Hope Remains

No Darius this morning so let’s get cracking as a hectic Arsenal week draws to a close.

Who am I kidding? It has been quieter than the summer months between the end of the old season and the start of the new. It says it all when an Board announcement at an unspecified time about an unspecified event that is ‘good news’ but not about takeovers, shareholdings, Lady Nina or David Dein, is the highlight of the week.

Anything to keep from talking about the draw against Blackburn. Rather than look back, looking ahead ought to be the order of the day. No utterances from the players this week which is just as well as their statements about what they hope will be the outcome and what they are determined to achieve, have been at odds with reality in recent performances.

The adage about ‘actions speaking louder than words’ has never been more appropriate.

It will be a diminished Arsenal side which takes the pitch on Sunday. Alex Song has not recovered from his knee-knack, which he is obviously feigning such is his lack of desire. Apparently.

Meanwhile Theo Walcott has reniggled his ankle-knack and seems likely to miss out on his stick of rock. Business as usual so far. Perhaps Arsène will bring a ray of joy to this darkened world at his press conference this afternoon.

He might need to. Harsh words have no doubt been exchanged about recent performances. It seems a long time ago when Sunday’s opponents were routed at The Emirates. The expected relegation fight has now engulfed Blackpool and it is going to be tough for them to win it.

They are helped by the paucity of talent at some of the other clubs around them and in the longer run, a team which emerges from the Championship and stays up by playing football in a proper manner can only be good for the game as a whole.

If West Brom could do the same, so much the better, particularly if it is at the expense of their neanderthal neighbours.

If the players need motivation (and at this stage of the season with a major trophy up for grabs, they shouldn’t), they can be inspired by criticism levelled at them by Paul Merson. According to Merson,

They have got no chance. I was really bullish about them five weeks ago but now you have to question them. They have just dropped too many easy points. I think it’s all down to (a lack of) winning mentality.

So a moment of truth has emerged. The players will probably choose to ignore him – understandably in some cases as ex-pros tend to be the harshest critics, forgetting their own individual and collective failings – some will probably not even have heard of him. There will be an element of the support were Merson’s words resonates, demanding that Wenger spend to solve the issues.

That will not happen, yet. It cannot happen, yet. And with two months – more or less – of the season remaining, why are people even wondering about the next campaign? This one has not finished and should not be given up on. The inconsistency of all sides in the title race cannot be ignored just because of consecutive draws.

Hope remains. Yes, the outcome is reliant upon United dropping points but they are far from invincible. Arsenal must regain their form and confidence, quickly, if they are to capitalise on any slips.

’til Tomorrow.

Posted on April 8, 2011, in Arsenal, Football, Premier League, Premiership, Soccer, Transfer Gossip and tagged , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 188 Comments.

  1. Hope remains, indeed.

  2. One of Us

    Not sure if you’ve seen this link on yesterday’s post re Paris Angels



  3. YW, am sure you do not count for first poster? LOL

    I really expect them to rally themselves and get the remaining results needed… happily one of the needed wins is over man U winch will automatically account for 3 points. Hope remains is the bottom line and until mathematically over, it is actually those pronouncing the season over that are being unreasonable!

  4. This reminds me of a tale in Neil Gaiman’s Sandman. In issue 4, “A Hope in Hell”, Dream goes into hell to regain one of his tools. He faces off against a demon in a battle of wits: the game is trumps, where one must a thing which trumps the other.

    It goes back and forth until the demon says:
    “I am anti-life, the Beast of Judgement. I am the dark at the end of everything. The end of universes, gods, worlds … of everything. And what will you be then, Dreamlord?”
    Dream’s reply: “I am Hope.”

    Powerful stuff

  5. Thanks Yogi.

    Gadget, Neil Gaiman has turned into one of my favourite authors. I loved American Gods and Good Omens, not sure what to check out next… any suggestions? What’s Sandman all about?

  6. Sandman I think was Gaiman’s first work in comics. It’s largely about Dream, a member of the pantheon of abstract gods called the Endless. It’s set in the DC universe so there are some cameos from Constantine, Joker Superman, etc, but despite that this is a series of comics which rivals Watchmen for storytelling and content (and there are too few of these out there).

    Absolutely seminal stuff and I can’t recommend it enough. They are 10 volumes in all, the whole thing is magnificent, and is a must for any Gaiman fan.

    I’d lend them to you were it not for Geographical differences (pun not included, but I’ll take the credit for it’s brilliance)

  7. Really??! Sounds great! I’ll have a look at getting me dirty ol’ hands on those… I’d heard he’d done some graphic novels but am yet to sample them. didn’t realise they were linked in with some of the DC characters, like the sound of that.

    Thanks Gadget, much appreciated! Have been umming and errring about the next book to purchase, looks like my decisions has been made 🙂 In fact I might just check em out now… Damn this internet shopping malarkey.

  8. Oh yeah – COYG!!!

  9. I would’ve thought those who think the season is not over are the ones who are being unreasonable. Where on Gods earth do you think we will gain 8 points on ManU. How do you think we will beat them ? Get real and hope AW reads some of these blogs and realises that it will take a mighty shift in his thoughts and approach to turn this ship around

  10. ozgooner, get a grip. If we ‘turned the ship around’ we would be going down to mid-table again.

  11. Yogi

    Bad (unintended?) pun:

    “No Darius this morning so let’s get cracking as a hectic Arsenal week draws,/u> to a close. ”

    No more draws please. Nothing less than 3 points from visit to Blackpool with an emphatic win.

  12. Last of The Country Gentlemen

    @oz gooner

    Why not go and ‘support’ someone else, becasuse you sure as shit aren’t helping. You seem to be confusing probability and likliness. One is mathematical – it says there is still a chance of taking the league. Your opinion is that it is not likely. While there is hope, why don’t you just cheer up a bit and get behind the team? Is it that difficult?

  13. If the predicament the lads are in (ie. a chance of the title, albeit a diminished one) doesn’t spur them on at least to a full blooded, gutsy run-in, I for one will be very disappointed. Please lets see some fighting spirit out there lads! COYG!
    PS. Sorry about the pun!

  14. Alex Ice Cream

    Hope, what hope? That we don’t get overtaken by Chelsea?

    There is no hope for this team in terms of winning the Prem (or even the League Cup). Don’t waste your time and energy on this bunch of losers! They are not worth it, or the money that they are being paid.

  15. It’s often said the insane think they are actually sane, so I guess the unreasonable would think they are also reasonable.

    Reflective question for the Oz: is it reasonable to give up all hope and relinquish endeavour before a definite conclusion has been reached?

  16. Alex the Ice Cream of the crop when it comes to undying support. Don’t put yourself through it mate, it’s obviously not giving you any enjoyment… Follow your own advice.

  17. dupsffokcuf you right if ‘turned the ship around’ we would be going the wrong direction lol

  18. Good lord, in my hiatus from commenting, I’d totally forgotten about the incorrigible existence of the AIC (how about that for being hopeless?)

    It’s a shame there’s no dislike/like thingy on wordpress that’s render his brain-faeces invisible to my profile

  19. Alex Ice Cream


    I do follow my own advice. I don’t waste much time on the team these days. My levels of interest are the same as that of many of the squad – practically non- existent.

  20. Alex Ice Cream


    A conclusion has been reached – you just deny the reality of it. This squad will win nothing!

    Carry on deluding yourself if it makes you feel better.

  21. Losers don’t go unbeaten in one of Europe’s toughest leagues for nearly half a season.

    Oh and thanks again, YW!

  22. Last of The Country Gentlemen


    For someone claims to not wast much time, you don’t half waste a lot time (your own and everyone elses) going on about it.

  23. AIC,

    Would that be the same young team that is currently sitting in second position in what is arguably the hardest league on the planet?

    Or the same team that was ahead three quarters of the way through in a match against arguably the best current team on the planet – until a referee’s intervention deprived them of a player and chance?

    Or the same young team that simply deserves better than you?

    Or the same team that

  24. Hey, let’s be honest, this is probably the strongest league overall. Get past the top seven or eight in Spain and you’re left with absolute cannon fodder. It’s touch and go wether the English top ten is as strong as La Liga’s, but the remaining teams in the PL are of a far, far higher level. Compare Villa and Sunderland, and all their internationals, to Getafe and Osasuna for instance.

  25. Alex Ice Cream


    I agree about Barca – the ref screwed us completely. That was the one game recently where the team actually showed some spirit. Since then and Brum in the final they have been utterly spineless. This was a great chance to win the Prem – Lpool out, Chelsea struggling, Citeh not gelling yet and a very ordinary United team that has a great winning mentality.

    This should have been our year but it hasn’t been due to the fact that come March when the pressure is one we implode and have done for years. 2007, 2008, 2009, last year and this. I don’t care where we are now because we won’t finish first. This team, manager and board are great at getting top 4 on a budget – their “trophy” but actually winning anything? Don’t make me laugh.

  26. OOU – I’d say the top 10 in England is also much better. Only Barca and Real are as good or better than Arsenal, Manure and Chavs. Valencia and Villareal are the only other teams vaguely capable of challenging (if you could call it that), then Athletico are much worse than before, Bilbao, Betis etc have all gotten worse in recent years…

  27. ‘A winning mentality’

    Thats what I hope we can develop, I’m not sure we can though. I really want to see that but I’m not convinced it will happen under Arsene and the current crop, still now is not the time to be negative, let’s get behind Arsene and the lads and see what they can do for us and themselves! COYG!

  28. It’s a tough one, Geo. Atletico Madrid, for all their problems, would still mop the floor with Newcastle, Bolton, Fulham (did only last year) or Everton.

    Really, go below Liverpool at sixth in our league and there’s a big step down in quality. I think the top fours are evenly matched overall (ours is probably better), but La Liga just about shades the remaining six.

  29. toughest league yes,best league no.fact,no english team in the europa last eight.the players are exhibiting their worst behaviour at the most inappropriate of times.in direct contrast is our title rival coming back from a two goal deficit to win,well after all said and done,that’s the stuff champions are made of.av got a weird feeling these bunch are starting to believe the hype that they don’t have it in them.that’s the only reasonable explanation for what happened on saturday.

  30. A Gooner can get shot nowadays for not having belief? Indeed he sure can but, can the shot be justified bearing in mind what we all have been through in the last few years but, more importantly the last few months.

    What else do you need to motivate to win games when you were in the position Arsenal were a month ago after nothing for so long? It was all there for taking and we couldn’t even manage Birmingham. I put the bad feeling to bed cos I thought Utd will drop points and then we can capitalise but, only the first part of my wishes came through and the second part didn’t even look like happening.

    Then came the international break which as I did you guys must of thought this is just what we needed and we could come back to the Prem and make it nice again but, that performance didn’t have enough effort for me which was
    more sadder than the lost.

    I down for the Club but, at the moment there’s something missing and it’s hurting the club.

    I thought we would of brushed Blackburn aside after 30mins.
    Hoping we can do it v Blackpool but, I can’t see utd dropping points now. We still need to finish strong though. and bring back our kid in Holland cos he seems to be putting in more work than Rosicky.

    No utterances from the players this week which is just as well as their statements about what they hope will be the outcome and what they are determined to achieve, have been at odds with reality in recent performances.

  31. Doomers are like clouds. Eventually they’ll fuck off and we’ll all have a nice day. Hopefully Sunday.

    Full week of training together ahead of this match and a well rested and recharged bunch of players. We’ll be too much for them.

  32. Personally I thought a key element of supporting any team is hope be it in respect of a cup, league, promotion, relegation or just plain old boring stability.

    Watching football from here on in is going to be pretty joyless for some until next August.

  33. Bloody eck,

    has anyone heard Wenger’s press conference? He has come out swinging. Never heard him so dismissive of other people.

    Great viewing.

  34. If our players remember what it felt like to enjoy themselves on the pitch, we would see a difference. Should their focus be on silverware, Man Who? and not playing for each other, them we will witness same-o, same-o Arsenal.

    The Bear wants his team to enjoy the party at the seaside, and returning on the coach with plenty of Song!

  35. Loved the press conference, ML, but he shouldn’t have to say what should be obvious to everyone.

    Funny to hear Paul Merson getting ruined in such a classy way though!

  36. george rodger

    where can you here the full interview?I have ATVO but its not on there yet

  37. george rodger

    hear not here

  38. I think it’s still looping on the Match Centre page at the moment, gr.

  39. george rodger

    No not on mine

  40. Hm, that’s happened to me before – the No Man’s land after it gets taken off “as live” but before it’s posted on the site.

  41. Limestonegunner

    Can’t find it either. Where do you folks watch it originally, as it hasn’t been posted to “Talk” and isn’t on “Matchcentre”? I love a good Arsene Wenger press conference!

  42. george rodger

    I am all over excited now

  43. Good stuff Yogi, loved this:

    “Hope remains. Yes, the outcome is reliant upon United dropping points but they are far from invincible. Arsenal must regain their form and confidence, quickly, if they are to capitalise on any slips.”

    Hope does remian!

    OOU, Atletico Madrid beat Fulham 2-1 in extra time, is that the game you are refering to?

    The English League may not have any teams in the Europa cup but there are still 3 PL teams in the CL and it was obviously 4 to Spains 2 just recently.

  44. Great post Yogi. I agree completely the team should take a vow of silence with the media for the rest of the season and let their feet do all the talking.

    I and probably most supporters still have hope but confidence (at least mine) certainly at a nadir right now. The annoying thing is that no one has any idea about whys and wherefores of what we have seen on the pitch recently and in the “business end” of several previous seasons. That does not stop some from trying to explain it and some of the explanations make little sense but the attempts are borne of frustration. A great performance this weekend would start to bring the confidence a little closer to the level of the hope. We have a tough run in but if we take it a game at a time near maximum points still a possibility

  45. I’m not sure the scoreline really reflected their dominance and obvious technical superiority, Paul. Even with the winning goal coming so late, I don’t think anybody tried to claim that Fulham were particularly hard done by.

  46. I hear you OOU. Even with that, they are not in the CL. Overall, the PL seems to do better in that competition, recently atleast.

  47. I think we minimize what a lack of confidence can do to a team. Again, the Barca loss was devestating, the way it went down was very hard to take for me as a supporter much less the players. You can see that Arsene can see what has taken place however it is up to the players to pick themsleves up, along with the supporters getting behind the team and not calling for Wenger to leave and calling the players every name under the sun.

  48. Limestonegunner

    OoU, yesterday you expressed some unhappiness with AST. I looked on their site and couldn’t find any statements directly from them but just the article in the Independent which has now become the basis for copycat stories all over with headlines characterizing the AST as criticizing or putting Wenger under pressure. The only quote directly from a statement they gave to the Press Association Sport describes their duties, their annual activities, and this comment: “There is of course considerable disappointment amongst all Arsenal fans at recent results in the cup competitions and the long period Arsenal has gone without winning a trophy.” In and of itself, I don’t see any actual criticisms of the team, players or manager, specifically in this. Is it inaccurate to say fans have “considerable disappointment” at our cup results? As far as I can tell their statement referred, indirectly reported in the article, to the end of the season as the time to judge the team’s performance in the league. I think that is what we are all calling for too.

    The only thing I think they could be looked on with criticism is making the statement at all (though I don’t know the circumstances of this and its timing–we can’t jump to the conclusion that they are coming down on one side or another of recent controversies simply on this basis) and not calling for supporters to get behind the team for the remainder of the season (though, again, to be fair, I am not sure they ever do this anyway–they aren’t Red Action after all, they are more a shareholders group that goes to AGM’s and reports on the fiscal health of the club).

    Perhaps you can tell me what you found especially disappointing about the AST’s statement, since typically I think it is useful to have organizations like this and AISA around.

  49. longblackcloud

    Geo – Neil Gaimans The Anansi Boys the sequel to American Gods – typically funny, odd and dark Gaiman fare

    Anansi Boys
    God is dead. Meet the kids.
    When Fat Charlie’s dad named something, it stuck. Like calling Fat Charlie “Fat Charlie.” Even now, twenty years later, Charlie Nancy can’t shake that name, one of the many embarrassing “gifts” his father bestowed — before he dropped dead on a karaoke stage and ruined Fat Charlie’s life

  50. Don’t have access to a press conference video. Any interesting quotes?

  51. Limestone

    The problem I had – and to be fair Tim from AST invested a considerable amount of time defending a genuine Press Release to me offline – was threefold:

    First, timing – the season isn’t over yet the language presumed it was. Second, it read like a recruitment leaflet, the language capitalising on the current dip in form.

    Lastly, the follow on sentence to ‘winning a trophy’ spoke of holding Arsenal to account. Personally I don’t think the AST should take on that role. Whilst it is democratic and the membership’s views on team performance should be noted, it is dangerous ground. AST / AISA should not be presuming that they are holding AFC to account on team matters since it dilutes the work they do in other areas, e.g. pricing. Once organisations such as those start to get involved in ‘on the pitch’ matters, there is a real danger that they get hijacked by a minority view that gets presented as a majority view.


  52. A sequel eh??! Great news! American Gods is one of the best books i’ve read, and was crying out for a sequel… thanks for that longblackcloud, I’ll add that to my shopping cart for sure. As you can tell, my research has been extensive 😉

    OOU – fair shout about the Liga teams. Both top halves are quite evenly matched, but the bottom half teams would struggle every time against similarly ranked english teams I think. Style of play will be the difference, as the less technically gifted english teams love a bit of the old anti-football, which is much rarer problem to come up against over there. WBA and Blackpool are the exception to that rule obviously.

  53. Please can someone paraphrase the AW conference? Thanks in anticipation.

  54. Haha, LG. It appears YW’s already dealt with this in a far more rigourous way here and on twitter!

  55. Utd are not invicible and not a patch on previous Utd teams that is why so many Gooners are up in arms.Utd will win the title at a stroll because the likes of the Chavs and us simply havent been good enough.If Wenger doesnt face up to that fact thinks will be the same again in 12 months

  56. Limestonegunner

    YW, thanks for linking to the statement. Is this the press release you and Tim Payton had a discussion about? It would be interesting to know more about your discussion (I take it you raised these particular points that you mention) and his responses to those objections.

  57. Hi, TS. This person is a bit naughty and posts Arsenal content – the interview will probably be up there soon enough:


  58. I meant “press conference” of course…

  59. Limestonegunner

    OoU, that doesn’t mean I am not interested in your views, unless you don’t think there is anything to add to YW’s. I don’t follow twitter–how can I read those comments?

  60. I don’t have a twitter account, but you can find pages like that easy enough. Yeah, I’d say YW said it better above.

  61. LG

    I’ll dig out the emails I’ve got and go through them. Our conversation was via Direct Messaging on Twitter which is not on anyone’s timeline.

    So who is on Twitter here?


  62. A feisty Arsene at the press conference today by all accounts. And he will probably get a slating tomorrow in the press and online for it. To whom was he addressing this though,

    Now it is a crucial moment where we have to trust these players and not listen to opinions of people who have not worked half a day in football

    Fight, fight, fight. Wait, no, we’ve done that already. What to do, what to do?

  63. It’s been a bit more of a “drawing mentality” during this unbeaten run… but I will let that be my bit of “doomishness”.

    I just want us to play our best the rest of the season, show some more fire than what he have recently, and if results that aren’t in our hands fall right, all the better.

  64. Limestonegunner

    Tim Payton can speak for himself and clarify further. And I hope he will. I found the tweets, but honestly these issues are too subtle for such short statements. It is obvious that the media is acting as it usually does in giving its own emphasis and framing to the statement. The headlines are all out of proportion with the content of the statement, to my mind.

    After reading the full statement, I am even less convinced that there is too much to criticize, except in your third point. As far as timing, I didn’t see anything in the language that actually suggested the season was over. In fact it goes out of its way to insist in a clear paragraph that reflection and judgment should be happening at the end of the season. I think you are right that it is informing supporters of the AST’s activities in the hope of recruiting members. But the timing of the AGM is coincidental with our dip in form. What this statement does seem to acknowledge is that there is a lot of discussion and controversy taking place and AST is suggesting that it as an organization and its AGM, its membership survey at the end of the season and its annual meeting with Gazidis after the season are good ways of channeling feedback to the club, no matter one’s position. There is a very slight implication of criticism in following the statement about the long trophyless period with the paragraphs about AST’s regular and annual manner of holding the club to account. But it is hard to see where else this statement about our disappointing cup results etc… could be made (at the outset? strikes a very negative tone which might be worse; at the end? emphasizes the negative too much and undermines the idea that real reflection and judgment should be at the end of the season). Perhaps you would like AST not to refer to these disappointments at all. Perhaps, but if AST is communicating to Arsenal supporters at this time in advance of its AGM it would be amazing not to acknowledge this atmosphere of disappointment. One could also just as easily see the statement as more directly cautioning against snap judgments before the season is over.

    Your point about the mission of the AST representing certain issues strikes me as a genuine one of concern and I’d very much like to hear more views, about the proper role of such an organization. There are a lot of groups with differing sorts of access. We know Red Action is also consulted and given some consideration in seating and stadium issues to generate better support at home games etc… In what forum should fan views about on pitch performance be expressed formally and informally? In some ways, YW, I think your position would have been a valuable one to raise with AST regarding their membership survey last year and when its results were announced a few months ago, because many of those questions do deal with on-pitch matters.

    You mentioned that you thought this was a dangerous direction because of how it represents and generalizes fans’ views, but perhaps you could elaborate further on the problem here. Surveys are always based on a partial and selected group, and I am sure Gazidis and co. understand enough about market research and polling to know that a survey of AST’s membership isn’t to be taken as a general account of goonerdom. I am sure they have many other mechanisms as well to try to understand supporter views as well and, on some level, have their own ideas about how important supporter views are and how much to take them into account in making decisions on various different kinds of issues. But it is an important objection you raised since AST does have privileged access to the club execs and board, so I’d be interested in your further thoughts on this.

  65. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    Early 90’s eh? Brian Jonestown Massacre’s Methodrone. The Lilys albums In the Presence of Nothing and A Brief History of Amazing Letdowns. Moose, Swirlies, Drop Nineteens, Pia Fraus (late 90s) are some other shoegaze bands of that era I like. I’m assuming you’re already aware of all the essentials like Slowdive, Ride, Lush etc so I didn’t even bother with those.

  66. Limestonegunner

    I just saw your comment further up, YW, about digging up correspondence. I certainly would appreciate anything more you can reveal about your views and what Tim Payton has further to say about their statement etc…

  67. Limestonegunner

    I should mention that I have thought about becoming a member of AST and of AISA, which is why I am interested in what the AST does and what purposes it ought properly serve.

  68. LG

    Commenting on playing issues will become the dominant perception of how the AST is viewed; it will either be seen as ‘doomer’ or ‘akb’, whatever label people want to give it. In becoming that polarised, the organisation will not attract as many people as it might necessarily and that in itself diminishes the impact they can have. The AST has done well to establish a rapport with the club and to be able to influence the decision makers in a limited way.

    If they become seen as a voice of one aspect of the support, that will by it’s nature become detrimental.


  69. Limestonegunner

    AW was so terrific in the press conference–full of fight, determination and feisty attitude. I hope the team is as fired up as he is! If so, we can look forward to a focused and motivated performance against Blackpool.

  70. Seems to me that in issues that matter RedAction have in their small way made more of an impact than the high blown ideas of the AST which appears to be taking on a life of its own as an organisation. I am not in any way suggesting that RedAction is a very effective organisation either but it has made as big an impression with the decison makers without holding a single share.

    I do not believe that the AST should be voicing opinions about the team, particularly as it claims to represent a large number of ‘fans’ and we know that there are almost as many opinions amongst ‘fans’ as there are ‘fans’. In fact ‘fans’ opinions vary hugely from one day to the next depending upin what happened in the last game.

    ‘Booo hissss down with the AST’, I say. Fucking charlatans

  71. Standing firm behind manager and team when it counts? Not the AST. Ooohhh No.

  72. Russian Circles anyone?

  73. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    I agree, Frank. These what have you done for me lately types can fuck right off.

  74. Any ‘supporters’ organisation that is not putting every effort into getting ‘fans’ to back the team and players with as much energy as possible is an arsehole of an organisation. I give you the Arsenal Supporters Trust.

  75. Alex Ice Cream

    Was AW’s press conference this year, last year, or the year before? It’s the same old excuses time and again. The same old selling us the future rubbish, the same old mental strength rubbish, the same old this team is 2 years old and they have learnt to walk quicker than other babies rubbish.
    AW cannot admit that his team do not have what it takes to win anything and thus nothing will change. Can you imagine what Ferguscum and Moanrinho would make of this.
    Top 4 on a budget is something that few managers can achieve, but unfortunately it’s not enough. Ultimately you are judged on trophies and we have failed horribly in this regard. This team can’t win and Wenger is unable to make this team into winners. What AW is saying is just deflecting attention from the fact that this squad is not good enough. He is shifting the goalposts by saying “what they have achieved is amazing”. Against Barca, yes despite the loss but what is amazing about losing to Brum and a ManU reserve side and then failing to beat Sland, WBA, and Blackburn whist scoring the grand total of 1 goal?
    The team can’t produce it when it matters i.e at this stage of the season. They are bottlers, they can’t take the pressure. Instead of keeping quiet and getting rid of the dross in the summer AW comes out like he always does to make yet more excuses. He’ll then do little in the summer, stick with the same losers and say that Vermaelen is like a new signing.

    More and more denial will equal more and more failure.

  76. absolutely Frank!

    There is no reason for them to come out with this nonsense now. The team is already under a lot of pressure, support is what they need not another critic.

    I think they are full of themselves.

  77. Alex Ice Cream

    AST are dead right.

  78. Is it me or did we score 2 goals against WBA? just asking.

    Not good enough but atleast talk the truth.

  79. being right or wrong is not the problem but in being selfish we always focus on what we dont like.

    If you dont want to support the team until the end of the season that is your business, but you offer the team nothing, you are of ho use at all to helping the team to pick themselves up and get it right.

    All in all, these rants are a waste of time.

  80. Limestonegunner

    I certainly don’t think it would have gone amiss for AST to encourage support to act like it for the remaining games of the season in their statement either.

    I am glad more of our games are away–we have the best away form in the league, and with a win on Sunday our home support will rouse itself for Liverpool. Maybe just maybe with a good run the home support would be strong for the ManU game and the Villa game.

  81. AST is just a modern form of freemasonry

  82. Limestonegunner

    AIC, you are completely missing the point of AW’s press conference. He didn’t offer excuses–he said he wants the team to be judged on the pitch and that the season isn’t over. Nowhere did he say, as the headlines are saying, that he said 2nd is a success. He said doing your best at the top level is success in any walk of life and that you have to accept the results of the competition.

    He acknowledges the disappointments but why shouldn’t he be defending his players now while they are still competing for top honors? It would be stupid to say what you seem to want him to say. For what? He is fighting to the end–let’s hope the players will do the same. We should admire that he is ready to do whatever he can despite these disappointments. We’ll see on Sunday if the team is motivated, but I can’t imagine any of the players being motivated by your words. It seems like you can’t take the pressure.

  83. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    AIC has been dooming around here ever since Ive been reading this site which is like 3-4 years, LG. It’s just what he does, he’s a curmudgeon. And you’ll never see him or his type like Joe after victories or when we’re doing well. Fair weathered bastards.

  84. Thats it Limest0ne!

  85. In other news, Gary Neville has been signed on by Sky begining 2011/12 season..

  86. like i said,this is football,do your talking on the pitch, no amount of vintage arsene pre/post match sparring would do us any good.

  87. Limestonegunner

    Rahl, I think AW agrees with you. That was a major point of his required meeting with the media.

  88. Happy Friday, everyone!

    NJN, good to see you! Love the new Kurt Vile album – good recommend.

    You’ll find me drinking my way along Upper Street in the sunshine. What an evening!


  89. I guess Arsene shouldve stayed silent.

  90. I hope Arsenal don’t spend the entire match talking on the pitch. There’s football to be played! ZING!

  91. Speaking of talking bollocks…. Nicklas Bendtner… what are you talking about, man?? “we must show the DNA of champions”
    Footballers and DNA… I just don’t know.

  92. Limpar, Rooney did a lot of talking on the pitch and look where that got him!

  93. Limestonegunner

    Paul N, it seems some people would prefer that. Even more than what he said, AW’s attitude and spirit was most encouraging. He is not ready to give up on this season and this team. That is exactly as it should and must be.

  94. It is a glorious evening, LimparAssist, and you will find me sitting by the Thames in one of my favourite pubs.

  95. Limestone:

    Just my opinion but I wish he would of said something like. “We had a poor performance last week. This week we worked our butts off in training and I expect a lot better against blackpool” . Leaving off “or heads are going to roll.’ I know its not his style but may be its time to try a little fire and brimstone.

    The comment you paraphrased “doing your best is success in any walk of life.” is probably not what most fans wanted to hear right now. Many would interpret that as another way of saying “I’m OK with whatever happens as long as we try our hardest”. I would love to hear the manager of my sons church league team say that but not the manager of a professional football team with this much talent in his squad.

  96. I am glad he came out like this and defended the players Limestone, against the the AIC’s of this world.

    No one is saying that the team is performing up to their level but geez, are we going to hang them and this even before they play any of the remaining 8 matches?!

    Good on Wenger, the teams needs to know they have someone who really believes in them. Fact is none of us know what is said apart from the media. I am sure Wenger lets them know how he feels.

  97. We have a team that is being blasted left, right and center and it seems the supporters would like Wenger to join in with everyone else.

    Great words from Wenger to me!

  98. AIC thou art a purveyor of bullshit. United are yet to ultimately claim the trophy, and yet like a man weak of cock, you prematurely label them champions. Grow a pair, weakling!

    The season is not over. The trophy is yet to be claimed and the maths still offer us glory.

    If we do not win the league, then we will in the very least make United fight for that trophy.

  99. Church league team, Bill. Fantastic. Anglicans vs Catholics, Salvation Army vs Christian Scientists, Pentecostal vs Latter Day Saints. Broken legs, prayers of forgiveness, guilt, passion…oh the passion.

  100. Star material, Gadget, no doubt about it.

  101. Bill, your second paragraph is ill thought out. When we try our best we are utterly magnificent. We’ve not lost when we’ve done our best. If we do our best and lose, that’s some foul luck or refereeing robbery, but how could one be angry?

  102. conférencier

    clearly AIC hasn’t worked half a day in football

  103. Well said, MC

  104. Maybe if you updated your religion, Bill, you could make pessimism and whimging mortal sins. I think you should you know. I really do.

  105. Whimging is just moaning about insignificant stuff, a kind of acute form of whinging.

  106. Limestonegunner

    Bill, he said as much about last week’s performance and said it had to improve. He acknowledged it was disappointing. Continuing the religious metaphors, do we want him to get up there and flagellate himself and the players publicly right before the next game? Now he is looking forward to our next match and he is confident and emphasized how much work they have done all season.

    I understand what you mean about his comments on success. Sure, I would have liked him to remind everyone more directly that we still have a chance to win the PL, but what he is responding to is questions about our trophyless period as if it includes this season, which is not the case. We still are playing for the title. Perhaps it sounds like he would be satisfied with 2nd, but I don’t believe that is the case or should be either. I don’t think he believes 2nd is good enough either. But everyone seems to think we are out of it already and he is fighting for his team to give them the best chance to recover and win. As I said above, his attitude and fight is as important an anything, as a sign for me. I hope the players are as motivated as he is and if they play to their ability we believe they have, we will beat ManU and everyone else we face this season. We’ll see if he can get his players to perform as they should in these remaining games. It isn’t going to happen without maintaining some fighting spirit. That’s more important right now than him reassuring us by telling us whatever it is we might want to hear, I think.

  107. I think the point he was making was that the team lacked creativity because the players are deeply dispirited by recent events. Anyone who suffers from depression will understand his point precisely. As would anyone with a shred of empathy.

  108. Im so mad at so any people i cant even write a comment. Arsenal fans need to be the opposite of the media but no, they have to be such awful, complainy people.
    We have shit stirres and racist like Adrain Durham doing the job well enough. HOw about we stop bending over and stand up proud. especially since none of us can put in any effort on that pitch.

  109. Limestonegunner

    Frank, that is what he said in his interview with ATVO. We all hope that they have managed to recover and are, like our manager, feeling up for it.

  110. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    Cheers, LA. Kurt Vile is one of my favorite artists, that Childish Prodigy record is just pure brilliance.

  111. Yes and they should have our full backing. The very least we can do, isn’t it, Limestonegunner?

  112. Limestone:

    There is no right answer to what should be done or said at this point. IMO best to say as little as possible. Coming out and fighting can come across as getting defensive. The statement you paraphrased is ambiguous. I know that many here don’t give a damn what those other fans think but I suspect at this point most fans would respond better to him just admitting that we have stunk up the place recently but we are a better team then that and we have worked our tails off and I expect/demand a helluva lot better this weekend, and left it at that. No room for misinterpretation.

  113. How can any serious fan, supporter or shareholder write about being disappointed with results with 8 games to go in the season, and a fighting chance.

    I’m going to be keeping away from the AST guys. They’re scum. Infuriating scum.

    The attitude I absolutely can not bear these days is people trying to be proved right while the game is still on. Even worse is why they’re so invested in betting against their own side. That’s just perverse.

  114. evening
    AW’s press conference aint going to do him no favours
    hes defo stoked the fires with that one..

    im not sure how to take his comments to be honest..
    how are we supposed to have a winning metality when he doesnt regard trophies as success…if he regards winning as just doing your best even if it means your not good enough then thats the whole problem with the attitude at the club at the minute..
    or he could be just taking the limelight away from his players in the run in and putting it on himself..he’ll get a punding now from all corners for that interview…

  115. JJ, you are putting words into his mouth. Where did he say he doesnt regard trophies?

    He is saying that the mark of true success is to always try your best and see what happens at the end.

    Its obvious to see that he it trying to get us to win things again. Obviously its inmportant.

  116. Limestonegunner

    Absolutely, Frank. It is still all to play for and why wouldn’t we want to give them the best chance we could?

    Bill, he has to answer the questions and he has to support his players because we are still in this fight. Instead of looking backwards he is looking forward to the remaining games. I don’t see his statements as ambiguous in this context.

    JJ, we don’t know whether the team is good enough yet or not because we haven’t come to the end of the season. Let’s remember that simple fact and understand Wenger’s comments in that context.

  117. paul
    have you seen the conference mate?
    im not putting words into his mouth at all…

  118. Limestonegunner

    Ole, AST were talking about the cup competitions which are over. I think folks are making too much of their statement, but Frank has convinced me not to join, since I don’t want to be a freemason. Haven’t we all said how disappointing it was to lose the CC final, to go out to Barca in the CL and ManU in the FA Cup in two weeks? It is disappointing. I can understand that we did quite well generally and that there are a lot of positives but it is really really disappointing–obviously it has been to the players as well, which in some part accounts for our indifferent performances and results recently in the league. Just because the media keep citing their statement doesn’t make it a hatchet job on the team. Just like our manager did not say coming in 2nd is a success in his press conference either.

    Anyway, I don’t want to defend AST’s statement too much because I do think they could have said something about how Arsenal supporters should come together to support the team in our last 8 games as we pursue the league title and reserve our judgments until then.

  119. limestone
    i dont balme wenger for coming out fighting hes taken alot of shit recently from ex players and his own fans and the seasons still got 8 games left..

    but you can understand that the pissed ppl are going to be even more pissed after that..

    to be honest i think he was picking a fight with the media but in hindsight he may feel hes also rubbished his own fans..

  120. i think we can safely assume that utd will be 10 points clear come tomorrow night..
    hughes wont do us no favours expect another team to ‘roll over’ tomorrow..
    6 or 7-0 could be well on the menu..

  121. Limestonegunner

    JJ, perhaps those who are angry will seize upon his words to be angrier still, but I don’t think he meant to rubbish Arsenal supporters any further than his comment after the Blackburn game that he couldn’t be responsible for how others reacted but only for the team. All that says to me is that we are abdicating our responsibilities–I can’t condone booing the team like some people seem to have done after Blackburn. Some of those who are angry are behaving in a really ridiculous manner with the wild statements that Wenger needs to go or attacking the team and demanding a clear out. We are still challenging for the title! Hang on for a few games, everyone! We may think the chances are low, but would we want the players to give up in such circumstances? Let’s hope they are made of sterner stuff…

    We’ll see. The proof is in the pudding. If the players can come out firing and determined like Wenger, we’ll be really happy and we could still recover. The main thing is to respond strongly and start performing well again, with the creative attacking play we are capable of combined with the good defensive discipline we’ve shown recently.

  122. Limestonegunner

    Hughes has a real rivalry with Fergie, sort of an oedipal rivalry–he’s unlike the other ManU players who now coach and always seem to roll over for Fergie. Fulham are terrible away from home, though, and ManU has been reliable at home. So we don’t expect them to drop points, but it isn’t as if Steve Bruce or Sam Allardyce were taking their teams up there.

  123. I am expecting a draw or a loss for United tomorrow.

  124. i agree with what you say limestone
    im a believer in constructive critism but some of the shit you see and hear is OTT..
    some people just want wenger out plain and simple…
    if we go on a winning streak and push utd close then maybe it can be seen as progress…
    it wont be success but a strong end to the season and finishing a close second will have to be seen as progress if nothing else and is definately something to build on for next season…instead of finishing 4th all the time 10 15 points behind every one else..
    victories against utd pool and especially spurs will change the tide as well…

    i still think we need a re jig in the summer though..not just in the team but right thru the club from starting at the top…

  125. i hope your both right..

  126. Having rewatched the goddamn conference again just to see what all the fuss is about, I will straight up proclaim it thus: any one who takes beef at Wenger’s comments on success is one who doesn’t use their goddamn brain.

    He totally defined success in a way which 1) says trophies is what we’re after, and 2) implicitly messes with the media.

  127. Limestonegunner

    Gadget, it seems people are forgetting that he said their goal is to try their absolute best to beat ManU at the end of the season.

  128. Note to self – Get rid of Slysports before the ugly sister starts as a commentator next season.

  129. hes defo messing with the media..
    but the trophies/success thing isnt really clear cut and is down to personal interpretation..
    i think he saying that doing our best to beat manutd is success..which it will be if we beat them wont it..
    but in the same comment theres also a hint of if we dont beat utd and come second its also success..which it isnt..
    in typical wenger v the media way its as clear as mud ….
    but after 6 years the fans dont want clear as mud…or spin as ppl call it..
    they want results and not excuses…which is how i feel it will be mostly interpreted…

  130. Ateeb- the band you posted above Russian Circles is good stuff, really.
    onto the arsenal. I’ve yet to watch the interview, but i believe Arsene is strong enough to (make/stand up) for his own beliefs. From the few interviews i’ve watched Arsene is willing to have a go at the reporters, whether very obvious or hidden within one of his statements. In other news, please, let us all continue arguing whether we have this magical thing. Sometimes it goes by the name “winning mentality” other times it costs 25 million pounds. Simultaneously, far off in space, Arsenal have 7 odd games left and have a chance of bringing the glory back to its rightful hands. we CAN win, it is not set in stone…..

  131. Just smash the opposition tomorrow.

    All the rest will follow.

  132. Limestonegunner

    Alas, Cbob, we have to wait until Sunday. But yes, that first step will be important.

  133. some smashing would also help to settle the nerves.

  134. “I want this club to win every single game, when we don’t, I’m down.”

    “What is success?… It is to do the maximum with the talent you have and to your potential.”

    Given Wenger’s prior sentiment about the team, it’s clear as air what he thinks is our potential, and therefore, what he thinks is success.

    However, he is also pragmatic. He knows at this stage, for us to achieve his success, we’ll need Man U to drop point. His ‘if’ about Man U is an admission of this. If they finish above us, he expects the team to make them work for it by winning our remaining games, which surely must be true of all.

    We win the league, I suspect Wenger may privately say we’ve only been 1/4 successful.

  135. I would love to meet AIC.

  136. a rvp hatrick would be nice..
    and a goal for nasri and chamak as well..
    blackpool will play their normal game i can see plenty of goals in this one..
    thats if were not flat..

  137. Me, I’m actually quite pleased with Wengers statements today. Of course Arsene has to defend the boys. They are his team, he practically hand picked each one of them, so how would it look if he starts to lambast them in public? Like Limestone, I hope the boys rewards his faith in them by showing the same defiant fighting attitude on the pitch.
    Re the ‘2nd as success’ thing; everyone knows that trophies are the real sign of success, and should not need AW to point that out. If we do come second, of course he’s going to try and spin it like that is ‘success’ too. Its his job to point out the positives in situations like that, at least publicly. Every manager in the world would do exactly the same thing.

    I can understand that some fans may not be happy but frankly, his job isn’t about making the fans happy right now, but about giving his team a fighting chance. If the team starts winning again, the fans mood will improve. Thats the way sports works.

  138. Yes, sorry Limestone. I’ve been away.

    What would you do if you met hime steww?

  139. ..or even him?

  140. Limestonegunner

    Welcome back, Cbob.
    Well said, Henristic. His focus has to be what he thinks will help the team perform on Saturday. If he doesn’t think criticizing them in public will be good, that’s his decision right now and we’ll see how it works Sunday. I hope the players realize AW is yet again willing to defend them and take the pressure on himself and do everything to repay that trust and sacrifice by playing well and winning big for their manager. I am sure they want to. They need to be confident and let their creative abilities come to the fore.

  141. good comment henristic

  142. Limestonegunner

    Oops, I mean Sunday, myself!

  143. I have no doubt that Wenger wants to win all trophies no matter what.

    I am going to rewatch the first match against Blackpool. Its on espn3 for anyone who can get it.

  144. thanks Paul N im gunna give that one a look

  145. also i did not know you could re watch all of these games! if any of you want to watch some free footy action online? espn3.com is free and has tons of matches from this season all free to stream. pretty sweet deal.

  146. not all William, I wish. They have La Liga games and international matches mostly. Surprisingly very few EPL matches.

  147. With 8 games to go we would be crazy to assume our title bid is over. So much can happen and it most often the unusual happens in the run-in so man up everybody and support our team, in May IF we haven’t done it then we can moan, until then we must keep the faith!

  148. Russian Circles is nice, I should check their new album out.

    RvP interview: http://player.omroep.nl/?aflID=12354800
    It’s in Dutch, but 90% of communication is body language anyway…

  149. haha Paul i got too excited. turns out most of the games are internal national matches and also like you stated, a very few epl games.
    Although i watched a lot of the game and we looked incredibly sharp. plus i learned that vermaelen still exists and alex song once had huge corn rows. Chamakh was the front man and we were dangerous down the left and right flanks. lots of nice one two’s with pace, and quality one touch passes.

  150. i’m talking aboot the game vs blackburn as well.

  151. woops. *blackpool

  152. We’ve had it, thanks to that clown Wenger’s bad signings. Once more AW shows his theories and working as an economist rather than a coach has ruined our chances

    He’s gotta go this time

  153. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    What a load of rubbish, Bill. You need to stop speaking for most fans. That may be your opinion, but to think you know what most fans think is ridiculous.

  154. Really enjoyed Arsenes Press conference. Its so refreshing to have perspective at the top and not a bunch of dollar slinging Boneheads. If our Season is a disaster then what is Man City’s (Europa league faliure), Chelsea, and the inevitability of Tottenhams season. We’ve missed an opportunity to grab it but if we need to talk of disasters and failures we can go all the way up and down the league and put cheque books next to the league positions. It might make a lot of people look a little stupid. For me Arsene brings something to the palette that the Burger and chips brigade are not yet ready to digest. It gives them verbal diarrhea. They are all clutching for the ketchup.

  155. How can anyone possibly argue against this from Arsene?

    “”I’m against superficial judgment, that’s what I fight against,” said the manager.

    “For example people ask ‘why don’t you buy central defenders?’. We have a better defence than Man United if you look at the numbers, but nobody mentions that. And should we kick Vermaelen, Djourou and Szczesny out? What for?

    “We’ve done well for our age as we’re second in the league. Is that a disaster for you? There are teams who invest ten times more than us, one player cost more than the whole team and they’re behind us. I don’t understand the way people think.

    “Do you judge this season or the last four seasons? Some of the clubs behind us have done nothing for 20 years, yet suddenly they get a lot of praise. I don’t understand.

    “We have eight games to go and are in a position to fight for the championship so let’s give the maximum. If we’re disappointed at the end then OK. Why do you say it’s a disaster when we’re second in the league? Do the 18 clubs behind us have a fantastic disaster?”


  156. amband seems a good name for a clown. Have you got your coaching badges so you can take over when Wenger leaves?

  157. ML, I saw you were fighting the good fight on twitter. Some real morons on there.

  158. if you think top four is a foregone conclusion, I suggest you look at the table, the fixture list and think again…

    you never know, you may like it 😆

  159. dupsffokcuf,

    I just do not understand why so many people think the world is caving in. If Arsene was called Harry and he managed another team. Imagine the mess that would regularly build up in the journos trousers.

    You gotta hand it to the press though, they are really doing a good job of making a great man look bad.

  160. Listen, Buster! My 88 year old mother could coach better than Wenger. Wenger couldn’t coach a choko vine over an outhouse.

    He has continually fallen over at the business end of the season

  161. here’s one of Arsene’s scouts looking for talent. A quck ad and away we go

  162. Sounds like your Grand mother was a man….which begs the question where on earth did you come from???

  163. Sorry even worse. you said mother! Its the 88 that confused me.

  164. Limestonegunner

    Mean Lean, I wish there was video for those quotes, but it wasn’t in the video on ATVO of the press conference.

  165. Just another thick troll.

  166. now now. No need to be confused

  167. A troll. because I disagree with AW’s methods! Sorry. I didn’t know this was the AW fan club.

    Do you pay his rent, “dumkopf”

  168. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    Nice post, Remonstrate. Perspective is essential.

  169. CBob – competition across the border!


  170. Personally I am very pleased with Wenger’s latest offering.

    The media, as usual, have pulled a typical playground move saying to the “fans”: “look, see what he says about you, he’s telling you all he hates you and doesn’t give a shit what you say”.

    In reality he’s saying TO THE MEDIA: “you are all thick arseholes and wouldn’t recognise success or talent if it jumped up and bit you on the nose”.

    If SOME fans find it seems to be aimed directly at them, then perhaps they need to take a long, hard look at themselves in the mirror and question whether those truly are “their own opinions”, or whether the media is leading them by the nose.

    Personally I do think that we as fans/supporters have contributed a rather large chunk to the attitude or mentality of the squad (not in a positive way).

    I like what Wenger said for several reasons:

    1. It shows he is deeply angry, and there’s still that passionate fight burning within him.

    2. He’s told the media to go and “do one” – I’d love him to “pull a Kinnear”, but that’s a bit like expecting a new Ferrari for christmas.

    3. He’s laid out the chart of progress, and re-iterated the quality of our squad – and explained WHY it is progress and quantified WHY the squad is good – pure logic – though I’m sure it will escape many.

    4. Along with the virtual media blackout this week, I suspect he’s instilled a sense of “us against the world” mentality in the team this week, which imo is exactly what we need to motivate and kickstart the run in.

    All I want to see is the lads giving everything for the rest of the season.

    I’d love it if we win the title, but what is far more important to me is to see our lads giving their all, win or lose.

    (and I don’t mean “giving their all” in the same way the UK media mean it).

  171. Pirates, MD!

    They come across as charlatans. No real depth to their inderstanding of pasties and their history – they don’t even mention my mother, God rest her soul. As for the Cornwall thing, well!

    Better step up the marketing drive.

  172. is it a cardinal sin for a fan to disagree with wenger’s approach? U guys think if wenger leaves the club or gets d sack Arsenal FC as we know it will cease to exist?
    Look around u,the teams that have won d P.league recently or d champions league do not have a wenger at d helm. When I say a wenger,I mean an arrogant man who refuses to take criticism,has disregard for d fans,always thinks he’s right, cannot inspire his team,cannot adapt to changes in d course of d game, shows stubborn faith in poor players(denilson,almunia,bedtner(?)), refuses to sign/mix in experienced &quality players,lacks winning mentality, prefers football economics to a trophy, bleats about “ze mental strength” for years which we never see,can accept to be 2nd for d next 20 yrs,has faith in a team that perenially choke on decisive games!
    Arsene is/was a good manager but so is davide boas,pelligrini,rijkaard,stoikovitch,van basten,d former russia &chelsea manager(I forget his name) & plenty more.. We should support Arsenal FC not Arsene FC!

  173. Cornish Massala! Eugh.

  174. P9ja,

    It isn’t a crime to disagree with Wenger..we merely choose to trust his judgement over those who “haven’t worked half a day in football”

  175. I’ve let pharo9ja’s post through. I wasn’t going to but it proves why Arsene dismisses supporters.

  176. hopefully the guns will turn things around this time.
    just started a blog about arsenal, read and enjoy. 🙂


  177. hopefully we can all still hope that there is still hope.

  178. yogi u weren’t going to let me post? Is it because I have a different opinion? See guys, we have one thing in common(atleast I hope we do) which is the support of the mighty Arsenal. My support for the club is for life…any other employee of the club has to earn my support.
    Wenger recently is leaving a bad taste in my mouth,.he has to change his tactics/approach or leave honourably or the growing decent will force him out. When asked who he’d like to see win the champions league fernando torres said “wenger, because his teams play some of the best football,and he’s a purist”. I want us to win trophys with him in charge I seriously do but he has to want it too. He knws the immediate problems & the dissatisfaction we feel, but like some of the brainwashed,he feels he knows best. He has refused to purchase wisely while our reputation as a big club suffers as a result. I do not & will not accept to be 2nd, 3rd or 4th when I can put a little more effort to come 1st! Only winners are remembered. what wld u lot do if supported the mancscum or barca-start a fergie or pep religion? I ask this bcos the followership wenger enjoys wld make u think we have been winning the treble since 2005..

  179. Nope, you were in moderation for poor behaviour last time around…

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