rooney 30Mil, Berbatov 30Mil, De gea 18Mil, Carrick 16Mil, Anderson 18Mil, Nani 18Mil, Rio 30Mil = 700m debt with training ground and stadium belonging to the banks …not united

    🙂 see the difference or still ?

  260. I object Yogi.

    Its not about liking its about making fun or mocking those who think they know better. It has nothing to do with countries… If the people of somalia were trashing wenger like the english are i would call them stupid too and make fun of their limited intelligence.

    I dont understand your comments. Youre putting words in my mouth i never used or said.

  261. Hunter “isnt it funny that the people who know the least about football want to tell a guru like arsene how to run his football club?” I see your point but you should be made aware that you talk as though your opinion is gospel, frequently dismissing all conflicting opinion as moronic and stating your version of the truth as both obvious, to anyone with a brain, and chiselled in granite.
    A little concession to the fact that most of what we peons contribute is just opinion in a fancy frock would be most welcome.

  262. And yeah…lol in the end of the day…from bangers and mash wenger upgraded us to chaviar and bon fillets….

    is that wrong too?

    i dont think so………. 🙂

  263. Hunter/ sorry had work on, no one hates some of the English journo’s more than me,
    Howard comes to mind, but we must not descend into the siege mentality of say Chelskie.
    Good points keep it up!

  264. Jabba's Delights

    Hunter

    Once again it all falls down for you. None of Utd debt has anythign to do with how they are run as a football club. It all comes from there leveraged buyout. As a club they are hugely profitable and will enter a new stratosphere when someone buys out the glaziers including there debt burden lumped on the club.

    Walk away with you tail placed firmly between your legs

  265. Hunter

    Jonny sums it up quite eloquently.

    I’ll put it more bluntly. Your posts are at best imflammatory. Sometimes you cool it and they are released into the internet ether; others you don’t. They are the ones which are released from moderation into spam.

    Frankly I don’t have time to release them all, you’re lucky today I do have the time and feel so inclined. Later this week I know I won’t have the former.

    It’s not only you who is targeted. Others have been but have moderated their approach. Some are even doing it themselves even if their opinions are entirely wrong.

    Earlier you said that you were fighting the fires as you saw them on six sites. If that’s the case, you need to adjust your language to each one.

  266. no jonny i object again…i never give my opinion…..

    i just observe a lot of people who aint specialists or have any knowledge authority or expertise on the subjects of FOOTBALL critisising and abusing a professional who is doing what is doing the last 30 years if not more.

    is that so hard to understand?

    what makes people think they can have OPINIONS on such things?

    if were talking about “opinions” to kill time over the internet then shoot away….but when these “opinions” of so many clueless people start becoming popular

    In fact the only opinion one can have on wenger and what he does is this:

    do i like it? yes or no …….therefore not an opinion..just a preference.

    to issue an opinion that can hold value it must be made by someone equal or above wenger.

    whose opinion on wenger would hold more value? johan kruyffs? or jabbas?

    i rest my case….

  267. Jabba's Delights

    Hunter

    Adding to Jonny comments what about all these managers who have won more than arsene who disagree with what he does. What about captains and players from multiple title winning team or even better back to back titl teams who criticise wengers team making ability. What about our own greats who look at our defence and call them inept and poorly coached on a weekly basis. If all this chatter was consigned to the terraces it might mean you were correct but in reality you basically saying anyone not called arsene can have an opinion thats right in football.

  268. Bill. You are wrong. That the club has excess liquidity (dosh in the bank to invest) does not mean Wenger is entitled to spend it willy-nilly, whether he has the authority or not. He must not, and cannot buy players (club assets) he cannot justify financially at fair market value. It is risky and extremely irresponsible to do this. Should he do this, he should be fired – at least at Arsenal.

    He has set out these rules and alluded to them many times. We must make a return on capital employed (make a net profit), that is our bottom line. Especially good and clever buys (they are all pretty clever financially I think) are those of Ramsey, Ox, Gervinho, Jenks, Ryo, Kos, Santos. These are players he is certain he has bought at close to or even below real asset value. In good times their value will increase with the bubble, but far more importantly, in bad or chaotic times, their value will hold firm and we are insulated.

    This then needs to be measured against the team needs obviously, and a huge amount of work goes into that; but I can’t see too much wrong here and I marvel at such clever and cautious use of resources. I am certain Wenger sees the only alternatives as being two: pay over-value prices for, yes, excellent players (a Tevez say, or a Dzeko) and a likely result is a Tottenham type scenario which is a more or less one-off season or two, but not the foundation for a 14 year CL run which requires sustained, stable finances. Or, bring funds in by an investor and become a version of Chelsea, Liverpool etc. Both are ultimately bad for football, for Arsenal and for business sense.

    Otherwise, live within your means and do the best you can, Everton-style, which in our case is punching above our weight for years now. But, in the end we will win because the inflated price player bubble will burst inevitably. There is literally no better example than ponytail at Liverpool, although Torres is a good one too. Try and offload either now, and see how much you lose. Neither club can afford to sell these players. They were terrible purchases.

  269. Jabba's Delights

    Hunter

    O dear old boy, go have look at what allot of greats thing about arsene job over the last couple of years

  270. Hands up all those who are happy that Mike Dean is the ref for the NLD.

  271. Walk away with you tail placed firmly between your legs

    Jabba ,you say things like that as if you have won the day!
    You have never won a debate yet.
    Hunter ties you up ,has a bit of fun rolling you around and then discards you like the used nappy you are.

    You have been embarrassed by Yogi ,Bob and Hunter plus countless others.And your replies is always the same.
    In short .you chat pure shit.

  272. Not suprised that PG & Hunter have some form of t’internet bond.

    The similarities are mind boggling.

    I’d say the Emirates has been about 5k-10k short of bums on seats for most games this season. Whether they are sold or not, we don’t know.

    Regardless – you can see that ST holders are not going, and red members are not picking up the slack.

  273. Bradys right foot

    We didn’t get Goetze, Hazard or Mata in the summer. All three if rumor is to be believed received bids from the club. Mata would have had to wave a £7milion signing on bonus and less wages to sign with us, Dortmund were not minded to sell despite a bid said to be in the region of £30million, hazard has flashed his knickers at all onlookers it is difficult to draw any firm conclusions as to what hapened in the summer. To say that “both the both the manager and the club got it horribly wrong last Summer,” regarding transfers presupposes that we are masters of our own destinies in the transfer market, that is simplistic to say the least. The Mata transfer should be a cautionary tale for any fan who believes transfers are easy, we got guzzumped, blew out of the water for a player who does not suit the Chelsea system but would have played through the middle with us.

    Arteta has been a good signing as has Santos, Chamberlin and Mertesacker injuries and the trauma and critical inaction at the start of the year have played a big role in the season. The inaction played out in August however hardly reflects the activity behind the scenes. We were trying to sign players the fact that we were unable to get them should not be placed at the managers throat, it ignores the competition and the fact our targets for the most part can earn a better living elsewhere.

  274. Jabba can you list the ex players ,managers and former club legends who say Arsene should leave?
    Or even that he should consider his position ?
    Last week people were making much of Dennis and his mild (and very much led) criticism and missed the fact that he said
    “I fear for Arsenal when Arsene leaves”

  275. Azed | February 20, 2012 at 4:05 pm

    “haha if adapting means we are 17pts behind the champions then yes we did”.

    – i dont know what you find funny but yes we are 17 points behind the current champions – only you thats laughing and 2nd we are not the most successful team in the history of the league we are the 3rd most successful team in the history of the league.

    That you keep comparing us to the most successfull side in the league says more about what wenger has done for expectations and your expectations as a fan than his short commings or limitations
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_football_clubs_in_England_by_major_honours_won

    show a bit more respect for our greatest manager of all time –

    “Funny enough with all the millions Fergie has spent, our wage bill is just 8mil less than untd while their commercial revenue continues to dwarf ours.”

    where is your source? i have’nt heard that where is your source so i can verify?

  276. Not suprised that PG & Hunter have some form of t’internet bond.

    Says Luke ,the second most tedious poster to Jabba,the most……

  277. I fear for your memory PG.

  278. Lew1234 | February 20, 2012 at 4:18 pm

    Cheers lew – Azed where did you get your figure of 8 mill?

  279. Hi guys! Talking about prudence, Wenger’s new signing Park has not played even half a match in PL. Yogi talks about finances so what about the salary that Park is drawing. Does not make Wenger look very clever there, eh?

  280. All total wage bill information is easily found on Deloitte’s website.

  281. Dhruv | February 20, 2012 at 5:05 pm
    Hi guys! Talking about prudence, Wenger’s new signing Park has not played even half a match in PL. Yogi talks about finances so what about the salary that Park is drawing. Does not make Wenger look very clever there, eh?

    What is the point of that?
    The stupidity of some people is staggering.
    He most likely thinks that post is insightful and witty.

  282. Jabba's delights

    George

    I’ve said repeatedly that it comes down to him changing or leaving . If he refuses to adapt he is going to take us further down. We cant continue to spend our “precious” wages on players who don’t get it done. We need to have a good transfer window and we need to adapt our tactics this is obvious. If the manger can’t sort that yes I’m afraid to say he must leave it’s really very simple.

    It’s not good enough to pay lip service to what needs to be done anymore. The decline continues as we aren’t proactive enough the board tells us there is money and the manager is in full control, well there is no excuse not to act then. Yearon year with a great manger with resources and continuity we should improve

  283. Jabba’s delights | February 20, 2012 at 5:14 pm I’ve said repeatedly that it comes down to him changing or leaving .

    pmsl..obviously alzations post at 11:07 never hit base with jabba …ahahah

    I admire Wenger greatly for sticking by the club and fronting it while the changeover / vacuum from above has taken place.

    We are all quick to forget that the decision was taken to build a bigger stadium before the petro-dollars entered football. We were realistically moving to keep pace with Man Utd’s increased revenues from expanding Old Trafford. If Abramovic et al hadn’t decided to move in, wages and transfers would have been far less than they are now and we would have a much stronger comparative squad.

    But we are where we are. The question is which direction does the current owner wish to take us? I understand (not from Sky Sports sources) that there is an agreement that expires in April, whereby Kroenke has been unable to remove or appoint any Director from the Board. Perhaps the next few weeks might signal where we go.

    “which direction the owner wants to take us” ………… BINGO!

    you see jabba….someone who understands that club’s policy comes from the top of command chain..wow will you look at that hey…..

    hahaha destroying you is becoming my specialty…would you like my opinion on the matter ? ..ahaha

  284. Jabba's delights

    George

    But is the park signing not questionable especially so considering the way he has been treated is completely at odds with our long term goal in creating support in the far east. BBC Asian corespondent has questioned whether we should even go on tour to Korea this summer such is there I’ll feeling towards us now

  285. Mike Dean referee for the NLD
    We have not won in the 11 game he has been in charge.
    Batten down the hatches .It seems the powers the be need the future England manager to be victorious.And for belt and braces Dowd is the forth official.

  286. Victory through harmony

    I’ve been reading this blog for quite sometime now & I have to admire your loyalty towards the manager. Especially after reading today’s post after what’s gone on lately at the club.

    BUT I have to question your belief in what you write. I mean even the most hardent supporter of the manager Is having to look at things from a different perspective now.

    Nearly all our legendary players from the past are saying wenger’s policy is not working yet you seem to slate other fans when they share that view. Why? Surely all our past greats can’t be losing the plot??

    Like I said I respect another opinion but there is only so much a fan can take before having to question the clubs ambitions & the managers policy. We’re the 5th richest club in the world for Christ sake! Surely we should be competing with spurs this season AT LEAST!

    I read someone even go as far to say we have been punching above our weight for too long! What gooner would say such a thing?

    I’m guessing some of the posters on here are well above there 50’s & wish to live a peaceful life & there is nothing wrong with that but the worlds gotta move forward & so does football & supporters.

    Maybe some of you guys need to also? No disrespect intended btw.

  287. Good lad George, get those excuses in nice and early!

    Dean is a c**t though

  288. YW well made points, but do you honestly believe we as a club are capable of learning from our past mistakes, if the past is anything to go by I don’t think so, there are so many still at Arsenal that are not playing for one reason or another that ought to be moved on free which will free up the much needed transfer/wage budget:

    1 Almunia
    2 Diaby – his injuries have blighted his career as talented as he might be we have not seen the best from him in an age
    3 Sanchez Watts – will he ever make the grade here?
    4 Vela – doing a great job in Spain, I think he is just suited to Spanish football
    5 Vito Mannone – will he ever make it at arsenal when we have Fabiansky as our number 2
    6 Nik B – will he ever make it when he cant even get a game at sunderland?
    7 Denilson – having a mare in his home land by all accounts

    These are just the ones I can think of the top of my head that seem to have been around for years and have not seemed to progress like we would all have hoped so why hand on to them? If it because they are being overpaid then we should really look at the the wages we pay players that are not established as this is hurting us.

    I haven’t even got to those in the current 1st team that really ought not be, our fav defenders Squilli and Johan.

    In my mind this is where Ivan G needs to start earning his money so that the fiasco that was the previous summer transfer window is never ever repeated.

    The problem is Wenger, probably told Ivan G that he was happy with the squad until we got mauled by Man U then retracted his initial observation and mage the August 31 panic buys, in all honestly we as suporters might never know what happened last summer but what unanimous is that it was piss poor planning.

    On the playing side our next game take on massive importance in the hope of ovoiding the recent trend in end of season mediocrity, as that will surely lead to dropping out of the top 4.

    OK I have had my rant what good it will do…. lol….

  289. geeGunner

    History is fine but lets see what is happening recently. Tactically, Wenger is falling apart. Arsenal are having horrendous seasons by his lofty standards, struggling against the likes of Stoke and Fulham in recent years. In CL, Arsenal dont look like going past the big teams, especially now when there is no Fabregas. If Wenger stays then well and good, but there have to be a few quality signings. No use talking like mugs who feel everything is fine and according to plan. Wenger definitely has lost his way. You cannot complain about Wenger’s record but dont rest on laurels.

    George

    What is the point replying to you, you are a frog in the well. Keep dreaming about playing Arshavin through the center, will you. Arshavin needs to be shipped out, Okay?

  290. Some terrific posts today – especially ZimPaul (all day long), ConsolBob and also great to see Jonny back; all talking a great deal of sense.

    Certainly a day of separating the wheat from the chaff, though. Which can only mean a recent defeat/draw for our beloved Gunners a very simple fact which is, as ever, always very telling …

    ***

    Hunter – remember those breathing exercises we were discussing the other day …?!!

    I really don’t believe you have to be inflammatory in order to win your arguments – you are much bigger than that – and you’ll win nothing through being in moderation and we’ll all be the poorer for it.

    By the way, and I’m SURE you must know this – it’s not just SOME English folk that don’t find Arsene to their immediate taste; he has detractors of ALL nationalities (as you would say “lol”).

    Of the English people I know, the ones that openly admit to ‘hating’ him do so not because of his nationality but because of the almost immeasurable success he has brought to the club; long-term jealousy can do terrible things to a person’s messed up internal make up …

    And the Doomers, in their desperation to land any kind of blow on him and with the ferocity of your average dead sheep, label him arrogant, stubborn blah de blah – all splendid qualities for being a top TOP manager, I think we’d both agree.

  291. YW if you will kindly bear with me>

    To compare Arsenal Holdings with Red Football Limited (Manure) is in my view comparing apples and pears!

    The bare figures are per 2010/2011 Financial Reports as Arsenal is 31st May and Red Football is 30th June 2011.
    Using the average monthly full time employees were:
    Arsenal monthly was 454 staff net cost of £109,578,000.
    Red Football was 628 staff net cost £135,568,000.
    In addition Arsenal employed 834 temporaries, included in the net cost that the players see on their monthly salary slip..
    Red Football employed 2,191 temporaries!

    The Arsenal have The Emirates, London Colney, Hale End Academy, Barnet Stadium and the Arsenal Ladies use another Stadium!
    Red Football owned in turn by Red Football Joint Venture in turn owned by …. and Manure do not have a Ladies Team. The stadium and some property around the stadium and Carrington Training Ground, built on former bogland and where ManCiteh are going to build their Training Ground cum Academy. Again the temporary staff are included in the net wages cost.

    It should be pointed out that the Gross Wages included the Employers’ NIC contribution and the employers’ pension contributions. Which I will not into.

    The Arsenal outsource their catering and Manure are in-house. The Arsenal have London weighting, Manure are in the provinces somewhere where Howard Webb lives?

    YW sorry if I am hogging the facts of life!

  292. Bradys right foot

    The modern Arsenal has been built on £4million of investment. Arsene has simply been guilty of being too good at his job. No other manager could have achieved what he has with such an insignifigant net spend.

    http://www.transferleague.co.uk/league-tables/managers-comparisons.html

  293. Jabba's delights

    Arsenalandrew

    Quite simple mate I don’t hate wenger at al in fact I used to worship him just like you. What I’m not blind to though is the fact that we aren’t doing that well anymore but we could be with better management from the top down. Tactically good and bad teams know how to nullify us now this means we are getting worse results….wow how did we get there.

    On the one hand we say aren’t fighting on a level playing field with wages but the we waste millions a month on players who have negligible contribution …..surely we of all clubs can’t allow this. Our wage bill after all is a
    LOt closer to utd than you would expect.

    We had a poor summer but the fact that no planning had gone in to losing 2 of our best players, stinks of a head in sand attitude, this has hugely affected our season.

    We are right to expect better. If you child is an a grade student up until university but the starts getting 3rds do you bask in his a level results or do you make him buck his ideas up

  294. Yes well all well and good BRF but have you none that show Arsene in a bad light?
    What about points per £ spent?
    Oh yes I forgot,he was top of that.
    Well what about win %?
    No ?
    I heard one that went “17 points in 17 games” Can we not just use that?

  295. Jabba's delights

    Bradys

    But what now when we have money. Thank you for what youve done wenger you were wonderful when we had no cash. However arsen youve not been so good when we have money now and I’m afraid it’s starting to get quite bad. You must adapt to being a manager with money as we are still paying you as if your a brilliant manager.

    There is nobody who could have done better before I think a number could put here hands up do have done a better job in recent times

  296. Jabba’s delights | February 20, 2012 at 5:37 pm
    How many hundreds of times have you written that post?
    You really are beyond tedious.

  297. Gio @ 1.55pm
    And can anyone tell me how many time Arsenal have gone more than 7 years in thier entire 125 year old history? II think this would be an interesting fact for all of us to know as it will put our current position into perspective.

    Periods in the “First Division” without winning the trophy (excluding the period from 1912 when we were in the 2nd division and the two World Wars) have been:

    1904-30 – 19 seasons: Average position 12.6
    1931-32 – 1 season: Position 2
    1935-37 – 2 seasons: Average position 4.5
    1938-52 – 7 seasons: Average position 5.6
    1953-70 – 17 seasons: Average position 9.1
    1971-88 – 17 seasons: Average position 7.1
    1989-90 – 1 season: Position 4
    1991-97 – 6 seasons: Average position 6.3
    1998-2001 – 3 seasons: Average position 2
    2002-03 – 1 season: Position 2
    2004–11 – 7 seasons: Average position 3.4

    We’re lucky to be alive to enjoy the most successful sustained era in Arsenal’s history.

  298. Bradys one question do you like to see your team mauled? Especially when your team has the resources to be competitive at the highest level. Kudos to all those who did the hardwork for making Arsenal a great club. But when all others are looking ahead, why should the Arsenal fan denied the right to see their club play with the best. BTW, why are the stadium tickets so expensive? Is it like what that mug Hunter says “biggest transition in history” Alsolute nonsense.

    If things do not turn out inspite of making the effort then its different, but Wenger does not seem to bother.

  299. Jabba's delights

    George

    But he had more to spend and hoose to either save it or spend it on current player wage increases, WHY IS THAT A POSITIVE.

  300. Whats up folks!

    Big up’s to those who are sticking by the team and manager.

    A rough couple of matches but we continue to believe in the team and a manager that knows what he is doing.

    The team has obviously been shaken real badly by the CL match, they are going to have to dig beyond that and I trust they will. My hope is that the supporters see the need to support them team.

    ARSENAL!

  301. “Arteta has been a good signing as has Santos, Chamberlin and Mertesacker injuries and the trauma and critical inaction at the start of the year have played a big role in the season. The inaction played out in August however hardly reflects the activity behind the scenes. We were trying to sign players the fact that we were unable to get them should not be placed at the managers throat, it ignores the competition and the fact our targets for the most part can earn a better living elsewhere.”

    I agree with all of this, but I can’t believe you left Gervinho out. He has also been a good buy and as he settles into the squad and the PL, I’m sure he will get better.

  302. “There is nobody who could have done better before I think a number could put here hands up do have done a better job in recent times”
    What the fuck is that supposed to mean?
    Is it me our is that utter drivel?

  303. Jabba's delights

    George

    It’s amazing isn’t it because it true and I’ve been saying it for over a year. You would have thought they might catch on. O wait I forget we actually have the best defence in open play and set pieces are simple to sort out. Don’t forget that mental strength an fight which they constantly show all the time when our manager needs them most. Have I mentioned tactical stupidity yet

  304. Jabba's delights

    Paul n

    We lost three in five before the cl match

  305. vP ain’t going to stay and Walcott is crap and should (must) be sold on, thereby undercutting the entire premise of your blog which as per, flatters AW and AFC. They’re crocked!

    Change the bloody manager for gawd’s sake; get the young Norwich guy in.

    It isn’t about money it’s about a winning attitude and dropping an arrogant snobby (yes) manager. Too many players are wimps lacking any guts or self respect. They think all they have to do is put the shirt on and show up!

    This much is obvious to any long term watcher of the club. A few good results, most poor and on a downward trajectory year in. Now 4th is seen as a great thing (true it is) but it concrete’s our lowered expectations over previous years.

  306. You have lost most arguments you have been in, that does not stop you from believing you are always right.

  307. Have I mentioned tactical stupidity yet

    Yes Jabba, a million times you boring bastard.And it is your opinion and nothing else .Mine is the opposite,And no less valid.
    Why are you here?

  308. Your right Jabba. I think less people are disillusioned about Arsenal’s strengths after last week. Lets see what happens in the meet. I am out of here.

  309. copernicus
    Not one original word or thought.
    What use are you to humanity?

  310. Yogi,how long will my sin-bin be if I lose it big time?

    Its coming.
    I can feel it

  311. I support, I have no interest in how much money we have and should have spent. That is rubbish to me because a manager get’s paid to handle that. When and if the board believes that Arsene is not the man or he loses interest a change will be made.

    I don’t know what comes from moaning all live long day. If you don’t like what is going on, don’t waste your time with it. Remove your support but to cry and moan day in and day out is unhealthy and annoying to say the least.

    To constantly complain, is a trait of selfishness and pride.

  312. Jabba's delights

    George

    Wenger was great when times were very frugal, he has ben stinkingly average since hes had cash. Decision after decision have been wrong

    Selling tour and ade and investing the money on wage improvements for 17 players in the squad

    Finishing 11 points off top and thinking chamackh, koscielly, squilaci would get it done.

    Getting played by 2 players to such an extent he didn’t even plan for an alternative.

    Continuing to reward players with contracts or positions in our squad who don’t deserve them

    Failing to spend the money of nasri and cesc.

    These are horrible decisions that have cost us. Add in the fact that we still can’t defend we still are tactically in flexible we still don’t play the way the manager wants.

    Do I think another manager could do better in those windows and with our play in that time……..HELL YES

  313. Hey Jabba, i understand your view on things, i cant argue against anything except opinion with what you say and im sure your as good an Arsenal fan as any one out there, so i seriously would like to know what you think the options are at this point of the season. We have to do something, what do you think of the idea of changing the system to a 442 ?

  314. To constantly complain, is a trait of selfishness and pride.

    Not to mention being boring miserable cunts.
    I know you are too much of a Gent. to say that Paul .So I have given you a leg up

  315. Jabba's delights

    George

    How do our tactics or execution of them look to you George you complete idiot

  316. “I think less people are disillusioned about Arsenal’s strengths after last week.”

    was that supposed to be a comment of agreement?

  317. Or Jabba,what do you think of the idea of hanging yourself.

  318. http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/feb/20/arsenal-flaws-exposed-sunderland-hybrid

    Interesting reading from the great ZonalMarking. Speaks about Arsenals tactical play this season.

  319. Jabba I think Arsene is tactically astute.
    Its an opinion that you don’t share.
    But the fact is he is our manager so the people that matter,and have mattered for the last 16 years, agree with me.You are hugely outgunned.

  320. Arsene has been wrong constantly but it took a crooked ref to kick us out of the CL last season. The only team that looked likely to beat the “best team in history” in the CL was Arsenal. I dare say that Arsene has gotten it very right but the players who he was counting on to grow together and get it done punked out. .

  321. Jabba's delights

    Dr nick

    We are in this position because of a complete failure to do ANYTHING. We didn’t change formations in pre season we have been taught to play in one way our horrible position and lack of options and hope is due to how we have been managed

    I see absolutely no possible down side to relieving our manager or whatever coach of defensive responsibilities and putting Dixon and known in sole charge…..it can’t get worse. I would then state quite clearly in the press that there will a extremely exciting overhaul in the summer and players next 13 games decides who is there to be part of it. It can’t get worse there is a huge lack of work rate and effort already let’s see who cares.

    I would also be working my arse off to try and get a major signing to sign on now to lift this hole club.

  322. Hey Lew, just read it. I think he has tried to write a fair assessment. I think hes saying that we dont currently have a system which suits our players, but also that long term injuries to the likes of Jack and the short but regular niggles have added to that dilema, thought it was ok, didnt read the spuds bit

  323. The biggest thing in the last two matches was that we lost confidence. Tactics are always “wrong” when you lose but many times you have to impose your style and we did not do it. We played a slow cautious game and that does not suit or style, we have to use our pace and drive the ball at defenders.

  324. top post..
    many good points..

  325. Many younger Arsenal fans like Jabba simply do not know what its like to eat bitterness so in turn they just whinge and moan and throw toys. They’ve become so spoiled and grown so decadent that they cant even enjoy the simple things. Not being able to enjoy simple pleasures must suck. I love Arsenal and am proud of what Wenger has achieved, it’s too bad dunces like Jabba have become such gluttons and have to ruin it for the rest of us who are able to derive joy from something so beautiful.

  326. Jabba

    , i cant see why anyone would have a problem with a couple, from the best back four there has ever been, taking an active role re defending.

    And I cant believe we wont make a quality signing come next season, the question of whether we will make a statement looks like a no go to me cause thats the way we do it

    Ive still got one eye on our loanes, we seem to have a few good young players so we might go for a player or two who are ready to hit the ground running

  327. Would anyone sniff at an increase of 10,000,000 GBP to the transfer budget this summer? By your calcs that is what we could have got if we had not renewed Djourou’s contract.

    Based on 50,000 p/w (it may be more) for the next four years, which is the length of time his contract has been extended, we could afford an extra 10,400,000 in transfers. I haven’t bothered adding anything on for a possible transfer fee as I don’t believe anyone would pay for him.

    It works both ways. We can get rid of the worst players and have more to spend on the quality and frankly the team would have better attacking options plus we would make up the shortfall at the back a different and more effective way. ie using Song at the back with Frimpong or Coquelin in mid.

    It is a win win situation.

  328. Bradys right foot

    “Tactically good and bad teams know how to nukiffy us.”

    Turn your pitch into a ploughed field, park the bus, tactically foul, work incredibly hard, hit us on the break.

    Every time we are in a football game Jabba, I think we aquit ourselves usually very well. My personal opinion is that it takes bravery to continue to play the way we do, I’ve been a long time supporter and can remember a time when we had a much more “tactical” approach and its easier. Its much easier to do what Sunderland did to us than what we attempted to do to them. The Lee Catermole quote, “We wanted it more” is an easy soundbite, he couldn’t do what TR7 was trying to do on Sunday he wouldn’t have the bravery as a footballer and on a decent pitch wouldn’t have been as effective. Any footballer could do what Cattermole did and yes he did it well. Pragmatism v Idealism on this one Jibber the road least travelled is the most rewarding, i’ve been down the other many times and its never been as enjoyable.

    “On the one hand we say aren’t fighting on a level playing field with wages but the we waste millions a month on players who have negligible contribution”

    I think we will all agree that the scale of contracts rewarded mediocrady at times. The club will be addressing this issue.

    “We had a poor summer but the fact that no planning had gone in to losing 2 of our best players, stinks of a head in sand attitude, this has hugely affected our season.”

    No planning really? I’m actually sure that the club would have planned for their exits regardless of whether they hoped they would stay or not. Kroenke seems to have intervened on Nasri which was too much money to turn down while Arsene seemed minded to force him to stay. It was a traummatic start to the season I think well all agree and the “plan” failed Mata was a real possibility but couldn’t refuse what Chelsea offered (reportadely a 7 million sign on), Dortmund turned down our offer for Goetze. We did sign Gervinho, the Ox, Santos, Arteta and the BFG the first two of which were planned, the other three less so as other doors closed. I still refuse to believe like you that it is up to Arsene to sign the players. I would see his role in transfers as asking others to sign players he has identified. From watching this manager over the previous 15 years I believe he would have had targets in mind and would have discussed these with those at the club responsible for securing new players. Contrary to some I believe that we have been done incredibly well in recent windows we have signed the standout players of the last under 17 & 19 world cups and Oxlade Chamberlin, if these three players fulfil even half of their potential we could be talking about the greatest frontline the club have ever seen.

    “We are right to expect better”
    I share the sentiment but perhaps without the sense of entitlement. I believe we have competed pretty well in recent years despite the £400,000,000 plus investment we have seen from Chelsea and Man City since 2004, the loss of star players and a quite absurd amount of injuries. As i’ve previously said Arsenes total net spend in 15years is £4,000,000 I have no right to expect anything from a manager operating within a budget against the money, Spurs, Liverpool, Chelsea and Man U have invested in their clubs since 2004. I expect more from the board, infact my anger at the previous board is still pretty raw. They invested nothing in the club since Arsene took over, gave him nothing to spend and cashed in their shares. The rumoured surplus of £40-50 million in the transfer protocal fund is their for a monster signing its the accumulation of years of frugality not the annual or bi-annual loose change thrown at Man City or Chelsea.

    We really have to put our sense of entitlement in check, I would love Kroenke to put his hand in his walllet a give Arsene a fortune to spend guilt free. It’s not going to happen. FFP will begin to bite in 2014 a year in which the kit and shirt deals are up for renewal, we will be incredibly well placed from that juncture onwards, currently our commercial side is hamstrung by deals signed when they were talked of in millions not tens of millions.

  329. @Jabba’s Delights why do you wanna compete about being the best fan??? Accept im a fan and accept that i am a different fan than you!
    My aresenal dream is not the same as yours.

    I love the creative free flow football which is arsenal at its best and my wish is that we win like that. My opinion is that this would be the best way to win.
    For ME that is the ultimate Arsenal dream, the slightly arrogant swagger.
    I wanna win but i would like to win the right way.Tell me, why is that wrong?
    I really enjoy wathcing us play at our best. Last season until CC final was alot of fun imo.

    This season what i miss more than any trophy is the excitment out on the field. the great play and the “arrogant swagger” that used to be arsenals trademark. Its more or less gone atm. and that makes me more sad than not winning trophies.

    I support Wenger 100%, however when he eventually does and we get a new one I will back him 100% until the board removes him.

    You on the other hand has proven you will only back a new manger if we win.

    You like will only back our players if they win trophies, not when they struggle and have a hard time.
    If they got success you love the club, if they struggle you mock the club.

    But when you really do like something jabba, when you heart really beats for something, you support them in both good and bad.

    The players have not been very good latley, which is why they need our support more than ever to rise again. Cos you do want them to rise do you not?

    “I would also be working my arse off to try and get a major signing to sign on now to lift this hole club”
    why would anyone sign for this club when the fans turn on them the minut they have a bad spell?
    Most massive plaeyrs would think ” hmm liverpool where the fans still love Carroll the donkey or Arsenal where the fans boo AA when he comes on the field?”…hmmm

  330. Jabba (5.37)

    I wasn’t suggesting you, personally, hate AW, just to be clear. And also, just to be clear, I personally don’t worship AW.

    But I do respect the guy.

    Here is someone who was smart enough – and brave enough – to make a difference.

    Not just to our club but to the whole English game. The fact that Swansea of all clubs (and I really don’t mean to be disrespectful to them) were able to beat us in the WAY they beat us recently was entirely down to Arsene’s long term influence. They beat us by playing football and by playing it the right way. And well done to them.

    Thanks to AW, we were the first club to properly challenge Manure’s tedious dominance of the league which really only came about when they became the first club to grab the riches on offer from the newly formed EPL and were then able to steal everybody’s best players to secure further success. Much as I disliked them, well done to them, too; not everyone could have pulled that off and they only did what we would have done had we been in their boots.

    Wenger was the first manager since Chapman to have the sheer raw ambition not merely to win a few cups but to genuinely take the club to the highest levels in terms of our playing on the pitch – and our finances off it. And to do all of that in such a way that would continue for decades after his departure. And none of this is to disrespect all those managers that came in between HC and AW; it’s simply the scale of what he is working towards that causes him to dwarf the rest.

    Thanks to Arsene Wenger, I have seen the best football in the whole of my life being played in North London. And I have seen many great Arsenal sides before him also. But again, the SCALE of his achievements in every aspect of the club and beyond are all but impossible to match even if my affection for the ‘old’ Arsenal remains undiminished and my overall love for the club stays unchanged and unconditional across the 40+ years I’ve been lucky enough to be an Arsenal supporter and to be called a Gooner.

    Jabba, we know the club is traveling difficult terrain and most of us accept that wider economic circumstances have affected us as much as anyone. What we don’t know is exactly how and why those circumstances cause the club to behave in the way it does or influence the things it apparently ‘fails’ to do. We are living in an age of terrific uncertainty – possibly unparalleled uncertainty, in peace time, at least. The phrase ‘the best laid plans …’ can apply to anyone and few find it easy to love Plan B’s at the best of times.

    But sometimes you have to stick with them because the alternative (Plans C – Z) aren’t worth thinking about as the fans of Glasgow and Portsmouth will undoubtedly confirm.

    So for all the above reasons, regardless of the errors AW may or may not make (and honestly, who are we to judge without possession of the background information, the ‘facts’), I unhesitatingly continue to back the guy and I will continue do so. In challenging times as much as in the good.

    And, to be honest, I do get very angry when I see otherwise decent fans fall by the wayside largely because they simply could not be bothered to see the woods for the trees.

    Dennis Bergkamp isn’t the only one who worries about the club after AW leaves. Because if he leaves before he finishes the job he started – to take us to the highest level – then I find it hard to believe we will be lucky enough to find someone to replace him who will.

    That’s when the spectre of the genuinely empty stadium – like the one up at Sunderland on Saturday – becomes a reality.

    And that’s when the likes of you, Jabba, will have won.

    But won what, exactly?

  331. Bradys right foot

    Jabba’s delights | February 20, 2012 at 5:44 pm

    Bradys

    But what now when we have money. Thank you for what youve done wenger you were wonderful when we had no cash. However arsen youve not been so good when we have money now and I’m afraid it’s starting to get quite bad. You must adapt to being a manager with money as we are still paying you as if your a brilliant manager.

    There is nobody who could have done better before I think a number could put here hands up do have done a better job in recent times

    Jibber the net spend figures are staggering, even the most ardent anti wenger zealot would have difficulty dismissing them except you lol. Your contention that we have money isn’t a very accurate depiction of where we are with respect its a bit simplistic. Hazard will be sold in the summer for somewhere between 30 -45 million and will command a salary depending on his employers of between £100 – £200 a week, lets say conservatively he signs for us for £30million at £100k a week that would represent a total investment of £55 million and make him our highest paid player. Thats only one player, the prediction for this summers window is that its going to smash all records. Players and more accurately there representatives are very keen to move, FFP will begin to bite in 2014 forcing a downward pressure on wages this is the summer to move, the agents know it, the clubs know it, the pklayers know it. If this were 2014 the ironic thing is we could afford Hazard Chelsea couldn’t my gut feeling is they’ll sign him in the summer using Abramovichs money.

  332. oh well its pointess to discuss this until end of season anyway as nothing can change before that…

  333. merlot | February 20, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    very interesting that list.

    it just goes to show the cyclical nature of success and again how you say we have been very lucky to witness the wenger era esp the invincibles

  334. By the way if there is any doubt….I am the best fan.

    And even though my posts are a bit mono thematic at the moment they always address the issues raised in the blog.

  335. arsenalandrew | February 20, 2012 at 7:00 pm

    I am in awe of that post,

  336. Jabba's delights

    Brady

    We need to adapt to the new old e live in.

    If we do the right thing and sell a number of negligible performers and there wages this summer we can easily raise ourselves 40 odd million plus 20 million in wages, add that o what we would have to spend anyway this summer 15-20m then add that to cesc and nasri money 50m.That’s an aggressive attempt at spring cleaning and something we need to do.

    Almunia, squilaci, djourou, rosicky, diaby, denilson, bendtner, vela, arshavin, Walcott, chamck, park. that’s my conservative 40 in fees and 20 in wages.

    That’s a team of negligible performers or players we can cash in on now as we have good cheaper youth in the wings.

    Bartley, Lansbury, myachi, Campbell to come in and fill up positions.

    That’s a conservative 110-120 m on players plus wages plus an extra 20m to just get to last years wages turnover ration.

    You can do allot of damage with that without risking the family silver

  337. I really don’t know why people try to discuss our finances in any detail. I am sure it all is more complex than any of us realise. I really is fruitless bandying figures around.

  338. Alright PG,

    I’ll admit Arsenal Andrew is a slightly better fan than me.

  339. And just to clarify, I think we could probably be a little bolder in the transfer market. But as I have stated above, that is only based on my thoughts on the matter and I could be completely wrong.

  340. Jabba If it was that simple do you think someone at the club might have thought of it?
    Do you think that you have ever thought of a simlge thing that Arsene has not already thought of ,considered and rejected?

  341. A warning to sll those wishing for the resignstion, there is an old saying:

    “You don’t know what you had until it’s gone”

    Many times in my life i have found this to be true, so think people, think about the larger scale of things, think about a future in which you got rid of Wenger but subsequently found out that the grass isn’t always greener.

    Many of you will agree that fabregas’s departure has had a huge impact on the creativity of the team and also the overall style.

    Just think about what kind of impact Arsene Wenger’s departue will have. Many players are loyal to Mr Wenger, they idolise him, the impact his leaving would have on the club would be immense.

  342. Figures are like statistics: they can be used to prove anything.

    ….and then they go bankrupt.

  343. Jabba (at 7.24pm) that may have been the least-worst post you have made in recent times. Bravo!

    Good post, YW. I’m guessing that when you wrote it, you didn’t quite anticipate that today’s many miserable comments would add to the “woes”!

    On the bright side, it has been good to see so many fight the good fight. BRF and Poodle, for example, among many, many others.

    Like it or not, the club lives within its means. That has pros and cons. At the moment, we are going through a tough spell. But is it really so bad? We are in fourth place (“Yes, but for how long?” I hear the doomers say). Over the last twelve months, we have beaten Man United, Barcelona and Chelsea. Over the next fortnight, we have the possibility of adding Sp#rs, Liverpool and Milan to that list. Maybe we will do it, maybe we won’t. Jonny’s terrific post above about Plymouth Argyle should remind people: if you’re only focused on the destination, you’re going to miss a lot of the joy of the journey. There is a lot to be thankful for if only people would look a little (in some cases, a lot) harder.

    To all the doomers: wouldn’t life be better if you supported United, City, Liverpool or Chelsea? Think about it… you would get the spending and trophies you so desperately crave, you would have cheaper seats (except in the case of Liverpool, whose tickets are also more expensive than Arsenal’s), and you would be making many people on this site very happy indeed! (Sorry, arsenalandrew – it might mean giving up your laughter therapy for the greater good! BTW, I salute your fantastic post from a few minutes ago.)

  344. bravo arsenalandrew

  345. Bradys right foot

    Jibber I do think well see a few more outs than usual in the close season, I think seven or eight out of your list could be away, but I believe that the club are thinking the exact same way.

  346. Jabba's delights

    Brady

    The net spend figures are ridiculous as we haven’t spent money in recent years which could have been spent.

    Really good point from someone earlier about djourou extension. How much us that costing us over 4 years.

    We shouldn’t be applauded for not spending our own money when we aren’t doing well we ashamed as it’s a perfect example of not doing all we can in a sustainable way to be as successful on the pitch as possible. This is what many want o see, not trophies as that is futile but the effort to win them

  347. Ask RBS

  348. Bradys right foot

    Dhruv | February 20, 2012 at 5:47 pm
    Bradys one question do you like to see your team mauled?

    Hate it m8, not to proud to admit that I took to my bed after the Mancs carved us up at the Theatre of Illusions missed work the next day. Got up in the afternoon and vowed never to let another result affect me so badly and if it did go straight to the Doctor, cause that aint fucking natural but neither was 8-2.

  349. But Jabba I am on a single issue crusade and am a stated 99.9% happy Arsenal fan. You can’t therefore use my figures generally to prove some point that they probably don’t fit.

    What I have uncovered so far is that Djourou is the illegitimate love child of our manager and AW is being forced to pretend that he is a soccer player and spend a huge amount of money keeping him at the club – some say value for money. Amazingly I have found that some people believe that he actually is a soccer player -maybe because he rarely plays or maybe because they blinked when he did – but his chirpy smile and the infectious way that he gets into photos and on the website mean that he continues to be regarded as main stream Arsenal.

    Give up your useless mission of trying to undermine AW who is frankly a miracle worker and come and join me chipping away at this obvious chink in the Arsenal armour – and defence when they use him.

  350. Bradys right foot

    Jabba’s delights | February 20, 2012 at 7:36 pm

    We shouldn’t be applauded for not spending our own money when we aren’t doing well we ashamed as it’s a perfect example of not doing all we can in a sustainable way to be as successful on the pitch as possible.

    I agree but you blame the manager, the only part of the budget that Wenger has access to is the Transfer proceeds account, which isn’t contrary to widespread belief ringfenced. From that the players wages are also paid so RVPs payrise would come from this . Only talking in terms of the transfer fee doeesn’t reflect the structure of the fund and quickly diminishes the headline figure of a £40-£50 million transfer kitty. If you want to discuss the money availible for transfers then it would be helpful if you took on board how transfer at the club are actually funded, thats a perfectly reasnoble request and its also perfectly reasnoble to insist that Wenger in real terms has had £4million to spend since 1996, but im sure would have wanted an awful lot more support and backing from the board in the transfer market.

    http://swissramble.blogspot.com/2011/05/arsenals-transfer-budget.html

  351. I appreciate reading a rational post that attempts to make sense of the workings of our Great Club in these uncertain economic times where Arab- and Russian- influences have changed the landscape and I do agree that the details behind club expenses (on transfers, wages et al) are complex especially for a team that decided to grow big in a sustainable way by changing stadiums to increase revenue.
    My main issue and the reason why I think Wenger needs to leave as soon as possible is that he’s lost the ability to motivate his team and it’s obvious. Other than our run in late November-December, it’s almost unexplainable how the team seems to have no sense of form or stability, we get a stroke of luck from Henry coming in to work wonders and then lose games immediately after as though there’s no mental aspect to the game. Arsene has also become a manager who fights external influences and chooses his squad based on some percieved slight by either fans or critics- he benches Oxlade who’s added some impetus to our team and who our best player loves on the pitch and leaves Theo for 10+ games when he’s completely off-color and form; he then reacts to fans booing the Oxlade move by either not starting him (Milan) or subbing him for Henry (since he cunningly knows fans will never boo Henry) rather than learning from his mistake and playing a player who energizes the whole team even on his off-day. He shouts at his team after a seemingly-terrible performance (MIlan) and his transition to hard-a** coach does nothing as his team embarrasses him in the space of days with a worse performance against an inferior team that was defeated a week before.
    I haven’t even started talking about his petulant displays (hyperventilating on his seat in a number of games over the past couple of years when he sees himself as too big to tread the touchline to shout instructions at his players and hopefully pass on some sense of inspiration/urgency to them), his deception whenever transfer windows open (misleading fans about obvious player departures or potential activity or signing a legend to ‘help’ for 2 months when it is clear to all that that legend’ presence will only paper over the cracks for tha period and prove to fans how miserable the other ever-present options actually are).
    Wenger is doing the same thing he did at Monaco, he over-manages, under-delegates and takes all his pleasant attributes to the extreme where they become unpleasant and inefficient. He’s molded the club too-much in his image and ignored the fact that we’ve needed other individuals to preserve the history and values of the club (the likes of Keown, Vieira, Pires, Parlour and many more) and not just him the all-knowing professor. And it’s his stubbornness that has done us in in spite of what he could’ve achieved if he’d just made slight additions/adjustments at many opportune times that presented themselves over the last 7yrs (keeping Keown, signing Alonso, extending Flamini early, adding serious defenders, getting Vieira back, dropping Almunia early are just some of the ones that come to mind).
    It’s time he leaves…

  352. YW, I am in despair!!!

    Someone has assumed that Djourou is not being paid for the next 4 years! Djourou, just like Senderos before him, may have reached his level of skills. He was and is a good centre-back, he is not a full-back. Let us assume that Djourou contract had 2 years to run at £50k a week, his increase in salary is say £55k a week. One can only guess, when big-mouths like Joey Barton boast what they earn. This will include bonuses and loyalty add-ons. I would assume the difference is to the salary budget just over £1 million for 2 years and £5,76 millions for the 2 year extension. Employers’ NIC would be additional to that sum.

    It is so obvious that the great majority have no idea how to use the PAYE and NIC tables! The great majority have never had to fill in the monthly and annual returns for the Inland Revenue and of course the monthly and annual Custom’s U.K. and E.U. Value Added Tax returns.

    If you believe the JD transfer budget, then you must believe the moon is made of cheese! He does not have a clue – end of lecture!

  353. Way to go guys, argue all day long. Typical day at ACLF

  354. in despair?

    why?

  355. BRF

    I emailed Kieron O’Connor that his transfer budget is composed of miscalculations, misunderstandings and he does not have a clue about running a company!

  356. so anyone know what happend to Ramsey on Saturday?

  357. Jabba's delights

    Notoverhil

    Most are pretty sure we have at least 50m to spend from last summer, would you disagree?

    If we sell 40-50m worth of our own players this summer and here departure leaves 20 mill in wage room I fail to see how that doesn’t leave us with roughly 110-20 mill to spend on new players and wages?

    Rather than saying the calculations are wrong why don’t you explain to non accountants what that means. If you can do so in a way that’s better than the Swiss ramble but highlighting how little money we have your very impressive. It was he who said we hd between 45-50m at the beginning of last year

  358. Any one read that post by James?

  359. Was hoping Hunter was going to be let out, Dups.

  360. YW is probably busy at the moment AA.

  361. jabba,

    don’t forget to add the money stuffed under Wengers mattress to that £120million.

  362. Yogi ,open Hunters cage door ,he has a customer.

  363. Dont tell me Yogi is at that f’kin AST meeting?

  364. Jabba

    At the AST meeting tonight it was stated that there was 50 mil in funds BUT we will lose 45 mil if we fail to get a CL place. That seems to be the reason that the kitty was kept.

    Can’t buy much with 5 mil

  365. And the £60 million we will get for RVP Song and Theo.Dont forget that.
    Thats £180 million.
    Going once.going twice………………………Gone .Jabba has the kitty at 180

  366. When you have sold all those squad players, to buy one or 2 so called top players, how are you going to fill up the rest of the squad? With junior players, who have little or no EPL experience? Or more cheap squad players, who are likely to to be as or less good as the ones you have sold.

    So what you gain by having a star play for you, you lose by having no-one decent to play with him.

    Good try, but I suspect that the professionals, ie AW and his staff, who have years of experience in running a successful football club, might know best and may be able to guage as to what they have and what they can get, better. Perhaps?

    Djourou played well last season until he was injured in the CC final. He was then brought back when he was not fit and ready, and made mistake after mistake.

    He was then used this season as a full back, a position for which he is not fit. It is not surprising he has had a torrid timne of it, even when he gets the occasion chance to be a centre back.

    Look at vermalen. A fantastic centre back 2 seasons ago and then, after a season out with injuries, this season, he is asked to play full back, when that is not his position. Not surprising, when he gets to be centre back again, albeit for just over a game, he seems out of it.

    Whether one likes it or not the injuries that have afflicted us and continue to afflict us is having a major effect on the confidence and ability of our players.

    We really simply have to grin and bare it, laugh when we win and cry when we lose, but enjoy being Gunners.

  367. That would be it, PG …

  368. merlot and andrew

    respect

    “If we sell 40-50m worth of our own players this summer and here departure leaves 20 mill in wage room I fail to see how that doesn’t leave us with roughly 110-20 mill to spend on new players and wages?”……LOL…… REALITY IS A BIT DIFFERENT THAN FIFA12 …. just saying….

  369. Jabba's delights

    Dups

    Sad reflection on how the club is run if that is the case. Kiss goodbye to us getting back in if any time soon if that is the case.

  370. I’ve been laughing at many funny comments, most of them intentional, as I scanned past the usual ‘occasional poster(s?)’ in the comments section today.

    Until I got to the part about Mike Dean.

  371. Jabba's delights

    Jigsol

    How many of those squad players contribute anything?

    Djouou and squilaci compensated by song and Bartley playing there games
    Diaby,rosicky, denilson compensated by Lansbury, wilshere taking errr rosicky games this year added to a new quality signing
    Arshavin Walcott games compensated by myachi, Campbell and a newqualitysigning
    Park and chamackh compensated by Campbell and a new quality signing

    Look at those players we are losing, what if any type of consistent good form have we seen.

  372. For those who don’t follow twitter, like me, here’s the full transcript of Frimpong’s thought upon that devoted Arsenal fan, Piers Morgan:

    http://blog.emiratesstadium.info/archives/18884

    I liked this part:

    “Stop chatting soo much rubbish you. You know nothing about football. You sit behind your laptop and just talk utter rubbish.”

    &:

    “Just don’t bring your ugly face to the emirates because we at Arsenal are sick and tired of your abuse towards players and coach.”

    Frimpong is only a footballer and an Arsenal fan that plays football for Arsenal. What does he know?

  373. jabba, honestly , dont you feel ashamed for being a traitor and abandoning your faith? …and ok fuck your faith..not much you can do when youre weak….but what about respect for what this frenchman has done for arsenal? no? not even that? …..

    from the 200 messages youve made today and the replies you got….lol did anything sink in ?

    nothing? not even one tiny little bit?

    🙂

  374. I think I’d better repeat, y’know, just in case soething was lost in translation:

    “Stop chatting soo much rubbish you. You know nothing about football. You sit behind your laptop and just talk utter rubbish.”

  375. “Just don’t bring your ugly face to the emirates because we at Arsenal are sick and tired of your abuse towards players and coach.”

  376. For sure, those black snoods were out in force during the reat BBB protest.

  377. My advice would be to minus the ‘reat’ from that last comment.

  378. I love Manu Frimpong. What a legend.

  379. Jabba's delights

    Finsbury

    Piers Morgan had nothing to do with the insipid performances in the last 2 weeks when the manager had issued a rallying cry to the team

  380. frimpong …….respect

    piers morgan….lol……owned by a kid !!! hahaaaaaaaaaaa!

    bravo emmanuel …proud and loud !

  381. So, now you are talking about 3 “new quality signings”. How much each, including wages? Even if it is £30m, that is £90m.

    You are replacing 2 centrebacks, with one, who has not played in the EPL and a midfielder who can, if pushed play centreback.

    Denilson has gone anyway and Rosicky will need replacing soon as well, so you can’t count them. How much do you think you would get for them?

    You would like to replace Arshavin and Walcott, who between them have how many goals and how many assist this season, with Myachi, an 18 year old and Campbell, not much older who has not played in the EPL yet.

    Also how much do you think the players that you would like to dispose of will bring in, to be used towards your £90m.

    Sorry, it simply does not work.

    Please face it, we are simply not in the £30m plus bracket, who can only be afforded by clubs with wealthy sugar daddies. (Liverpool could only afford the money to buy Carroll because Chel£ki gave them £50m for Torres)

  382. Piers Morgan is a c**t. That’s all

  383. Finsbury

    Dean is ref – Dowd 4th official. How lovely that sounds.

  384. dupsffokcuf (x2)

    Did enyone ever tell you, you’ve got a great name.

  385. Sure he did, Jabbas Delights. Him and his cohorts are swine. They’ve done nothing but question, critique, and insult. Simple fact is, he’s a petty ignoramus who creates people like Hunter13 and makes the fine people of Great Britain look bad.

  386. Bloody Opera messing about again

  387. Frimpong is such a great guy. I really hope he can come back from the injury stronger and feature for us next season. He is the kind of player we want the Academy to churm out, someone who’s not willing to take sh*t from anyone when it comes to the club. Legend in the making.

  388. Jabba's delights

    Jigsol

    I’m replacing 1 average cb with another average at worst one in song

    I’m replacing one awful on with Bartley who is at least aggressive and powerful do not forget that Miquelon will need more game time. We already have 3 starting quality players.

    Denilson and rosicky maybe 6-7m in total. There combined production this year is 2-3 good games. It’s not like the guys coming have to world beaters.

    You talk of Walcott and arshavin as if they have been really good. I saw enough in myachi this weekend and the week before to think that there isn’t a huge amount of drop of than Walcott. AOC to replace arshavin production this year and then some.

    Campbell to add in flashes of class from the bench which Andre has done what two to three times this year. If played as a striker look at chamck and park this year is Campbell a world beater if we ask our wonder class young striker to score 2 goals by feb as a twenty year old

    That added to 3 quality additions. Reus just went for 16 euro he looks like he will develop into a magnificent player. That is your winger if we had acted

    Pudolski has is desperate to leave and his contract is running out. Nasri younger and at a bigger club with significantly richer suitor went ffor 24 so let’s be aggressive and say lukas 20m

    So now for an attacking midfielder with decent cash to spend why don’t we say Erikson for 25m. The big Market will be hazard and gotze in that position so that leaves us with an opportunity. Now take that squad and have a big hard look at our chances next year

  389. Bradys right foot

    dupsffokcufdupsffokcuf | February 20, 2012 at 9:23 pm

    Jabba

    At the AST meeting tonight it was stated that there was 50 mil in funds BUT we will lose 45 mil if we fail to get a CL place. That seems to be the reason that the kitty was kept.

    Can’t buy much with 5 mil

    Jabba’s delights | February 20, 2012 at 9:51 pm

    Dups

    Sad reflection on how the club is run if that is the case. Kiss goodbye to us getting back in if any time soon if that is the case.

    We are unfortunately a proper business Jibber, we can only spend and plan with what we have, we have reserves and contingengies things that are almost unheard of in footballing boardrooms. Our competitors for the most part are not, Chelsea, Man City are certainly not businesses they’ve simply won the lottery. We have no one willing to finance us off their own personal wealth. Roman Abramovich personal investment of £1000,000,000 in Chelsea is frankly perverse. Man Utds and Liverpools financial deals dwarf our ancient ones but you’ll have to wait two years that to change. That is where we are and the fact that we are run for the most part responsibly and conservatively should fill you with sadness says alot about modern football.

    HMRC have issued 25 winding up orders against football clubs in the last two years. They are currently pursuing 6 former and or current premier league clubs regarding offshore employee benefit trusts, Rangers are in hoc to the taxman for a reported £76 million over these. The reprecussion given the sums floating around the premier league could be even greater. HMRC gave the clubs an opportunity to disclose EBTs until December and are looking to be reinstated as a prteferred creditor. I’m hoping we don’t have any EBTs as the settlements could be huge im hoping the Chavs, Mancs & Spuds do. One things for sure alot of clubs will be wishing they were better run in the near future.

  390. Jabba ,Will you fuck off playing Championship Manager.
    In fact just fuck off

    jjgsol ,why are you feeding him?

  391. Jabba's delights

    Brady

    Our CEO stated 1-2 years go that we could cope without being in the cl for a short period and that we had plans for such eventualities in fact we not even budget to be in the cl. If in reality what he actually meant was we must sell our 3 most expensive assets nasri,cesc and rvp to survive then it doesn’t look so fricking smart then does it.

    Being able o cope without l is one thing but the Idea is to get back in and planning for that eventuality means cash

  392. some tunes for the chill out

    george …lol there is new game out for jabba…this time instead of football manager you become chairman/president and decide for e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g……. 🙂

    i give him half a season before going bust….and im generous…

  393. jabba you shoudl write all these pearls your giving us here down in a book… 🙂

    i will be the first to buy it…..

    of course a toilet roll is far more cheaper than a whole book but ill treat myself….. 🙂

  394. Bradys right foot

    Jibber

    Arsenes spent 4 milion net in 15 years putting that with your doomsday scenario means he is an absolute effing genius, and the only manager who could have kept us competitive I already know this you seem to be experiencing some sort of doomere logic funk.

    Sit down take a breath and repeat after me, Its all Arsenes fault the trophies, the emirates the 15 years of champions league football, “spend some fawking moneyyyyyyyyyyy you french cnut”. All better now Jibber lol.

  395. Jabba's delights

    George

    Identify a weakness in your team or squad from a personnel perspective and try to sort it out. This is exactly how it works don’t try and overcomplicate it.

    No it’s not as easy to just get the player but we pay people millions to do this.

    Pudolski is out of contract, go read his quotes. This player Is available to us.

    Reus just went o Dortmund a club with considerably less finncil clout than us.

    The most expensive attacking midfiel Market this summer will be for goetze and hazard there are a finite number of clubs in the world who are in the running for these type of players due to cost and need. Any body who has ever worked in any type of Market Evaluation for goods understands this. Stop making out football is so different to anything anyone does.

    Why is it completely un plausible looking at those developments. This is make or break we must be completely different and daring this summer. We need to keep rvp

  396. Why can’t everybody be friends ?

  397. I really hope that Rosicky will take the one-year-deal that, if rumours are to be believed, is being offered him. He is obviously the wrong side of 30 but his form this season has been excellent and if he can keep it up, he will be a very useful squad member.

  398. Jabba's delights

    Brady

    You must separate past from future. Working on a shoestring he was brilliant since he has had disposable income he has been less so. He shouldnt be given credit for not spending money that’s available to him when we flatter to deceive.

  399. Oh right Jabba
    I get it now.
    All we need is a manager who understand as much as you.
    I don’t know how I missed it.It is so simple when you put it like that.
    I’m in
    WENGER OUT

    JABBA IN

    Simples

  400. Jabba's delights

    Evil

    But has it been excellent or has he just played 3-4 good games. How many games has he won for us how many has he made the rest of a midfield function better. This is precisely our problem why are we impressed with that. Good servant but he is exactly the type of squad player we need to jetison

  401. Jabba's delights

    George

    It’s a debate and where in what I said am I speaking tosh. It’s a decent argument mate. Do you have any thoughts on how we might create cash and wages for better players, or should keep the same squad

  402. Jabba

    You can forget all about your plans until we qualify for the CL. If we don’t your plan will be no good anyway (even if it had any legs to start with).

  403. Bradys right foot

    Jabba’s delights | February 20, 2012 at 10:47 pm

    Brady

    Our CEO stated 1-2 years go that we could cope without being in the cl for a short period and that we had plans for such eventualities in fact we not even budget to be in the cl. If in reality what he actually meant was we must sell our 3 most expensive assets nasri,cesc and rvp to survive then it doesn’t look so fricking smart then does it.

    Being able o cope without l is one thing but the Idea is to get back in and planning for that eventuality means cash

    [b]Ok weve got no money? Someone at the club fucked up some French twat no doubt[/b]

    Jabba’s delights | February 20, 2012 at 11:01 pm

    Brady

    You must separate past from future. Working on a shoestring he was brilliant since he has had disposable income he has been less so. He shouldnt be given credit for not spending money that’s available to him when we flatter to deceive.

    [b]OK we do have money now then, is that right? Someone at the club fucked up some French twat no doubt.[/b]

    Doomers keep on dooming on.

  404. can anyone tell me please what the ast do?? is it like a mothers meeting just trying to keep up with the gossip?? do they actually represent anything?

  405. Duke

    They represent themselves, nothing else.

  406. Jabba's delights

    Who called the manager a twat and I’ve always showed my displeasure with the board in recent times

    The fact doesn’t change that they are valid questions to ask.

  407. Jabba ,It is not my job or my concern .But get this.IT IS NOT YOURS EITHER
    I have never read as much shit in all my pip

  408. Duke,they speak for us fans.Or at least their head honcho says he does.

  409. Jabba Do you think the board gives a fuck what you think?
    If you and you ilk fucked off the club would be in a better position.
    Far to many Londoners at the stadium on match day, if you ask me.

  410. @Jabba
    He was instrumental during the CL group stages and when he plays we just get the ball quicker to our wingers. You can argue all you want, but in recent times he has shown a certain quality that we have been missing in the advanced midfield position. He has shown that he can play aspects of that position better than Ramsey. You should understand that football is a team game. Not every player has to be a match winner, players have to do their job so that the team functions better. Rosicky’s job — when we are attacking — is to initiate attacks and distribute the ball to the wide men, which is a job he has been doing very well when he was given the chance over the past several weeks. He himself has some things he could work on … especially his ability to turn goal scoring opportunities into throw-ins, but that shouldn’t take away from the obvious quality he brings to the side. If we had Wilshere back, things might be different, but at present, between him and Ramsey, I think that Rosicky is offering us more from a play making perspective though Ramsey is infinitely more likely to find the goal.

  411. There are more Arsenal fans in Nigeria than in the UK.

  412. Bradys right foot

    Jibber Im glad i’ve seen someone try to argue two conflicting points and arrive ultimately at the same conclusion, its been illuminating. I don’t however agree I think that even the Arsenal would have difficulty in mismanaging the club to the extent being potless while at the same time giving tthe manager a huge transfer fund he’s too miserable to spend. Maybe this is a doomer wet dream where two different realities have merged and in each Arsenal are fucked. Someone at the fucked up, some French twat no doubt lmao.

  413. PG / Dups,

    Hunter is being let out on remand. TBH this is his last chance. I don’t have the time or the will to continue moderating him.

  414. So what was the lowdown on this ast mothers meeting tonight then….did they ask for the board to go into the red for some silverware?? as thats what most of us fans wan’t isnt it!!

  415. Jabba's delights

    Dups

    They represent The gateway and voice to us fans actually trying to become shareholders in the club. Barca bayern Dortmund supporters groups have genuine representation in the running of THEIR club because that is what arsenal is our club. It’s a great idea with lots of improvemnts to be made but learning. We shouldn’t scoff at people who actively try and get us fans no matter where we are on the spectrum to have a voice in our club. There is no criteria of fan they do not all want wenger or kroenke gone. They want to see improvement across the board in the club and so most people

  416. Dups ,but they are not proper fans like our Jibber.They cant be.

  417. Sure he did, Jabbas Delights. Him and his cohorts are swine. They’ve done nothing but question, critique, and insult. Simple fact is, he’s a petty ignoramus who creates people like Hunter13 and makes the fine people of Great Britain look bad.

    i congratulate your honesty and openmindness.Bravo! Rise good people of England and proper Arsenal fans. Dont let the stupidity, jealousy and bigotry of Morgans, Hansens, Savages, Allerdyces, Pardews and the rest sack our manager ….Do the right thing…Where words dont apply the stick does…Do it like FRIMPONG! Civilisation ..i.e wenger…must prevail over the doom merchants.

  418. Yogi ,I have a vision of a little Jack Russell being slipped of his lead.

    Go on son ,get them heels

  419. Jabba's delights

    Evil

    No it’s not the Ramsey role in our midfield is to be the chief creator. Arteta is the position who keeps things ticking over and wilshere played there last year. The advanced midfielder of the 3 is the 4th attacker he must create and score. Neither rosicky or Ramsey have been adept at this this season

  420. Bradys right foot

    dukegoonem | February 20, 2012 at 11:12 pm

    The AST have played a very positive role in the club imo until recently, the fanshare scheme, the debate surrounding a rights issues and concerns over ticketing etc. Tim Payton however has politicised it imo and weakened it considerably. Payton is a self publicist with a clear anti wenger agenda, infact he is ruining much of the work that AST was and could be doing. Ultimately I thought the AST could’ve been a way to get a fan representative on the board but that is never going to happen with Payton in charge.

  421. Jabba

    That’s all fine and dandy as long as they speak only for themselves and not believe they are the spokesmen for all fans.

  422. Hunter,
    Will you consider what you are posting before you post it.
    I struggle to keep myself out of moderation without having to shepherd you.
    Now don’t let me down

  423. Bradys right foot

    I know lets all laugh at fat Sam, he said this today about Twitter and I quote,

    “people can say what they want, when they want, and I think that is a very dangerous tool to be bandied around the world”.

    lmao

  424. Not the sharpest tool in the box, this Allardyce fella, huh?

  425. He wont see the humour in that though BRF.
    It is an example of the intelligence of some people in football.

  426. Jabba's delights

    Dups

    No your right and they shouldn’t. But you must remember that on some very high profile blogs where the blogger in General is highly respected by many of his visitors are AST members. This where there is a huge distinction between different types of fan. A season ticket holder who nearly all without exception ast are represent allot of the people who put 95 million in the clubs coffers a year. They can’t cater for every fan but they cater for allot of disgruntled people who spend a huge amountbof there disposable income on the club during tough times. You may say fuck them but they are important to this club and many aren’t happy

  427. Unless he was being funny on purpose.In which case I have hugely underestimated him. And I owe him an apology.

  428. Jabba what very high profile blogs where the blogger in General is highly respected by many of his visitors are you talking about.?

  429. Jabba

    Like the 400 ST owners who have attended 1 or less games all season. Fuck em I say.

  430. Yes Dups .fuck them indeed

  431. Anyway I have an early start so will say bonne nuit

  432. Telegraph saying RVP ready to listen to Arsenal;s offer.
    Most likely a load of bollocks but still it is not John Cross so it has a chance.

  433. Bradys right foot

    Jibber the purpose of the AST is not to represent “disgruntled” fans it was set up to:

    Promote the interests of supporters who own shares in Arsenal Football Club
    Facilitate wider supporter involvement in the club
    Facilitate and promote mutual supporter ownership of Arsenal.

    It was an avenue in theory for fan representation at board room level that was the eventual aim. Im no longer a member and it has become increasingly political and has a clear anti wenger agenda. Its raised Tim Paytons profile as a voice for the fans, but he will never represent me and the board simply pay lip service to it now far from engaging in any meaningful relationship, its beinfg fundamentally weakened and although louder in its criticism of the club its influence has been greatly reduced. Two uncomfortable nights a year for Gazidis apart.

  434. Lol yogi seriously you dont have to moderate me..

    i say specific things targeting specific mentalities ..i dont boil it all in one pot..

    plus i do it with humour, i do realise the sensitive nature of calling the majority of them english journalists and exmanagers and pundits ( in the sun, the mail, the mirror) useless in football to think they can exercise critique on a manager like wenger..its too bitter a pill to swallow i know…but you have to come down hard on those who insist on disrespecting the manager and painting a picture of disaster and crisis. If they think they can doubt wenger then i can doubt them …and if i start counting the trophies… wenger holds more than all these mugs who castigate him. How much bs can we tolerate from all these morgans and jabbas out there ? How many clueless experts will come out telling the manager who developed weah vieira henry fabregas that he got it wrong with the players he got? for gods sake dont make me apolgise for mocking the stupid. How many more will come out saying that the man responsible for 26-12-00 in the year 2004 is tactically naive without receiving a slap in his face ?

    its so silly its unbelievable and im surprised..after all football was born in england and here is a manager combining flair football with financial sense and unparallel sporting ethos and he gets treated as if he has committed serious crimes …lol fuck them all!!! ..i dont know maybe its the political correctness of the internet…i dotn care about such things you see..i will type it like i would say it in face to face convo…perhaps this can be seen as rude..sorry again..but only as regards to your sites rules..not about anything ive said..ill concentrate on music now … 🙂

  435. Jabba's delights

    Dups

    But if peopledont renew red members must pick up the slack or it straths of accycle which could be very bad. Are red members going to jump at he chance to spend a ton of cash on a team that’s getting worse…..I’m not so sure.

    Pedro and gunnerblog I believe. Arseblog has spoken highly as well. Witchier also. George go read most arsenal blogs comments sections and see if hemajority of fans share your views.

  436. Jabba's delights

    Brady

    They represent their own views. Many season ticket holders share them. Many season ticket holders are them

  437. In principle the AST was a great thing, but in the past few years they’ve aborted their original purpose and turned into something else. Especially Tim Payton is a massive problem in my eyes, as he seems to think the AST is more or less a plattform so he can raise his own profile.

  438. They represent their own views. Many season ticket holders share them. Many season ticket holders are them

    very sad indeed…i am trully embarassed to be represented by such ignorant people….

  439. Evil | February 21, 2012 at 12:07 am

    well … maybe dein has promised him a position under new regime…. 😉

  440. jabba your right most fans are pissed,thats because all fans want is to win. but we do have to look at the long term future of our club, i mean rangers going into administration is a shock, chasing the winning dream.. i bet pompey fans would give up that fa cup to still be floating about in the prem.

  441. Jabba the very anti Arsenal Polls did a poll and even they could only get 16% of fans to say they wanted Arsene out.And the questions were loaded against Arsene
    So it seems I am in the majority.
    Fuck Pedro the mindless twat.

  442. Jabba's delights

    Hunter

    What about managers and players who have won more than him, what of here views? If you asked the managers of the top 10 clubs in football what they thought was wrong with the make up of arsenals squad over the last 3 years and why we struggled against better and stronger teams, how similar would most of there answers be?

    What happened to Brian clough, fabio capello, rikaard, Benitez, vogts, Graham etc why did there ability to win deminish. I thought brilliance lasted forever. Who would have thought that stying ahead of hevcompetition would be harder than first getting to the summit………errrrrrrrrr

  443. Bradys right foot

    Many season ticket holders don’t, indeed wider than that they don’t represent the wider support base. It is my sincere hope that alot of members and fans fuck off next year as they will be replaced by people who love the club, not those with an incredible sense of entitlement reflected by Tim Payton. The best games to go to the emirates are actually carling cup matches, ordinary real fans.

  444. Jabba's delights

    George

    Be interesting to see that poll if done at the ground after a defeat on Sunday.

  445. Jabba's delights

    We don’t fill up at carling cup. Therevis also one thing a kid spending 25 on a carling cup game it’s a completely different when asked to hand over 1200

  446. Bradys right foot

    lmao Pedro only just noticed that thanks PG. Pete wood wil never represent me, never.

    Jibber listen to yourself m8 you’ve spend the whole night getting the answers to the questions your still asking lol. You ignored them granted but read them might help you step off the wheel.

  447. hey jabba, hows it going mate ?

    i got my old subbuteo out (im a bit old school not much of the fm generation you see) and i need some help with tactics and how to motivate my players

    can you send me a pdf with your analysis?

    i can fax you the ergometric tests and fitness results of players so that you throw the data in the CYBEX you got home and brings out the recommended strategy for the season like the machine batman had in his batcave in the old series…cool isnt it?….

    du ru rut du ru rud *flashred* ……ding!…and out comes the bit of paper with the 442s or 443s depending on what parameters we want to set.

    pep is amateur in front of us. 😉

  448. Jabba
    I honestly believe you want Arsenal to fail.
    You can deny it all you want,But I think it is in your miserable nature.
    You will cream yourself if we lose on Sunday.

  449. Bradys right foot

    Jabba’s delights | February 21, 2012 at 12:19 am

    We don’t fill up at carling cup. Therevis also one thing a kid spending 25 on a carling cup game it’s a completely different when asked to hand over 1200

    We have the highest recorded attendance ever at at CC game, but i digress. Some of those kids will get a chance to get a season ticket this year if some of the disgruntled fans fucked off. It would make for a better atmosphere a better stadium experience and better performances from the players imo. Oh I don’t do a hierarchy of fans Jibber as it would put me at the top lol.

  450. Arsene has done some remarkable things in the past, but the last 4 years have been a slowly escalating disaster with the club lurching from one crisis to another. The strangeness that is our team defense has been ongoing for 5 years. The culture surrounding the club for both the players and the fans has been slowly deteriorating. The last 2 years have seen a rapid decline. Last season we turned a team with the best on paper squad in the league into a fading 4th place team. This summer was remarkably mismanaged, and this season has the potential to be the worst in 16 years. The end of the season collapses almost seem to be an inevitability. Arsene has been a great manager for the club, but history shows that even for the best managers when things start to go downhill they usually don’t turn around. Arsene is a brilliant man but history also shows how difficult it is for anyone to micromanage an organization like Arsenal over a long term. Hopefully he will have learned a lesson from last summer. I think we need to diversify our coaching staff and delegate some of the control and bring some new ideas into the organization because things are currently going the wrong way. Reversing that without some significant change in the status quo is unlikely IMO.

  451. Jabba's delights

    No George i won’t, I’ve been to the last 22 top division home london derbies, where I’m from losing to the yids probably isnt quite as galling for you as it is me. I hope we destroy them and go on and secure 4th. It will be very interesting what the reaction is if we don’t turn up though

  452. Bill,Steady.
    You and I should remain friends.

  453. What happened to Brian clough, fabio capello, rikaard, Benitez, vogts, Graham etc why did there ability to win deminish. I thought brilliance lasted forever. Who would have thought that stying ahead of hevcompetition would be harder than first getting to the summit………errrrrrrrrr

    clough …you dare put that name in your mouth ? anyway fabio is fine..sending his regards from silvios villa parties while he is preparing to laugh his arse off this summer when the euros start….raijkard? i dont know why you mentioned him, its probably because youve never heard of henk ten kate, benitez found ruins in inter milan and faced war from moratti and wasnt allowed to bring in his own people, vogts is a national manager…lol…and wenger has won more than graham and i dont see his players collapsing on the pitch from previous night partying.

    “i thought brilliance lasted forever”

    come on, tell us ..honeslty now…arent you embarassed to use such cheeky corny lines? not even a little bit ? ….. 🙂

  454. ” i thought fairytales of ending seasons unbeaten and having 4 -5 players who are the best in their positions possibly in the world with doubles and cups and european finals and shit lasted forever! you lied to us lord vengah!!! die!” …said harry potter….. pothead morelike

  455. Jabba's delights

    Hunter

    Benitez……Liverpool, he was loved but what happened. You do realise that many opposition fans see our manager in terms of slipping in the same light as bentiz when he was losing the plot.

    Rikaard won barca first cl since 1994 he broke six years real, Valencia or deportivo dominance. What happened, he lost his ability to get the bestout of his players.

    It’s about getting a group of players together and getting the best out of them and it’s hard to keep doing it mate. There is nothing to show our manager is good at that with this team anymore. THIS TEAM

  456. Jabba's delights

    Hunter

    That old trophy chestnut again yup ya got me pirate!

  457. So basically managers lose the ability to get the best out of players?
    Have they all looked down the back of their settees.That is where I find stuff.

  458. George:

    I am still your friend. We just happen to disagree about a few things.

    Do you really disagree that things are going the wrong way for the club? The culture around the club has gone downwards for both the players and the fan base. My experience is mainly with American sports but even for great managers once the team begins to underperform its very hard to reverse the trend without a change in the system. Just like winning begets winning, struggling especially in the high pressure is also habit forming. The players need something to change to make them believe that things will be different next time. Hopefully I am wrong and Arsene can get things back on track because I think he will be our manager for as long as he wants. Hopefully your faith will be justified but even for someone as talented as Arsene it will be very difficult to reverse things at this point

  459. @JD
    I find it very good that you brought up the example of Benitez. People got the change they craved for, the fans even got the manager they so desperately wanted. But now, after a year of King Kenny and close to two years without Rafa, would you say that the change was a good one for Liverpool? Going from a team on the brink of winning the league (second to last season under Benitez) to a side not even playing in Europe anymore. Even if everything goes according to plan for them, the best case scenario is probably finishing 5th, with a finish outside the European places just as likely.

  460. Well Hunter, you need to understand one thing. Humour doesn’t always travel well. You’ve been told how to behave; I’ve got an IT problem which means that anyone who goes into moderation – outside of the usual first post rule – is going to stay there for at least a week until it is sorted. When frankly comments will be deleted as they will be irrelevant.

  461. Dups

    That 400 was at club level.

  462. didnt have the time to really comment last night..

    at least we know that the 50mil for reinvestment is not a myth or a figure plucked from thin air..

    as for the 4th place being a trophy then for financial reasons the manager is correct in a way..

    but what he needs to understand is 4th place is not a trophy..its a minimum requirement..constantly bleating on about it as some sort of massive achievement is starting to grate and is typical of the culture that has been created at this club..

    4th place is not silverware and is not a massive success in football terms..whenever you finish 4th there is room for improvement..rejecting those improvements because the minimum requirement has been achieved previously is lack of ambition..

  463. it will also be interesting to hear ppls veiws on whether they still think the club has been run fantastically and everything is done in the best interests of the football club..

    the thread today will be an interesting read…

  464. Alzation | February 20, 2012 at 11:07 am

    Nice post and I agree.

    I disagree with your last paragraph though, slightly. As most of the fans that call for wenger’s head are reactionaries venting their spleens after every loss.

    A few wins in a row and they shut up for a while. So, whilst changing the manager in a crises would have the perception of change, winning keeps them docile.

  465. JD’s stats for the season.

    Played 23 out of 39 matches.

    He has played or partially played in only 58% of matches.

    We have drawn 3 matches that he has played in, and AFC has drawn 4 in total

    He plays 75% of the times we draw.

    He has played 10 matches out of the 11 matches we have lost this season.

    He plays 91% of the times we lose.

    Whatever the reason for it might be we need to look at a way of playing him less. Much less.

    Fabregas is missed because his figures were the opposite. ie we won more when he played and less when he didn’t. When big clubs play us they target Djourou as he is seen to be weak. He does not clear well, pass well, head well, shys from tackles, is slow to read the game, he gives away penalties and free kicks like candy and gets sent off. His presence on the pitch is worth (at least) a goal in the opposite direction in many matches.

    I know statistics goes against the grain of guys who think that one should use intuition to judge a player, but look where that has got Chelsea vis a vis Torres.

    It is true for the earlier poster that if he had 2 years left on his contract then the addition to the kitty would be only 5.75m, but I would rather strengthen our strike force with that and play with 10 men than have walking liabilities that cost us matches trawling the fields.

    AFC is a lot of things, but it is not a charity. We can’t have random’s coming on to get match fitness and costing us matches. However cheeky their smiles or whether they came through the youth system.

  466. Oh my life, is this still going on.

    Can anybody sumerise Hunter’s posts for me please? I don’t mean to be rude, but I seriously can’t read his posts. He just seems to speak a lot without really saying anything. He might be making some good points, however I must be missing them.
    Hopefully we will have less 13 years on the site today.

  467. Bob – Ah, sorry mate. I really could not be bothered posting yesterday. The same inane argument involving the same posters seems to have been going on for days now. Its draining.

  468. hey andy i can summarise for you .

    I dont consider the english journalists , pundits ex managers and arsenal haters knowledegable enough or credible enough or experienced enough to be critisising the work of wenger or the financial method(s) that club arsenal has chosen to solidify itself among the best.

    I just come down hard on all them ignorants and narrowminded doomers and of course yogi didnt like it , and he is right.

  469. Benitez……Liverpool, he was loved but what happened. You do realise that many opposition fans see our manager in terms of slipping in the same light as bentiz when he was losing the plot.

    lol..but liverpool are idiots…they had a fine manager , a manager who was there for 4 or 5 years ..knew the players, knew the club, knew what he had to do and had understadnign of the european markets and competitions and the owners screwed him over ..(keanne). Benitez is a fine manager…technocrat like wenger… and rafa knows too mate…not my fault liverpool are idiots and sacked one of europe;s finest to get kenny and then spend 30m on carrol..pmsl… stupid things…keep them far away from arsenal thank you

    hows your pdf on subbuteo going ?

    Rikaard won barca first cl since 1994 he broke six years real, Valencia or deportivo dominance. What happened, he lost his ability to get the bestout of his players.

    Lol you clueless child …it took a massive investment from laporta to achieve what raijard did and i aint surprised you havent heard of henk ten kate…go ask the barca and chelsea fans about him if youre that clueless. Deco, Ronaldinho Marquez, Etoo….lol…… did raijkard purchase those guys or laporta ? 😉

    It’s about getting a group of players together and getting the best out of them and it’s hard to keep doing it mate. There is nothing to show our manager is good at that with this team anymore. THIS TEAM

    Lol again,. but this team aint a team to go and win titles , we all know that, this and the team of tha past 6 – 7 years is a work in progress with view to future, i.e after they reach their peak years. sadly our cretin fans and general anti-arsenal sentiment in england didnt allow the first crop to grow and now we are paying for it. i thank you all for your great support to our club……lol..

    again point for point i destroy you yet youre allowed to come back and talk sh*t non stop ….whats the point ?……lol……and then yogi tells me off….lol….

  470. Arsenal are a very rich club . The revenue from the Emirates £93, is over double the revenue from Highbury ie £46 million plus.(see chairmans report 2006/07accounts) how did we buy world class players back then. The latest accounts show cash in bank £160 million, debts £256mllion, net debt £96 million. The half yearly accounts are said to show a profit of at least £50 million, net debt £46 million, which does not have to be paid back for at least 18 years. When you buy players, they still have a value, if we had paid the extra million to buy Cayhill, he value would have increased . We have brought to many poor players , who we cannot sell and have paid them high wages.
    If we continue down this path we will lose champions and premier league, gate and sponship money,

  471. Hunter, banitez is not a fine manager at all.

    He took a 5 time in a row serie A champion,, defending champions league, treble winning team and dismantled it in a record 6 months.

  472. hunter,
    You’re saying we haven’t had a team that is able to win the titles in the last 6-7 years?.
    I beg to differ. The team last season and the season before, as well as that of 07/08 was of title winning quality, imo.

    In some weird way, you do sometimes sound like a doomer. An AKB doomer, har har.

  473. but what he needs to understand is 4th place is not a trophy..its a minimum requirement..constantly bleating on about it as some sort of massive achievement is starting to grate and is typical of the culture that has been created at this club..

    4th place is not silverware and is not a massive success in football terms..whenever you finish 4th there is room for improvement..rejecting those improvements because the minimum requirement has been achieved previously is lack of ambition..

    lol patience….if the club had no ambition it would still be at highbury…they have a programm..they will stick to it…in the meantime the fan has to get a perspective or else he will suffer. Merlot hit the nail on the coffin yesterday!.

    these things were obvious when we moved stadium and im surprised they didnt start sooner. when the opposition plays a ready and established 27-28 year old drogba and youre fielding a 18 yearold who is learnign the game and how to be a professional…what titles are we talking about? lol …cant people see that the last 5,6,7 years have been for education purposes for our youngsters? it was/is necessary. yet we exercise critique on them as if they are the ready and finished article. they are not.

  474. Hunter – Fair enough. A very sweeping statement, but that is your call. I would agree with yuo on the “Arsenal Haters” comment mind as they have an agenda. But plenty of people who have good standing in the game have also raised concerns who are most definatly not Arsenal haters.

    You can’t simply cast any commets and thoughts aside which don’t tally with your own. Especially when some of the thoughts are coming from people with a better understanding than yourself.

    It is difficult for anybody (whichever side of the fence they sit) to really offer any insight or relevant thought to Arsenal’s financial goings on, as very few (and probably none on internet forums) actually know the full picture.

  475. hunter,
    You’re saying we haven’t had a team that is able to win the titles in the last 6-7 years?.

    no i said that they were critisised without being the finished article yet .
    and even if the 07 team had won it it would have been an anomally. against the odds, and againt logic. it would have been nice though.

    the thing is that they always looked capable of doing it, but we preferredd to castigate them for failing instead of congratulating for getting so close at such an age.

  476. He took a 5 time in a row serie A champion,, defending champions league, treble winning team and dismantled it in a record 6 months.

    i disagree ..there are many articles you can find in gazetta where you will find the war benitez had to face from inter stuff that were still idolising mou and sabotaging rafa;s work. he wasnt allowed to bring his guys in and he wasnt allowed to make transfers ” this team won the treble rafa..and you need new players?” …. 😉

  477. It’s not often that I think a gravatar fits the person but in Hunters case it is so apt. You look mental in that picture and your posts serve to confirm it.

  478. and obviously when a team like inter ( overageind squad of elite names) reaches mount everest …they need to dismantle and start over again.

  479. You can’t simply cast any commets and thoughts aside which don’t tally with your own. Especially when some of the thoughts are coming from people with a better understanding than yourself.

    like who?
    piers morgan ?
    or tim payton?

    would marcello lippi , pep, cruyff, carlo fergie rafa guus ever say anything negative about wenger ?

    when serious people talk about arsenal they have nothing but praise for what wenger has done for us.

    i prefer to listen to them than robbie savage or ian wright or paul merson.

  480. It’s not often that I think a gravatar fits the person but in Hunters case it is so apt. You look mental in that picture and your posts serve to confirm it.

    mental for arsenal.

  481. Please I need someone’s help. I saw an article/blog somewhere on net spend of premier league clubs, I think since 2006 (not really sure) but couldn’t figure out where I saw it. Can someone please give me the link?

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