It’s Over, So Don’t Cry Any More, ‘Cos International Week’s Been A Bore
So that’s it, the international break is over and we wait the return of the walking to see how wounded they are. It seems somewhat fitting in the modern era that England’s 2,000th international goal was scored by a foreign player beating the archetypal English midfielder to the ball, applying the proper technique to the finish.
England might have been undefeated in a year but they have not convinced this week with two stereotypical Italian wins. With players missing, there might be the expectation that performances will improve; it is just over six months away but I wonder if this time, the English press might be more restrained in their advancement of the team? No, I don’t believe it either. Still Theo Walcott seems to be averaging 7/10 for his performances recently and The Times this morning is rating Jack Wilshere’s rise to prominence as a positive for England which offers some hope for sanity.
That is in short supply when it comes to the game’s administrators. Sandro Rosell has been stung by Barcelona’s liquidity problems last season and is determined to milk the cow for all the cash there is. Starting with Uefa and Fifa. The clubs have a point; no other industry borrows key assets from businesses at the employers own risk and can return them in any condition, paying only lip service in real cash terms.
It is obvious that Rosell is taking a negotiating stance and as such does himself no favours in opining that a reduced Premier League would allow more dates for an expanded Champions League and friendlies. The clubs are looking at a rapacious public and believing it will never stop, wilfully propelling themselves toward oversaturation of the market. It is not going to take many years before stagnation of football’s revenues can only be avoided by price increases to an already squeezed matchday audience.
A favoured counterpoint of Rosell is a reduction in wages. It might happen at the lower echelons of the game but those such as Robin van Persie will not be taking paycuts for club owners to pocket. Bloated administrations could be surgically removed from the game but that is not likely. Equally, not paying agents is likely but it seems harsh especially when Mr van Persie’s has worked so hard to get this story into The Guardian this morning.
An entirely brighter point is Carl Jenkinson. A torrid debut has been put behind him and progress is being made on his quest to be a Premier League right back. The formidable Bacary Sagna is ahead of him at the moment but the youngsters industry and capacity to learn, aligned with a natural talent, offer promise for the future. England would do well to offer him an international route before the Finns nip in with an offer that is too good to turn down.
The transfer window is a mere 45 days away and the fires are being lit for a cracking New Year. First up today is Etienne Capoue, The Sun‘s French starlet tipped to be Arsène’s next gem. Pesumably they are buttering up the Arsenal manager to write a column when ‘Arry gets sent down, Redknapp’s idea of ‘A Scrubbers Diary‘ has not been well-received. Daily Star reporters are better informed, knowing Arsène is suffering from travel sickness and is not keen to leave these shores on scouting trips. Well, that’s the only reason I can think that they are watching Jack Butland. Either that or Fabianski and Almunia are off this Winter which will lead to flags and bunting being hung out in some quarters.
Marouane Chamakh has to change his mind and decide to return to Bordeaux if their utterly mental President‘s dream is to come true. The question is, which one of the hardy perennials is to be seriously linked with the club to be signed now? Hazard and Goetze are next Summer’s targets so whom will it be? Breath is being baited.
’til Tomorrow.
Posted on November 16, 2011, in Arsenal, Football, Premier League, Soccer and tagged Arsenal, Football, Premier League, Soccer, Transfer Gossip. Bookmark the permalink. 133 Comments.
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Morning Yogi – worrying words from RVP – we’ll have to offer a big wage package but if he is greedy for £250K and MC decide they want him, then there is nothing we can do. We’ll have to hope that the years of love, the fan connection, and the opportunity to become a legend weigh enough in our favour.
Atrophy this season would be a good sign of progress as would a big name signing to show our intent.
Good to see Benayoun will get his chance in the Express article – I’ll be interested to see what he adds.
Butland? The papers would love the various bottom connections there, “Butland makes an Arse of it” etc.
This morning’s best bit from the newspapers – bet he’s flying on a cloud of happiness this morning. Good luck to the lad. http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/nov/15/corby-striker-james-harrison-goalkeeper
http://news.arseblog.com/2011/11/vertonghen-rumours-get-serious/#comments
Yogi,
In particularly poetic voice this fair morning!
Just three more days to go.
“The France midfielder left for a cut-price £24m”
From The Guardian .
Really? I say we did rather well to get that for him with 12 months left.
£40 Million for Cesc is looking better by the day as well.It seemed bad at the time,but as it goes £64 million and the spirit reinforced is looking like Arsene really,really does know.
Whisper it quietly but sounds as though everyone’s coming home in one piece. I literally cannot remember the last time that happened.
Joel Campbell’s goal against Spain – nice work fella.
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=10150473980880460
Goonerkam re your comment yesterday about being sad at Nikki B’s desire to never return to our club – my ten penneth –
Nothing sad about that kam – in fact I was delighted. Never managed to improve his first touch, an egocentric disconnection with reality which borders on messianic psychosis, frequently makes waves in the tabloids, not particularly well liked by the rest of the team, has no respect for our club and, in spite of looking pretty ordinary at Sunderland, does not want to return.
He’s still talking us down even now – claiming the club mistreated him and YAAAAWN.
I look forward to the day we can offload him to whoever will take him and I could not give a jot if his career fizzles, splutters and dies. He could be a good footballer but he’d have to be able to distinguish between the difference between a great player and himself and where he currently is for that to happen.
Problem is, unless he does up his game, at 52K a week, we might be stuck with him for a while yet…no way should he ever be allowed back to our fold though. I’d rather he rotted in the reserves.
I still can’t believe he never apologised for his glaring miss at Barca. His ego was too big – bet he just pretends it never happened and remembers only the good stuff that he did.
@ Jonny,
U guys are serious about this 52k a week thing… How exactly is that worked out? Cos he changed his shirt number? Hmmmn
Either we revise the wage structure and raise the upper level just enough to keep loyal players from straying or we continue to lose them and man up. On the one hand I’d love us to be a club where players feel they can stay for their whole career, especially the likes of Van Persie and Song. On the other hand, what our current model has shown is that nobody is irreplacable, except Wenger! No other manager could (or would) do what he does.
Personally I think the upper wage limit needs a little revision at this stage. We’re bound to be in much better shape now than five years ago in terms of debt and the new stadium, so a little pay review may be in order.
Question: Do the Mr.20%’s of the world only earn their cut from transfer fees? What do they earn when they negotiate a better deal for a player at his current club?
I heard it was 52K & yes to match his shirt number (which was also deliberately chosen).
It could be lies but his wages are at least 50K – as we found out in this edifying article
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1354689/Nicklas-Bendtner-I-deserve-50k-week-wage-Arsenal–Ive-skiing-football.html
@ Markus, I believe agents get a cut of their client’s basic wages as well as transfer fees, but not bonuses. Another reason to make players remuneration more performance based!
Jonny, I thought you’d have more sense than to link to the Daily Fail. Also, 50,000 is stated as fact in the article without any sources. The player himself doesn’t mention how much he earns. 52 to match his shirt is fucking idiotic. Pardon my language.
Markus – that article, where he was quoted justifying players wages, was printed in every main newspaper in the country – they all cited 50K. Even before that article I had heard he was on around that amount – if it was massively wide of the mark Bendtner himself would probably have taken issue.
I’m not saying it’s gospel – but I’m struggling to understand why you are so adamant he isn’t on 50K+ – it’s in line with Diaby and less than Walcott’s reported wages and we are known to have one of the highest wage bills (though less so just recently). We pay very well across the board.
It was also mentioned as a sticking point for those trying to sign him – why do you think he ended up at Sunderland on loan?
I hate the Daily Mail as much as anyone – I was in a hurry and didn’t even notice which link was top. Mea culpa.
Asking for 52K, having been offered something less, (instead of 50K) IS fucking idiotic which is why it sounds perfectly believable.
I see he was involved in a ‘drunken riot’ (nice overstatement) with Agger last week.
back to your old tricks eh jonny?
in other news, nice finish by campbell, cant wait to see him playing for us next season.
No not adamant, I’m just aware that nobody outside of the player, his agent, the club and any possibly potential suitors knows for sure. For the media it’s complete guesswork.
Surprised to even consider that Walcott may be on less than NB. It’s been a few years since he renewed his contract but I suppose when he last did (in 2009) he wasn’t a first-teamer per se so I suppose it’s possible. Madness.
Just one thing Johnny. Even if we overlook you quoting unsourced Daily Hate articles we cannot overlook the fact that Nic is an Arsenal player and you calling him names is pretty poor.
morning everyone, I’m also very thankfull the players are coming back from these games without any major injuries and other setbacks.
the club and the manager have realy got to comeup with a mutually beneficial solution to keep the talent we want at the club and stop the hemmoraging of our players to the moneybag teams, without compromising our main ideals and principals. i know its easier said than done, but we can’t keep this two steps forward one step back routine that has been plaguing us in the past few years.
it is super frustrating when we nurture these talents and just when it seems the time for fruitation has come to lose them to teams who either genuinely need them or have a hidden agenda to weaken us. hopefully this next transfer window will see us get stronger and more equipped to tackle the challenges still ahead. keeping Alex and Robin and also Fabianski is imperative. i would definitely include Arshavin in that group also.
@jonny
i read and understand your feeling regarding Nikkei B. i think my sadness is mostly due to the fact that Nik is putting us down in public by saying he doesnt want to come back, not because i think he is a super talent and will be missed by the team. that said, if he had worked harder and been more realistic as far as his place in the peking order he would have been an adequate backup and could have served us well off the bench and/or helping us with the cup competitions.
UP THE GUNS!!!!
Steww-I’m pretty sure many others would call nik names. He has openly told the press of his desire never to return to arsenal. He obviously forgotten that arsenal was the club that gave him many chances, even though he had many poor performances, his arrogance is annoying for many people including me.
Steww you might not be able to overlook it but that’s hardly surprising!
However
The article itself is not unsourced
I didn’t actually call him ‘names’
Why should I show him any loyalty or love when he has less than zero for the club I support?
He was clearly bad for the team and I hope he achieves his stated aim and never returns.
Yeah Jabberwocky – looks like I’ve found my calling. Heh.
That Capoue looks like a bit of a beast.
Just because bendner is still a arsenal player docent absolve him from being a righteous dick does it now stew? Just like being a true supporter ( as some like to put it on here ) does not mean they are not right cunts. Not aimed at you stew. I don’t feel any loyalty to him just because he is still on our pay roll. He has dissed the club and wants out so let’s just politely ask him to close the door on his way out. We can take that 52 k and give it the players we need to keep happy.
Bendtner is an Arsenal player who has said he does not want to play for the club again. His loss, and our gain. He is a lazy player, and one who will never give 100% for the cause.
Anyone who finds medicine/science interesting should have a read of this it’s remarkable and IMO rather fascinating.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/nov/13/nocebo-pain-wellcome-trust-prize
The naked power of thought eh?
An entirely brighter point is Carl Jenkinson. A torrid debut has been put behind him and progress is being made on his quest to be a Premier League right back. The formidable Bacary Sagna is ahead of him at the moment but the youngsters industry and capacity to learn, aligned with a natural talent, offer promise for the future. England would do well to offer him an international route before the Finns nip in with an
offer that is too good to turn down.
best laugh ive had all season, keep up the great comedy, thats made me…ha.ha so oh stop it ha ha ha
@Jonny 1:21, I read something about this not long ago, I thought it was on The Guardian website, but I can’t find it now. Maybe the next time Diaby goes down with a muscle injury we should give hima few sugar pills and tell him to get on with it
Fuck up boomer. Now and always.
it wasnt boring for ireland!!!!!!!!! it must be awful for english fans,,,qualify for everything year after year,,,then start hyping players up b4 a major finals..then BANG,eliminated,its same thing everytime a finals is on,,,english media expects miracles,,but in reality the squad,,managment team,and attitude of the players is dreadful
Meh, who cares about international football?
As a genuine half English, half Irish – I get the best of both worlds.
Still, delighted as I was for the lads, I can’t be arsed with international football – I’d not shed a tear if it was axed entirely. Scarcely watched the last World Cup – and regretted it when I did.
Jonny,
I agree with your view expressed earlier regarding Bendy.
The shame of it is that when he was a youth player he had great presence and an excellent touch. He is one of the very few players I have seen who has “developed” an appalling first touch, which is in inverse proportion to his experience.
Really disappointed because he has all the right makings in physique, confidence (too much?), goal scoring etc, but that first touch, and his big mouth??? Pity!
Nice post again Yogi:
Hope we can keep RVP. I understand how he feels and there are very few of us who would not change jobs if we were offered a lot more money to do the same job at with a different company. This will be his last contract and his earning power ends in about 4 – 5 years so he needs to make as much as he can while he can. Unfortunately what makes sense for him is not the best thing for the club. Time will tell what happens.
Glad the international break is done and hopefully we will get everyone back in one piece. Don’t care either way about Nik B. I really thought he would turn out to be a great player, same with JET. Both were superstarts in the reserves.
That’s true, Red Arse. He was an absolutely fantastic player when he was in the reserves. I’ve said this before, but I think he grew a couple of inches quite late on, around 2007, which robbed him that great touch and put his centre of balance of kilter as well. No kidding, not even Bendtner saw himself as a CF when he was a teenager; he was much more creative than that. It’s a real shame the way it worked out.
Van Persie should be reminded of the patience the club has afforded him. He should also be reminded that no other big club would’ve put up with him having his break out season at twenty eight years of age. I absolutely love him as a player, but if he decides to leave I will not remember him to fondly.
It is imperrative that we tie him to a new contract. Otherwise we will simply be a club that cannot hang on to its best players. And that is not a good view of the club.
no worries at all..6-7 months and a treble later we would have no problems with the contracts..
i believe
“It is imperrative that we tie him to a new contract.”
But not at any price ,Otherwise we will simply be a club that can be held to ransom by its best players.
PG – Very true. I don’t think it is all about money though (obviously if somebody offers him double whatever we offer his head will be turned). If we look like having a team which can seriously challenge for honours, I think he will stay. If we look like endless seasons of transition, he may decide that in order to get some medals he has to move elsewhere.
I really hope he stays. He is so important to this club in more ways than one.
Just a little warning for anyone interested in keeping their PC intactus.
I was contacted by Microsoft, via an ‘agent’ who said my PC had been hacked and was being used to produce counterfeit copies of my microsoft software programs.
He explained that if I went into the system files I would see under ‘services’ a whole load of files marked with ‘error’ and ‘warning’. Very persuasive too!
I played along because I was interested to find out what the scam was.
The files in question are just system log files and quite normal.
He said after a long spiel that if I downloaded a remote access programme he would be able to rectify the problem that my Norton or McAfee security software could not detect.
Yeah, right!
These guys come across as friendly and professional, so beware! Give them remote access and you are cooked. Excuse the phraseology Jonny!
This medals thing really annoys me.
It is a team game so your ability as a footballer is in no way reflected by your medal haul.
Who would consider David May a better player than Matthew Le Tissier ,simply because May has a drawer full of medals?
“These guys come across as friendly and professional,”
So does Jonny for that matter
George. But that’s just how you feel about it all, I know for a fact that majority of players would disagree. Winning medals is what it is all about, well that’s how it used to be. Now it’s money first then medals. But medals are still up there on every players wish list.
PedG,
You make a sensible point that ‘we’ should not be held to ransom over players contracts. The fact is the club are well handled by boring but careful accountants, like me really,
who will offer the management advice as to what is feasible and sustainable and attempt to pay what the going market rate is, if possible.
What tickles me tho’ is how possessive we all are in ‘protecting’ or ‘spending’ the club’s finances dependent on our particular personal genetic make ups.
How often have I read that ‘we’ should not pay x for this player, or y for that player. On the other hand I read ‘we’ should spend £30m or £40 million or whatever is necessary to get this player or that player.
For myself, I might express an opinion as to worth, occasionally, but I really know that the laws of prudent, commercial economics are at play here and the club will act accordingly, whatever we think!
The RVP quote about our pay structure is an old one. RvP wasn’t captain then and no one can tell me his loyalty and love for the club, and his appreciation for our ‘limitations’ hasn’t developed quite a bit since then.
As far as I am concerned, nothing has changed about his contract situation, and this is a non-story. Not so say I’m not a tinny bit worried, I am. But no more worried than I was in the summer. I’m now resigned to wait until next summer for whether he will sign or not.
So explain how Medals relates to ability?
Or do you think May was better than Le Tis?
I dont think there is any need to break the bank for RVP, he is 28 and remember our policy for players above 30. i think a 4 year contract earning 120k should be fair enough for him
Also tell me how you know it as “a fact”?
Have you doe a survey,or seen the results of one?
Also tell me how you know it as “a fact”?
Have you done a survey,or seen the results of one?
no new injuries from the international break?? brilliant
George,
In addition to GJ’s answer, medals aren’t meant for comparison of one player to the other. Its certainly no way to judge a player’s skill, and few if any do that.
You can’t however overestimate how important medals are to the players themselves. and the cash of course, as GJ points out.
So Nicky B is on 52k, Deni is earning a cool 60k and then comes RVP with 70k? You really couldn’t make those numbers up!
Red Arse and Big Al – I don’t remember his reserves outings – intriguing to hear he actually ‘developed’ a bad first touch. I find it interesting that he has, since then, been unable to recapture what was once a good first touch.
It’s such a fundamental part of the game and I would have thought, through application, tenacity and man-hours, the he would have been able to improve it since, even a little bit.
Though it sounds as though it’s rooted in the mechanics, one wonders how much of it is psychological – I think it is difficult to improve if you are unable to accept or see that you have any weaknesses.
I played cricket at school with someone like this, who could not see why I was picked as lead bowler and he was overlooked. In his head he was just as good as me and, as a result, all he did was complain about unfair treatment. Eventually he was dropped altogether. It was tricky as we were good friends – but the harsh truth, which I never admitted, was that I was a lot better than him.
He is still young of course – but without a tweak in attitude he could be destined to destroy his career – confidence is one thing vaingloriousness another altogether.
Yes but you see Henristic I think that is exactly what people are doing,overestimating how important medals are to the players .
GunnerJ,
True dat!
Street talk? Me? 
I think you are correct. Players do want to show at the end of their careers a nice haul of silverware trophies, to the fans, family and pundits. (That is why, at a guess, Cesc left after 8 barren years, using DNA as an excuse).
In practice, the Chavs, after Abramovich, attracted players for big money transfers and huge salaries, and so too have Manyoo and now Citeh, and in doing so have built trophy winning teams, so completing the virtuous cycle (for the players) of both big money and many trophies.
Sad, but true!
George , I never said it has anything to do with gauging a players ability. But you can’t tell me that it doesn’t mean anything to the players. And I point to it as a fact as I have read countless interviews with players stating how they dream of lifting trophies, I have on the other hand never read one where a players says he could care less about trophies. So I’d say its a fact.
Red Arse – phraseology..?
PG – I’m a professional at marketing, cooking and at least semi-pro photography.
In terms of friendliness I’m both an amateur and an amateur .
How would you know that George? Have the players been telling you something in secret different from what they say in the media at almost any given opportunity (I am of course referring to players with a chance of medals)?
I certainly haven’t heard any player even hint that medals aren’t all that.
pedantic george, you are really living up to your name. When you play football games you generally want to win. When you play football games for a team in a league or cup competition, you generally wan tto win the competition. And if you’re a professional footballer who’s put in all the hours, taken all the knockbacks and finally made it onto a team like Arsenal you certainly will be driven to win and succeed, hence win medals. Stop talking bollocks man.
Jonny,
I should have said, as a matter of balance, when commenting on Bendy, that in addition to his dodgy first touch, I never really understood why he was played so out of position on the wing.
He is still a good goalscorer, at least at international level, with headers, shots and tap ins, but this was hardly likely while stuck out on the wing last season and crossing for giants like Arshavin, Jack and Walcott.
Strange.
Nice post as always YW. I do not take any notice of what Sandro says. As you rightly pointed out, less league games will simply be seen as an opportunity by FIFA to schedule more meaningless friendlies, which in turn will lead to more injuries to players. Again as you pointed out, the compensation to the players respective club/employer is next to nothing compared to the loss incurred. A perfect example would be RVP injured whilst playing for Holland. How can The Arsenal quantify such a loss? Based on his present form, it could be argued that without him we would have no chance of qualifying for the CL, which in real money could be valued in the 30-40 million pound region(if not more). And that monetary value is ONLY in regards to the CL. What about league position payouts, CC and FA Cup?
Jonny – I almost fully agree with you in regards to international football but I think it is more to do with saturation than anything else. I never could figure out why we have to play qualifying games for the WC/Euros/ANC etc. During regular season. Take Ireland for example, we had to play 6 qualifiers which means taking 20 odd players away from their various clubs at times when the clubs need them. Why can these games not be played in the summer before the international competition in question is played? I know you said you barely watched the WC but inthe off season it is better than nothing I think. It is also unfair on the players as they are faced with the difficult choice of playing for their country(which the vast majority see as a huge honor) and risk getting injured or refusing to play and being seen to disrespect their country. Especially so when it is a friendly.
And to all those who voiced their congratulations on Ireland qualifying, thank you very much indeed!
although to be quite honest I really could have done without a hangover on a Wednesday morning. I was asked a very good question by a friend last night which I honestly could not answer and that was, what exactly would happen to Ireland if we actually won the Euros? I mean is it actually possible for an entire country(and millions more worldwide) to call in sick from work because they are so fucking hungover they cannot get out of bed? It would make St. Paddy’s Day look like a regular Friday night out!!!!! Simply from the point of view of a social experiment, I think all of our opponents should just roll over so we can find out. COYG!!!!!!
George – I don’t know any sportsmen who don’t want to win things big prizes – of course it doesn’t measure how good you were – no one (outside of Pele maybe) thinks Butt was better than Shearer. Shearer, when asked, admitted he made wrong decisions in his career (cos he won fuck all) but wouldn’t change it.
Le Tiss is a weird provincial throwback – certainly not the yardstick to use a measuring device.
George,
Likes to challenge conventional wisdom from time to time. Good on you man, only be more clever about it next time
FFS ,I am not saying they do not want to win medals.I am saying it is not the priority as a “professional”
“A professional is a person who is paid to undertake a specialised set of tasks and orchestrate them for a fee. One who is payed for a service or receives a fee for their work or effort. ”
Cant find any mention of medals when looking up the word professional.
Agreed Red Arse – though, funnily enough, his passing proved quite agreeable at times.
Def should have had a few more goes down the middle.
*George likes to challenge…
PG – That is a strange view mate. I would imagine the majority of players at the top level judge their career by what they have won througout their career. If a player thinks there is litle chance of winning something at their current club, it stands to reason that they would want to move to one where their chances are greater. Le Tiss was an exception to the rule in all reality.
lol, George, that is such a lame attempt at defending yourself.
Jonny,
“Phraseology” — just ignore me. It was a throwaway reference to your being a chef. And clearly, thrown away it should be!
Pure carnage Irish. possibly the collapse of society as we know it. I’m all for your experiment.
Surely yer man, knows ‘a man’, who can engineer this?
‘Make it so’.
PG – You are talking about a “profesional”. Fair enough. Instead though, try talking about a “professional sportsman” and I think you will find there are some relevant differences.
George, your pedantry on the professional vs medals point is duller than an interlull lasting 6 weeks.
3.38 = the sound of a meerkat scraping the bottom of a barrel.
Block4
Fair enough
George . Cant find any mention of medals when looking up the word professional.
I can assure you if you asked any professional sportsman or woman what there ambitions were you would always hear the word medal in there right at or near the top of the list, because to them it is extremely important.
Jonny , thanx for the nocebo link, back in Africa people still use witch doctors and black magic ( Tagati ) to get at people who have pissed them off. The go see the Sangoma or witch doctor and get a hex put on some one with very effective results, to the point where the cursed person will die. But it never ever works on some one who does not believe in it. So what could make it so effective other than the mind of the individual ?
Look you are all wrong.Just admit it
I wish people would stop walkout bashing winterbourne has had his pop now.
Put it this way Nigel Yes he has the odd bad game but he has more good than bad.
If midfielders would watch for his runs he would be seen in a different light entirely.
Jonny,,,
agree with u entirely on the whole self-perception thing with bendtner..its a fine balance with the optimum between low self confidence and bendtnerishness..
Unfortunately for young players, its often the people around them whom he trusts, who make all the difference when it comes to this
PedG,
Your definition of ‘professional’ is all encompassing and is not relevant in the context of a ‘professional’ sportsman.
For example, I am in a ‘profession’ as a qualified accountant (when I am not on here chatting to you)
but there is no chance of me winning a medal or trophy for doing so. Sport and sportsmen and women march to a different tune.
There is an element of truth in what you say, however, because there are so many players earning huge money with Citeh, who are unlikely to win medals getting splinters up their bums warming the bench as expensive subs, but have decided to take the money and sod the medals.
So, perhaps everyone is right!
PG inadvertently with his definition of a professional raises a fair point, as a professional, imagine if you are at a crossroads in your career path, and you have two choices -
1. Big payday move to become one out of a number of vice-presidents in a huge organization
2. CEO of a much smaller organization, with lesser pay, but with a free hand to shape company policy
what would you do?
Of course option 1 reaps the greatest financial reward, which covers the latter part of the definition, option 2 gives you a chance to hone and express your “expertise” much more than in option 1
So as a professional which do you choose?
and as with almost every other aspect of human decision making..it comes down to the individual professional in question
PG
If it wasnt inadvertent, and if that was what you were trying to say, then sorry mate
Anirudh – That would reallt depend on option 2′s potential to be the top of its field though.
It is not really accurate to compare “normal sector” work with that of a pro sportsman though. Most people work simply to earn a living, therefore most would take the higher pay. The thing with the “higher pay” option in the footballing world is that it is also likely to be the option which is also provides good opportunites to win things. You get the best of both worlds.
Anyway off home. I don’t earn enough, or indeed get a medal, in my job to stay any later
.
Laters.
Its a big coincidence that where the medals are won just happen to pay the biggest wages.
I suggest a young player would priorities a Bentley over a CC winners medal.
I think Chelsea and City have proven that money trumps medals.
Jonny, Shearer did win the league with Blackburn.
George, all players want to win medals. The problem now is that they all want to do it the easy way – by joining a club who look likely to win something. I think a lot of the players we lost this summer prove that. Those who stayed will hopefully be willing to win the proper way, through graft, hard-work and determination.
Anirudh, I like the cut of you jib, but will the PL be included in our treble or will we have to ‘settle’ for the CL, CC and FA Cup?
GA
but wouldnt being one of many vice presidents as in my example diminish the value of the said success for an individual professional
especially if there were 6-7 vice presidents with the same portfolio, to relate it to a situation at city say for example
Markus
if we are less than 6 points off the top by Christmas..then the PL becomes a part of the quadraple
“George, all players want to win medals.”
Yes I know.I am not totally stupid.Just a bit dim perhaps.
see im reasonable and rational
Anirudh,
Not sure how your question addresses the Meerkat’s point about medals.
Anyway, I would follow the bucks. Better to be the boss cat of ICI than the boss of some unknown little outfit with limited dough.
And I bet Jonny would rather be the top chef at Rules and GunnerJ would rather get his teeth into ……… oops sorry GJ that was insensitive!
red arse..
the point about success following the money (assuming its true), I clarified this in my reply to GA
“but wouldnt being one of many vice presidents as in my example diminish the value of the said success for an individual professional
especially if there were 6-7 vice presidents with the same portfolio, to relate it to a situation at city say for example”
Quoting myself..seem to be in a bendtenerish frame of mind today
Silver Gunner – what the hell is “walkout bashing”?
On today’s debate, Madals: The professional athlete’s yardstick or simply some extra bling to go with the other hideous bling bought with the millions earned playing for Citeh?
Does it not all depend on the color of the medal? I mean it would be pretty impressive to be able to open a drawer full of winners medals at the end of your career but surely said drawer would be locked and the offending key thrown as far away as possible if all that you had where runners up medals? I mean who would want a permanent reminder that they where always second best? Well, maybe the Spuds. And maybe Stoke. But that being said there are many players who have winners medals, both Arsenal and other teams, who if they where totally honest should return them as they where simply in the right place, at the right time. That being said football is a team sport, and for the most part the best team usually does win. And by best I simply mean most consistent.
Guys, did you realize Pedantic George has not mentioned you-know-who once today? Surely that is a record?
From today’s 5iver – all yours, Irish gray.
Irish hepatologists (look it up) were celebrating today after the Republic’s qualification for Euro 2012, which statisticians consider likely to increase the risk of liver complaints by as much as 18.9%. It isn’t so much that the Irish like drinking, although there’s probably a bit of that involved, it’s that they’re basically ordered to do it. No people on earth party like the Irish, and nobody’s going to let them forget it.
“They deserve to drink beers,” said Giovanni O’Trappatoni. “We’ll enjoy tonight,” said goalscorer Stephen Ward, adding that his manager at Wolves, Mick McCarthy, would cut him some slack as “he knows what the Irish public are like”. “There’ll be a party in Dublin tonight,” cheered the FAI’s chief executive, John Delaney. “The country … the country … well, the country’s going to erupt tonight.”
The problem with continually telling the residents of a country that they drink and party a lot is that eventually they start drinking and partying a lot. The Fiver has – brace yourselves – done some genuine statistical research on this issue. In 1985, before Jack Charlton started qualifying them for major competitions, Ireland were one of Europe’s more abstemious nations – at the time they were outdrunk by France, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Holland, Belgium, Luxembourg, Denmark, Germany, the Czech Republic, Austria, Slovakia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania, Bulgaria and Greece.
Then came the 1988 European Championships and the run to the 1990 World Cup quarter-finals. After their penalty shoot-out defeat of Romania in that competition, Jack confidently predicted: “I think the pubs will sell more booze tonight than in the last year. There will be a party the likes of which you have never seen before.” Then there was the 1994 World Cup: “I’m trying to encourage our fans here to have another party,” said Jack. “OK, then,” said the fans.
By 1995 consumption had shot up from 9.71 litres of pure alcohol per person per year to 11.88 – the equivalent of drinking one teaspoon of pure alcohol every three and a half hours of every day, including night-times – but the Irish still drank a bit less than Austria, Denmark, the Czech Republic, Hungary and Croatia, about the same as Spain, Switzerland and Romania and way less than Europe’s big drinkers at the time, France, Portugal, Germany and Slovenia.
But then they qualified for the 2002 World Cup, during which tig-hat sales went up 20% – “it’s been mental for the past couple of weeks,” said one fan – and which ended with a government-funded €500,000 street party. By 2005 they were each drinking 13.35 litres of pure alcohol, more than any country in Europe except the Czech Republic and Estonia. And a fair amount of the alcohol drunk in the Czech Republic and Estonia is consumed by people from places like Ireland on stag weekends.
So watch out Europe, the Irish are coming. And they may be a little the worse for wear.
FIVER LETTERS
LOL Red Arse , still sensitive but I’m on semi solids now. If you can count papaya and watermelon as semi solids , all the talk of pastys on here has me dreaming and drooling for the day I can chomp down on one. Prob another few days.
Gunnerjones – Just make sure you chomp down on Consolsbob Original Recipe Pasty and not one of MDGunner’s imitations. It may indeed be the sincerest form of flattery but it also plays havoc with one’s bowels!!
Jonny – Now that is one hell of an article. Pulitzer worthy if you ask me. I can also personally attest to the article’s accuracy as of last night. I have already assured The Girlfriend that she and I will be spending some time apart next year as I and many thousands of other innebriated Irishmen and women take in the delights of Poland and Ukraine. She then assured me that my use of the word “spending” was entirely appropriate, as she intended to use said time shopping. Simples
Evil @ 3:17:
“So Nicky B is on 52k, Deni is earning a cool 60k and then comes RVP with 70k? You really couldn’t make those numbers up!”
If thats true then I understand why RVP would be unhappy. Fortunately for the club RVP signed his contract before the current run of form. Hopefully the club will recognize the bargain that they have gotten for the last couple of years as I am sure Darren Dein will gladly point out.
The scary thing is the numbers for NB and Deni. I know its always easier to see things in retrospect but those wages seem completely insane for a club claiming it was hamstrung by lack of money in the transfer market and made deals like the free transfer for Silverstre or bringing back Sol Campbell. The boss may be a great money manager in the transfer market but it seems he cancelled that out with the way he ran the other segments of the budget.
Bill,
Those salary figures are probably all bollix.
Individual salaries are not contained in the Annual Accounts and personal data such as someone’s contract details are hardly likely to be bandied about by a discrete and professionally managed club like Arsenal.
Perhaps you and I can start another rumour.
a) Denilson is paid on a £1m per match basis. (So that’s fuck all for the last x months)
b) RVP is paid £110K per week + a bag of toffees
c) Arsene pays the club £52K a week to stay as manager.
More bollix, of course — just like the other stuff.
Yea Irish unfortunately I’m gonna have to settle for the south African shop down the street. It’s damn hard finding a good pasty here in south Florida. The place is called meal in a pie and they do make some damn good uns ! Congratulation to you and all your fellow country men. Not a fan of international foot ball but I do love a underdog so I’m gonna make Ireland my team for the euros.
I always thought Bendy chose number 52 as a play on the B52s – as in NB52 – but I`m not sure he`s as `droll` as that.
That first touch stuff Big Al mentioned earlier is really interesting. A better one & we`d have knocked Barca out last season.
Nik could not have No.7 shirt so wanted 5+2=7
I may have just made that up though
niks talents were not utilized fully for the last couple of years, as Red Arse mentioned. he doesn’t have what it takes to be a winger , although he tried. he would have been more effective as a center forward, being able to use his height and physical strength.
slightly off-thread, but seeing as lots taking daily heil as source material, Giant Haystacks bastard off-spring, martin samuels of late seems to have bee in his pants about Arsenal, he had a snipe at Arsene for daring to suggest that there’s generally ten other players on the pitch alongside RvP. It’s a shame he doesn’t publish his email like some of the other heil ‘sports’ journos.
PG
From the other day, I didn’t mean to imply that those other players were poor. Just that it interests me that Fabio Capello would ask Walcott to play RM in a defensive set up ahead of other options. Where the hell did Walcott learn to defend like that (as in better then Glen Johnson)? I must be really fick to have missed that one.
Quotes from the Daily Stand Up & Heil are about as reliable or useful as this evenings quotes from Sepp Blatter.
So, if you are a fan of orthodox right ole whing play, right on man.
although i rate nikki higher than chamakh, i dont think he was really good enough either..
not to mention hes a total wanker..
fuck him we dont want him back..
what he did to the club was no different to what cesc and nasri did..the fact hes only on loan to sunderland would suggest the wages we pay him dont match the talent or his ego dont match his talent..or a combo of both..
end of the day he was a part of the ‘baggage’ the club was carrying last season and we dont need that culture back..
same applies to denilson and anyone else who messed about….fuck them they all wanted to leave just cos some got loans dont mean we should still ‘love’ them..bollox to that.. the best ones got to go where they wanted and the rest got to go where they deserved..let em rot…we owe them exactley what they gave us over the years..fuck all…
woah JJ getting emotional there. Although their contributions never contributed to winning silverware, these baggage players still brought us joy. Almunia becoming a brick wall against an onslaught of Cuntalona players was fun to watch. Bendtner completely F**king up a golden chance to beat Cuntalona….Denilson doing that one game where he had 100% pass ratio against Cuntalona….
Bendnter is a wank for talking about Arsenal in that manner. We don’t need him back here, we have a couple equally mediocre replacements waiting in the shadows of RVP….
I cant remember ever having anything but support for an Arsenal player,but I am in the camp with JJ here.If they as to go on loan and actively want to leave.Well fuck em I say.
Arsene’s things to do
1. Convert Lucky Nick to winger ? Done
2. Convert Enoue to midfield maestro ? Done
3. Convert Santos to defender ? Pending
i like to get emotional over the arsenal..
ok maybe it was abit of a rant but fuck me..we gave nikki everything he wanted..we launched his career we put him on a pedestal, we paid him good money and introduced him to cl football..yet he never really deilvered the goods and talked a load of shit..and now hes gone hes still talking shit..
my advice to him would be to shut up and score some goals for sunderland so next time we try get rid of him its for a good fee and not a crappy loan..
the only reason why i feel hes still getting a mention is cos of chamakhs dodgy form..but a cardboard cut out of chamakh would be more dangerous to the oppo than chamakh so its not exactley anything for nik to get excited about..
@jonjon
” come back Nik, all is forgiven”
from yesterday.
or were you just kidding??
i don’t like the way he is conducting himself as well. he does need to open his trap with a bit more respect and humility. or better yet, keep it shut..
@irishgray and jonny
the Russians i have come across can outdrink anyone .
i have never seen anyone party like that. somehow they were omitted in your list.
they have to be top three, at least.
I think some people totally miss the point of Bendtner out on the wing. He was not playing out of position. Arsene does not really believe in static positions for the front players. A good player should be more versatile than that. Bendtner was still a young player learning his trade and being out on the wing was part of his development. It also gave him more playing opportunities than if he could only play up front and centre. It also added a different dimension to the team because I remember him winning a lot of headers up against a usually smaller left back as well as giving him the opportunity to cut inside and score from wide positions. It’s a pure lack of imagination and lack of understanding of modern team play to still expect ‘the big man up front who hangs about in the box to get his head on crosses’ but can offer very little else to the team. You very rarely see that type of player today, especially not in a top team.
well, it sure as heck was comical when he was the one sending in the crosses and the shorter fellows trying to get headers in. comical as hell, but i bow to your superior football knowledge and all that jive.
goonerkam
that sentance had a little smiley face on the end of it mate..it was said in jest, buddy..
“Nik could not have No.7 shirt so wanted 5+2=7
I may have just made that up though”
No, I remember him saying the same thing.
And whoever said he was not liked by his team mates, where did you get that idea from? It’s amazing which myths stick!
“It’s a pure lack of imagination and lack of understanding of modern team play to still expect ‘the big man up front who hangs about in the box to get his head on crosses’ but can offer very little else to the team. You very rarely see that type of player today, especially not in a top team.”
King Kenny will not be happy if he reads that Pass.That is Kennyball circa 1990′s too Date.
Gainsbourg69 | November 16, 2011 at 2:28 pm
“Persie should be reminded of the patience the club has afforded him. He should also be reminded that no other big club would’ve put up with him having his break out season at twenty eight years of age. I absolutely love him as a player, but if he decides to leave I will not remember him to fondly”.
I totally agree and I’m hopeful that he will remember that. As I recall, he took his time and weighed up his options before he signed his last contract extension, so this time he is not actually doing anything different so far. The difference is the timing following so closely after the departure of the two cowards and the fact that he is finally fit and showing what a difference he can make for us. Had we had a fit VP alongside the barca boy, we might have achieved a bit more than we managed in recent seasons.
Arsenal have shown with TH14 that they will pay top dollar for top players, but whatever they pay, it will be dwarfed by the riches on offer at oil city. Ultimately, he will stay if he believes that his ambitions can be realised at Arsenal and if he is motivated by more than money.
Yes george – sounds a lot like the £35 million pound man! And what a great player he is!
got you JJ,, i missed the smily face and thought you realy wanted him back.
http://arsenalist.com/video/?id=xhhaym
“It’s a pure lack of imagination and lack of understanding of modern team play to still expect ‘the big man up front who hangs about in the box to get his head on crosses’ but can offer very little else to the team. You very rarely see that type of player today, especially not in a top team.”
which is why he was never good enough for wengerball or arsenal, why he shone at brum and is why hes at sunderland now…nik is this type of player…
he was definatley played out of position..
say no more. Anyone who don’t want to try hard at Arsenal . they can go and find comfort somewhere else.
at the end of the day there are many ways to approach each game and each opponent. sizing up your strengths and trying to take advantages of your opponents precived weakness. having the right players and talents on hand to help accordingly.
there are times against certain defensive lineups where a tall and strong center forward is exactly what is called for. and other times speedy wingers can be the undoing of other defensive setups.
I’m glad the international break is over. it is exactly that, a break from football. It was a bore.
JonJon | November 16, 2011 at 8:09 pm
not to mention hes a total wanker.
The most honest statement that will appear on the entire interweb today.
The Ox showing off :
http://www.thefa.com/video/England/Mens-Under-21s/2011-12/Belgium/The-Ox-in-the-Box
129th.
Gosh, was that international break? Um, not sure how I missed it completely. Was it fun? Did we win? Did anyone win? Are the hospitals busy? Did England dazzle? Send answers on a postcard to a special friend in need.
for the record Zimbabwe beat South Africa (second string) 2-1. Yawn.
Actually got to see an International so am not so down on the break this time, but can’t wait for the next few matches to come. If we can bank the 9 relatively easy points available to us we should have toppled the pretenders in the top 6.
The $hiite-y match will be our most interesting test in our resurgent form and comes in the Carling Cup. Will it be:
Arsenal B
vs Shiite-y B
(with Nasri)
or will we be treated to their A games.
From the Cote D’Ivoire v Bafana match:
South Africa is a very welcoming and relaxed place so it was easy to chase the teams down. (Skills honed at the World Cup)
Ya Ya Toure is a big fast bloke, but Gervinho,who seemed to be aloof, is a very smiley and very personable guy when stopped (he signed virtually every piece of clothing shoved in front of him)
Eboue seemed to confirm, what I learnt from the staff at the Emirates, that he is great to have around and a bit of joker.
I ‘chickened out’ telling Kolo that he would always be an Invincible in my eyes. (he left because Gallas is such a doos – box for all you golfers out there lol)
I watched the Ivorians against Brasil in the World Cup (best live match, classic WC event, blowing my Vuvuzela with a Brasilian band), and they are always well turned out.
my guess is shitty will come and park the bus again. just like last year. the whole game, they were popping their shorts. your right, it is going to be a pivotal game. we will be very up for this game, but first is first. one game at a time.
i think they should hold the world cup every two years. l catch as many games as i can. very enjoyable.
same goes for the european and south american championships.
http://wp.me/p1aPg-1Wz
Today’s diatribe