Money, That’s What They Want
The 2007/08 Football Money League, published by Deloitte’s this week, contained no real surprises. Within the top ten, only AS Roma were a new face and they had been number eleven for the previous issue. English clubs appeared to lose out due to sterling’s relative weakness at the time of collation – or has their performance been inflated by the currencies previous strength? – may well find that they are diminished even further next time round, Arsenal’s finances being €45m lower than if the FX rate had been comparable to the 2006/07 valuations. Indeed, had that “inflated” figure been used, the club’s revenues per this report would have been higher than that of Barcelona and Bayern Munich for the period covered.
Yet does that matter? Rankings for clubs around Europe are subjective, no matter how objective the criteria. According to other research published this week, Barcelona has the most fans across the continent (44.2m), followed by Real (41m), Manchester United (37.6m), Chelsea (25.6m) and Zenit St Petersburg (23.9m). It begs the question why Andrei Arshavin left to come to The Emirates as his previous employers reportedly have 2.6m fans more than his new ones. That also highlights the popularity that continental cup-winners have enjoyed thanks to new-found success outside of their own borders. One wonders how many ZSP shirts will be spotted down your local high street nowadays.
Hold on though, last season there was research that showed Benfica had the most members, closely followed by Arsenal. Does that mean that we are more loyal than the fly-by-nights captured in the previous research? No, simply that statistics can show anything that you want them to.
The key use of reports such as these comes not from the dick-slapping on whose revenue is biggest but from comparing the revenue streams. Of the top ten, Arsenal, true to form, remain the most traditional model for a football club. 45% of the revenue comes from matchday sources compared to others. Of the exalted continental European clubs in whose company Arsenal find themselves, the range is 13% for AC Milan to 29% at the Camp Nou.
The Premier League likes to think of itself as commercially aware and collectively it might be but envious eyes might well be cast in the direction of the Italians who manage to gain 25 – 50% more from broadcasting sources. Even that is small-fry compared to the comparison of commercial revenues; Real earn double that of Arsenal and Barcelona are not far short of that figure either. Question marks remain as it is not clear whether the Spaniards figures are purely football related or whether other sports associated with the clubs are swept up in their commerical revenues. Even so, the monies gained from the sponsorship deals are unfavourable compared to others although Bayern took that to the extreme by buying the company that owned their stadium hence their eye-watering 300% advantage over Arsenal in this area.
The figures used in the report have several weaknesses. Firstly, they do not compare the various debt-levels nor balance sheet strengths. On that score, Arsenal may well be more highly-rated since their tangible assets have been funded through borrowings rather than that money being used to operate the club. Secondly, the global economic downturn hit its stride post the end of the financial years covered by this report. An indicator of how clubs will fare is their capacity utilisations; Arsenal are at 99.9% on average this season. Only three others in Europe have comparable figures at the higher end of the capacity scales.
Where the report highlights areas for concern is the way in which football is marketed. There has been a long-standing suspicion that foreign owners of Premier League clubs will break up the collective bargaining that is used in England over broadcasting. Whilst the EPL has just renegotiated to 2013, the continued advantages that their Spanish have in this revenue area may well fuel those suspicions further. The Italians have underlined that by returning to collectivism that will see their broadcast revenues drop dramatically.
The other key issue is how these clubs manage to operate profitably. The answer is many don’t. Largesse is not normally associated with financial institutions but many are showing just that when it comes to football club. It is not just the direct business aspect of these relationships but more those that are unsaid. With the vices around their corporate nuts being tightened, which bank will want the media stigma of being the one that sent a major European club to the wall? Those with benefactors smile benignly at the others. Those smiles have been weakening when divorces and diminished investments have bitten. Arsenal’s Board may have a certain smugness – not the biggest club in the world but one of the steadiest. And that counts for more than being the top revenue earner.
’til Tomorrow.
Posted on February 15, 2009, in Arsenal. Bookmark the permalink. 154 Comments.
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Hi Yogi – As always an interesting read. One comment that I would make is where you question whether PL clubs turnover has been previously inflated because of the strength of Sterling against the Euro. The Euro – Sterling exchange rate stood at 1.4 – 1.45 euros to the £ for years. It is only recently that sterling has dropped hugely against the euro and $. I would not presume to predict future currency exchange rates, if I could I would be typing this from my yacht somewhere in the Indian Ocean but the downside does have a positive note. If CL entry was worth 20 million euros at the old exchange rate it is now worth considerably more.
To: Consolsbob – Poliziano
Try one phart at a time. Speed Pharting doesn’t work.
Great article. Keep up the good work.
i always thought we got more supporters than chelsea and make more revenue than them .
Top revenue is one thing, more important is top PROFIT … and then there is a long way nothing after Arsenal ….
My mother had a saying about people who thought they’d ‘pharted’ when they had in fact, well, you know..
These figures are always interesting. I’m just not sure that they tell us nything much. Until someone produces proper profit and loss accounts for football clubs we will ahve no real means of comparing their comparative wealth.
For instance Chelski had a higher turnover than us but by any real economic measure they are poorer as they spent £67 million more than they earned with the funny looking Russian picking up the bill- again.
I don’t really understand why clubs, which are businesses these days and substantial ones, are treated differently than any other business when it comes to thr transparency of their accounts.
Of one thing I am fairly sure,the banks will not be as indulgent to the ‘big’ clubs as they have been in the past. To answer your point asto “..which bank will want the media stigma of being the one that sent a major European club to the wall?” Well, which bank will be willing explain that they are continuing to prop up clubs indulging themselves in overpriced players and huge wagepackets to a customer base losing their jobs and homes and a government to whom they are beholden to stay in business?
Morning (almost) all.
So how do they collate these numbers of fans ? Think there’s a lot of guesswork going on.
I think it was on the last Census, Ponyboy.
santino,
For the last 2 or 3 years Sellsey has always claimed to have brought in more money than us. They claim the difference is in commercial revenues. Sale of merchandise and stuff like that.We will soon know the truth. You can make your revenues look larger legally for a while but after a couple of years it’ll be untenable.
We should be able to watch Barazite today.
Morning Yogi, I did wonder what would inspire your writing on this slow news day, but you’ve managed to come up with another interesting read. These ‘rich’ lists are quite meaningless in reality because each one uses a different measuring stick and most of these clubs have very little substance to them. One strong gust of wind and the whole pack of cards will come tumbling down, then we’ll see which are left standing.
I get the feeling Passenal that you will be out there huffinn’ and puffin’ like a good ‘un.
Pb. Pz is almost always extracting the urine. We are the idiot children.
The number of fans is an interesting one. a) no-one asked me so am I included in the count, and b) what difference does it make as I don’t directly contribute much to the club anyway other than watching them onthe telly (and I don’t even have sky sports anymore either). I haven’t even bought a home shirt for about 15 years (they don’t suit me at all)
Sounds like an element of my dad’s bigger than your dad rather than any any real meaning
It’s amazing to me how many people don’t get that it is Wenger and not Mourinho who’s haunting Stamford Bridge right now.
Arsene Wenger is standing proof that Abramovich can have his dream of a dominant team that plays great football. The Invincibles will always be remembered in England, and Mourinho’s teams won’t even be remembered in 10 years.
Nobody knows this more than Mourinho, who almost certainly has had his face shoved into this reality.
Did anyone see the article about Mourinho in the Telegraph today in which he revels in the infantile hankering of Shellsey fans for him. It wasn’t without a silly dig at Arsenal and Wenger.
He’s traumatised by Wenger’s class. What disgusts me is that he really isn’t of Wenger’s class as a manager. He just isn’t even with his impressive record of victories (which isn’t more impressive than Wenger’s to start with).
The funny thing is that Mr. Mourinho’s success was partly based on targeting players Wenger or Ferguson were going for and paying over the odds for them, thus getting a top player, depriving a rival of the same, and getting fellated by the media for it.
Football is an exciting, creative and absorbing game…..counting is not….neither is comparing the size of your d*cks….
Thanks Yogi for the post.
IF you don’t mind. Let me just express my excitement about a great player in our ranks:
Simply Nasri (with AB’s OST track and no indulgent cuts or effects added): (great compilation)
vs spuds away:
vs Everton away:
vs Scouse c**ts at home:
vs Russkies at Sh*tford bridge:
vs Hull city away:
And we know how he ***** Neville, Vidic and sc*ms in Emirates. I don’t have to remind.
I want you guys to look at his first touch, control, passing (Vision, weight, and timing) – If at all, few players aren’t up to his level. When we get Eduardo, and ARshavin into the team, he will enjoy!!! It’s going to be telepathic. Just can’t wait…
Well, Thank Christ for that, although I wish you’d told me when I was younger Frank.
Yeah, the secret is to latch onto a Chelsea or United and revel in purported “success” to save their miserable lives. Pl*nkers.
Test…
Agree about Morinho. What a jumped up tosser; the annoying thing is, he’s doing really well at Inter.
Ponyboy – he took over an already successful club and has just continued from where they were last season. He’s hardly had to build a successful squad from scratch and with limited resources. He might have something to say that’s worth hearing then.
OleGunner, spot on about Mourinho. Lest we forget, Mourinho inherited a team which had already had considerable money lavished upon it by the Russian gangster and which also finished second in the league and managed the semi-finals of the CL under Ranieri. Mourinho then was given even more money to buy players targeted by others for inflated prices and at wage levels which make Kenyon’s ridiculous claim of being self-sufficient by 2010 patently unachievable.
The thing which interests me is how Chelsea, a club with a 40k max attendance can have revenues higher than ours. Our stadium is, I think the most expensive in the country, replete with more corporate boxes than a clown has pockets. They get marginally more tv money from the premier league deal and also some more for getting further in the CL. But can this really make up for selling 20k tickets a match less, over a 25-30 match season at an average of £50 quid a go? Clues anyone?
The fact that Chelsea have more fans than us atm, really signals the nature of a lot of “supporters” in these times. I’m fairly sure that the next time we win the league or (please God) the CL our fan-base will be “boosted” by a massive influx of these useless f*ckers.
I’ll never forget having a heated discussion a couple of years ago with a Chelsea supporter in Port Harcourt. At one point I asked him how long he had been supporting Chelsea – he said two years. I asked who he had supported before and he said Arsenal!
Chelsea do not have more fans than Arsenal…..that is a complete and utter f*cking fabrication…..the sample size was probably 100 people…and the location of the survey was probably the Kings Road….
I do think there are a lot of “floating voters” who attach themselves to whoever seems likely to dominate at that time. Just look at Manure.
I do agree, however, that there seems to be an attempt to portray Chelsea as being on a similar level to Arsenal. When in fact they are light years behind.
Yogi:
Great Post. All those statistical analysis you done; wow; I find difficult digesting all that ..wonder how much effort it wud have taken to analyse and write that stuff..keep it up..and thx for giving us for free..
Mourinho..
oh how much i hate him…and y is he so obsessed with wenger…if he thinks he is so great..y doesnt he go to mid table team..with limited budget and win something…b*stard is living on legecy of mancini and ranieri…
i wud be rooting for manu agst them..even better let me win and let us send them to cleaners..
the guy is so self absorbed..i am just waiting for him to fail..i wish milan wins scudetto..and he doesnt go further in CL…but bugger for some reason has luck on his side..
I believe that chel$ki have a genuinely higher turnover than us like I believe I have a posy of purple daisies growing out my a&$e.
uncle fester has probably got his soon to be supplier of a nice tight pair of cement shoes paying 1m per director’s box seat or something silly, or providing gold-plated dogbra shirts from the store for the BOD.
Imo that whole deck of cards is due to come tumbling down sometime soon.
The train set is likely to be tossed into the cupboard one of these days.
Maybe RA is starting to take a close interest in uncle fester’s exotic car collection and impressive share portfolio?
The latest story about the conversion of debt into a new share issue has to be questioned as well.
Why would you forgo debt for a share issue to yourself, diluting the shares you already own anyway?
Something smells a tad fishy on that one.
Someone (other than the terminally stupid mihir bose) needs to investigate that one a bit methinks.
Passenal -
True enough. But as adc says, he’s a lucky little creep. Off to find some streams.
MikeSA – I hadn’t heard about a share issue at Chelsea. That makes no sense for a club in private ownership, if he were planning to go PLC it would make more sense but there is no way Chelsea would be allowed to operate with the business model they have (It makes the banks to properly run) and appear on the FTSE. If the story is true the only thing I can think of is to bring in a partner/partners to make a cash injection into the club. This opens a pandora’s box of questions. Has Abramovich lost more of his wealth than has been reported? Is he unable/unwilling to subsidise Chelsea anymore? How the hell can the club expect to provide a return with 2 investors (or more) when they cannot break even with one providing interest free loans?
All in all something is not right at Chelsea and it is getting to breaking point.
To all the moanrino hater’s out there (I include myself in this) I have a feeling that he might just appear in Manchester during the summer.
At Citeh Marc? Could be but he won’t be inheriting a strong team there, which goes against the scenario painted here of his track record. Could just as easily go back to Chelski.
I asked this the other night but does anybody know if Hiddinck alwats looks so miserable and emotionless when he is watching his team?
Marc, there is some speculation that it looks suspiciously like someone dressing up a balance sheet in preparation for a sale.
If (for argument’s sake), you wanted to sell a company like that, it would typically be sold for a pound, with the new owner taking over the debt.
However, 700m plus of debt is not going to be attractive for a would be purchaser because that shower of sh^te isn’t worth anywhere near that.
I don’t know much about UK tax law, but where I come from, converting a large portion of the loan into a donation wouldn’t wash, there would be huge tax implications.
Seeing as the shares are currently owned by an offshore company, coming up with a new share issue to another offshore vehicle would then enable one to trim the debt by devaluing the shares without attracting any tax penalties.
The debt would then be dramatically reduced, making the club far more attractive to potential buyers.
I’m sure the tax office would have some questions, but seeing as it’s all offshore, I think they won’t get too many answers.
Perhaps these ridiculous turnover stories are also part of a sale strategy?
MikeSA – Something is going on, but Abramovich is taking legal action against the Sunday Times for printing a story a couple of weeks ago that he was planning to sell to some Middle East group. I don’t pretend to know what is going on but if he is intending to sell showing £65 million losses is not going to get him what he has put into the club. I also think that a PL club is not a sound investment, I just can’t see how anyone can expect to get a return on the initial investment when even clubs that make a profit plough all there money back into transfers and not many clubs make a real profit.
Bob – Yeah, he would have even more money than at Chelsea and would be able to stick it to Abramovich and Ferguson even more than before. If Chelsea do start to struggle can you imagine the fans reaction to moarino being at City and doing well, same with Man U.
I can’t see Hughes being manager next season and the owners will go for a big name.
Marc, yes, I am aware of the legal action, hence my reference to “for arguments sake”.
We are allowed to discuss the theory of any such sale, we are not allowed to claim that one is going to take place.
In my country there would be no basis for a legal claim at all unless he could prove that the claim resulted in quantifiable damages (like a lower sale price, which is more than a little difficult).
If any sale were to be contemplated (in theory), then the club would have to be devalued, and RA would have to take a loss, hence the reasoning on why he would want to reduce the debt by dissolving it into a devalued share.
Unless they sell citeh and invest in a club that players actually want to go to..
Marc, I’m amazed Hughes has lasted this long at City and I will be even more amazed if he survives beyond the end of this season. If they want to attract top players, they need a manager with a reputation. I will cry if it’s moaninho!
MikeSA – Sorry you missed my point. IF RA sues the Sunday Times for libel and then proceeds to sell the club he will open himself up to all sorts of retaliatory legal action possibably including perjury.
Passenal – I wasn’t suggsting that moanrino was my choice, just a feeling I have.
I wondered about that too Marc. Unless it’s just a threat of legal action that he has no intention of carrying through. He was maybe just ticked off that his plans were exposed in the media. Maybe things work differently in Russia and the media would not dare to spill the beans like that?
Oh no Marc, I didn’t think that you would want Moaninho any more than I would, I was just expressing my personal view as I absolutely can’t stand him!
Passenal – Some of the stories you read about press intimidation in Russia are frightening. I can’t believe that our journalists have more integrity so they must be either brave or stupid.
Sorry Marc, yes, point taken, as Jeffrey Archer discovered.
Money and power. That’s the ticket. If you can’t get one. Get the other. Somehow the idea of sport has drifted from what i can do for the team to what can i get from the team.
If the threat of legal action was sabre rattling to try to shut the press up then RA is more naive than he looks. When you threaten something like that you have to be willing to follow it through. If RA cannot take legal action either because the story has some truth about it or just because RA does not want his dirty linen paraded in public he was stupid to threaten in the first place.
Although it would be ghastly to see Mourinho back in England, there would be some serious satisfaction in watching him fail.
Apart from Drogba, does any player really want to be under that Ego ?
Players come to Arsenal because Arsene is a good, honest man and a fantastic manager. Mourinho is none of those things.
Well, if it isn’t about dressing up for a sale, then some really hard questions have to be asked about why some of the debt has apparently been dissolved into a pointless share issue.
If it isn’t about a possible sale, then something stinks to high heaven.
Marc, RA may look like an idiot, but he’d be in hiding by now if he wasn’t a canny bastard.
Ponyboy – Players also join Arsenal because they know that they will improve under Wenger. How many players come to Arsenal as unknowns or near unknowns and within a couple of years are an integral part of their national team. Just ask SWP what signing for moanrino does for your prospects.
I think maureen is a huge BS artist.
As such, I don’t think he can stay at any club too long before the more experienced players start sensing that it’s all just hot air.
dogbra still loves him because he’s just not the sharpest tool in the shed, and still believes the fantasy.
Ponyboy – I sure that RA is not a fool but ego can get in front of common sense and the more power you have the more you are used to getting your own way.
Mike and Marc, you obviously know your stuff on this matter. Tell me, why does no journalist, sports or financial, delve more deeply into these stories? They could be sensational. How many papers would they sell on the back of a story such as you are intimating here?
For the less learned amongst us and watching the Villa/Everton game. How many players that have already been booked could have recieved a second card had the ref chosen not to be lenient?
Just thinking about Eboue. Very few refs will book a player twice in a game unless he really has to,
“ego can get in front of common sense and the more power you have the more you are used to getting your own way.”
Even going against legal advice and believing that you can buy your way out of anything if you have enough money and power. Remember his friend Putin will not allow him to be extradited if it comes to it.
Bob – They don’t have the coloum inches to spare without removing the “Arsenal in crises” stories.
With regard to ref’s what winds fans and players up is a lack of consistancy (IMO). Ref’s are always going to interperate the laws slightly differently, it’s when the same ref gives 2 different decisions 5 min apart that get’s the blood boiling.
“Very few refs will book a player twice in a game unless he really has to,”
Unless he is an Arsenal player…
Consolsbob, I suspect some paper will at some stage, but they are probably being a bit cautious right now.
As long as it’s not some idiot like mihir bose, who probably wouldn’t know the difference between a roll of bog-paper and a wad of 100pound notes.
On the subject of refs, a ref on a board I chat on came up with a pearler that I really don’t even know whether to believe or not.
He claimed that if one side was committing the majority of the fouls, the ref would start blowing up the opposition for even really minor fouls to “calm the situation”.
I was told this is known as “match control”.
Personally, it sounds more like “match fixing” to me.
The quality of so called investigative journalists is a joke. The Panorama of a few years ago where they claimed to have Harry Redknapp on tape taping up a player turned out to be a conversation where HR comments that a young player looks like a talent. I just don’t think that they have the wit to be honest.
I agree Marc – the calibre of journalist who could expose such a situation is perhaps not drawn to an issue as mundane as football and your average football journo is not the brightest bulb in the box otherwise they could write something more original than the usual clap trap they come up with!
…sadly there is almost no quality in British journalism….period…football or any subject of your choosing….they are lazy and good for nothing…their egos erect before them…like enormous…puddings…pendums….er….pudiddums….well …you know…cocks
Quite right Marc, Passenal etc. Football journalists are probably the lowest form of writer. They have a cushy life and never, ever risk it by saying something that might be badly received by the power-brokers. They are at opposite end of the scale from those journalists who risk their lives in order to discover the truth and perhaps improve the world.
Btw I love the phrase clap trap. I just got to wondering what it evolved from. Then I stopped….
Oh ffs…you live a very exciting life don’t you?….those journalists who risk their lives are generally adrenaline junkies with a huge nose for fame and fortune…you won’t find any of em in Zimbabwe…Darfur…the Congo region….usually pop up with flack jackets in very obvious war zones…none of them understand economoics…if they did they would have seen this f*cking depression coming long, long ago……none of them have twigged that Britain’s surveillance/database/nanny oriented state is sleep walking into becoming a police state….. there is no decent journalism in the world now…if indeed there ever was….none of them have the first f*cking clue about climate or science..it is a cynical self interested profession….the lowest form of parasitism….
Frank:
You are so spot on. And there in Frank, lies the problem of the developed world.
Wow Frank, I guess your cynicism is balanced out by your Arsenal fervour.
Do you think there any other hope?
Wow Frank, and I thought I hated journalists, but I can’t disagree with you. We all know as well that they sit on half the information they have and will only publish if it suits their or their puppet masters’ agendas. None of them had the balls to print the story about the racist insults John Terry hurled at his England team mate for example.
I see Villa have finally run out of luck – long may it last!
If we are going to start a cretin fest may I present our current government.
Passenal – They have Chelsea next week, I really can’t make up my mind which result I would prefer.
Let’s not go there Marc. I couldn’t take an endless list of cretins at this time. Let’s just list those that aren’t. That’s more manageable.
I’ll start.
Arsene Wenger.
Sheffield Utd or Hull at home. Not bad.
Me
…bit of a faux pas that Marc…
That was meant as a joke!
…I have a key ring, Passenal…and attached to the ring is an object….about three inches across….people often think it is a small boxing glove…and when they look a little more closely…they laugh…a gonk they say…haven’t’ seen one of those for a long time….but when they look even more closely..they stop laughing….they often turn pale…and one or two have vomited…..you see it is not a boxing glove…. or a gonk…….. it is the shrunken head of a journalist….
I’d like one of those too! You really bring out my dark side Frank!
…I will see what I can do….
the fa cup draw has made
Cardiff/Arsenal/Burnley v Sheffield United/Hull
another home match for the winners of arsenal/cardif/burley
.
Please excuse my ignorance, but what racist remarks did Terry make and to who?
Is it certain that he said them? If so it really is a sad indictment of the football and the press.
Btw Frank, one high profile example of “investigative journalism” is, I think, currently Dancing on Ice on ITV.
This night has opened my eyes.
Simply put; Chavski has done well buying success. Chavski has improved the number of their fans both at home and abroad. They’ve also sold merchandise in large numbers.
We’ve not invested in our team properly and have made us trophiless for years now. This has also affected our ability to sell more merchandise.
Our continued poor performance in the league will eventually affect our revenue both in terms of tickets and merchandise.
The simple fact is that success brings in revenue while continuous poor performances will eventually impact on earnings.
Others think that the best way is to bring in cheap foreign players hoping that they will develop and win something for us however, it hasn’t worked for four years and Chavski has passed us in terms of earnings as evidenced by recent financial reports even though we have a bigger stadium.
It doesn’t look so good for this policy if it’s continued for the next few years.
It doesn’t look good for you Howard if you keep posting the same old b*llocks.
I hear that Chelski have confirmed tha they have had a bid for Terry from Citeh.
You see, if we followed Howard’s advice it could have been us looking to sell our ‘star’ or (too highly paid, take your preferenc) because we are broke.
Wht doesn’t Arsene listen?
Was building the Emirates a good idea?
Howard:
Was building the Emirates a good idea.
Howard,
In your eyes is Chelsea looking better?
F*ck off Howard.
I think you have missed your cue G4E. Get on the ball.
Is anyone watching this Milan derby? I thought it was live, but the commentary seems to be ahead of the action?
Seems better now Passenal.
Should be live Passenal. You can check on all the live games on this site.
http://www.livesportontv.com/football/
Sorry, just the sound effects are in sync, the commentary is ahead.
V. annoying.
FFS, I have no desire to repeat the alleged comments, but they were made to Ledley King (I know he’s a spud, but…). It was widely rumoured at the time that the press quashed any publication because he is the England captain and it would not look good alongside the ‘kick racism out’ campaign.
Where do the rumours come from?
I am no fan of the media, but I’d be appalled if it was possible to keep this kind of thing quiet.
Wouldn’t it be a scoop for some publication?
G4E?
Does Howard realize that with all the money Chel$ki spent, they didn’t win anything last year and they might not win anything this year?
So, with all the money they spent they might end up like us with a small difference, we didn’t spend 300 or 400 million on players but on a great stadium that Chle$ki would die for?
F*ck off Howard.
Haven’t heard from Muppet for a while FFS but I am sure that he would tell you that anything is possible in Grub St.
John Terry is, I believe, an extremely unpleasant character. Have you noticed how Ashlet has become a much more nasty player under the malign influence of his master?
You had me worried there G4E. The universe was out of balance for a few minutes.
it’s never out of balance when people like you, YW, Passenal, Frank, Poliziano and many others are there to keep it in order man.
Referees won’t book England internationals unless they absolutely have to, are you seriously expecting the media to bite the hand that feeds it FFS? It’s not the first and it won’t be the last story that the media keeps quiet about. I know people who deal with the media in their jobs so I’ve heard about such things (not football related).
Adriano just scored with his hand. Typical Mouninho success.
CB.
I can’t stand the football media.
But with the importance of the Net and blogs etc. you’d have thought there’d be a bigger stink about it. Hell, we should all be making some noise.
I despise Murdoch and the large conglomerates, but I still want to believe that really important stories will see the light of day.
I see the devil looks after his own as Inter go ahead with a hand-ball goal. Come on AC, I want to see the special needs one crying at the end!
…how the f*ck can both teams be at home…?
..F*ck off, Howard….
FFS, it’s only because of the internet that we’ve heard about it, but none of the established media had the guts to pick it up.
…there is no such thing as important news…because by definition if it is news it is either a lie or it has already happened …..neither of which gives you any hope of action….important information is what we really need…as early as possible….journalists don’t do that though…too difficult….useless f*ckers…
Don’t me modest G4E. You are on the good guys list.
Passenal, I worked in Fleet St for a short time, not, I hasten to add, as a journalist. I saw at first hand many times in the pubs and the offices how they operate, their conceit and arrogance and in too many cases, their sheer unpleasantness as human beings.
They lived on the ‘status’ that knowing anybody ‘famous, gave them. Mind you, wait until anybody’s star starts to wane to see the knives go in. Always someone else to butter up to. Someone else to feed them stories, someone else with a higher profile. It is a sick business.
How else can you explain the difference between the world as it is and the world that we read and hear about from the media?
…nice jiving with you, Passenal…
I’m really curious now.
Any idea of the source? Is it really any different from the printed rumours which come from anonymous “sources close to the club”?
There is plenty of crap on the net FFS. Too much for anybody to give stories not covered in the mainstream media any widespread credence.
Just check out LG for instance.
I learnt a long time ago a good test for how good the media is at telling a story well and accurately. Ask yourself, what was the last time you read/ watched/heard about a story covering a topic that you, personally, actually knew the truth.
Then compare that truth as you know it with the story that the media report. It is always wrong. Not sometimes, but always. Sure, occasionally they will get the obvious things right,they must. a fire is a fire, for instance. But the causes, when it happened, who started it? Forget it. they get everything second hand from ‘souces’ and by the time the truth emerges, they have moved on.
I really hope Mourinho does come back and crashes and burns. That would be some really good entertainment. It might allow the hacks to really showcase their talents also.
It’s interesting to note the contempt for journalists at the moment. It seems a real shame, given the theoretical potential of the medium to do good. It makes me wonder, though, if it does a disservice to the journalists who have recently been killed in Russia and other states in that region and elsewhere.
Are they the same breed?
I can’t take this game – AC Milan without Kaka are a shadow of their former selves, and this is the team that Flamini can’t get into?
They are all running dogs FFS. The sooner you accept that, the saner will be your view of the world.
I guess we are seeing through our own passion for Arsenal, that the papers etc. are becoming superfluous, if not, damaging to our support. I wonder what will happen if newspaper readers move over to ever more specialised blogs?
Could it not become even harder to have some form of significant political agreement?
Would it not potentially further isolate more extreme factions and play into the hands of dubious leaders?
2-0 ; that maureen!
Cb – Don’t you prefer a running dog to one that just stands there, about to spring at your throat ?
(Journo) fact: More journalists were killed in war zones last year than ever before. Not a single one was British.
Now I’m getting paranoid. I just wrote something about politics and papers and it has disappeared into the ether. I’m worried they are coming, are you still there CB?……PASSENAAAAALLL!!!!?
John Terry, along with most other footballers, will say a lot of things that would be greeted with righteous indignation if they became public. Everyone knows that football players are not saints. I don’t believe anything would be gained by printing their comments.
Journalism may have started as an honourable profession with worthy ideals, and there may be the odd good egg out there, but certainly the modern western journo is closer to the one described by consolsbob.
I don’t like dogs Pb. They scare my chickens. Foxes are dogs too.
Good fact Pb. Source? Do you think that troups are catching on and leaving them in harms way?
On that point, I always thought that Ross Kemp was just another lovey but his series in Afghanistan tells us more about what is like on the ground than any coverage by any news journalist. Not the why stuff but just what it is like to be there.
Don’t worry FFS.
You are not paranoid. Your postings are being monitored. Somewhere, in some technology packed room, staffed by apparatchiks, your views have been noticed.
They won’t actually come for you.
Yet.
Whew!!!
Cb -
As a veggie pacifist etc, am all in favour of saving chickens from the evil that foxes do. They kill one chicken and eat it, then kill the rest of the hen-house for fun.
Fleet street, btw ? That’s a long long time ago, Consols! Do you have a picture in your attic ?
FFS : It’s a healthy thing to wonder if you’re paranoid. Those who truly are, KNOW IT !
Here’s to a healthy level of paranoia then!
Once again, an obvious penalty not given!
2-1 – and Phil is on.. this is exciting.
Cb – the source was the BBC World Service.
Passenal – which stream are you watching ?
Yes, Pb. You know that I am an old fart. It was back in the early 80′s. Just back from India.
Many hours spent in the Cheddar Cheese.
I actually did meet a jouno to tell him a story once. Straight out of the cliche manual. I was the one with a rolled up copy of the ‘New Statesman’ sitting at the bar! You couldn’t make it up.
The world needs to know. Foxes are evil. (That wasn’t the story by the way).
vipspots is so annoying…… but, game almost over, alas.
I hate the World Service. Ever tried to listen to an Arsenal game or a Test Match while in Crete? It’s not for us Brits abroad at all. You get more coverage of bloody basketball.
It’s on BBC 3 Pb.
BBC3 – I really thought AC had pulled a point out of the bag there!
It’s strange to see Vieira and Senderos on the pitch but these commentators really love moaninho – they spend more time talking about him than what is happening on the pitch.
H*ward off Mourinho.
They kept on panning onto his rat-like face.. Man, am so full of hatred ! Kaka…why did you have to hurt your foot ?
Weird to see Phil still the same, as if he’s not quite sure what’s going on. Good foul though..
Thanks..Never thought to check the Beeb..
World Service is a help for us occasional insomniacs, Cb – and you can be sure to get the latest news from Burkino Faso.
Did you here the ‘Special one’ on TV earlier. ” I will go back to Chelsea one day. They are part of my story.. I have special friends there”
Throw me want up to made.
Furkin where Pb?
You obviously sleep far too well, Cb.. i have even learned that Belize, formerly British Honduras.. but no, am losing my audience now.
Well, you did it that time Pb. Everbody just b*ggered off.
consolsbob, that quote needed a health warning – I nearly up-chucked!
…Cheshire Cheese, Cb…the journos pub was The Cheshire Cheese….
If you had seen the whole interview Passenal, I swear you would have. I couldn’t stand to stay in the same room.
Yet it was reported as a straight bit of news. No questioning of his own ‘up his own bum’ hype. Not even a hint of ironic comment. To them, he truly is the ‘Special One’.
If one interview summed up football as it is today, for most people, that was it.
…it is where the owner of the shrunken head was drinking one cold. foggy night in 1971…
What did I call it Frank? The Cheddar I suppose.
Wel, age does that to a once agile mind and worse to an athletes’s body.
Plus I was usually pissed on Marstons by 7 most evenings. That after a few at lunchtime too. Could’n't do that any more now either. Don’t want to mind.
The worst place to study appalling behaviour by the 4th estate was that pub almost opposite but back towards the Strand a bit that was in a basement. Everyone would pile in there when the Cheese shut. About 9 if I recall.
Things got seriously weird in there.
There was a Cheddar Cheese though. Up near the Strand?
Mourinho has not lost a home league game for SEVEN years!!!!!!!!
…I don’t know a Cheddar Cheese…..but I do know the Coal Hole….
This is really crazy money. We all need it
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