Players Out Of Time: No. 3 Ray Kennedy

Ray was the player, more than any other of that great squad, that everyone used to ask about first. He was simply one of the best footballers ive ever seen” – Bob Paisley

Ray played in no mans land, in a world of his own, but he gave the team balance. He had style and he reminded me of Matt Busby. Ray Kennedy was some player” – Bill Shankley

It seems odd to open with quotes from two Liverpool managers but given they were amongst the best the game has ever seen, their opinions are hard to argue with. Ray Kennedy was one of my favourite ever footballers, the first hero I worshipped.

He was only 24 at the time of his departure from Highbury. 24 and already a League and FA Cup double winner; a Fairs Cup winner; an FA Cup runner-up. By the end of his playing days, he had added another 5 League titles, 3 European Champions cups, as well as UEFA Cup, League Cup and a European Super Cup to his medal haul. Just for good measure, he threw in a Welsh Cup winners medal whilst at Swansea.

Having been rejected by Sir Stanley Matthews as a teenager, his early Arsenal career must have seemed like a dream. 1969-70, his breakthrough into the first team and a crucial goal in the first leg of the Fairs Cup final in Belgium. 1970-71, a title-winning goal at White Hart Lane, a season in which he was Arsenal’s top scorer, a feat he would repeat the following season and 1973-74.

The variety of goals he scored for the club is impressive. The strikes from range, the well-timed run, climbing headers as well as the predatory striker’s goals. He rarely complained about the knocks he suffered, there was a spikiness to him that hid beneath a shy demeanour.

Since retiring, he struggle with Parkinson’s Disease is well documented, one cannot even begin to imagine the devastation it has brought to a former player.

How would Kennedy have fared today at The Emirates? He was an excellent header of the ball with a powerful shot in either foot. He was an intelligent footballer, highlighted by his transition at Anfield into an attacking midfielder. He scored a similar amount of goals for both Arsenal and Liverpool, his advanced role as John Radford’s strike partner meant he reached his total in 100 fewer games for the club.

Looking at the way Wenger sets his teams, it is not hard to imagine him slotting into the central striker’s role. He and van Persie play the game in a similar way, looking to link attack and midfield whilst scoring consistently as well. The only contemporary English player you could compare him to would be Wayne Rooney. Perhaps the United striker may be that good in the future, it is hard to say.

Whatever it was, 17 England caps was scant recognition for his abilities. Ron Greenwood could not decide on which goalkeeper he wanted, alternating between Clemence and Shilton for internationals. He had no qualms about choosing between Trevor Brooking and Ray Kennedy, his former West Ham charge winning through. Kennedy retired from international football in 1980 at not even thirty years of age.

In each of the decades since his retirement, Ray Kennedy would have been a successful player. Each Arsenal manager would have loved to have him in his team. And the supporters would have done so as well.

Enjoy this extract from the 501 Arsenal goals of a man who is an Arsenal great:

’til Tomorrow.

Posted on July 3, 2011, in Arsenal, Football, Premier League, Premiership, Soccer. Bookmark the permalink. 120 Comments.

  1. good one yw, can’t wait for ian wright & dennis the menace… have s great sunday..
    UP THE GUNS OF ARSENAL!!!

  2. mumbai gooner

    Thanks YW for educating newbies like me about our greats

  3. kamran

    They both played for Wenger…

    YW

  4. Ray was that rarity, an Arsenal legend at only 24.
    But remind us why he left for Liverpool. In those days players respected their contracts and Kennedy didn’t play just for the money.
    Did Liverpool “tap” him up?

  5. Top post…now back to cleaning after a gaggle of women destroyed my house.

  6. nicky

    In those days, players could not leave unless a club decided to sell. No Bosman’s, no tribunals – a club retained registration until someone bought it off them. He went to Liverpool because Arsenal were breaking up the double team and he was struggling for form in a poor team. Had weight problems as well, he had a big build.

    YW

  7. YW

    A good post mate, one of the many Arsenal legends.I was at WHL that great night in 1971 when Ray got the winner.

    Was very unhappy when he moved to Anfield, but he adapted well to his move into midfield. Not sure if he would have fitted into Wengers current style of play, AW would probably play him on the wing like he has done with Bendtner. But then again, Kennedy was a class above Nik.

  8. YW
    Ta for that.

  9. I see what you mean about slotting into this Arsenal team YW. He seemed to have the all round game, good finish, aerial ability, a Van Persie type CF.

    Great video clip, thanks.

  10. One of a number of mistakes at the time made by Arsenal Management & Board….selling Ray was probably the worst, a close 2nd the selling of Charlie George,and then Frank Mclintock & George Graham this coupled with disastrous signings of Peter Marinello & Geoff Blockley (among others) reduced a great side to average in 4 years by 1975 we were in serious danger of being relegated and were buying the likes of Terry Mancini who although a very likable guy who gave his all was nothing more than a lower leagues player! But hey most of the Arsenal History of the last 50 years is litered with the Arsenal Board allowing our best players to leave too soon and for never wanting to spend Money (SOUND FAMILIAR????) And in all this time a HILL-WOOD has always been involved!

  11. Is Arsene Wenger in control of the dressing room? I’m really surprised that almost every Arsenal player is able to say anything to the press and doesn’t care its effect on the club. These foreign players have no feeling for the club and it serves AW right for building a team of foreign mercenaries who have no feeling for the club , do and say anything and don’t care about Arsenal.

    We can’t even sell the dross in the team because they’re paid too much so no club wants to take them. Almunia, Eboue, Denilson, Rosicky, Bendtner are all receiving tons of money 50k and above per week. They will prefer to rot at the club rather than leave because no club is willing to pay their wages for their level of performances. Unfortunately, without those sales I doubt Aw can do much in the transfer market.

  12. Are we right and every one else is wrong then regarding Bendtner and Denilson and Almunia, i mean we want to sell but no one wants to buy hem for the money we are paying them or the money we value them at. the football world doesnt know what we know about these players the fools.

  13. Thank for this Yogi,

    Ray could very well slot in Wenger’s team as you say. He reminds me of Bendtner more than anyone else. Probably something to do with his height.

  14. george rodger

    Give it a rest Duke.You are like a broken record.
    Its early July,the sun is out.Cheer up man.

  15. Wenger is right about most clubs not moving yet. It explains why neither of Bendtner or Denilson have been sold yet, as these guys are unlikely to feature top of anyones wish list.

    Only manure have been active in the market but that’s because Fergie seems to value the need to wrap up transfers early more than Wenger does. I imagine City and Chelsea don’t plan to be too active this window or we would ave seen more movement from them.

  16. Anyone got a link to Nasri’s recent statement in full?

  17. george rodger

    Nigel Winterburn now think Cesc is gone.Oh god,I cant fucking stand it anymore.
    On the bright side Limpar think he will stay.Thank goodness for LA.
    We should have a day where only people post that think we will be better after the window than we are now.

  18. Henristic,

    The interview is behind a paywall so can’t get to a link of it. Might try to scan it in at work but that will be tomorrow.

    YW

  19. And yet the really worrying story this morning has been entirely missed.

    NotW reports that United are looking to build their own ‘virtual’ hospital with scanners, etc. Essentially, any injured player is immediately assessed there and moved onto a private hospital for op, if required. An entire sports science dept will be looking at the players and tailoring the rehabs to that.

    With Arsenal’s record of injuries over the past seasons, we ought to be investing in this scale of facility. It is believed that recoveries will be significantly improved with relapses less likely.

    YW

  20. Why should Aw be concerned about lack of transfer activity? I thought he had in mind/paper the weaknesses in the team that needed to be fixed plus the players he needs to move on so why the waiting game?

    For me we can manage if Clichy leaves because I believe if Gibbs is fit and he plays regularly he will improve defensively. Already going forward he’s better than Clichy. More games will only improve him barring injuries.

    Let’s say Cesc is gone but Aw shouldn’t accept any amount below 45m. Barca has already secured Sanchez for 40m. If they don’t pay up, Cesc stays.

    We can’t allow Nasri do go though. Aw should use savings from sale of Bendtner and Denilson to cover Nasri’s demands of 110k. The sale of Bendtner and Denilson will save 102k per week ( Denilson 50k, Bendtner 52k) Sale of Eboue and Almunia will save us a further 110k but I can’t see it happening because Almunia will run down his contract because he can’t get more than 20k a week anywhere on this planet.

    So why does AW pay so much money to average players and turns around to complain about lack of funds?

  21. Aren’t we doing the exact same thing, YW? I thought there was talk from Ivan at the AST on plans for an onsite medical facility at Colney. Did I imagine that?

  22. I like Nigel Winterburn. His heart always seems in the right place, and he packs a good deal more belief than some of his peers. When it comes to transfer policy though, he’s as benighted as the rest of us.

  23. george rodger

    “We can’t allow Nasri do go though. Aw should use savings from sale of Bendtner and Denilson to cover Nasri’s demands of 110k. The sale of Bendtner and Denilson will save 102k per week ( Denilson 50k, Bendtner 52k) Sale of Eboue and Almunia will save us a further 110k “.

    Erm.I don’t think that is how a wage structure for the club works.Its sort of a pecking order thingy.

  24. george rodger

    Limps,you are the gift that just keeps giving.

  25. george rodger

    A ray of sunshine in a currently gloomy Arsenal world 🙂

  26. lol Perry you think Rooney has so much feeling for United? Or Terry would love Chelsea if he did not get that extra payrais he asked for? Nobody “feels” for their club unless there is a fat cheque involved. Not even English players. If they did Henderson would stay at Sunderland and Caroll would stay at Newcastle, his childhood club that he always supported you must know.

    Dont make yourself look stupid man, you know better than to belive these young englishmen really care for their club. They care for trophies and money, one or the other will make them Denilsn is not on 52k pr week Perry, where you got that info from? the sun?

  27. oops! will make them move i mean. then new sentence, Denilson is not on 52k a week, where did you get that from? the sun?

    Nasri is not making it easier for himself to sta the way hes behaving. If he signs a new contract now he has to really show us that he is capable of being the winner we all want him to be. On the other hand, as he is today i doubt he would be able to take the responsibility required for a player of his stature in Arsenal. Hed rather be in United, surrounder by better players than himself cos he cant handle the preassure it sounds like. Cesc wants to leave cos he wants to go home, he never shuned any responsibility. I feel Nasri is. Which is why we should sell him. Nobody is bigger than the club, deffinently not Nasri. Did he say all this? Who cares? His agent has ruind his reputation with me anywya. I cant but hope he gets sold now. We are not that desperate that we need to bend over for Nasri are we?

  28. I think this column in the guardian is on the money without regards to our current situation. AW has made some mistakes in the past but he has every opportunity to put it right now.
    http://m.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2011/jul/02/arsene-wenger-arsenal-transfers?cat=football&type=article

  29. poodle

    “They care for trophies and money, one or the other will make them Denilsn is not on 52k pr week Perry, where you got that info from? the sun?”

    Agreed. They care for trophies and money so they will fight for it but one group cares for money only.

    Denilson collects 50k a week. Fact. Here are the wages of players I personally consider as average and whose wages are eating deep into the pocket of the club:

    Almunia 50k
    Denilson 52k
    Eboue 60k
    Rosicky 60k
    Diaby 60k
    Squilacci 50k
    Bendtne 52k

    That is a total of 384k a week for being in the squad.In a year we are talking of 20m. Its a lot of money to players who are not working hard enough.

  30. Klon.

    The Manchester Gruniad’s print journo’s are always reliable and accurate in their reporting of Arsenal FC.
    Why just last season Sid Lowe’s reporting on the Cesc to BBB story was clearly the product of a mind that had knowledge of the workings at AFC. Nothing to do with his career in Spain. Oh no. What could I mean? I have no idea.

    Anyway, it really is very simple. As 1LC wrote above, the footy hacks here don’t like AW. Never have. Never will.

  31. YW – marvelous post; another newbie supporter here.
    Appreciate your spotlighting (along with select others) memories.

    Best of all, the post is a positive diversion from the daily recycling of “gossip”.

  32. apologies yw,, i didn’t know you where covering the era before aw.. I’m with those who think a club shouldn’t bend to appease a player holding them for ransom. as much as i like his product on the field, if he doesn’t sign ,and as i expect, the club don’t bend, he has two options. eat his words and sign the contract that on the table. or move on and start a new somewhere else. we don’t want a Roony type mercenary at ARSENAL..

  33. looking forward to your next post containing another jen from the past. i have never followed ARSENAL and know them to finish other than top four. how many seasons have they come close to relaxation and how horrible that must have felt like. i know in all history of 1st division and now EPL ,ARSENAL HAVE BEEN THE ONLY TEAM NEVER TO HAVE BEEN RELEGATED….

  34. george rodger

    Perry,Where did you get those figures?
    Are you a “cat burglar”?
    Did you break in and look at their personnel files? say
    When you say”Denilson collects 50k a week. Fact.” what you actually mean is “I have been told this by someone equally as stupid as me and I have believed them”
    And even if the figures were right then to say” Here are the wages of players I personally consider as average “show how little you know about players.Rosicky,for instance is anything but average.

  35. Another top post mate, I agree that Ray would have starred under wenger. However, I feel there is a big difference between Ray and the two players from previous articles. Kennedy is rightly acknowledged as a legend because of his achievements on the pitch, where as the other two underachieved and were under used. I think I am right to say that Ray won more honours at liverpool than any other player in their history. But, my favourite quote of his came when he was asked to describe the difference between liverpool and Arsenal. He repied that liverpool were a pork pie and pop club compared to The Arsenal, apparently this view of his never went down too well with Tommy Smith, but he always maintained we were the biggest club he ever played for, quite a statement considering what that liverpool side achieved. By the way, what do you think was his most important goal he scored for the club. I`d go for the goal in The 1st leg against Anderlecht. Everything we went on to win stemmed from that. The goal against the stinking Yids was nice as well though.

  36. George Rodger

    Dream on and continue to believe.

  37. george rodger

    Perry.Good reply.Not!! 🙂

  38. johnny, stop with the racial slurs friend. you should be above that. we all should.

  39. @henristic,

    yes, Kennedy was a similar build to Bendtner and an out and out centre forward. But he had decent wingers and attacking fallbacks who could supply the crosses that he and John Radford could convert into goals.

    The problem with Arsene and Bendtner is that AW has played him out of position. If AW played Bendner in the middle, like a tradional CF, who would have supplied the crosses? Clichy? Walcott? Nasri? perhaps Sagna but thats all.

  40. george rodger

    Kamran,What racial slurs?
    If you mean”Yids”Then I think you owe Jonny an apology.I am sure it is not meant a racial.Simply a “by usage” term.

  41. Sure, NB52 was asked to play wider this season at times, but he got a fair go at games in the CF position.

    There are few strikers of his style and age who have played two games at the Cmap Gnu in knock out rounds of the CL (scoring in one. His overall goals to games ratio is not that of a player who’s been shunted onto the whinge, I’m afraid). He also got the nod ahead of Chamack to come on for RVP in the CC Final.

  42. cmap<camp
    Also, any look at NB52's goals to games ratio should consider the number of appearances made as a substitute. No point in forming any premature judgements about a type of player that seems to normally 'peak' at an older age, but his form in that run of games that he was given last season (at CF) was quite good.

  43. @finsbury

    Didn’t bendtner miss an open goal in one of those games. Kennedy would have put it away.

    What I was trying to explain is that the current system adapted by AW doesn’t favour out and out CF’s. If the team do sign Gervinho then Wenger needs a couple of outright wingers to be able to supply the balls into the box.

    Bring back Georgie Armstrong! or perhaps Miyaichi would be a good immitation of Georgie……. or even Alvarez!

  44. LA

    Not as in-depth as United are planning. The Arsenal one is not intended to be as large, not superficial by any stretch but more focussed on replacing equipment that exacerbates injuries. There is a move toward rehabilitation but if we kept everyone reasonably fit or ruled out relapses, would there be such a clamour for big signings? As it is, I’m slightly uneasy at having just four centre backs for the season!

    YW

  45. Gr*t. ‘Last season’ above refers to ’09/’10.

  46. Northbank.

    He might have missed the chance. Doesn’t mean that he wasn’t playing as CF, does it?
    He was.
    Does Wilshere’s pass/cross not count as a cross beacuse he is not a traditional whinger?

  47. @finsbury

    Gr*t to you too F’, how can ‘last season’ refer to 09/10??

    peak at an older age? how old do you think Kennedy was? and Charlie George? and Thierry Henry? ffs……… get a gr*p finsbury about the players that have not performed to their supposed potential at Arsenal. Bendtner needs to go, he can’t control a ball and when a clear opportunity arrises he f*ckin’ misses the target.

  48. re. kamran. Nothing racist about my comment my oldson, I happen to think people who follow that scum are stinking cunts. They call themselves yids.

  49. george rodger

    I think we will regret it if B52 leaves.
    But I do understand how he might be seen as an under performer.

  50. george rodger

    Jonny, Lol @”stinking cunts”

  51. @george at2.31pm

    We may well miss him when he goes, but you agree he has under performed.

    Another manager may get more from him, and that is not criticising Wenger, it’s just that another system may suit him better.

  52. george rodger

    Chris,I do agree.I just think he will improve massively as he matures.Having said that ,he will need to play in order to improve ,and with RVP in his way I dont think he will get that playing time

  53. Nice article. I liked what Ray did (from the games i saw) in an Arsenal shirt, he was just as mercurial a talent as Charlie George! As ever it seems with us we broke up a winning team far too early and ‘reaped’ the rewards.

    Back to present day and i feel that no matter what Arsenal say the press would twist it into something bad or at least look like we are weak and on the downhill spiral into oblivion! Darren Dein seems to be doing a stirling job at destroying and crediability that Nasri has with the fans, maybe easier to get moved on at their price (not Arsenal’s)??

    There seems to be a veritable whirlwind of media bullshit enveloping the club at the moment, fostered by the media’s collective wish for ‘change at any cost’. I’m sure we will sign the players needed but i think we are going to have to move a few people on first.

  54. Northbank @2:26

    I simply pointed out that Bentdner did in fact play as a CF on more then a few occasions in 10/11, a lot more previously. I don’t think that I flew off the handle with that one.

    I also don’t agree that Arsenal’s system does not favour out and out CF’s.
    What was Eduardo when he came to Arsenal? His goals against England were a little hint. There were times in games where Eduardo might have ben asked to drop into a different role. Didn’t really affect his ability to get goals over the course of the season. Whatever the evolution of the team, it’s not so different now.

    A fan might feel the team needs more pace*, or a different type of player. But there is no need to distort the events (or tactics) of this last season in order to consider such a thought.
    *’I’ve never written that, not ever. It’s true! I have never droned on and on about what TW14 brings to the squad, Even if he is not as good as Ronaldo the Great. I’ve never had him as my avatar. And no one else has ever thought the same, I’m sure of it.

  55. Here’s some football:

    Kun Aguero vs. Bolivia

    http://www.101greatgoals.com/videodisplay/%E2%80%AAsergio-aguero-bolivia%E2%80%AC%E2%80%8F-12102088/

    I thought is was an OK game. Only two goals in two games so far. Messi was good.
    Tevez missed a few chances that were set up for him, but the football press in Argentina were critical of Messi. Well, there is a surprise! Idiotic press. Who’d have guessed it.

  56. Perry don’t make urself look stupid now. You know nothing of what anyone earns in that team. Neither does the papers. Your facts are wrong. Simple as that.

  57. LimparAssist

    Right, YW, incredibly ill-informed opinion coming up but, never stopped me before, so:

    Will the Manc ‘virtual hospital’ (let’s call it ‘Theme Hospital’) ‘rule out’ relapses? Doubt it. Don’t see how it can.

    And why would Arsenal need a Theme Hospital when we live 2 miles from St Barts? Not to mention all the other little specialist hospitals like the London Bridge Hospital. And that special knee hospital (where’s Frank when you need him?)

    Also, isn’t London a hub of cutting edge medicine with 50 or so working hospitals to Greater Manchester’s 10 or so (one of which is the Royal Manchester Lunatic Asylum)? The poor fuckers could do with another horsepital come to think of it – even if it has to be a virtual one …populated by limping, wanker millionaire love rats.

    And following that curve upward I would imagine there are good deal more specialist physicians for any given freak injury living in and around London, than there are in Mancville. Because, well – that much is obvious isn’t it…

    Don’t get me wrong, anything we can do to stop our relentless niggling injuries the better. But I don’t think we need to build a hospital, considering there’s lots of good ones on our doorstep. I think it’s more to do with possession football than anything else, but that’s another story.

  58. LimparAssist

    Wow, that was poorly worded. Back to the tennis…

  59. Hornby moaning about Arsenal in between songs at the moment. Playing some good stuff though.

  60. On the radio, that is…

  61. so the latest quotes from Nasri is it is nothing to do with money why he wants to leave but he wants to win titles. well if this is the case why doesnt Wenger explain to him that he will be bringing in the players to make sure we dont bolloxs things up at the last hurdle next year!!!

  62. dukeGoonem

    Nasri knows how close we were to the title, how close we were to knocking Barca out, how close we were to taking the Carling Cup.. these latest quotes are purely intended for damage limitation. Everyone knows he would leave because of the money, now hes trying to swing it to make people believe its for the glory.

    If these quotes are indeed legitimate and from the mouth of Nasri within the last few weeks, then I am afraid he has ran his contract down and used it to force a larger wage, or do a Flamini and get a massive signing on fee and all the perks. This is what many thought anyway.

    Anyone know whether the comments are real ??

  63. I don’t think United has more chance than City or Chelasea or arsenal to win next year. You would have to go o Spain or Italy to be 80% guaranteed a trophy. United is only 60% just as chelsea and arsenal and city. How can anyone sat different?
    Chelsea and city has not signed big yet but they will. Arsenal has not yet, united has already replaced vds and rio with talents. If we replace nasri with gervinho we swap talent for talent. United has swapped giant players with talent. There is a big difference there.
    Nasri won’t have more chance to get trophies with united than with city or Chelsea. Not if he maintained his form for the entire year anyway.
    Nasri was one of the biggest reasons for us to implode. Our key players includes him did not handle the pressure. He cannot blame Arsenal without taking a ling good look in the mirror.

  64. Oh lord its all very depressing at the moment…….

    Can someone tell me some good news about Arsenal, just make it up and indulge me if you haven’t any!

  65. Poodle, I will reverberate that , Nasri was a major factor in our imploadation last season so its no wonder the board dont really want to give him top dollar.

    At least Rooney and Terry helped their respective clubs win things before taking them to ransom. but on another note we cant lose him now either.

  66. george rodger

    I like Nasri,But Poodle is bang on.He was one of the problems,He owes it to Arsenal and himself to make up for his shortcomings,

  67. Just read on Vital City that Clichy is gone for 19m and will receive wages of 110k. He’s expected to be unveiled on Monday 4th. Any truth in that?

  68. Perry,

    No.

  69. “so the latest quotes from Nasri is it is nothing to do with money why he wants to leave but he wants to win titles. well if this is the case why doesnt Wenger explain to him that he will be bringing in the players to make sure we dont bolloxs things up at the last hurdle next year!!!”

    Wenger won’t explain that because it won’t happen.

  70. Gainsbourg69

    Nasri’s a good player. If he sees his future with another club, fair enough. I won’t miss him as much as I would miss Robin, Cesc or even Clichy, though. To me, he hasn’t showed the quality necessary to hold the club hostage for higher wages.

  71. i can see manure trying to strengthen their midfield which was truly shut at times last year. chitty coming for Gael is pure and simple an attempt to weaken ARSENAL as they have good enough left backs already at their club. in fact, they are two or three strong in every position and i can’t see them buying too much this year. same goes for chelski. i thought one reason for early play last year was due to Anelka who i thought was a catalyst in their front line and the play maker. now he is talked about as a potantial player to be sold.
    @ george
    i have always felt that Word to be knock on one religion and beliefs, therefore my protest at johnnies usage of said word.

  72. Ignore it all

  73. george rodger

    Kamran,I understand how you feel,I am simply pointing out that Jonny did not mean it that way,Therefore calling him racist is simply wrong and out of order.He is not responsible for how you see things.

  74. Gainsbourg69

    I just read that MU have Ashley Young at £135k a week. That is absolute insanity.

  75. Whats up folks?

    Poodle is correct about Nasri, he is also to be blamed as much as anyone else for what happened at seasons end. Not sure what match it was but I believe it was RVP who set him up numerous times only for him to spurn the chances. If he is saying these things, I say he should be quiet and put in more work to ensure that he doesnt tail off in seasons to come. A brilliant player he is but consistent he isnt as yet.

  76. fair enough george, we leave it be..

  77. george rodger

    Kamran,Cool.

  78. Young on 135k a week… hahahahahhahaahah

    You get mugs arguing how Arsenal should get players like Young! I don’t know how much Cristiano Ronaldo was getting, but Young isn’t even half the player.

  79. kamra- Wenger is not very keen on Clichy if he was he would offer him the wages he wants. I think the penny dropped with him. Last season he did not do well. He has a habit of getting caught . I don’t think we will be weaker without him, his crosses hardly trouble any defense. He has his qualities of course but we need someone solid defensively. Gibbs is in line waiting also Traore the forgotten man can be a cover but a top class left back is needed to help the youngsters like Gibbs. I hear Vermalen can do a good job there but it will be a waste to play him there.

  80. 1lc,,, i seeyou point, yet for him to play for liverpool or chitty is too much for me to take. i also don’t think we have anyone in-house to take his place and if we buy, you can be sure it will cost much more than we will get selling him..

  81. i also agree with you about using TV in Gael position. i wouldn’t mind if we give him a try in DM position. see if he can fill gaps in case of emergency.

  82. off to play some FOOTBALL.. have a good night everyone.. up the guns!!!!

  83. @ 1loosecannon – I do not think it would be a waste to play TV at left back as unlike Clichy he has a great shot on him. How many times did Gael refuse to shoot when presented with the opportunity because even he knew he had a terrible shot!! He is also a more natural defender and is better in the tackle but I do not think he is as quick as Gael. However in saying that quite often Gael would venture a bit too far forward, relying on his pace to make up any lost ground. Gibbs has the raw talent but lacks maturity/experience. Traore can be brilliant or frustratingly naive, so in some ways a natural replacement for Gael 🙂

    @YW and LA – With regards to Manure building there own “Virtual Hospital” would there be any chance of them then having the ability to declare there players unfit for international duty because of this facility rather then having the player to travel to London for a physical? Also in regards to Manure, I was discussing with a friend AW’s lack of dealings as opposed to Rednose who has all ready made some moves. I tried to point out that Scholes has left and therefore Rednose had an opening for a player in the squad and was able to act immediately whereas we have to wait for someone to be sold before we can buy(I am ignoring players under 21). To me it seems quite simple but idiot that he is, he could not wrap his head around it. Was curious to see if you agreed.

    And just to lighten the mood, check this little video out and keep a special eye out for our very own Mad Jens Lehmann up to his usual tricks 🙂

  84. LimparAssist | July 3, 2011 at 4:25 pm

    Good point. Most of the top teaching hospitals are in London and the best specialists in the country already work there. It’s no trouble to refer our players there or call them in for a consult if need be.

    “Nasri was one of the biggest reasons for us to implode. Our key players includes him did not handle the pressure. He cannot blame Arsenal without taking a long good look in the mirror.”

    True Poodle, this is what pisses me off most about the likes of Nasri and Cesc. They were on the pitch and failed to do the business, but instead of taking responsibility for their own failures they are looking to blame anything else. Arsene was right when he said players always want you to buy, but never in their position.

  85. Was Boateng not a left back? how can Clichy be better than him? Maybe we should swap.

  86. Watching Brazil vs Venezuela. Nothing special about Brazil so far.

  87. YW

    thanks for the post. Club history is always interesting. Even though I find it hard to resist sometimes and there is always the urge to take on a debate its nice to take a break from discussing transfer stuff. Will be back at it tomorrow I guess.

    I do think TV could be a great LB for us. He is not as fast as Clichy but there is no reason to think he would struggle defensively out wide. Getting his rocket launching left leg into the box more often can only help the team. I have said this before but I think he can create double figures in goals scored just by us tapping in rebounds since very few keepers will be able to hold his shots. Not to mention we get another players who is better in the air around the 18 yard box for set pieces on both ends. I know there are a lot of us who think that the idea of tap ins or set piece goals is somehow not in keeping with our vision of beautiful football but realistically the club needs to score more goals then it has for the last several years and getting more scrappy goals is the easiest way to increase our goals scored. One thing the last few years should have taught us is that no matter how good our players are it is very difficult to effectively play our 1 touch movement and passing game on a consistent basis. Getting more scrappy goals and scoring beautiful goals does not have to be mutually exclusive. However, if we were better at getting “ugly” goals it would certainly help compensate on the days when our passing game is not at its best.

  88. “Watching Brazil vs Venezuela. Nothing special about Brazil so far.”

    It’s a very poor game Paul. Brazil are a shadow of their former selves.

  89. Brazil 0-0 Venezuela. The Venezuelans parked the bus and Brazil had maybe four shots on goal total eventhough they played a 4-2-4.

    If anyone ever says that Denilson is shit because Lucas Leiva and Ramires get picked for Brazil ahead of him, they should watch a recording of this game. Lucas and Ramires were dross. Brazil resorted to hoofball in order to bypass their crappy midfield because they created nothing.

    Kamran, if Neymar is worth 40 million euros then Ryo Miyiachi has got to be worth at least 25m. And I’m being generous since Ryo plays in a league where the defenses are much better organized than in Brazil.

  90. Kamran, if Neymar is worth 40 million euros then Ryo Miyiachi has got to be worth at least 25m. And I’m being generous since Ryo plays in a league where the defenses are much better organized than in Brazil.

    On the basis of half a good season in Holland? They don’t even want him back next season!

  91. I’m very hopeful to see him ply his trade at our first eleven. this guy just got out of high-school . good future there gains..

  92. I’m very hopeful to see him ply his trade at our first eleven. this guy just got out of high-school . good future there gains..sayonara..

  93. I don’t think that it#s just the comparison with the two players you name that some people feel that Denilson doesn’t bring enough value to the team. Probably more on the experience of watching him play for us for several years in the premiership rather than on the performance of his international rivals in one game. And from the team selection this year it would seem that Arsene agrees. Do you think Arsene was wrong in that decision ?

  94. from what i heard, they liked having him. its AW who is trying to get him a permit to play for us. he must be something. they would love to have him in loan one more year.

  95. James: “On the basis of half a good season in Holland? They don’t even want him back next season!”

    Says who?

  96. G69 ~ says James. He just made it up.

  97. David, the comparisons are often made by his critics and they use the fact that he never gets picked for Brazil as an excuse to call him shit. Therefore I think it’s fair to judge how his rivals play for their NT. And one game is enough criticize them in a short tournament like the Copa America. Brazil face even better teams than Venezuela in their next group games and they may not even make it beyond the first round. This game was against their weakest rivals and the aformentioned players were utter shit.

    By the way, I’m not basing my criticism of Lucas and Ramires on one game. Lucas has been in England for a few seasons and he’s nothing special. As for Ramires, Chelsea supporters were pleading that Carlo Ancelotti keep him as far away from their squad as possible. I don’t think either of them is better than Denilson. I’ve watched Denilson play for us ever since he came to Arsenal and I’ve always thought he was a good player. Some of our fans have selective memories and only choose to focus on what he does wrong.

    Wenger kept him away from the team for god knows what reason. It could be his back, the emergence of little Jack, who knows? But I don’t think he kept him out because he’s shit. He certainly didn’t think he was a bad player two seasons running when he was one of the players who played the most games for us until his injury. Let me ask you, are you prepared to call Wilshere shit if Arsene Wenger decides to rotate him more often next season?

    Kamran, I thought that Miyiachi was an apt comparison to Neymar because they’re both around the same age and play the same position. They also seem to suffer from defenders marking them closely. From what I saw today I think anyone would be bat shit insane if they payed 40m euros for him. He still looks like a youth player and seems to be very weak on the ball. See, when he gets to Europe he’s not going to be afforded the same protection he gets in Brazil He’s going to have to slug it out with the big boys and I just don’t think he’s going to be able to handle it. Not yet, anyway.

  98. Denny has brought about the same value to be team as nasri this year which is fuck all regarding trophies right? Non of them gave us any joy this year so non brought us value. Am i right? our so called stars was not worth shit in the run in. They could not score and they could not defend.
    Cesc singelhandedly bacpassed us out of the CL, bender shoot us out of the CL and they all failed when it mattered as most. Against Birmingham and the last 12 weeks of the series.
    Seriously dude if we gonna talk about who does not bring enough value to he team the list is long. Starting with those who failed out on he pitch. Do i think Wenger was wrong this spring? I think when he looks back he will ask himself what could i have done different. He even said that himself. I’m sure one of those questions will be regarding his fringe players.
    Would Denny have made a difference might be one of them. No one will ever know, but played in a more advanced role he has scores alot before and has a mean distance shoot something he is not afraid to do. And that was those three things that we lacked most in the run in this season. The ability to not be afraid of shooting, to score without walking the ball int the net and take responsibility. Would Denny have doe this? Well he surly could not have done a worse job than nasri, cesc and jack. They failed miserably. Only Aaron shoot against united and we won that match.
    I fail to see how the inclusion of Denny would make us let in more goals or score less than we did this spring.

  99. Well we should pray neymar has a cracking tournament that makes all the moneybag trams drool and start a bidding war in the 40m class. That will give us ample time to do our business n peace.

  100. My god john cross comes up with some proper shit. Looks like his panicking now over his cashcow fabregas. The transfere not going as planned, he’s back in Uk. And barcs reporting arsenal to FIFA for tapping up two youngsters?? Is John drunk?

  101. Happy 4th to you guys over the pond.

  102. gains, do you remember some of the goals deni scored for us from freekicks?? screamers

  103. we do need more shootings from behind the 18. i see less and less every year. beautiful goals are great but goals from rebounds and tapins count just as much. we should take our chances from outside.

  104. @Dups – Thanks man re:4th will be spending the day with The Girlfriend on my friends sailboat drinking and smoking the day away while watching the fireworks and eating as much free food as is humanly possible. Plus it will be a day free of transfer gossip and such crap 🙂

  105. BARKA reporting us. LOL
    so wraped, this.

  106. @irishgray
    cheers… party hardy

  107. @ Kamran – Cheers mate I am really looking forward to it but am dreading the hangover on Tuesday morning. Taking that day off work lol

  108. drink yourself a lot of water too. hangover won’t be as bad… 😉

  109. LOL will do if I remember

  110. Omg! Today the mirror officially declares Arsenal crisis. They ask the question why we don’t attract stellar names like fabregas. did we ever? We don’t buy stars we create them. Also would even Barcelona or Real be able to replace a player like cesc? Or even city or United? Cos he’s unique and worldclass. Those kind of players are never for sale. Ours are cos he happends to idolise the only team in the world that is virtually guaranteed trophy every year foe the forseeable future.
    Arsenal goes from crisis to crisis in the papers. And gervinho is crsp, unproven and may fail. A bit like he signing of nasri?

  111. If the media kpees this up ppl will start to sympathise towards arsenal cos they get treated so shit. Nobody liked injustice let alone the public. Even they start to smell sOmethig is rotten with the curent arsenal journalism. Im inclined to thi l the press is shootin hselves in the foot here. Its going from scary tO bordering a farce

  112. its awfull poodle, just awful….LOL the basterds are in overdrive… now maybe the common man in the street will know what we are up against… for years…

  113. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    Nice one, fuckoffspud. I wish I was out of the fucking country to be honest. I hate Americans on the 4th of July. Myself included. I’m fucking well pissed though and the next shot of jäger will be taken in your honor my friend.

  114. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    Oh and nice one, YW. I’m loving these history lessons. I’m a huge history nerd and I love the way you do what you do man. Brilliant stuff.

  115. you addressing me jonesee..

  116. if you are, you are one mean drunk son of a bitch. moderate your drinking, you can’t handle the drink boy

  117. Poodle

    I can sense the sympathy already. A few of the people i play 5 aside with are already saying look at Arsenal, they probably going to drop out of the top half! They find it hilarious more than anything else, especially the Pool fans who have to endure an amplified level of media misery over the last season. We are viewed at as being in a crisis, it is unreal.

    Whether they REALLY believe that we will fall into a mid table battle, and whether they believe most the crap the media puts out there.. who knows. There has to be a section of supporters up and down the country who don’t buy it. Like you say, I think everyone will cotton on soon enough, ON and OFF the pitch we continue to be dealt an unfair hand.

    United’s extraordinary debts, Chelsea’s title shopping methods, now there’s City who inflated the whole footballing world markets, billionaire owners destabilizing football clubs all around the country, meanwhile.. Arsenal stick by our principles with a fine business model, unable to compete against the big spending cunts who don’t give a toss about the affects of their actions. Our club has earnt a huge amount of respect, we just need to deliver that final shot to prove all these fuckers wrong. Last season was a massive opportunity, I am still confident we can beat the big spending by signing a few quality players and keeping our stars.

  118. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    WTF are you going on about? I’ll call you by your name if I feel you need to be addressed. Believe that homie. So until then cheers and try not to be so simple.

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