The Hope Of Improvement & Ridiculous Public Speaking

Arsene spoke yesterday of his belief that the squad will compete for the title in the coming season, in spite of the massive investment once more by Manchester City. Whilst their spending is a relief for the transfer-based media at this time of the year, consistently signing significant numbers of players makes it hard for them to build a cohesive team, understandings taking time to be built. They should not be dismissed as challengers on that basis because football is a strange beast at times and perhaps Mancini has been astute in his purchases.

Wenger gave no indication of any imminent activity although rumours abound that Mertesacker or Tasci will be joining Arsenal within the next week, depending on which source you choose to believe. The manager observed that the coming campaign will be difficult but was upbeat in his assessment of the squad’s chances:

I am very confident [we’ll do better than last season]. We know in England that the Premier League is the biggest league in the world and everybody invests a lot of money. We invest in our work, in our beliefs, in the quality of our behaviour and I am confident that will pay off.

We finished third last year and we hope we can improve on that. But the race will be tough.

It is standard fayre from Arsene; his belief in his players publicly is unstinting, rarely criticising any deficiencies, real or perceived. The hard work which the players put in brings about improvements in their own abilities and with another season of experience behind them – good and bad – the collective must surely benefit.

Wiser heads in match situations is crucial, choosing the correct defensive clearance to picking the right pass through to shooting options. Confidence is key to using this knowledge effectively. A good start to a match or the season will build momentum for the squad, building solid foundations upon which to mount a title challenge.

Whilst the squad could do with strengthening, there is an air of negativity surrounding them. Although this has been based on last season, some of it is entrenched, irrational hatred of a player such as Denilson, for example, is baffling. His performances suffered through injury to himself and others; he is however chastised more severely for his mistakes than others, more experienced players in some cases, make. Some rely on statistics to prove their case, others rely on their jaundiced sight to decry ability.

Time for the first kick-off in anger is approaching and there is the hope of strengthening still to come. I think that is needed, particularly at centre back where the depth is not as many as it could be. If Arsene is to make one more signing, it would be there; a good, solid partnership in the middle breeds confidence throughout the side and helps to minimise the number of chances presented to the opposition. Goalkeepers everywhere have their flaws but put a wall in front of them and they are not so exposed.

Cesc-mania came to the fore yesterday with comments attributed to a Spanish magazine interview. The publication in question is for a chain of fitness clubs in Catalunya and has carried interviews with sports personalities so should not be cast aside. Yet there is no indication when the interview took place and the context in which the words were spoken. We all know that leading questions are asked and I am perplexed as to why the words of the captain are being jumped on so intensely. They, after all, contained nothing new; his love of Barcelona as a city and club is well-documented.

A significant contributing factor is his silence, a situation which will last a day or two more. The Emirates Cup this weekend is in all likelihood going to be the first opportunity for the English-based media to get him in front of a microphone and to ask for his views on his future. It should be expected that he will stonewall such an interrogation, it would be unlikely that he would state his position of wanting a move unless he has formally requested one. That would be common knowledge beforehand with Arsenal wanting to try to control such an event through press releases and interviews.

Posted on July 30, 2010, in Arsenal, Football, Premier League, Premiership, Soccer, Transfer Gossip and tagged , , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 402 Comments.

  1. ineresting read as always thought you might wait for wengers press conference. you think cesc will be the player with him? no fucking way

  2. Nice post Jogi.

  3. first 🙂

  4. haha… i thought i was in with a shout… dem met!!!

  5. RSD

    Not today. Tomorrow or Sunday, possibly. Monday? Definitely, if for no other reason than to put the speculation to bed before the season starts.



    Amazing, he ws really highly regarded a few seasons ago.

  7. Also I wish puyol would shut his mouth.

  8. YW you still think the speculation will be put to bed? I dont think it will as there is still a strong chance he will go!!

  9. Morning all, thanks Yogi.

    I dont know what all the fuss is about. Once we sign a quality CB to partner TV – which i am more confident than most about, we’ll be in a stronger position (personel-wise) than we were last year. Losing Gallas is a big blow imo as whatever anyone thinks about his personality, he’s world class. But there are suitable, fresh replacements out there and i’m sure Le Prof is doing the necessary ground work.

    The whole Cesc thing – again, everyone needs to calm down – ignoring that neanderthal twat and all his little minions. He’s said nothing we didn’t know already, he’s reiterated how important Arsenal and Wenger is to him. And let’s face it, he’s not the kind of guy that wouldn’t give 100% for us – even if it is his last season…

    I’m itching to see us nail the scousers to kick start our title charge. COYG!!

  10. sorry it takes me ages to write a post on the sly at work so i’m re-posting this…

    goonerandy, deni is good enough to play that role for song don’t worry your pretty head. What is it that you see in Frimp that your don’t see in deni? I imagine it’s just because he’s large, there are many many defensive midfielders that are not big and bulky, however you do tend to find that slighter players have more skill with the ball and passing ability. Obviously there are exceptions. But would you rather have a destroyer or somebody who can do as an effective job but contribute in attacking moves.

    I admit as a spectacle it’s nice to see a vieira run back and brush somebody off a ball as if he was a fly but unless we can get another one of those players of which I would say in his prime vieira was in the top 3 dm’s I have ever seen. But would you not like to watch Arsenal cutting passes out with the likes of deni and clichy and nasri and rosicky then instantly turning defence to attack with a carving pass? That to me is a great thing to see. Something Wenger is working toward. It’s forwards thinking and a move away from tough tackling mouthbreathing leg breakers that need someone next to them who can pass.

    Sorry YW now to read your post mate.

  11. Marcus

    I am not as convinced as before. I suspected that he would put a transfer request in but I don’t think he will now.


  12. goonerandy are you jon-jon in disguise? The same boring, repetitive obsessions. The same psuedo logic that provides irrational absurdities e.g. we don’t need to spend like Man City because we have a youth system but we need to make three big purchases. Duh! The same tenuous grip on reality. The same over-inflated ego that sees itself as superior to AW and his scouts.
    Maybe you should do like our boy j-j and start your own blog and spend most of the time arguing with yourself. You are wearing out your welcome.

  13. I agree. I don’t think all the speculation will affect his performnces. It seems pretty clear he has told some of the Spanish players that we would rather be at Barca, but they are doing him no favours constantly speaking to the press about it.

    Hopefully we will have a sucessful season and he will decide that the Arsenal is the place to be for another few season to pick up more silverware.

  14. Very good post Yogi,

    One part realy stood out for me, the call for “Wiser Heads” on match days, not new players but a different frame of mind. Depending on how you look at this football is a seris of either opportunities taken or ones missed.

    Moreso than ever, last season was haunting for the amount of moments that might have been.

    Van persie through at Old Trafford only to be denied making it 2-0 by Fosters toe.

    Arshavin deciding to shoot instead of pass at 0-0 against united at the Emirates when Fabregas and Nasri were both in positions to score in acres of space.

    Eduardo nervely scuffing a chance against Chelsea he would have normaly buried and made it 1-0 at the Emirates.

    Young Ramsey getting in the way of Rosicky to make it 1-0 at Villa park.

    The over commitment of players in attack at Man City and in general (possibly due to adjusting to the 4-3-3.)

    The momentary lapse of concentration responsible for the 2 goals we concededed against Barca.

    Diaby not seeing Walcott to surley make it 2-0 at the Poo Camp.

    I’m not at all berating out players with this list, mereley trying to highlight how different things might have been if the right mindset were there at the key moments.

    Had everything on that list gone contrary we may well have won the double. That should highlight how close we are to something special.

    As far as I’m concerned we are far stronger in personel this coming season, both in terms on signings and development of current players.

    If the right mental attitude can be adopted by our players then it’s ours to lose.

  15. Shotta – Lucky I don’t need a welcome then eh? Who said anything about “big signings”? You are puting words in my mouth in an attempt to justify your point.

    It is not irrational to point our we are short in both number and quality in the CB position, and that our keepers ship too many goals down to individual errors. Would you disagree with that?

  16. Wenger is on the case, what is all the fuss about?

    He will certainly sign new player(s) before the end of the window. No doubt at all.

  17. I think so as well.

  18. I felt completely italicised yesterday. Nobody would even talk to me in straight up normal text.

    Oh, I tire of these endless charades around player purchases and ‘what went wrong last season/s’ (and if you landed from another planet, assuming something tragic happened); all taken out of context (Arsenal’s strategic development, stadium, finance, sustainability, academy, style, football method, and sheer guts of it all; but I’ll not worry anyone with details, if you don’t know find out) it makes Arsenal sound like any other team, such a miserly result given our rich culture.

    Ole G was in superb form, hell I thought he would get his hatrick after skewering sprectum.

    Can’t we have a discussion? At least Bill, great purveyor of defensive sensibility has context to his non-stop repeater points.

    And some humour, paaa… lease, without which ACLF is not ACLF, it’s AFCL or FLAC. It’s Friday. Life is good. Arsenal are great. The adventure we are all on with Arsenal, even the dullards, is just incredible. We are lucky to be living it.

  19. I really hope you are right, putting in a transfer request now would probably be the worst thing he could do. Leaving it so late in the transfer window.

    I was really optimistic about this season with a Goalkeeper and a CB. Without those two positions improved I am slightly concerned considering Man C and Trottenham will be stronger this season for sure. It is certainly going to be one of the most competitive seasons for years. Which can only be a good thing for the sport.

    If we compete for the title this year I think we should be genuinely proud of what the club has acheived over the last 5 years considering the stadium move and the lack of debt within the club!

  20. On the topic of ‘big signings’, TV was one of, if not the, best signing of the season. Would anyone complain if Wenger brought in someone of a similar ilk..? I don’t recall him (orAA for that matter) setting us on the road to fiscal ruin….

  21. Well said Shotta. Poor old doomerandy and his peanut sized brain.

  22. Supercod – Exactly right. A few signings of that stature would be perfect, and financially viable.

  23. “The same psuedo logic that provides irrational absurdities e.g. we don’t need to spend like Man City because we have a youth system but we need to make three big purchases”

    Well we can make 3 ‘needed’ signings as the players in the youth system arent quite ready just yet without spending 100 million a la citae. How is than an irrational absurdity?

    We need a keeper as our current no1 aint good enough but our youngsters look like they could be. Surely Wenger and his scouts can find a keeper? they did a cracking job in Mad Jens when we needed to replace Dave.

    We need another centrehalf as we lost 4 senior ones and got 1 in (for 8.5 mil was it in Kos) Surely Wenger and his scouts can find these (1 down?)? they did a cracking job in Verm when we needed to replace Kolo.

    We need a DM – we have 2 teenagers who may step up in a couple of years but not quite ready now –

  24. haha! nice one ZimPaul – you got the right idea

  25. Yes he will sign Schwarzer and a 15 year old from Zambia.That will really make Cesc want to stay

  26. Not answered my reply though has he? Maybe because it is fairly accurate.

  27. DeiseGooner – Good points right on the money. But you can’t say that around here. To some people that makes not “NOT a PWOpeR FAN Innit”.

  28. shotta,

    You really nailed it. I laugh when I hear them say, “we’re not asking for expensive signings”. Well if you’re not, and you presumably want quality signings, that means the club would always move slowly in the transfer market, and do things carefully and correctly. Precisely because we can’t afford to make expensive mistakes like Berbatov, Ibra, Shevchenko, and the like. We can’t even afford cheap mistakes.

    Why can’t fans be adults and accept that the manager wants to have a strong squad, and will do what he can to get the players he needs within the real life constraints he faces?

  29. Good walk Steww..?

  30. YW, fast forward to the start of the season! Just delete the next 15 of so days, and bring us all to August 14/15. Like a mass hypnosis kind of thing.

  31. Denilson is quality, if only a very very good squad player at this moment. At his age, to have got the games for Arsenal under his belt will only be of huge benefit to the guy. Maybe not everyones cup of tea, but Gilberto had the same problem. Never truly recognised for what his role actually gave the side. He will again shut up a very stupid crowd of ‘critics’ who only seem to open their mouths when they have something negative to say. He was one of our star performers the year before last, I guess many have forgotten that.

  32. YW.

    It would be professional suicide for Cesc to hand in a transfer request. The truth is that he’s being bullied by Barca players and the Barca hierarchy to risk all the goodwill he has earned at Arsenal because Barca have realised that their crass under-hand tactics don’t work any more.

    It’s their last roll of the dice. They’ve hung him out to dry and have been shocked by Arsenal’s resolve to keep Fabregas. Besides, Barca can’t afford paying player wages, let alone Arsenal’s valuation of Cesc.

    ELS….thanks for your suggestion of a debate. I’m not writing until next week but will tackle the topic for sure.

  33. What you guys thinking about Kolchieny? I’ve only seen a little bit of him so far and wasn’t convinced that he could handle it against the Drogbas of this world, seemed a bit slight… Having seen more of him, has anyone gained more confidence in him than i have?

    Don’t get me wrong, i’m not writing the new boy off after just seeing half a match and some highlights, but i do have some reservations…

  34. Ole

    We live in a society of extremes. We’ve either got to be buyi…. I mean winning everything or be…..Leeds United.

  35. @YW dont think the cesc story will ever go to bed till he leaves.
    being this year or in 2015 on a bosman.

    but least we can all laugh at barca trying pathetic

    #Fuckyoubarca #arsenal RT @darylbooth:
    Oh and scroll down for the `Arry story underneath chaps/chapesses

  36. I genuinely hope he does turn out to be quality, I really do. He has lots of things going for him, and I do think if he had been brought into a more experienced side he would have developed faster.

    Where my opinion of him comes frmo his his mental attitude; him giving up whilst trakcing back (a few times last year), and the amazing incident where he just fell over presenting the ball to an Everton player. At least fall on the ball to stop play.

  37. goonerandy and supercod

    Vermaelen was not regarded as a big transfer, at the time of the transfer I think you were both as oblivious as the rest of us in his abilities. The only one that knew was Wenger. The difference is real fans had the faith that he would be a quality player, and not listen to the bullshit the media came up with about his height.

    What will you say next season when Kosc comes good and proves to be a very good CB? Will you again ask for more Quality signings but slate the manager when you haven’t heard of the next guy that comes in..

    You very much both conmtradicted yourselves quite stupidly

  38. The most annoying meme going round is that we lost 4 centre backs so we need 2 more.

    Seriously, what’s the problem with the doomer mind? I can’t remember how many times the likes opf Bill and company insisted we started last season with just 3 centre backs. Arseblog was also pushing this meme. So, we started with three, lost 4, and now still have 3. Doomer algebra for you.

  39. Doomer thinking always needs ignoring clear fact. Notice how DeiseGooner claims
    “we have 2 teenagers who may step up in a couple of years but not quite ready now -”

    No. We have Song, Denilson, Diaby and three teenagers who can fill in there. Diaby is not a holding midfielder, but he’s been deployed there, and quite a few times last season.

  40. Geo – To early to tell I suppose. He looks comfortable on the ball, and seems to read the game well though. He does look a bit slight, but the fitness team will be able to bulk him up. Arsene must see something in him to shell out that amount of cash for a him though.

  41. goonerandy

    I think he was in agony against Everton for the split second it took for them to take the ball off him. Not realy fair to characterize him on that now is it?

    Wouldn’t you rather characterize him on what he did against Everton on the first day of the season?

  42. Great post, also looking at the line up of postees hopefully we may get some decent convo going here today.

    Darius, no rush mate 🙂 though it would be nice but I wont teach you to suck eggs mate.

  43. Nice one andy…

    picking out a few incidents over a whole season to mock one of our players. TRUE SUPPORTER

    You say he gives up when tracking back, go look at the stats to see who does the most milage in this team. You speak a load of shit, think before you speak

  44. Man, it would make my day if Arsene signed some puny-looking, glasses-wearing, intellectual unknown Zambian as Gallas replacement, and said “Voila, I give you our new defender”.

    It’s almost worth it just to read the comments.

    And Hark, you think Zambians don’t play football! You ignoramous you. On which point, it seems to me that Kenya will rise in the next few years to become a ‘Senegal’. Iwonder Ken Gunner thinks.

  45. doomerandy only remembers the negative on the players he aint fond of

  46. SuperCod – Wenger will say he has brought in someone of similar ilk (to TV5) – Kocseinly or however it’s spelt – you know who I mean.

    I still think Swartzer will come + one defender, but I can’t see it being a 10m+ signing. Wenger usually makes ‘big’ signings well before pre-season.

  47. Chris – Did you even read my post properly? Nowhere was I sceptical about TV5, not am I about our new centre back. If Wenger buys a player I have not heard off, I could not care less as I trust our manager to make good purchases.

    Where is the contradiction?

    I am not asknig for “big transfers”. The only people that keep mentioning them are the ones on here bickering with me. We are short on numbers and quality at CB. Hopefully Arsene will address this.

  48. els

    I am hoping so also, the convo early yesterday was shocking, where have these disgraceful fans all come from!

    Glad Ole put a few in place!

  49. Darius,

    Barcelona are skint, and they don’t have the money to buy Fabregas at the going rate. The entire saga is about getting him at below value, not least because they will be laughing stock for paying top dollar for a player from their own academy.

    So they want to turn it into a moral issue. Unfortunately for them, they’ve acted like thorough cunts and have no moral leg to stand on.

  50. u aint painting yourself with glory andy by taking little pot shots at certain players,

  51. Chris – Where did I mock a player? Making stuff up again to prove your point I think.

    I questioned his mental attitude. On the “falling down incident”. Would the likes of PV4/Keown/DB10/Adams done that? No, becasue they were winners. Pain or not, they would have put the ball in row Z then recieved treatment. The full play was ahead of him, and he just fell over.

    It was unprofessional, and if I remember rightly Wenger said aftwerwards (with a smirk) that he would have a word with him.

  52. Gooner Andy, we are NOT SHORT on numbers. Not in the least.

    I challenge you to present a reasonable argument for how we’re short on numbers.

    I’m eagerly awaiting your analysis.

  53. fu*k barca

    They should have no time on this comment section today. Lets forget they exist until we meet them in Champs League, then we will see how they fair against a full strength flying Arsenal XI

  54. goonerandy

    Vieira was the one who gave the ball away in the FA Cup Final when Giggs ran the length and scored baring his hairy chest.

    You choose to remember certain incidents to mock players you aint fond of. You proved it once again.

  55. LOL Zim Paul.

    BTW, I thought Zambia really suffered as a generation of footballers were all killed in that tragic plane crash – still wonder to this moment whether better transport arrangements could have been used.

    That Zambian team were giving a real good account of themselves.

    Speaking of Kenyans and East Africans, there was a debate during the world cup as to why West Africa produces more talent than the rest of Africa. To date, only Malcolm Mariga from Kenya has been at a top flight club, and he only ended up at Inter Milan after he was refused a work permit to play for Man City. There was a Ugandan player who played for West Ham a couple of seasons ago but his name escapes me.

    I think there will also be more of an influx of Egyptian and north African players after their show in both the ACN and the world cup.

  56. Ole –

    Lets just say TV gets an injury, say for a couple of months. This is who we have to choose from:

    Konciesky (totally unproven, hopefully will be good)

    Djourou ( I like him, but always injured)


    Song (good CB, but leaves us short at DM)

    New CB (Hopefully ready for 1st team action)

    Does that fill you will confidence? And that is only one injury.

  57. Always the same with the doomers. Just can’t accept facts, spin the truth to fit their view of the world and always talking about those ominous “one or two players extra” needed so we can win every cup year in year out. Wake up, guys. That is not how football works.

    I am happy that Arsene is prudent when it comes to transfers. It is better to keep an eye on the player you want for two or more years than to shell out 30 million and get a player of Berbatovs quality. Is that what you doomers want? Wenger to splash the cash on a player, any player, that fills one of the voids you see, just for him to turn out to be of Berbatov’s calibre?

  58. Have we lost 4 centrehalves?
    How many is currently in the first team squad?
    How is it hard to understand that we are weaker in defense?

    Diaby is not a holding midfielder, but he’s been deployed there, and quite a few times last season. = thats exactly my point – he isnt a holding player – hes a aquare peg for a round hole – therefore we have 1 holding player and a few who can ‘fill in’ jesus h christ whats so bad about wanting a round peg?

  59. @goonerandy
    Now just imagine Terry gets an injury for a couple of months for Chelsea….

  60. EvilFiek,

    We’re always 1 or 2 players away. It’s always the players we dont have that will win us the league.

    The truth of the matter is that they want Arsenal to change transfer policy to be more like other clubs. For good or for ill, that’s what they want.

  61. No, we have Song (1), Denilson (2), Frimpong (3) and Eastmond (4). 4 holding midfielders and a player who can fill in there in the worst case scenario.
    We got 4 round pegs, why buy a fifth one for an ominous sum of money?

  62. Chris – ???? I think we can cut Paddy a bit of slack no? But I don’t see that that relates to my point about Denilson’s mental attitude.

    What it does point to is you making wierd arguments which are a bit random.

  63. I think the problems some “fans/supporters” have in comprehending the true nature of the workings of a football club need to be blamed on the likes of Chelsea and ManCity. Some fans on here obviously cannot draw a line between realistic goals and fantasy.
    I for one cannot blame people who have just started watching football over the past 5-10 years to have realistic expectations from the club they support, seeing how chelsea and man city are attempting to buy teams rather than build them. They are attempting to completely eliminate the natural cycle of blooding young players when the old ones are past it, and by doing so they have artificially closed the gap between them and teams such as hours, who have spent years of blood, sweat and passion to be where we are.
    People need to realize that what Wenger is attempting to do here is quite simply stay within the bounds of reality, common sense and uncompromising ideals, that are already bearing fruit with our fantastic new stadium, a revolutionary footballing philosophy (atleast in England) and a crop of young players that we should be proud of.
    Take pride in the fact that we are doing things the way they should be done, be grateful that we have AW to guide us to glory.

  64. Deise

    What do you do with that round peg that can’t get 1st team action then leaves…

    cough… Diarra… Flamini….

    I think Wenger has learnt from situations gone by, about time you start too dont you think?

  65. Evil – Yup, Terry gets injured. they have Carvalho and Alex who could both be considered as 1st choice defenders. They also have Ivanovic who has good experience and is pretty solid. Better options that us I think you will agree.

  66. *hour=ours

  67. Worst case scenario is 1 injury to Song. then we have Denilson, who cant/doesnt do what Song does – then we are down to 2 teenagers to hold our midfield together = and you think thats fair on these guys to expect them to step up like that?

  68. Arseman – I started supporting Arsenal in 1984, and have done religiously since. I think your points are more valid for some of the rose tinted glasses on here.

  69. goonerandy

    You always seem to avoid the discussion when you know you are wrong. You pick one player out for criticism, but are willing to allow other players a free pass.

  70. goonerandy wants us to be a second chelski.

  71. Chris – I could have swore Flamini was 1st choice in his final year at the club. I am pretty sure of it.

  72. goonerandy,

    That’s your analysis?

    I would have thought squad building is based on quality and numbers.

    Numbers: Most teams have 3 or 4 centre backs. Chelsea have 3. Barcelona have 3. Inter have 3. Real Madrid have 3. Man United have 4. Bayern Munich have 3. Liverpool have 4. We have 3, plus 1 that can play there and the manager says he’s looking for a fourth. We also have a promising kid who might not be the answer but nevertheless is part of the numbers. WE ARE NOT SHORT IN NUMBERS.

    Personally, I think we need more experience in that area and thus we need an older, battle-tested centre back with Premier League experience. But there aren’t many targets around. I’ve asked at least 12 people to draw up a list of suitable targets, and nobody ever had up to 5 names on that list. Even more than that, the same names always come up. It is a hard position to fill.

    We are not short in numbers. Not at all. Predicating what numbers we should have on injury scenarios is ultimately meaningless. You can not predict hopw many injurioes you’ll have. If you have 13 centre backs and 12 were injured you’d still have a problem on your hands.

  73. Yeah Flamini left because he didnt get first team action.

  74. Deise

    Wait a minute, Denilson is pretty effective at his job, and was up there with the best the season before he had his back injury. Song was one who fans like yourself slated before his rise to fame, what makes you think Denilson has peaked at the age of 22?

  75. @Ole Gunner.

    I had so much respect for Barca a while back because of the football they played. They became the scum of the earth, lower than the faecal matter that rests beneath the mound in a pit latrine when they embarked on their under-hand, uncouth and disgusting public tapping up of Cesc through the media.

    It wasn’t just the management, the in-coming or outgoing presidents; it was like the Barca players called press conferences just to twist in the knife. The whole lot of them need to be lined up against the wall and shot like the dogs they are.

    Yesterday, Limpar Assist was given greif for voicing his opinion about Cesc’s role (even if it’s by his inaction) in the whole saga. I actually agree with Limpar in that Cesc as the Arsenal captain should have said something to stop a lot of this nonsense. Whatever he says now can be viewed as a little too late.

    It’s not enough to pass the buck and just say it’s the Barca players that are scum; Cesc has allowed himself to be bullied into a difficullt position between a rock and a hard place. There are responsibilities that come with signing long term contracts and taking the pay and captaincy, and one of them is that of being man enough to take a stand and stop playing victim on the basis of nostalgia.

    I personally don’t mind if Cesc leaves, but I’ll be pissed off if we don’t get a transfer fee that is worth his true value. I’m confident he’s staying at Arsenal though for at least this coming season.

    Arsenal is bigger than any one player; and the thing that has got to me the most is the way Barca has been allowed to drag Arsenal through the mud like their bitch.

  76. Chris – Your points is flawed. I don’t think Denilson is good enough for us. I highlight this by talking about his bad points (I have also mentioned his good points in previous posts but nobody seemed to pick up on this). I though Paddy was good enough for us, despite the mistakes that he (and all players) make.

    Notlager – Where on earth do you get that from? Somebody asked me a Chelsea related question, and I aswered it (I have had no reply though, as his point wasn’t really a good one). I can’t stand Chelsea, they are a vile club.

  77. goonerandy – I forgot to add that many old fans have also become easily disillusioned, seeing the sheiks and oil mafioso buying success, changing managers at the blink of an eye, buying players at inflated prices thus making it harder for honest, hardworking teams to buy within their means..i could go on

  78. Flamini used time in his last year to get a free transfer. His mind was probably made up at the start of the season. If Flamini had the time on the field prior we would have signed him on a new deal.

    Pretty simple really, shame a few on here are a bit slow.

  79. goonerandy

    That is why you ain’t the Arsenal manager. Denilson wasn’t Brazil U21 captain for nothing? Or are you saying the Brazil U21 coach is incompetent too. Please back your arguments up, leave your personal issues aside. Denilson is a good midfielder.

  80. Ole – I take your point about the 3 CB’s. I suppose it really depends who you are counting as your 3.

    We have TV5/New bloke who might be good/Djourou (when not injured).

    Manure have Ferdinand/Vidic/O’Shea/Evans

    Chelsea have Terry/Carvalho/Alex

    We don’t even know if TV5 has a 1st choice parnter!

  81. goonerandy,

    do you know how much chelski pay those centre backs? do you want our club to go bankrupt?

  82. Bloody hell, Daisy (gooner), bloody hell.

    You’re not that stupid are you. The 4 players you glibly say we lost, only one of them was a starter. The other 3, only 1 would you say was good enough for the club, but he cant even play 2 games a week. The other 2 you’d say weren’t even good enough for the club.

    A top club needs 3 or 4 senior centre backs. We currently have 3. We perhaps need one more but you can’t ignore how many we do have. Start by acknowledging that we have 3 very good centre backs then we can have a conversation, and not this strange algebra.

    Man United dont even have a back up for Evra or an established clear right full back.

    Diaby can very competently play holding midfield. He is a round hole so long as he can play it. He’d only be a square hole if he couldn’t play the role.

  83. It’s the same with us, isn’t it. We have Djourou and Koscielny, who can be considered first teamers (after all if Djourou hadn’t suffered that injury last year we would have seen the TV/Djourou partnership more often in action while Gallas would have gotten a chance to rest — and Wenger would not splash the cash on a player like Koscielny if he thought that he is 4th or 5th choice) and Song, who has good experience and is solid.

    Though I am obviously not going to deny that Alex/Carvalho have more experience than Kos/Djourou.

  84. I never said Denilson has peaked or that he isnt a good player. I just happen to think hes not the man for that position who will dominate the midfield against the big boys. He is clearly a good player and has a lot to offer. Anyway my point isnt to try slate Denilson, its to say we could do with another holding player in there as the cover we have isnt ready yet.

    Leaving injuries aside then

    We have 1 centreback we know can cut the mustard and 2 who there are doubt over. I believe id Djourou can stay fit hel be a baller. I cannot comment on Kos but id trust the man why spied out Vermaelen for us in that one. Therefore we need another. Jeez Wenger said it himself we are short in the defensive areas.

  85. Not good enough to get into their 1st squad (which is pretty average at th moment) though eh?

    Arseman – I don’t want any of that. Sheiks/cash cows and the like. Our club is ran excellently. All I want is the squad suplemented in the area’s which are weak. Wenger himself has identified this, so hopefully it will happen.

  86. goonerandy,

    Again you ignore the existence of Koscielny.

    I could ignore the existence of Terry, Carvalho and Alex and say Chelsea have no centre backs.

    It won’t make it true.

    That’s why you lot get abuse on here. I don’t consider this to be a reasonable discussion if you keep ignoring facts for convenience.

  87. so we had more centrehalves than we do now but the fact that 2 wernt good enough means we can let them go and not count them as a player?

  88. Ole – When I said “New bloke who might be good” I was reffering to koscienly. I have not ignored any facts, so the abuse I get is beacause I simply highlight the flaws in the side. Shame on me.

    Notlager – I didn’t say i wanted those exact players did I? TV5 cost a fraction of the Chelsea players and I would take him any day of the week.

  89. DeiseGooner,

    With Denilson we have dominated midfield ‘against the big boys’. No point arguing if you wont start by acknowledging the facts.

    When Denilson played holding midfield for a season, he was blamed for us conceding too many goals. When Song played the smae role, we conceded even more goals, yet Denilson still gets the blame. Twisted.

  90. Ole.. well put

  91. Ole

    Song is in all the doomers good books though mate, he is strong and looks tough. Thats the difference!

  92. ok if you are happy with 3 centrehalves with doubts yet to be cleared up over 2 then so be it. Personally im not but im done with trying to convey that to you.

    i think we need 1 more centrehalf

  93. What facts Ole? Just because you claim to state facts, does not make what you say “fact”. We didn’t dominate against Manure in the CL semi did we? Nor against Barca? They are the “big boys” you refer to I take it?

    And before anybody jumps on me I am not saying we got humped in those games because of Denilson. Just that your “facts” are pretty much made up.

  94. Nope, the point is we need 3 or 4. We have 3, the manager is in the market for one more. WTF are you railing about?

    Irrespective of how many left?

  95. Chris – And he plays pretty well. Don’t forget that.

  96. DS,
    can only partly agree on your assessment of Barca players.

    These people are merely children; spoilt, petulant, selfish and badly-behaved children.

    As with all badly behaved brats they need discipline.

    The fault lies fairly and squarly with the governing bodies for not applying it.

  97. Looking forward to the weekend, havnt watched any of the other pre-season apart from goals on tv. generaly there are big improvements for a player, whether he be good , bad or indifferent when moving from teen into twenties, players improve. Take Denilson, love or hate him, he has improved since he first began to play for us, he is a better player. If ones expectations are put so high, then it makes it difficult to accept someone in any walk of life. Men get stronger and quicker with no help from anyone aside nature, men get better at any skill with more experience, is there any one out there who has got worse at their job over the years ? if you have then the manager will replace you. I think i am arealist and IF AW doesnt buy another CH then that is going to be a problem, duu obviously, all the doomers are realy good at spotting the obvious, its the rational for wenger not realising it also, that i dont get. Some people suffer from anxiety more than others, they will never get better until they challeng it

  98. Lets do a run down on all positions..

    I think we ne need to start with midfield because the calls for a defensive midfielder are just so irritating!!

    RM = Walcott, Eboue, Rosicky, Nasri, Bendtner
    LM = Arshavin, Vela, Nasri, Rosicky
    CM (2 spots) = Cesc, Diaby, Nasri, Rosicky, Wilshire, Denilson, Ramsey
    DM = Song, Denilson, Diaby, Eastmond, Frimpong

    Correct me if I have missed anybody.. but this is our player’s abilities to perform in various positions. I havn’t included Nasri as a DM because that seemed to be just a temp solution.

    SO do we need a DM…..

  99. Ole – He is going on about it becasue we only have one recognised first team centre back. That is why…

    Djourou is not.
    Kosciesky is not.
    Nordvitt most certainly is not.
    TV5 is an excellent defender.


  100. You ahve missed JET who can play anywhere and Nordveit who can play DM

  101. oh fuck it goonerandy,

    Denilson did not feature in the CL semi finals. Against Barca, we didnt get back into the game and start to hold our own in midfield until Denilson showed up.

    Again, tenuous hold on the facts, ignoring what happened to suit your pre-conclusions.

    Denilson has had terrible games. He was dismal against Man United and let us down there. He failed us against Stoke. On the other hand the last times we beat Man Utd and Chelsea it was with Denilson in midfield.

    I still ask you to explain away how it came to be that he won the ball more than any player in the league when he was our holding midfield player for the entire season. Explain that away, then I will agree with you that he can’t play holding midfield. I’m waiting.

    In 2 years I’ve never heard any of the anti-Denilson people acknowledge that fact, talk less of discount it.

    Here’s your chance.

  102. This is how I want my team and club to be:

    -Goalkeeper: worldclass. 1.Backup: worldclass. 2.Backup: worldclass
    -RB: worldclass. First backup: worldclass. Second backup:worldclass.
    -CBs:worldclass. First backup: worldclass. Second backup:worldclass.
    -LB: worldclass. First backup: worldclass. Second backup:worldclass.
    -DMs: worldclass. First backup: worldclass. Second backup:worldclass.
    -AMs: worldclass. First backup: worldclass. Second backup:worldclass.
    -Strikers: worldclass. First backup: worldclass. Second backup:worldclass.

    Players in general are: loyal, play for minimum wages.
    Owners: No sugardaddy.
    Tickets: for free.

    And finally this is how I see the world: realistic.

  103. Chris – I agree a DM is not a priority because Denilson can fill in there. For me Diaby is too attacking to play there, and for all of the potential of Frimpong/Eastmond you would not want to rely on them for too long.

    A signing there would be nice, but not essential.

  104. Nothing sways the stupid more than arguments they cannot understand.

  105. Depends on what recognised means for you. WTF does it mean? Another of those football cliches that ultimately mean nothing.

  106. Goonerandy – I do think we need one more defender. I prefer 4 in the squad. But that is my perspective. Your logic that Djourou and Koscielny are recognised defenders is beyond me.

  107. Notlager @ 12:52….utopia?

  108. Goonerandy – I do think we need one more defender. I prefer 4 in the squad. But that is my perspective. Your logic that Djourou and Koscielny are [b]not[/b] recognised defenders is beyond me.

  109. I happen to believe andy that we need 1 more CB to be ready, a GK who is better than what we got would be a bonus, and a DM is just stupid.

    I have no doubts over Almunia’s ability, the defence this year if improved will result in less clear cut opportunities given away.

    Wenger stated the defence was the area he needed attended to, lets wait and see who lines up come match day 1. One thing we can all agree on, is that if the defence is sorted, either by personnel or by organisation, we have every chance of winning the league. Our attack is full of talented playmakers and goalscorers.

    Lets just enjoy the season and quit picking on squad players. Its fuckin childish

  110. I remember when Lauren came to the club, and was playing right midfield. Many many fans said he wasnt good enough. Then, horror, Wenger moved him to right back and the voices were even more strident.

    We could do a whole trend on how many players the great all-knowing Arsenal public have said were not good enough and went on and had outstanding spells at the club.
    That’s why Wenger ignores you lot.

  111. By the way, I do think that the fourth defender will have to wait a bit. Don’t expect anything in the immediate future. The fact that the whole world knows that Arsenal is looking for a defender is going jack up their price when Arsenal tries to buy them.

  112. From


    Arsène Wenger is considering “plenty of names” as he bids to bring in another centre back before the start of the season.

    Sol Campbell, William Gallas and Mikael Silvestre have departed since May with the manager adding only Laurent Koscielny from Lorient. Johan Djourou has returned after sitting out almost the entire 2009/10 campaign with injury. But, with Thomas Vermaelen, that makes only three established, experienced centre backs on the books.

    Wenger admits that last season he needed five central defenders so he is looking to add one more at least before the transfer window shuts. But, for now, the Frenchman is remaining tight-lipped as to his targets.

    “I wouldn’t like to give you any names,” he said. “There are plenty of names that we consider and we analyse. We look at the financial possibilities and the technical potential. But it is impossible for me to come out with a name.

    “We are still on the search because at the moment we only have three centre backs and we have seen last season you needed five. I believe we need at least four because we have some other players who can fill in this position but overall we are still on the search.”

  113. Ole – I am not saying he is not a decent player, because I think he is. I am simply saying that I do not think he is good enough to be starting for us.

    He may well improve, and he would not have started so many games but for injuries. I personally would like to see a better player (in my opinion) ahead of him in the pecking order.

    I am not into slating our players, and are happy to just state my opinion that I don;t think he is quite good enough for us. It probably seems as though I have it if for him due to the way these discussions have gone. But I don’t. He is a decent squad player, but our starting 11 deserves better.

    None of us can “prove” right or wrong, it is all down to opinion. Stats prove shite…they highlight what has been done, not what has not. i.e, runs missed, bad positioning etc. They can be misleading.

  114. Now please, lets leave it to the professionals…shall we?

  115. Vermaelen and Djourou will be a fantastic partnership.. Koscielny could well challenge Djourou for the spot, depending on how he settles. Wenger needs one more to make us better equipped, he knows this, and it is taking a while to finalise or find the last piece. If this new recruit is an experienced guy ready to challenge, we have 4 good CB’s to call on. Nordveit looks like he could be a squad player, but we cannot assume this just yet. For all we know he could be dropped back to the reserves.

    So lets wait to see if 1 more is brought in before panicking.

  116. Chris – Yeah, I pretty much agree with you. I would prefer another keeper, where you are not too bothered. Fair enough.

  117. Thanks Arseman. Arsene says we need at least 4. He says we’re in the market for one more. Why are the doomers threatening mass suicides?

  118. If Djourou can stay fit, I also think he could develop into a monster CB and with TV5 it could be a great prtnership for years to come. Koscienly should be good back up, and maybe even challenge Djourou?

    Djourou is the key in the issue here for me. Can he stay fit? That said, if Arsene buys a CB who can walk streight into the team instead of a “maybe” we will be set.

  119. The complicated mind of a doomer… sounds like a nice idea for a book

  120. there you go again with this ‘doomer’ lark – when what we are saying we need another, just as the boss says.

    So we are weaker defensively until we get that 4th. And thats just the numbers game.


    Better or worse (individually of course) than


  121. Fook me, GoonerAndy, it’s not about your opinions. Not about mine either. It’s about the expert considered judgement of the manager. He is in no doubt that Denilson is good enough. For 2 seasons, he’s generally started when he’s been fit. And when we look at any objective measure of his performance, through stats or just discerning observation, the manager’s faith seems justified.

    I’d suggest you take a look at Arsenal games. Any time when we’ve pushed up, and the ball comes back into midfield with most of our players in the box. Watch out for which Arsenal player is usually first to the ball. The answer is Denilson. Watch it. Find 10 of such examples, and you’ll find he was first to try to win the ball back more than any other player in the team. His ability to read the game is outstanding.

    There are weaknesses to him. He needs to bring more determination and intensity into 1 on 1 duels. He also sometimes lacks speed.

    But the overall assessment of the players must acknowledge his strengths as well has his weaknesses.

    If I just focused on his weaknesses I could say Fabregas is not a good player.

  122. Keysoze – I base my assumption that Djourou and Konciesny are not established because Djourou has only ever started 38 league games for us, and Konciesny has only had one season in a top division.

  123. So Djourou is injury prone?? In his professional career he had ONE serious injury that kept him out for a year. Is that injury prone? NO He has 67 starts and 11 substitutes apparences for Arsenal alone so has some experience.

    Koscielny in his first year in French L1 has got an average of 19 interception per match, making him the the highest ball winner defender in the whole league AND was voted best defender in the league. This comes from the lfp which is the official league body’s ranking. According to UEFA’s ranking which determine how many CL places a league get the French L1 is fourth with in order, England, Spain and Italy ahead of them but in front of the Bundesliga.
    He his thought as a replacement for Gallas in the French team by Laurent Blanc, hardly a football ignorant. So I wouldn’t say he is completely untested and if you look back Players in L1 have often integrated well in the Premierleague (ie Drogba, Essien, Evra, Gallas, Petit,…to name a few).

    And finnally just so you relax this is on
    Wenger – We need at least four centre backs
    Arsène Wenger is considering “plenty of names” as he bids to bring in another centre back before the start of the season.

  124. goonerandy

    Yep I agree with u there, 1 more CB who is able to come straight in would be nice. I don’t think Wenger would like to throw Kosc straight in anyway going by his comments.. this is obviously if Verm or Djourou get injured or are absent in any shape or form.

    Regarding the keepers, Almunia isn’t as bad as he is being made out to be. I only remember a few incidents this last season that he messed up, but obviously they stick in the mind more than his 1 on 1 saves, penalty saves, and his heroics against Barca. Cech done stupid errors (more in fact) the previous season and recovered. At one point Chelsea fans were on his case.

    It is widely perceived that Almunia can only do much, and his ability is average. This is the problem with Arsenal fans nowadays, always thinking that players elsewhere with bigger ego’s and bigger price tags are better. Why undermine our own players who fight for us week in week out. It is foolish.

  125. Ole – I have mentioned Denilsons strong points in previous posts. Nobody seemed to notice, as I have now (incorrectly) being tagged as a “doomer”.

    I know full well our opinions don’t matter. But I am not planning to speak to Wenger about my concerns, so instead I go on an internet fan site to discuss the issues.

    Wenger himself has stated openly that our defence is an issue, and is now openly stating that he needs another defender. Maybe he is a “doomer” too.

  126. My comment yesterday.

    Why can’t we just look forward to the new season without second guessing the people that are paid do do jobs that none of us could do?

  127. Just catching up as I had to WORK! unbelievable. anyway you could add traore to the left on your list cg.

    And it is the usuall defence against doomers again aint it.

  128. Ole, i couldn’t agree more about denilson. His lack of “flair” and simple technique make him an easy target for some to criticize. But, if looked at objectively, the evidence is clear, even for a blind man, as to how important his skill set is to make a formation like ours work. Some will slack him for the fact that he only passes sideways or cannot pass forward (im looking at you Hark) What they fail to realize is the importance of the pass in terms of keeping possession and making space for other attackers.
    People need to understand that his game isn’t meant to be physical! He works on intercepting passes, reading the opposition and getting the midfield out of difficult situations.
    Its a curse on him that he makes it look so simple that people dont understand his value.

  129. Chris – Almunia had some great moments last year, and made some really important stops. It is the nature of the beast though in the goalkeeping world’ you are judged by your mistakes, not your saves.

    I like the guy, but I just want Arsenal Football Club to have an outstanding goalkeeper. throuhgout the years it has almost been tradition at the club.

  130. wengerball

    If only!! Lets just be glad we have a smart manager who knows what hes doing. Imagine if we had a numpty like Redknapp in charge!!

    Dear ohh deaar .. dare I even say it!

  131. goonerandy you say they are not classed as proper cb’s as they havn’t played enough games but are you not the one who said that waskjhjksznyzhjklzny should not be given a chance in the sticks as casilias could do it at 18 for real?

    Also how arrogant can you be to use AKB as an insult. Of course he does! Do you think you really know more about Arsenal than Wenger? I’m starting to get rattled now so I think I’ll stop posting which is a shame cos idiots stop play once again.

  132. els

    Yea they keep popping up. They can never take my optimism away from the season that awaits. The day that happens is the day I go out with a shotgun hunting doomers! lol

    Tomorrow will be a relief to watch the Arsenal in action! Cant wait

  133. Ole – Lets ignore goonerandy and his sidekick desiegooner (remember jon-jon and suga) for the moment. I think what is important this weekend at the Emirates Cup is to see how our rotational defending, by our midfielders in particular, has become more disciplined and focussed. One of our major problems last year was the tendency for the midfielders and defenders to be dragged out of position, in our desire to attack and score. Note that oftentimes Song bombs forward and there is insufficient midfield rotation to cover. This left gaps which were exploited by good counter-attacking teams, e.g. Wigan – apart from that horrible error by Fabianski we were caught on the break twice. Part of the problem was that our best transitional midfielder, Denilson, had his back problems and was either out injured or not at his best. Diaby, imo, is learning to play this role as his natural instinct is to go forward. That partially explains his inconsistency. In the recent friendlies there was no way I could judge if we are improved in this area. Almost everyone raved about Frimpong but while he has improved he is nothing but a back-up. The times he bombed forward and almost lost the ball had me cringing at him doing something similar in a regular PL game. Not only would he be dispossessed but we would be punished. Am I making sense?
    Over to you Ole.

  134. Els….thats what they want you to do man….dont stop posting….have some fun with it…but dont stop posting.

  135. Els – I can’t remember to be honest. I would prefer us to buy another keeper and for Tech9 to compete with him in a few years time. Failing that, he could not make more mistakes than Fabianski. Don’t think I was the one that used Casislas as an example though.

    Of course I don’t think I know more than the manager. I don’t know what you mean about using AKB as an insult. I haven’t even insulted anybody.

  136. Your right Arseman

  137. shotta

    Have to say I agree about your Frimpong. I had the same feeling when he lost the ball roaming forward. Wilshire even done it on occasion. These are the incidents which prove they are not quite ready yet.

    You compare them to guys like Nasri, Rosicky.. who barely gave the ball away over 3 friendlies.

    Will be interesting to see how they perform against stronger opposition tomorrow and sunday though. Wilshire ran riot last year!

  138. absolutely spot on. Good point 🙂

  139. you ARE right

  140. Arseman – I don’t want anybody to stop posting. There is nothing wrong with debating the club. It just seems that some (not pointing fingers) get very childish about things and start tellng people to “fuck off” and such like.

    I am as much a fan as anbody on here. I just so happen to look at the club objectively. Both bad and good.

    I can’t wait for tomorrow.

  141. CG

    Almunia only made a couple of fucks eh?In both games v Man Utd one of of biggest rivals,Man City away 1st goal,Birmingham injury time one up palms the ball into his own net,Spuds away.

    Arsenal are a massive club we should have one of the worlds top 5 keepers playing for us

    His only saving grace is Flappy is 10 times worse

  142. I’m expecting a fairly serious line up tomorrow. Something close to the expected first team. It’s obviously a shame about Johan, as I’m still unconvinced as to which pairing Wenger is classing as first choice. Or maybe he hasn’t decided?

    I have my fingers crossed for Nasri and Theo playing a good portion of the game and season. They are going to be the men this season.

  143. “I am as much a fan as anbody on here. I just so happen to look at the club objectively. Both bad and good.”

    No you are not. Take that back. Right now.

  144. Goonerandy.

    You were challenged earlier by OG to define what you mean by “established”, since you keep banging on that we need established defenders.
    As far as we know, both Djourou and Koscielny are defenders. They’re not midfielders or strikers.

    So pray tell, what do you mean that we don’t have established defenders. Are you suggesting that the Arsenal scouting system got Koscielny from a youtube mock-up and that since he has only played one season in the French first division, he is not competent?

    I suggest to you that the Arsenal scouting team are much better than any of us in identifying players who can do well for Arsenal. We haven’t even started the season and you’re writing them off.

    Wenger has already said he will sign another centre half. What more do you want?

  145. Oh, one more thing. On the eve of the Emirates Cup, signalling the start of the new season, a little music to inspire ACLFers and ZimPaul in particular:

  146. Dont stop posting. Thats what they want! WTF! Who wants to stop anyone from posting? Debate is the thing here not shouting down others opinions or trying to drive them to stop posting, or saying childish things like ‘lets ignore the doomers’ Jeez if its everyone with the same opinion on everything you want why not set up your own blog and only allow those who agree with you.

  147. Hey everyone Hark is here yey. What a guy. Hark whats up hark, what have you got for us today? ? ? ?

    Wait for it lads this’l be real good. Wait for the wisdom oo oo oo oo oo what’ll it be?

  148. goonerandy

    Both bad and good.

    As we all do.. I just feel as a fan at this time of the year we should all be looking forward to what is to come. We have a very talented team that has the capabilities of doing something special. In pre-season the younger players who are knocking on the door prove how much work has been put in behind the scenes. Trust in Wenger to bring in the signings he needs, theres no need to go on about the negatives of individuals, they are pretty obvious and we review them game by game. There is no need to use them as an excuse to prove a point, whatever that may be.

    I am sure we will have a fantastic season, and we have every chance of bringing a trophy. If not I ain’t gonna commit suicide!

  149. Darius – By establised, I suppose I mean a player with good experience. CB maybe more than any other on the pitch is the position which benefits from this. Descion making is vital, and that useually improves with experience. That is what I mean by established.

    I am not writing anyone off. I think we will win the league each year, I am not sure where you got that from.

  150. goonerandy and DeiseGooner, do u feel the love?

  151. DeiseGooner

    Your problem lies is you support the same stances as our local Hark. Another idiot which sets out to undermine the manager and certain players.

    Its come to a point now where this type of behaviour is quite frankly not accepted by many supporters. I personally cannot stand to hear another supporter jump on the back of player.. as if they are a piece of shit. It is wrong, these guys have a profession which is playing football. Its our choice whether to support or not. NOT abuse them!

  152. Chris i dont think goonerandy or myself for that matter have anything other than optimism and excitement over the new season – but its tempered with the worries over our weaknesses that have yet to be addressed .. indeed havent been addressed in nigh on 3 seasons now

  153. Arseman..

    Love or rocks thrown their way?!

  154. GoonerAndy,

    You are missing the point. You can say what you like. You can come on here with a PHD thesis if you want to. You can tell us of your tales of monitoring pre season in Austria, or sitting in the crowd with a telescopic lens in the world cup and watching the stand out players. You can inform us of arsenal traditions of a bygone age and let us know that goalkeepers and strong centre backs used to be our forte.

    Alternatively, you can talk tactics and tell us how successful Mourinho has been with his 8-2 formation, or you can talk about money, and how much we have to spend, and who we should spend it on. You can talk about class players who have slipped the net, or, who are perhaps still available.

    But I tell you this. I haven’t lost a single nano second of sleep over what you perceive as a shortage of quality, because I know that the manager is Arsene Wenger. If you seriously believe that any blogger can point out concerns which would not have occurred to the manager, or things he was not trying to address, then you surely cannot be serious, with the greatest respect to you.

    And before you rubbish Koscienly, name me a single player in the last 3 to 4 years that has turned out not to be arsenal quality. I dare you. Sure, Baptista could have been better, but we wanted to keep him – he only left because his fee demanded by RM was too high. Jeffers was a stinker, but that was an acknowledged error. One that he hasn’t made since. Vermaelen, Sagna, Eduardo, Arshavin are all recent signings. All quality. All internationals. What is your problem ? Nobody wants to call you a doomer, but if you come on and make fatuous statements they will.

  155. Chris – I agree, and I am really looking forwrd to the season and think we will do well.

    You said “as well all do”. But it seems not to be the case (this is not directed at you, or anyone inparticular). As soon as certain people bring up a decent point they get shouted down as being a “doomer” or “not a proper” fan. What is wrong with just disagreeing with point and backing your argument.

    Football is about opinion, and there is nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree. Everyone on these boards have the same aim.

  156. Sorry Chris? What? When have i jumped on either Wenger or a players back and called then a piece of shit? I have pointed out what i think have been mistakes by Wenger and players who i think arent up to the standard for Arsenal and winning the top trophies.

  157. DeiseGooner

    So in 3 seasons you believe Wenger has done nothing about the defence?

  158. Muppet – I have not lost any sleep either mate. But for all those who think Arsene does not make bad calls, why have we not won anything for 5 years? All managers make mistakes, don’t delude yourself that ours doesn’t.

    I am a huge Wenger fan by the way. There is nobody else I would like to see at this club, and think the guy is a genius.

  159. Of course he has Chris, but hes not fixed it. He has tried but he hasnt fixed it. We conceded more last season than the season before – therefore hes not fixed the issues.

  160. shotta,

    Every squad player brings something to the side. This is an underrated aspect to squad building. I think it’s a strength to have Song and Denilson, who bring different approaches to the same role.

    For me our biggest defensive problems are in descending order;

    1. Poor defending from wide forwards and midfielders
    2. Poor organisation on corners
    3. Allowing too many crosses from full back positions
    4. Panic, leading to bad decision making.
    5. Inadequate personnel

    Problem 1 hasn’t been solved yet, and it’s amplified by the formation. Problem 2 is intermittent. At times we handle set pieces situations flawlessly and at other times like schoolgirls. The crossing situation, is baffling given the quality of our full backs. The one about panic is no less baffling. I am still haunted by the goals conceded against Man poo and Chelsea last season when 5, 6 players made the wrong choices that ultimately doomed us. Remember that Rooney goal? It was a comedy of errors. An one player doing the correct thing would have stopped that goal. The problem of inadequate personnel also exists. Silvestre was pretty useless, let’s face it. And sometimes our defenders played very badly.

    To me, defensive improvement will largely come internally.

    What baffles me most about or defending ios that we actually win the ball a lot, for a team that dominates possession, and we concede few shots/chances to our opponents which means overall we can defend.

    The right tweaks are necessary for sure.

    The irony is that Arsenal’s coaching crew is chock full of defenders; Wenger, Primorac, Pat Rice, Banfield, Bould…..yet defence is where we struggle.

    I laugh when people say all we need is a Keown to come in and drill the team. As if we were lacking coaching personnel who know what defending is all about.

  161. What I will say about the defence is that for the past few years any fan could see that our defence is the issue. I don’t think anybody would argue with that.

    Not nessasarily the personnel, but more than likely the sytem. That leave 2 options; Arsene does not really coach the defence too much, instead concentrating on our own game. Or, our defenders cannot carry out his instructions. Either way the buck stops at his door.

  162. Deise

    Some of the comments and treatment our players have received merits such a statement. I did not direct it at your comments, but that of comments throughout the blogging world where fans use this space as an excuse to really lay into certain players.

    You and Andy have done that in a less explicit way I would say

  163. Ole – All good points. The thing that stick out the most for me is the gaps in the lines between defence and midfield. We are not compact enough without the ball, which leaves our defenders isolated quite often.

  164. Formation change is what hurt us the most in defence, the personnel were more than capable. Numbers wasn’t an issue too.

  165. I would never say xxxx is shite, or xxxx is wanker. That is not constructive at all. Nor would I not get behind a player when they are playing for us, regardless of my opinion of them. I am sure Deise is the same. But I maintain, there is nothing wrong with debating it on a fan site. It is not trolling. I am not going around trynig to wind people up.

  166. Goonerandy.

    Your argument about experience is flawed. Last season we had a pairing of Gallas and Vermaelen, before that Toure and Gallas. They were experienced, no? We still had issues then.

    Are you suggesting that we have 4 1st choice centre halves who have accumulated what you perceive as acceptable game time with 2 of them sitting on the bench, just in case? That won’t happen, and no other club operates like that.

    Vermaelen, Djourou and Koscielny are good enough. In addition, Wenger wants to add another central defender. My question again, what more do you want?

    What is the point of having someone

  167. In theory the new formation should have given us even more protection as we have more in midfield. But it seems to have done the opposite.

  168. Im sorry are Wenger and the players beyong criticism? I do not resort to abuse. Is that what this ‘Hark’ guy does?

  169. GoonerAdny,

    We haven’t won anything for 5 years because of the combination of the financial doping of 2 very big clubs, who have managed to inject at least 1.2 billion pounds worth of expenditure into the squads, and our relative inability to afford marquee players that would have given us a stronger squad, because of our stadium bill.

    I strongly believe this is the case. Others on here will argue the same point. Arguing that it is Wenger’s stubborness, or lack of activity in the transfer market is complete tosh. We live in a world where we are now competing with 3 clubs in the premier league – chavs, northern chavs and mancs, who are dirty ruthless bastards with scant regard for economics.

    The other point that you miss is that in spite of what you perceive as a lack of a trophy, we are the 3rd wealthiest club in the world, we have competed for the champions league in the last 13 years. No arsenal team managed by any other manager, ever, reached the final or semi final of the european cup, which we did in 2006 and 2009, as you know.

    You can bleat on about the lack of a trophy until you are blue in the face, but what you seem to be asking is that we too, spend huge sums of money which, I might add, will still not guarantee anything. RM have spent, god knows, £500 million + in the last 5 years, and not once have they reached the quarter finals of the champions league !!

  170. Darius – I am more than happy with one more CB. prefarably one with enough quality to go streight into the 1st 11.

    What more do i want? Not much really; a better keeper I think is essential, and possibly another DM to challenge/cover Song.

    You are right that we have had problems for the past few years regardless of personnel. It is the defensive system that is the problem. Getting less experinced players will not help thoug will it? Wenger has said on a number of occasions after game “we were naive”. Thats right….maybe more experience will go some way to sorting that issue.

  171. Darius the argument is not flawed. If experienced defenders like Toure/Gallas/Sol etc had issues – be it with not clicking with the playing partner, the formation, personal ability, concentration levels, whatever – then how can you say that player with less experience will be any better?


    Arsene Wenger, May 9, 2010:

    On if he believes he must strengthen his squad in the summer…
    “We want to improve in quality. It is not necessarily a big number of players needed and overall I believe you don’t win the title when you concede 40 goals.”

    On which positions he believes need improving…
    “Leave that to me and come back in July and you will see. When you come back for the Emirates Cup you will see.”

    So I ask. Arsene Wenger, a doomer for suggesting he wants to improve in quality?

  173. Muppet – I do not think we should be spending huge sums.

    Also you said that Wenger has had no cash, but also that we are the 3rd wealthiest club on the planet. Which is it?

  174. Muppet – im sorry you blame it all on ‘financial doping’ by Chelski and Man U – but then say we are 3rd wealthiest club in the world but its not wengers fault for spending?

  175. goonerandy,

    We are that because we live within our means. That should be obvious.

  176. ArseChicago,

    Ask anybody here if they want to improve the quality of the squad. See if anybody answers no.

    Don’t be silly, the dooming is the endless whining and woe-is-me attitude.

    It’s very well documented the kind of attitude referred to as dooming.

  177. ArseChicago,

    no Arsene is not a doomer for saying that. A doomer is someone who says the only way to solve this problem is to throw cash around that we don’t have and giving up before the season even started.

  178. I know we do, and so we should. Nobody is asking for stupid money to be spent. Wenger has shown countless times that we can get in quality at good prices.

  179. I refer the honourable gentleman to the answer given some moments ago – 1.58pm.

  180. Notlager – Show me one post that has said that. One.


  181. You cannot compare our wealth with the fact we won’t pay 35m on a Berbatov signing. The money is there, but who is out there worth the fee?

    Milner 35m?

    Yaya 27m?

    How about Ade.. 35m?

  182. Look i approve of Wengers stance on the uber transfer fees being paid by Chelski etc, its disgusting amounts of money.

    We are cash rich but spend within our means – i say we spend below our means – but wenger just seems to be able to pull a rabbit out of the hat every now and then. But he has had money but not spent it when it might have proven better to have done so. He certainly does need to spend now by his own admission.

    So while chlski moved the goalposts do not say wenger hasnt made mistakes. Thats just not the case. Hes done a blinding job no doubt but hes made mistakes

  183. Jesus christ….nobody wants a £35M signing.

    A couple of TV5 stature signings would be perfect. Monsy is not the object, quality is.

  184. Well, Muppet, Darius, Chris, Shotta, you know I’m no Frank. I try to reason or gently take the piss but where today’s clowns are concerned I have resorted to a Frank style fuck off as they will argue black is white. You have endless patience but they are not worth your time or intellect. They should be at Arseblog not here.

  185. Sorry Ole -didn’t mean to leave you out.

  186. Shay Given – £7M
    Van der Sar – £7M

    And that is just off the top of my head.

    Not uber money by any means. A signing like that could make all the difference to our team.

  187. Goonerandy.

    First ask yourself where our cash is going before you suggest that Wenger is a tight fisted bastard.


    Listen to yourself. What you are suggesting is that we get more ‘experienced’ players than Gallas, Toure, Sol, Adams, Keown, Bold (…fill in the blanks with any other player you see fit…). It’s not going to happen. If you want nostalgia, go to a museum.

    Besides, you have no factual basis to argue that Vermaelen, Djourou, Koscielny and any other CB who comes in will not do better; in the same way that we can’t argue that experienced (whatever the threshold is) defenders will do better.

    Let the staf at London Colney do their job. Otherwise, you’re better arguing as to whether Wenger’s judgement is impaired and he has become incompetent. That’s an argument that would have more mileage, but I have a feeling it will be a non-starter in most quarters.

  188. Transfer market is fucked, why moan if Wenger won’t stoop as low as the likes of Arry Redknapp do and buy absolute shite for extravogant fees.

    Wenger looks for quality, irrespective of price. Only then he will determine if the player is worth it.

    Jeffers, Reyes, Wiltord… all bought at quite high market value. Even Kosc and Vermaelen he forked out quite a bit for relatively un-known players. He will splash it if he has to. He may have to on another CB, just sit back and stop bitching.

    This is the point doomers.. the bitching. CUT IT OUT

  189. So what if he’s made mistakes DeiseGooner ?! – the question is if he makes fewer mistakes more than others, and get’s it right more than others.

    I am finding this argument very different to understand. What level of success do you think we should demand when we are up against 3 clubs whose transfer budget is probably 3 or 4 times ours every year ?

  190. My god this is getting repetitive now. Lets discuss our attack for a change, shall we? We all know what each of us have to say about our defense. Whether we like someone’s point of view or not, it should also be clear by now that we can’t change them.

    What do you guys think should be our preferred top 3? I would go for van Persie down the middle, Arshavin on the left and Nasri on the right. If we need to chase a game we can bring in Bendtner/Chamakh, or use Walcott’s pace to burn through the wings. Now where does that leave Rosicky? And I have not even mentioned Wilshere yet. It is a real conundrum. 😦

  191. So who are those worldclass keeper, CB and DM we get for peanuts now, goonerandy?

  192. Steww,

    Don’t even know why I am bothering. I haven’t been on the blogs that much, but it’s the same old Groundhog day, especially on Le Groan. Unbeliveable.

  193. keysersoze – you don’t exist do you ?

  194. “It’s not enough to pass the buck and just say it’s the Barca players that are scum; Cesc has allowed himself to be bullied into a difficullt position between a rock and a hard place. There are responsibilities that come with signing long term contracts and taking the pay and captaincy, and one of them is that of being man enough to take a stand and stop playing victim on the basis of nostalgia.”

    Darius, I think we misunderstand the character of Cesc Fabregas. In this months Arsenal mag Arsene had this to say about him now that he is a ‘world champion’:

    “…it will add something to him. It might give him more confidence and make him stronger. It also adds some authority.”

    From a man who knows Cesc as well as he does, this is a very telling comment for me and has changed my perspective on the Cesc situation. I don’t think he is as confident as we might like to think he is and as a Catalan, it is very difficult for him to resist the overtures of barca. These are his people after all for good or ill. I think the ‘my future is in the hands of Arsene’ comment was him trusting his ‘second father’ to look out for him and protect him from some of that pressure. The adamant reaction from Arsenal protects Cesc from having to burn his bridges with his home town. Cesc may come across as mature for his years, but he is basically a kid.

  195. They don’t call it the D**M position for nothing.

  196. Chris – Again (it has alreay been repeated god knows how many times). Nobody is advocating huge outlays of cash.

    Darius – I didn’t say he was tight fisted. I think he as invested heavily in the youth project, which in itself is amazing. They way the club is run is excellent. I just think that sometimes he needs to supplement that youth. And if a player he really thought would make it is not quite developing as he though, he should look to upgrade the player.

  197. “What you are suggesting is that we get more ‘experienced’ players than Gallas, Toure, Sol, Adams, Keown, Bold”

    No Darius thats not what im suggesting – im suggesting that our current 3 centrehalves have less experience than ones before them, so how can you make the claim that we are better off…..

    “no factual basis to argue that Vermaelen, Djourou, Koscielny and any other CB who comes in will not do better”

    Again not my point – of course they could be better – but in the same system with same tactics and the same defensive coaching we had better players that our current lot – therefore we are now in my opinion, weaker.

  198. Muppet – It is all for you to see. As for how much to believe, I would leave it to your judgment. 🙂

  199. Silver Gunner

    Denilson will be a massive player for us in years to come of that there is little doubt yes he lacks flair but he has that natural reading of the game that few players have.

    There are sides of his game that he will have to personally work on like the agrressive side but all in all I would rather him than mikel or carrick to name a couple similer.

    I think everone agrees we need another defender of that i am sure we will sign before august 31st.

    I too pray we have no defensive injuries this season. The thought of loosing TV5 for a sustained period of time feels me with serious dread a couple of games here and there would be ok but not for longer, I am sure wenger feels the same and will sign.

    Changing the subject I absolutely love the EPL’s new squad limit it will level the playing field man city for all their players will have to let some go on the cheap or face watching them rot in the reserves chelsea the same.

  200. Fair point Darius

    Doomers you are just argueing against something of which you have no legs to stand on. The way our manager has acted during such difficult times has been admirable, even if he has been restrained from buying. The guy knew he had no money when moving stadium, we only mustered a few smart buys. Even now he probably anticipated being able to bring in high calibre players for a fair fee.. 15-20m.. but that is not possible.

    The fact that he still manages to find a Vermaelen, Sagna, Eduardo, Nasri, Kosc, is remarkable. The guy is a genius and is working wonders in a fucked up environment which consists of billionaires, and clowns.

    This is why DOOOMERS are not tolerated, because you don’t have a clue, how can you even dare to dream of questionning the very man who put Arsenal on the map, and is still keeping within touching distance of the top honours in football.

    This is not Blind Loyalty, this is Arsenal pursuing a very sound route to success. Through youth and efficiency are club is the best run club around. Not only financially, but through bringing players through to the 1st team, even if they got sold for a profit. It is a SUCCESS.

    ARSENAL has been the biggest SUCCESS of the Premiership, even last season, its a shame many of its own fans have not seen it. I am very proud to be a Gunner.

  201. I actually agree with the notion that throwing money around won’t guarantee success. But if you sell the likes of Adebayor for 25, Toure 15, Hleb for 13, and ultimately Cesc for 40+, and you continue to charge a premium for stadium tickets, leading to 50MM+ pound profits every year, I can understand why a supporter or two might openly wonder is the point of amassing a mountain of cash. This team as it stands might be good enough now, but I do think Arsene will bring in 1 or 2 before the end of August. I also think that it is possible for a supporter to appreciate the quality the team has while also not being 100% complacent. Anyway, my point is, don’t worry.

  202. goonerandy, why would Arsene deliberately miss out on those cheap upgrades?

  203. Pragmatists – want to improve the club by identifying where we have deficiencies and then looking at the players coming through. If they are of sufficient quality integrate them into the first team, supplementing through the sensible purchase of a small number of quality players to bolster areas we need, freshen up the squad, build confidence and, to a lesser extent, excite the fans.

    Idealists – want to improve the club through promoting the young element and integrating into the first team. The use of the transfer market is deemed a last resort.

    Pragmatists get exasperated by idealists’ percieved refusal to see an alternative view, idealists insult pragmatists as they cannot understand how objective critisism and ‘slating’ the club/manager/players are different things.

    Just my casual observations, Also, can someone elighten me as to the definition of a doomer please?

  204. Notlager – Don’t know. I would trust our scout who picked up the likes of TV5 though.

    Keysoze – Our attack. There is an area of the team to drool about. I am not sure where Chmackh fits in, but I would agree with your front 3 of AA/RvP/Nasri.

    There is so much scope for interchange there, we really should have no probelsm there. This team will always score plenty of goals. I am really looking forward to the likes of Wilshere getting some 1st team action.

  205. I propose that Arsenal fans World wide post letters once a week for the next four weeks to UEFA & FIFA complaining about Barcelona FC’s ‘tapping up’ of Cesc Fabregas. Also post a letter just once to Arsenal FC requesting that they formally complain to UEFA & FIFA. I have drawn up 3 template letters that I will email to willing participants. All you need to do is type in your own Name & Address before printing off & posting. Momentum will be boosted by you forwarding the email to every one of your Arsenal FC fan family & friends, encouraging them to participate.
    The aim of repetitive letters is to create an Admin headache for UEFA & FIFA with thousands of letters received from all over the world & display the strength of feeling from Arsenal FC fans. The purpose of the single letter to Arsenal FC is again to display the strength of feeling from us fans.
    My email address for this campaign from where I will email you the letter templates is ……..

  206. Ha ha.

    Dunno about the attacking trio though. Because of injuries and rotation, I believe, it will be something like:

    Chamakh Arshavin

    Walcott Nasri

    With plenty of interchanging.

  207. goonerandy

    Chris – Again (it has alreay been repeated god knows how many times). Nobody is advocating huge outlays of cash.

    So what is it, you expect Wenger to pull off more miracle signings.. or flash the cash? I don’t get your argument, you say we need this and that player like its a very simple task.

  208. Supercod – That is a good overall view of things on here i think.

    From what i have seen a “doomer” appears to be somebody who openly questions a player. Regardless of if he/she does it constructviely or just plain maliciously.

  209. Not sure SG that I agree that Deni lacks flair. I’ve seen him tackle with a back heel nutmeg and pull off some stunning sleights of foot and waht about his long range shooting?. I think more often he looks like the kind of player who ‘does a job’ for the manager. ‘Keep it tight, keep it moving, win it back move it on, hold your position’

  210. supercod, you and goonerandy.

  211. Chris – Was the like of Eduardo/TV5/Nasri “miracle” signings, or were they the type of extravagant £35M signings you keep harping on about? Which one?


    Were they good signings, at good prices. If so, these are the type of signings we should be looking at. We have already made one so far, a couple more and we would be set. All for under the price of one Yaya Toure.

  212. No one is doubting what Wenger has done for Arsenal – but fuck me he did not put Arsenal on the map. I seem to remember an Arsenal before Wenger. Why does saying something, that Wenger has just this very day also said, mean you are a doomer and does not ‘have a clue’ – Dare to question – fuck me what he, infallible? No he isnt. But saying so doesnt mean i dont admire the man and appreciate what he s done. ARSENAL has been the biggest SUCCESS of the Premiership – get real will you …

  213. The other thing to think about as it pertains to transfers is Arsene being a victim of his own recent success in the transfer market. I guess when you look at the impact that Sagna, Nasri, Arshavin and Vermaelen have all had, one can see how supporters might be excited or anxious for Arsene to continue to work his magic.

  214. transfer*

  215. Has C’bob really left us? Anyone know him beyond ACLF

  216. Fair enough Passenal.

    From my point of view, my biggest gripe is the way Arsenal has been bitch slapped all over the media, especially with the thugs masquerading as Barca players taking to the media to talk about Cesc every time they get an itch. FIFA and UEFA have shown how incompetent and useless they are by allowing this sort of unacceptable behaviour to go ahead without consequences.

    Cesc can’t continue to claim the “I’m still a kid defense”. He’s the captain of one of the biggest clubs in the world and a world cup winner. At the least, he should not be using his father as an agent (if that is still the case) for the serious conflict of interest that it represents.

    I’m more for Arsenal “absorbing” the pressure on his behalf by taking up the role of the bad guy, but the more Cesc takes the stance of sitting on the fence on account of this malarki being way over his head, the more anarchy will reign.

    How did we get to the position where the Arsenal captain is being bullied to submit a transfer request? This is a kid they threw out at 16 because they didn’t think he was good enough.

  217. goonerandy,

    All those players were watched over time, and brought in at the right time, with the right conditions, without pressure and hysteria from you.

    That’s why you might need to hush, be an adult and let the manager do his job without 50,000 hysterical people on websites undermining him and the harmony of the club.

  218. goonerandy

    Exactly – do you see Chelsea, City or United making them signings, he is working on it. You are panicking as if he will settle for a squad that will not cope with a Premier league season. There is only so many times you can pull a rabbit out of a hat. With clubs all over Europe unwilling to part with their valued squad players due to financial difficulties, it is even harder!

    One way or another we will have the numbers.

  219. Ole – Hysteria? if you say so.

    I am pretty sure we watch players all the time, during the season and after it. So you would hope he already knows the targets.

    Nobody is undermining anybody. I am pretty sure that he does listen to our ramblings, nor would he care. It is just fans debating the team they love. Some get more upset than others, and some act like children. But that is all it is.

  220. Fuck off DeiseGooner

    What do you measure success on you twat.

    If it is financially and managing to actually run a football club then Arsenal is number 1.

    If you think Spending 400m of a billionaires pocket money is success you are a bigger twat than we all thought!

  221. Chris – this is thing; i am not panicking. Initially I just highnlighted my thoughts on the situation. It is only after having repeat myself time after time, and correct people randomly making stuff up that is sound like I have a bee in my bonnet about it. I don’t.

  222. Passenal,

    It’s time our Cesc stood up to be a man. It doesn’t speak well of him, to have the likes of Caveman Puyol, purporting to speak for him using rhetoric Cesc won’t use.

    If he subscribes to what Puyol and the other cnuts are saying, he should say it himself, if not he should tell them to shut it.

    It reflects very badly on him. These guys are his friends, and they appear to either be disrespecting him and Arsenal.

    My esteem for Fabregas has not dropped 1 bit.

    I understand how difficult this all is for him, especially with Barca telling him it’s now or never, and with him spending months in the company of these people, all expressing extravagant desire to have him at Barca.

  223. It’s nothing short of hysteria. Arsenal have been active in the transfer market all Summer. The manager says we’re looking for players. Yet we have the likes of you threatening suicide essentially.

  224. Heh,

    So let me get this right then Ole –

    You so cleverly say that we have 5 problems in defense – but then go on to elaborate that we have all the required resources in-house to deal with these issues.

    It kinda begs the question as to why nothing seems to have been done to remedy these problems over the past number of years then doesn’t it..!!

    A bit like saying – we have a superb youth system, yet in 2007 when our fine young players capitulated at the business end of the season do you think any lessons were learned when the same thing happened last season? Like maybe we were short on some leadership experience and balance. Did your castrol index not provide any answers Ole?

    Our defense has been nothing short of shambolic over the past number of years for a club of our stature. We can’t even defend a 2 goal lead with any sort of assurance against far lessor teams. If we managed to remedy this, were sooo good up front and in midfield – we might actually win something.

    For someone who spends so much time pontificating on a number of blogs – you might actually put a little effort into your thinking rather than resorting to calling people like Bill a “doomer” because he asserts and substantiates a similar opinion. A tad lazy and dated dontyathink Ole?

  225. andy

    The children are the ones who fail to understand why are club acts as it does. It is laughable of you to come on a demand Wenger to pull out another Vermaelen and Nasri. Like its such a simple process which happens over night. Wenger scouts these players for months before integrating them. Soon the intregration is happening from within where the youngsters will make the jump up the 1st team with ease. Get with the program mate

  226. Chris – where do you keep pulling this “spending £400M from, then directing at somebody when they have not said that. In fact I have not seen anbody mentioned figures like that unless they are implying that a “doomer” thinks this is the way to go.

  227. Joe – another idiot to believe nothing has been worked on to erase these errors.

  228. ArseChicago,

    I know, but it’s not asking too much from supporters to understand the economics of today. Signing a worldclass player fro 7 million is still very difficult to achieve even with Arsenal’s world wide scouting net. Some doomers believe they grow on trees and only needs to get picked. And that Arsene is deliberately missing out on them for whatever reason.

  229. Chris – Nobody is “demanding” anything. Just saying those type of signings are what we should be making.

    If you are happy with Almunia or Fabianski in goal for the season, good for you. I am not because I want the team to do well, and think with a modest investment that area could be improved. It is not really difficult, but you seem to be struggling to grasp this.

  230. Oh Sod off Joe.

  231. Heh, Joe makes a very good considered post and is called and “idiot”. How ironic.

  232. andy u dont need to hold DeiseGooners hand you know.

    Deise’s believes the money Chelsea spent to earn a trophy is a success. There u go. Was that hard?

    geeeez what has happened lately on this site!

  233. goonerandy, are you twelve?

    how ironic.

  234. goonerandy

    I think many on this site will say yuo are struggling to grasp a lot of points mate. Go do one.

  235. Chris – I have not heard him say that.

    Notlager – I won’t even bother because you probably are.

  236. It’s not a case of ‘pulling rabbits out of a hot’. Arsenal are acknowledged with one of the best scouting networks around, the result of a lot of hard work and investment. The reason we bag quality players for roughly half what other teams pay is testament to the system. There’s no doubt the machinery is working overtime to strengthen before the season kick-off – not heard of Gazidis’ whereabout for a while. It’s the thoroughness of the system which leads me to believe Koss will prove to be an astute purchase but until he has a run in the first team the jury will inevitably be out.

  237. goonerandy, are you sheep?

    how ironic.

  238. ha ha ChrisGoona came down mate. Running a football properly is not a measure of success its how it should be, lets not applaud ourselves too much on that one eh. Where did i say spending 400 mil is? In fact i find that disgraceful and totally classless. But hey if you want to believe thats what i see as success and am panicking over arsenal not doing then so be it.

    Success is winning trophies. Thats the defining measure for a successful sporting team. And boy have we been successful – but the most successful – do me a favour

  239. Delia-----Block 112

    Another jolly read. Thank you to those kind folks who complemented me on my occasional posts.
    I missed out yesterday but cannot let Spectum’s
    rants against AW pass by without comment. His remarks were disrespectful in the extreme. AW has given his all to our club and the innovations and far sighted business plans have put us ahead of the game. We are the best placed club in the league to comply with the new squad numbers and our facilities and financial standing are of the highest order.
    I was so pleased to see AW in almost “party mood” following Tuesday’s game. There were times at the end of last season when he looked really stressed out and I began to wonder whether he would see his contract out.
    For us , who appreciate the “beautiful game” and
    expect to be royally entertained ,we have few complaints. I am convinced an experienced CB will be in place before the end of the transfer window,so let AW manage and in him I trust.
    Meanwhile ,I am looking forward to my trip to the
    Emirates on Sunday and will pass judgement on our new signings once I have seen them in action.

  240. Chris – Quite the opposite.

    i have grasped that there are some really good posters on the site, with good opinions. Some of these posters agree with my views, and plenty don’t. All is good.

    There are also some posters who are more than likely under the age of 15 with very little experince of life ingeneral, and certainly Arsenal before Wenger. When they cannot back their arguments up properly resort to childish name calling and the like.

    I think that is about right. It is a good site, with a great daily blog.

  241. “It’s time our Cesc stood up to be a man….If he subscribes to what Puyol and the other cnuts are saying, he should say it himself, if not he should tell them to shut it……It reflects very badly on him..”

    “My esteem for Fabregas has not dropped 1 bit…”

    What your saying Ole is a total phucking contradiction..!

    Cesc is by no means mr innocent in all this and he’s been very poorly advised and completely outplayed by Wenger. Coming out with statements that Wenger is like his second father – just isn’t phucking good enough for the captain of this club.

    And people think the Captaincy doesn’t matter. It phucking well does – because its about leadership both on and off the field. Do you think Ferguson or ancellotti would have appointed a 21 year old boy as captain?

  242. anyway had enough argueing about so called issues which aren’t even issues that have been turned into issues!!!!!!

    We need 1 CB and we are more than equipped to go.. Those Almunia Bashers, Fabianski Bashers, Denilson Bashers…. go support fuckin Citeh if you can’t handle it.

  243. Notlager – Do you know what ironic means? Perhaps not. Just putting the word after random statments does not make sense. Ask your English teacher when you go back to school.

  244. andy lets leave it as that

    DeiseGooner, success is not a measure of trophies. Would you class Liverpool more successful if they got relegated yet won the Carling Cup?

    You speak absolute rubbish and havn’t got a clue on how far Arsenal has come.

  245. Yes maybe. I don’t rate some of our players, so it stands to reason I would go and support somebody else after 25 years of support. Speaks more about your thought process than mine mate.

  246. goonerandy, do you read your posts? Bleating about perceived insults when you dish out yourself. How ironic, indeed.

  247. Chris – Yup. Consider it left.

    We will some football to talk about at least tomorrow. And hopefully plently of goals.

  248. Notlager – I really would not “bleat” about insults I get on an internet forum mate. It really does not affect my life in any way. Insult away if it makes you feel better.

  249. Hello my friend Joe…

    You seem to have developed a mean cursing streak while I’ve been away. What did they do to you…LOL! How goes you?

    Are you looking forward to the new season as I am? I think Chamakh and Koscielny are good signings. Let’s see who else uncle Wenger will unleash from us before the end of the transfer market.

    As for Cesc, I actually agree with you for once, though I would have gone easy on the profanities.

  250. Although you did get the “ironic” bit right there if you thought I was bleating. Have a pat on the back.

  251. Don’t worry about that silly sp*d Delia.

    It really was a sp*d.

    This quote from notlagers link above was more interesting then YW’s Amstrad built Cyber-Troll:

    “FULHAM are sensationally taking legal action against Premier League chairman Sir Dave Richards.
    They are accusing him of being involved in Peter Crouch’s £9million move from Portsmouth to Spurs”

    I mean, Crouchy?
    Understandable, if it’s say the transfer of some star, like, um, that upcoming young player who obviously is very well suited to the PL at his current age, Raul

    In other news, I see, that off in the distance,

    Mount D**M is rumbling again.

    Flights from Heathrow have been suspended again, & people with respiratory conditions are advised to remain indoors.

  252. goonerandy.. for sure

    Probably wont come back on till monday, but enjoy the football anyway!

  253. Chris – And you mate.

  254. goonerandy, I was quoting you if you haven’t noticed.

  255. to brighten up everones day…

    Spurs 1 – 4 Villareal

    hahahah makes me laugh every time! And they think they can do well in the champs league, never mind winning the title!!!! Joke club

  256. Chris – “Joe – another idiot to believe nothing has been worked on to erase these errors” = he didnt say it wasnt worked on – just not been fixed – and it hasnt.

    Why are you trying to twist my words? success = trophies. You claim Arsenal is the most successful club in the premiership – i say its not based, on the fact that we havent wont the most league titles.

    Would you class Liverpool more successful if they got relegated yet won the Carling Cup?” no of course not, id class that as failure and relegation.

  257. Who cares what Ferguson or Ancellotti would do, except chavs?

  258. Notlager – I did, but it does not make it ironic.

  259. Anyway, can’t be arsed with tittle tattle. I don’t mind debating all things Arsenal, but I am not here for slanging matches.

    No more.

  260. Ole they care so much about the mancs and chavs and know so much about their players don’t they? They seem to admire them so much …

  261. DeiseGooner

    So what is your underlying issue with our manager if he has tried to correct the defensive issues that have left us trophyless. Would you prefer someone else in?


    Do you want him to personally hand you the knife to slit your wrist, or can’t you do it yourself? Seriously cheer up. You are supporting a very fine football club that challenges every year despite mobving stadiums. Enjoy the football and stop your bitching.

  262. Chris,

    Welcome back.

    You contributions on here are like the cartoon section of the times…..Candy floss for the brain.

    Did it not dawn on you Ole that we actually had the right personnel last year when we had Gallas? And please tell me how a player like Koscielny is supposed to instantaneously replace a proven player of Gallas’ stature? Since 2006 we have changed Jens (Almunia), Sagna (Eboue), Kolo (Vermy), Gallas (Kos) and with any luck we’ll be rid of Almunia too. And of course this season there’s also Sol, the great and wonderful signing Mr Silvestre and Senderos who we couldn’t manage to give away.

    Yes all the signs are there that were on top of things and moving in the right direction eh….!!

  263. “can’t be arsed with tittle tattle” you couldn’t make it up could you? Like a cow saying it can’t be arsed with all this cud chewing milk producing mooing…

  264. Not surprised you think it’s a contradiction. Not surprised at all.

    My esteeem for Cesc is based on his commitment to the club so far, and my willing to accept the difficulty of the situation.

    I know that if Barcelona had not been in for Cesc this season, he’d have very happily and commitedly stayed. It’s a matter of the heart for him, and I understand he’d not preclude one or other.

  265. Ole G,chrisG,evilfreik…y d hell have we not won things in the last 6yrs if wenger was doing well? Man utd has, chelsea has,even liverpool, spurs, portsmouth have.
    Poor luck? Then we must be very bad to get 6yrs of ill luck
    Injuries? Common other clubs have them(essien,hargreaves,man utd’s entire defence,rooney,torres etc) &stil win things
    The only reason that seems peculiar to arsenal is a bunch of young lightweight inexperienced boys with a stubborn egotistical coach who’s obsessed with his tactical prowess
    U can tell me to go support the spurs or mancs, but I’d say don’t bother I’v already gone there, @least the team is making effort to improve, then you’d say y am I commenting here & I’d say I just felt so sorry 4my fmr fellows I decided 2say hi,
    Jesus I can’t stand being fellows with guys who name djourou as their club’s cb, when man can call on ferd,vidic,evans,brown,hell even o’shea Wud do better than blind djou &now they’ve got smelling too. Or call eastmond an epl dm, shit who does that insect expect to get the ball from? &he’s supposed to prevent the likes of essien,de jong, palacios, fletcher etc 4rm dominating the midfield?
    Goonerandy you’v got better things to do than waste your breadth on wengers stupid children (chris,OleG) &their cousins

  266. Chris:

    “One thing we can all agree on, is that if the DEFENCE IS SORTED, either by personnel or by organisation, we have every chance of winning the league. Our attack is full of talented playmakers and goalscorers.”

    Spot on, I have been saying that since the beginning of last year. This is priority Number 1 – 10 for this team.

    I am not sure why all the argument and name calling. I think nearly all of us Goonerandy, Ole, Chris and Shotta included agree that we need a another 1st choice CB and although slightly more controversial many feel we need a new GK. IMO a DM would be a luxury signing and would allow us to comfortably rotate Song/Denilson and in some cases play 2 defensive midfielders. A DM is certainly not a priority and I think the chance of us adding another is zero. We can certainly win without a new DM assuming Song stays healthy.

    My concern is whether we will get those players most of us agree that we need. (CB, GK) This summer has been somewhat more frustrating then most. Hopes were raised when we were told that we finally had paid down the debt enough to really become more aggresive in the transfer market to fill those spots in the squad that are thin. So far KOS is the only addition. I had hoped we could have had our dealing done by now so we could be ready to have a good start. We could be in a world of hurt if for some reason we are not able to find the right CB at the right price in the next month. Rightfully or not I have resigned myself to Almunia in goal. I hope that does not haunt us. It is somewhat disappointing to me that we have such a talented team with so much potential yet for whatever reason we have to rebuild our central defense. We already have issues with defensive organization and lack of stability makes it difficult to solve those issues especially when we need a good start.

  267. fuck sake Chris why do you have to turn this into a ‘Wenger Out’ stance. I want him to resolve the issues once and for all – not with a 20 year old, not with a man u reject in Silvester, not with a near to retiring Schwartzer.

    And where do you get the impression im depressed enough to want to slit my wrists? Why do you call having to repeat myself because you cant get the point im making, bitching?

    How does pointing out our defensive shortcomings relate to Wenger hating and suicidal tendencies?

    Grow the fuck up mate.

  268. Bill. We also got Chamakh, no?

  269. Finsbury,

    a transfer scandal involving Harry Redknapp? No way…

    And SIR Dave Richards of all people, tsts… why did the FA appoint someone like Richards as their chairman after what he had done at Sheffield? No surprise they are in such a mess.

  270. Joe,

    Absolutely, we had the right personnel. I always advocated keeping Gallas. But if ultimately there wasn’t a way to keep him, then he had to leave. I still think we might need to re-sign him. On the other hand we need a long-term solution to our defence, and Gallas doesn’t represent that. Vermaelen, Djourou and the new signing will be that.

    But this was classic nonsense from you;

    “And please tell me how a player like Koscielny is supposed to instantaneously replace a proven player of Gallas’ stature”?

    em, by playing well and putting in the performances? Sure, he doesn’t have the experience but neither did John Terry when Chelsea built their defence around him. You’re rushing into judgement, putting way too much faith in your own judgement.

    But it also happens that Arsene is looking for another experienced centre back. Remember that part?

  271. Joe and Ex Spud

    Thats good, point out all the reasons to why u hate our club and manager. Keep it up, the supporters which are not blinded by the idiotic media and le groan type fans will actually enjoy the football and supporting Arsenal. You guys can continue sulking like little spoilt bitches who still miss the invincibles. Fuckin children, yet again prove that stupidity has no boundaries! You have been left behind by a club which is so far ahead you can not even bring your pathetic little minds to realise what is going on.

  272. there you go anain Chris ‘hate our club and manager’ did you also say earlier go support man city? ha ha you are the fuckin baby here mate

  273. Ex gunner,

    You’re no longer a gunner. Go to a spud or ex gunner forum. I hope goonerandy would take your advice and stop wasting his breath. take the doomglooming elsewhere.

  274. Heh.

  275. Yikes to this discussion!

    Arseman talks sense.

    On a point of order, however, ladies and gents, comrades and friends, members of the diplomatic core … Arsene Wenger did put Arsenal ‘on the map’, like it or not, and I mean the global map.
    It is well documented. Either that or Arsenal’s extraordinary rise to a global fan-base happened to coincide with 1997 onwards. Like a singing detective, I am not a believer in coincidence.

  276. You mean apart from when GG won a European trophy a few years earlier?

  277. ZimPaul – no doubt Wenger had a hand in that – but another coincidence might be the global explosion that is the Premier League – just a thought mind – now dont take this as a slight against Wenger, i dont hate him. 🙂

  278. Bill,

    “We could be in a world of hurt if for some reason we are not able to find the right CB at the right price in the next month.”

    I worry about being too young in dentral defence but I think you should acknowledge that even with however many centre backs we could still be in a world of hurt. If you want guarantees you’ll never get them.

    Can I ask what you mean by being aggressive in the transfer market?


    “Unless Arsenal get a decent centre half, goalkeeper and central midfielder, I think they’ll struggle to hold onto fourth place. Man City and Tottenham look like good first 11s now.”

    Needless to say Arsenal did not get a new goalkeeper, or a new central midfielder, and still finished THIRD, let alone fourth. The author, a Mark Ellis from Windsor, perfectly encapsulates the foolishness of this time of year with his final summary: “Man City and Tottenham look like good first 11s now.”

    This is not Football Manager. This is not Fantasy Football. I don’t care how good first 11s look on paper, I care about how they combine, how they actually play football.

    Every summer the teams that spend big are hyped, and those that don’t are written off – something that, astonishingly, is even being targeted at Fergie’s ManUSA at the moment. It is hilariously absurd, as irritating an annual tradition as Merry Christmas Everybody belting out from department stores.

    Don’t fall prey to it, children. Ignore it, dismiss it with the contempt it deserves, and patiently watch the action from Austria and the Wengerdome. Soon the real stuff starts, and yet again we’ll see that big spending does not necessarily result in big success.

  280. But you are right, Wenger has tranformed the club.

  281. I agree with Bill, on many points there. Not sure the arguments or name calling is needed either to be honest. It can really lower the tone of what is often an intelligent discussion board…

    Call it dooming or whatever, dont really care, but I feel that a quality experienced CB is needed, not necessarily a GK.

    As someone said earlier, if we have a solid CB pairing, then the opportunities for our GK to be exposed reduces drastically. But someone of Mertersacker’s ilk would be just the thing to give our defence some much needed confidence – something that is needed to eradicate the errors of seasons past. I’m not saying that wenger should buy him, just that that type of player is what we should be looking at – in my opinion..!

    Almunia has gotten a lot of stick over the last couple of seasons – but if we watched every Chelsea match last year or every Liverpool match with the same detailed analysis as when watching our own team, we would be giving Cech and Reina just as much stick – for sure.

  282. Darius, the Zambian team killed in the aircrash in Gabon I think, perhaps Guinea, was the most successful generation of footballers in their history. The entire team was killed, including technical personnel, barring 3 or 4 players coming from europe or unfit. It has affected their football until today, since the foundation was removed. It was a sad sad day. Zambian football is otherwise very capable, and trust me no one wants to meet Zambia in Africa. They are the traditional giant-killers.

  283. Silver Gunner

    ok steww perhaps I was being a bit harsh with the flair aspec his long range shooting is of the highest standard i wish he would have a pop more often.

    10 goals from him is not beyond him.

  284. I must admit, Many City does worry me. When the same thing happened to Chelsea we all dissmissed it initially. Me as well. And then they dominated.

    If Many City step into that bracket, we really will have to be on our guard.

  285. Fuck off DeiseGooner

    I throw everything back at you, and you cant handle it. Your a loser and a pathetic supporter!

  286. Geo,

    I’m mostly with you. But sometimes I despair. Why do Arsenal fans and the blogs act like children when it comes to transfers.

    Why can’t they accept that the club and manager want us to have a very strong squad and work every single day to make that happen?

  287. SuperCod at 2:14:

    AWESOME. LOL. Best post of the day.

  288. What have you thrown back at me? Apart from labeling me a doomer and telling me to fuck off

  289. No Deise; it helped but I see no Everton, Villa, Spud, Man City, Hammers, and not too much Chelsea global fanbase, to name a few examples. It’s all ManU, Liverpool and Arsenal. In Africa Arsenal are every-bloody-where, but perhaps behind ManU in this respect.

    I cut a lonely figure supporting Arsenal in the 70s and 80s in my sweet part of Africa. the 90s were worse. then came Thierry, Bergcamp, Vieira, Pires et al. Now who created that team?

  290. Ole – amen to that! Evidently, to some people, it’s as if Wenger is leading this seedy conspiracy in an attempt to topple Arsenal to it’s foundations, by not replacing players with ‘brand names’ so that he can say he’s got the best financial model – or something… ;-p

    Havent quite worked out what they think Wenger’s up to – other than making the best (and most difficult) decisions for one of the best clubs in the world.

  291. I am quite sure most of the doomers here have stepped onto a football field and kicked a ball. Listening to them you would think it is a formula, an exact science. If we have conceded a few goals there is some unique way to stop it, and it is supposed to work out 100 times out of 100.

    Welcome to the real world , sports is lot more complex than that. it is not a video game where there is sure shot solution to every problem. A good player is not guaranteed to get it right 100 times out of hundred. Football coaching on the ground is not football manager coaching where if you get the right coaches and right schedule your stats go up invariably.It is not a fucking math problem. Just enjoy the ride!!!

  292. I am quite sure most of the doomers here have notstepped onto a football field and kicked a ball.

    Why do I keep missing the keywords. 😦

  293. goonerandy, desiegooner, now joined by Jon-Jon’s alter ego Joe.
    Your circular logic is is frankly fatuous and disengenous.
    You keep moving the goal posts every time another of your fantastic tales of woe are exposed as the spurious ramblings.
    1st. Arsenal doesn’t have enough defenders – Knocked down as b.s. as most teams have 3, some have four and Wenger is in the market for one more.
    2nd. We don’t have quality defenders – More b.s. (see Verm, Kos, Djourou).
    3rd. We can’t compete if we don’t spend – Super b.s. (We intend to live within our means, no intention of spending like Oil City and the Chavs). 4th. Shucks we don’t mean big signings, only 2-3 quality signings. Smelly, specious b.s. – Quality comes at a price. Wenger and his scouts have proven it takes time.
    On and on, and on. This is like having a conversation with inmates in an asylum.

  294. Actually it’s a rare day I don’t see an Arsenal Tshirt in downtown Harare. The other day at the airport I stopped to buy a paper and said to a guy next to me “I like your team”. He was Arsenal. He said “Thanks brother”. 5 minutes later I was going through this checkpoint – intelligence guys, nasties actually, but there’s a certain courtesy even with ‘them’ and there he was! He smiled, checked my passport, asked if I thought Cesc was leaving and waved me through.


  295. haha! Sort it out keysersoze lol.

    So you’re trying to tell me that Football Manager does not refelect exactly how real life football works??? Jesus, i’m gonna have to go away re-think a few things… 😉

  296. Supercod at 2.14.

    You’ve got it backwards. These people are not pragmatists because they always routinely ignore reality.

    One of them asserted to no end that he doesn’t want expensive signings, yet he wanted top class, experienced centre backs ready to go into the team. How do you resolve that contradiction?

    I support Wenger because he’s the ultimate pragmatist.

  297. I hope played football on a regular basis thank you very much, and at a decent level. The team’s set up is not right without the ball. Anybody can see that. The best way for us to get better is practice, practice, practice on the training pitch. Whoever is in the team.

    Our defence is isolated on a regular basis. Our full back play a big part in our attacing game, but we regularly get caught with both up the field. That is stupid. If one goes forward, the other should drop.

    Our gap between midfield and the back line is way too big, when we lose the ball we are not compact enough. These are things that can be sorted out on the training pitch…..if we devote enough time to it.

  298. Darius:

    Yes I forgot about Chamakh. He will certainly be helpful. Still my obsession with defending makes me always worry about that side of the pitch first.

  299. Shotta – We agree on one thing then. Your last sentence. Except deaf one’s.

  300. Correction: I support Wenger because of the right balance between idealism and pragmatism.
    Every time Wenger has bought a player for the first team, he’s bought an experienced international usually around 24-26 years old. Every time he’s bought someone for the squad, he’s but a promising kid, who’s usually an international. I subscribe fully to this approach.

  301. Ole – “One of them asserted to no end that he doesn’t want expensive signings, yet he wanted top class, experienced centre backs ready to go into the team”.

    You really don’t listen do you? TV5 cost £10M I believe. Not £30m, not £20M, not even £15M. It is possible.

    And before you bleat “this takes time”:

    1. You have no idea how long it takes, the same as the rest of us.
    2. If he had been watching TV5 for “ages”, why could he not be watching more than one player. I would have thought we had quite a few scouts.

    Stop ignoring people’s points because it does not fit in with your childlike argument.

  302. Zim – nice to hear. One of the sticks used to whack Arsenal is the percieved lack of British talent and dependence on imported talent but I guess that has given the team a much broader global appeal.

  303. The best way for us to get better is practice, practice, practice on the training pitch. Whoever is in the team.

    And I am sure that there is a lot of practice. Any suggestion to the contrary is unbelievable. What I want to say is practice is not going to make everything right. In the football field opponents switch formation, switch tempo, switch passing very often. You need to allow for the fact that this can affect us every now and then, and it will affect other teams also.

    Our defence is isolated on a regular basis. Our full back play a big part in our attacing game, but we regularly get caught with both up the field. That is stupid. If one goes forward, the other should drop.

    This is countered by the DM dropping in line with the central defenders. And really do you think when one of the full backs is attacking, the other full back is in the same line with him?

    Our gap between midfield and the back line is way too big, when we lose the ball we are not compact enough. These are things that can be sorted out on the training pitch…..if we devote enough time to it.

    If anything, I thought we play a high defensive line and there is some gap behind our defenders, not in front of them. That is why we seem to get caught by the long pass. That is why Wenger does not like playing lumping CD’s unless absolutely required due to injuries. And again, there is no reason to believe that the club does not try to sort out things in training. Only there are too many variables in action during an actual game of football. It is simplistic to assume that since some problems exist nothing is being done in training.

  304. oh FFS Shotta its like a roundabout in here – having to continyallt go over tour points because either they have been taken up wrong or someone has twisted it to trey throw it back in your face.

    3 defenders isnt enough – 4 just about cuts it, wenger said he needed 5 sometimes – thats exactly the point

    we do have quality defenders – but either not enough or unproven at this level just now

    We can compete if we dont spend due to the great youth setup and manager we have – but we have to spend when we dont have the inhouse solutions to long standing problems after we sell off players

    we dont want and are not askin to spend like city

  305. Can’t wait to see Chamakhattack! Chamakhattack!

    I reckon he’ll work very nicely with our style of play and will give us someone who is outstanding at headers to aim for in the box. Him, RvP, Arsh, Nasri, Theo, Cesc, Jack, Vela, Bendy, Rosicky, Diaby – what a delightful array of attacking potency… Bollocks to defence – we’ll be fine!!

  306. I want Howard back. You knew where you were with Howard.

  307. Keys – OK then. So it is not our players, and it is not our systems. Why are we such a mess at the back so often?

    Other attacking teams don’t seem so “all over the place” as often as we are. Why do you think this is?

  308. Ole @ 1:41:

    I agree that our defensive problems are not personnel related although adding the right personnel would certainly help. Like you I just can not understand why our defending has been inadequate. I have my theories but it would start another firestorm of cursing.

    Nonetheless as you point out we clearly have not done an adequate job defending and there certainly is plenty of blame to go around. Ultimately our coaching staff has to take responsibilty and make the changes needed. Adding Keown or someone like him is not a magic bullet but I can not see how it could hurt us. That said we certainly have enough brain power at London Colney without him and hopefully this year things will change for the better.

  309. goonerandy,

    We’re talking about today, this market. Please draw up a list of suitable

    1. Most of our transfers are players scouted for 1-3 seasons.

    2. Many players are watched, and are signed when they are available, and if considered suitable.

    3. Outside of this, we can just identify a player from any club, and then go pay what the club wants. Usually top class players are only available on this ‘spot market’ very expensively. If anyone came in search of Vermaelen they’d have to pay us much more than the £8M we paid for him. Maybe double, really.

    4. There are times when we can ‘spend big’ but it can not be the approach of the club because transfers are fundamentally too expensive in general. Players are overpriced so to get value you have to take your time and do it the way Arsenal and Wenger do it.

  310. draw up a list of suitable 2 centre backs, keepers and defensive midfielders and write how much they would cost.

  311. Injuries? A bit of bad luck? And of course, I and no one else here is saying that we have the perfect team and perfect system. I don’t know where you got that. What I am saying is that there is never a solution that is supposed to work 100 percent of the time. In that case football managers wouldn’t have been paid in millions as every street would have one of them.

  312. Ole – I am not suggeting he go out and start scouting a player now. It will be an organic process happening all the time. There must be some on the radar (which he alluded to today). Hope fully one, or even two of these will come to light in the next few weeks

  313. OleG – depends on your definition of expensive I guess.

  314. And also, our problems stick in your mind because you follow the team. Our competition also has these problems. Otherwise we wouldn’t have challenged for the title.

  315. Keys – i am not suggesting there is a 100% way to sort things. They were just a few observations I had. Have you ever noticed how teams gets lots behind the ball against us, but we seldom seem to manage to do that ourselves. It is due to lines between the area’s.

    We get the same number of players back, but they are too far away from the back 4. That is why teams play through us so often. To gap is too large. Have a look at the weekend.

    No the full backs are not in line when we attack, but one (normally Clichy to be fair) gets caught forward too often. Sanga seems to have abetter sense when to stay back.

  316. Silver Gunner

    jesus the past couple of days have been bad so peops have a difference in opinoin we are ALL aresnal supporters.

    It always gets this bad in the summer transfer window people can’t stand it that peops have different opinions regarding our beloved team this should be a forum to air our views not slag one another off.

  317. Silver – Agree with that 100% mate.

    Anyway, off home now. The weekend is here!

  318. Why do doomer have such thin skins?


    “It is hoped the new regulations will have pluses that go beyond the encouragement of homegrown and academy players and provide clubs with the incentive to continue investing in their youth-development programmes. They might also discourage them from stockpiling senior players and so offer an economic benefit.”

  320. If they make it a point of duty to criticise the club and manager, in many cases unfairly, they shouldn’t mind having their own feet held to the fire should they?

    Why then do they whine?

  321. Ole @ 3:44:

    Everything you say is why I am nervous at this point. All of us agree that we need another CB yet with only a month left and all of those difficulties regarding scouting etc. We all knew at the start of the summer we needed CB’s . Are we really going to be able to sign a suitable player in a month? I will continue to be concerned up until the time we actually sign someone.

  322. How many goals conceded last season were as a result of the full backs being caught out?

  323. OleG – I agree that Wenger is more pragmatic than he’s given credit for. Nobody outside the club fully knows the contraints he’s had to operate under so whilst it looks like he’s persevered with players who probably needed a couple more years ‘integration’ there’s a good chance his hand has been forced. This could be evidenced by his reluctance to use Upson more when he was coming through. It hasn’t helped matters that PHW etc routinely bleated to the press there was a considerable war chest when the odds are there wasn’t. This builds up unrealistic expectations and gives ammunition to those eager to jump on the errors of ‘junior’ players.

  324. fat frank hahaha

    FIVE thousand unsold gold-plated Frank Lampard iPods are to be “melted down” following England’s dismal World Cup flop.

    Goldgenie, backed by BBC Dragon James Caan, is said to be planning to rebrand them with kids’ cartoon character Hello Kitty. A TV source said: “They’re melting down all the Frank Lampard iPods.

  325. Bill,

    Your nervousness won’t resolve the issue. The other day I owned up to my own nervousness about the squad, and feeling we need a centre back and a go-to player in midfield and attack.

    But we never have an ideal squad. If we went in with 3 centre backs we well might be fine.

    I just want you to acknowledge that the manager and club absolutely want to have a strong squad, and are trying very hard to find suitable players to fortify the positions they’ve identified.

    Wenger has said we’re trying to bring in a defender and keeper.

  326. There is no way Arsenal can step up unless Arsene get rid of players like Denilson( overran by refrees and Sidibe), Almunia (hopeless), Diaby ( have played over 100 games but still crap), Rosicky(always injured) Eboue ( the clown) and Flappianski.

    Fourth is the target once more

  327. AW gave an interview regarding Upson last season.

    If you type in Upson and AW into google, I’m sure anyone can find it.

    Inaccurate conjecture is just pointless speculation.

    He was injured and acted like a twit. His loss.

    But I suppose, that is AW’s fault too.

  328. Notlager – that is superb…..!

  329. The fumes coming down out of Mount D**M are making it quite hard to see properly. No wonder people like to mae things up about Upson.

    Some people seem to be stumbling about all over the place.

  330. Make>mae

  331. Finsbury, post the link – I’ll have a read….

  332. Somebody was talking about scouts earlier, who didn’t seem to know much about it… might want to read this:

    Interesting read.

    Apparently Grimandi’s done an interview with French magazine called RMC? But I can’t find anything other than a soundbite about Gallas going to PSG. Can anybody help?

    Also, anybody read this as a bit of leverage strategy…

    “There are plenty of names that we consider and we analyse. We look at the financial possibilities and the technical potential. But it is impossible for me to come out with a name.”

    i.e. No point Club X driving player Y’s price up just because they know Arsenal have the need – we have player’s A, B, C, D and E waiting in the wings so quit holding out or miss out on making the deal.

    As I said before, I’d be very surprised if we didn’t add another centreback before close of window.

    My feeling is that we have 4 or 5 possibilities, and we’re negotiating long and hard to get a fair price. Maybe even fair enough to buy two of them. And I’m talking about 4 or 5 from the pool of players we have been continuously scouting for the past 2 years. Those who know Arsenal know the score on this. And unsurprisingly those are the ones who aren’t pissing themselves with worry on a blog. Apparently Giles saw Koscielny play more than 40 matches before we signed him, analysing every aspect of his game.

    Anyway, might find out more in this press conference.

  333. What’s the problem Supercod?

    Bleeding fingernails?

  334. The bare facts are we havent won anything for 5 years because the players we have have not been good enough.Hand on heart how many players in the squad now would get into the 2004 team Cesc Yes Sagna maybe but thats it.The Team has been in declins for 5 years.The likes of Adebayor,Diaby,Denilson,Silvestre,Eboue,Walcott,Bender,Almunia,Flappy have not been good enough.You can bury your head in the sands all you like Ole and Co

  335. Ole:

    I have never questioned Wenger desire to win and have a strong squad. His actions on the touch line say everything you need to know about his desire to win. When I first started on this site I really believed some of the stuff that Miles Palmer would say. I had never stopped to think about what Wenger had done for this club. He is probably the greatest “total manager” in history considering both the on field and off field management of an organization that has been in transition.

    I ackowledge that the manager and club want to have a strong squad. No one questions the motivation, however, the methods that have been used to build the squad do not make complete sense to me and thus we argue. I continue to believe strengthening our team in the transfer market although not a magic bullet or a guarantee, will improve our chances to win this year. IMO, we need another center back and a GK. For whatever reason, if we do not get those players it will negatively impact our chances to lift the league trophy at the end of this year.

  336. zimpaul

    i think algeria 1982 is the best african team ever,we had world class players and should have at least made it to the quarters.

  337. The point I was trying to make with Upson was that at the time the club was operating under a different environment. There were a number of top quality established players ahead of him and, arguably, the club was better placed to compete in the prevailing transfer market than it has been able to whilst the stadium costs took it’s toll. This might account for why what appear to be inexperienced players are given extended runs in the first team. There seems to be a lot of critisism for Wenger’s youth policy, I trying to put forward a counter argument.

  338. Apologies Supercod, I think I misread your earlier comment.

    Yes, I agree with you.

    Upson’s mistake was to think AFC were not a big club, and that he didn’t have to fight for a start against other, lesser players. He was the first or second choice back up, but that didn’t mean that those ‘below’ him shouldn’t start a game, ever.
    He had a distorted impression of his own position, a bit like Bentley. Injuries also must have lead to some frustration.

  339. Lesser players is crude expression.

    I meant Cygan!

  340. I dont know where some of you get the energy and time to have the same old arguments every day!

  341. At least the cricket has been entertaining.

    (Top quality fast bowling, from both sides…amazing!)

  342. Finsbury – thanks mate!

    Word – people love the banter, gets us through the day at work I think…!

  343. Bill,

    I believe that as long as we have the broad outlines of a proper big club squad, then we have a good chance of winning.

    Worse teams than us have won the league, namely Man Utd in 2007. They weren’t all that special.

    You know Bill, what I’d like you to do would be to explain what doesn’t make sense to you about the way the squad has been built. Let’s start from that point. It’d be helpful if you showed an awareness of the club’s reality.

  344. S*y Sports news just said that Cesc is trying to engineer a move away from Arsenal. They described him as the Spain playmaker.
    Am I alone in despising everything Murdoch touches?

  345. How the fuck would they know?

    Garbage. Sky “understands” no doubt.

  346. They can’t even acknowledge that he’s our playmaker.

  347. The horrible former Australian prime minister, a Murdochian Murder Inc. acolyte, did not win a recent election for the ICC presidency (Cricket’s version of FUFA), so that was a victory of sorts, against The Destroyer of Sport.

    Although, I doubt the votes against were given for innocent reasons.

  348. *

  349. “Am I alone in despising everything Murdoch touches?”

    I’m pretty sure you’re not alone Steww, in fact you may have more support than you think. 🙂

  350. Supercod @2:14:

    “Idealists – want to improve the club through promoting the young element and integrating into the first team. The use of the transfer market is deemed a last resort.

    Pragmatists get exasperated by idealists’ percieved refusal to see an alternative view, idealists insult pragmatists as they cannot understand how objective critisism and ‘slating’ the club/manager/players are different things.”

    You’ve got it entirely backwards. The real pragmatists have been the ones who don’t mind that Arsenal hasn’t won a trophy in five years in order to ensure that the club has a brighter future. Another characteristic that sets us pragmatists apart from you idealists is the fact that we know that there has been consistent improvement and that our sacrifices (youth project) wil pay huge dividends. In fact idealists is too kind a word for you lot. If you don’t have confidence in our squad and our manager then you are insecure, period. You may think you’re pragmatic for buying into the usual doom merchants assesment of the club but you’re not. You’re just scared little children who can’t stand it when theirchav and Manc friends gloat about their bought trophies.

  351. Bob, is probably watching Cricket. Hopefully, that is the reason for his absence:P

    MOopaay u still around!!

    And . to your *, G4E.

  352. and then some………………..

  353. Hey Ateeb, how are you man? I miss Cbob and his Cider.

    Thanks for the .

  354. Gainsborough – just a casual observation, I’ll leave the pigeon-holing to the experts.

  355. I’m doing alright.

    Yah miss Cbob, wanted to discuss the cricket match with him, but he isn’t around. Hope he’s doing alright.

  356. David James chooses Bristol over Celtic – ’nuff said….

  357. Arsenal fans and their club can’t face the reality that your captain doesn’t even want to play for you and that is why you all slam Puyol, Xavi, etc, when they all just simply state the truth. The media is asking them questions, and they are answering them. If you don’t want the answer, don’t ask the question. So why is it Puyol’s fault that Cesc wants to come to Barca, and when the media asks he gives his opinion? I don’t get all the hate from the fan-boys. It’s just a game.

  358. Below is a reply to the comment above. I assume that it’s from a Sp*d or someone else. Perhaps the same Troll from earlier. It doesn’t matter, they have no relevance.

    The question is:
    do FC BluntBarker have any relevance?

  359. AW didn’t just deny the Cesc transfer again, he pretty much destroyed all the groundwork that the Spanish rags’ had lain this week to give their latest batch of rumours some semblance of plausibility.

  360. – ‘

  361. Its like forcing yourselves to live in denial. Wenger will force Cesc to hand in a transfer request, wich is exactly what Cesc did not want to do because he does love Arsenal.. The problem is, that he loves Barcelona even more. 7 years is a very long time, you should be greatful to him. Trust me when i say that the rest of the world is judging Arsenal for this, just as they are judging Barcelona for their persistance. To want to play for a team from the heart in this sport, is what separates this sport from the likes of the NBA where money and contracts are everything. RESPECT!! remember that word?? well after so many years of service to you, Arsenal should respect Cesc’s wishes too.

  362. Finsbury, i read the article you posted.. Just wanted to say that it is complete BULLSHIT!!

    If Cesc ever said anything like that, he could never set foot in Catalunya again. And those comments would be very well known by now. It is a very stupid article, that made me laugh.

  363. Did anyone hear anything then?

  364. “If Cesc ever said anything like that, he could never set foot in Catalunya again.”


  365. You heard it too then Fins. Thought it was a bad dream.

  366. Just a passing shadow.

  367. Very perceptive Isaac….

  368. There’s a rumour doing the rounds that Cesc only wants to go back to Barcelona to try to get his parents back together. They divorced a few years back by the way.

    Anyway, he’s a big fan of the 60s comedy The Parent Trap, and feels that if he can get them to meet at Parc Güell one sunset with the help of his imaginary twin brother, he might be able to spark their marriage and reclaim some of his lost innocence.

  369. sunu equalise for france in under 19 championship good match

  370. What he doesn’t know is that Guardiola was the one having an affair with both his mother and father. When he heard of Cesc’s troubles during the separation he was so consumed with guilt that he gave him his number 4 shirt.

    What Pep didn’t tell Cesc was that it was the exact same shirt he’s been wearing the night of the gangb-

    Better leave it there.

  371. Something is growing in Puyol’s v*gina…I think it’s called Isaac.

  372. Isaac….Cox..?

  373. Any one knows if the Emirates Cup game are broadcast on Arsenal TV?

  374. france score against spain 2-1
    cracking match

  375. Come on France!

    I love AW’s press conferences:

    “If I want to buy your house and you don’t want to sell, you don’t negotiate with me, that’s completely normal.”

  376. According to the Sporting Life transfer centre, Flamini Tells Cesc To Follow His Heart.

    That’s a bit like Larry Flint giving advice about abstinence to a bunch of horny 15 year old girls.

    Does Flamini actually play football any more? Or does he just warm the bench after following his heart.

  377. flamini have not follow his heart just his wallet

  378. He doesn’t have a heart, just a calculator to work out how much money he can make from his next move!

    Well done France for winning the under 19 Euro’s.

  379. To all the doomers who want Arsenal to splash the cash, in direct contradiction of the club’s policy for the last three years, in his press conference today, AW again made the strategy very clear. According to

    Arsène Wenger believes his squad is at “the start of a cycle” and will make a natural improvement again this season.

    Wenger was quick to remind reporters that he chose a different method to team-building a few years back and, as a result of his investment in youth, he expects his players to make a step forward in 2010/11 irrespective of his transfer dealings.

    “We have to remind ourselves that we decided to go with a very young team three or four years ago and we have developed this team,” said Wenger.

    “I believe that two years ago we were quite far [away from the top of the table] but last year in April we were two points away from the top. Normally we should be closer again because that development is part of a young team.

    “I know that in England when you do not win the championship it’s always about buying but what is important is that we improve individually and as a team because we are a very young team.

    “We are not a team that is at the end of a cycle, we are at the start of a cycle. So our future will be decided not by who we buy or need but as well by how much we improve.”

  380. @SG.

    Sometimes I wonder why Wenger bothers explaining a well thought out growth strategy that is geared for long term stability to a bunch of press freaks who continuously show that they have the personality of an asparagus.

    The media has from time to time shown how low they can get for the sake of sensationalism and selling a story. These are guys who would never let the truth get into the way of a good story.

    Sometimes I think Wenger should just tell the lot to fuck off.

  381. It’s bizarre the respect that old red nose gets and he shuts a lot of the media out altogether.

  382. Steww.

    I dread to think what they’d do if Ferguson was actually English.

  383. Ole @ 5:16PM:

    As you know to even start down the road with a discussion like that will go round and round with nothing ever resolved in either of our minds.

    Have a good weekend. I can not watch the games so I will be eager to see the blog on Monday and get everyones thoughts.

    I am anxious for the season to start and the transfer season to finish. I realize that me calling anything tedious seems rather comical but I am glad the real season is almost here. Hopefully the team will play well especially defensively and I will have nothing to talk about.

  384. “Hopefully the team will play well especially defensively and I will have nothing to talk about.”

    Bill, So if the team is doing well, you have nothing to say, and if they do bad you’re all over them? 🙂

  385. “The personality of an asparagus.”

    I wonder what personality traits an asparagus would have?

    Would you like to elaborate on that Darius? 🙂

  386. 🙂 🙂

    🙂 🙂

  387. Ah, Asparagus Syndrome; Repetitive behaviour and inflexible routines.

  388. Sounds extraordinarily familiar OOU

  389. Is asparagus a diuretic ?

  390. Is it safe to post now? 🙂

  391. How can you not love Arsene? He’s given all for Arsenal, aways done what was in the club’s best interest. People underestimate how hard it is for a winner with a winning team to start from scratch having reached all the peaks.

    Arsene will win titles for the Arsenal again. He deserves recognition for the amazing work he’s done in these parts.

  392. It is actually moronic to think that a manager like Wenger is just happy with 3rd or 4th.

    But most people who don’t agree with him think, he’s not buying players just to prove them wrong, or that you can win with kids.

    If you really observe the man, you would know that he has put in 13 years of his life, reputation and always made sure that Arsenal’s best interest came first.

    You can’t say that Wenger didn’t see this coming when he went on the new stadium adventure, he could have said in 2006: You know, I got you this far now I need to go do something else. Yet, he didn’t. He knew it is going to be tough for him as a manager of a top club with no money competing in the most difficult league.

    It’s time for the people who are so angry at Arsenal & Arsene to “Wake up and smell the coffee”. In either case whither we stayed at Highbury or moved to the Emirates we were going to struggle with money. Actually Imagine us now in a 38,000 stadium while Chel$ki’s money hurling owner is pumping the cash up the club’s ass? We would be in a much worse situation than being 3rd or 4th for a few seasons.

    I bet most of these people are either living on social security or under Mom & Dad’s roof and have no idea how hard it is to survive on a budget these freaking days.

    Grow up…one day you will wake and face the reality when you have to pay some bills, or feed your kids and don’t know where the money will come from. Only then, you will know that this man is doing what amounts to a miracle.

    Enough said, time for a Corona.

    We love Arsenal…………We do.
    We love you Asrene……We do.
    Aaarsenal Arsene We love you.

  393. gunner4eve

    you are for me, fan of the year.

  394. Well said G4E. Funny how it gets safe to come here after bed time and the real nonsense posters are only around in the school holidays.
    I was thinking strange thoughts about Arsene and realised how much he probably sides with the doomers and haters himself. A man who hates to lose above all else probably castigates himself more than those of us who love him ever would.
    How unbelievably lucky I am to be an Arsenal supporter alive during the time of Arsene Wenger’s tenure.

  395. Nasir Jones-Nasri

    Long live Arsene Wenger.

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