The visit of FC Twente to The Emirates is probably the best thing that Arsene could have wished for following on from the lacklustre performance at Craven Cottage on Saturday. There is nothing like another match to clear the cobwebs of a bad defeat. This evening ought to be a rubber-stamping exercise but nothing can be taken for granted. Even so, the criticism that has followed since Saturday’s defeat will be nothing compared to that which follows dropping a two-goal advantage.
Cesc returns to the squad this evening although it would be bordering on folly to use him from the start; better a substitute getting twenty (or should that be Twente?) minutes as preparation for the visit of Newcastle United this weekend. Other than that, it is hard to see what scope Arsene has to make changes. Silvestre will not apparently be available until the 13th September visit to Blackburn; perhaps Djourou and / or Song could come into defence and midfield respectively but it is almost tempting to suggest that the side remain unchanged so that the players can almost ‘right their wrong’.
Gallas and Toure certainly need some playing time together. In any partnership, it takes time to rebuild the understanding and this evening would be beneficial to do that. To drop either would certainly be an ‘un-Wengerlike’ solution. He is noted for his consistency with players, even if they have had a howler or committed a costly error. Gallas is getting criticism again but Tony Adams has backed him, albeit cautiously,
If he thought William was the best captain for the club then he is the man to call it. I am not really there. A lot of people throw stones but I am not prepared to do that, because I don’t know the situation. He thinks he is the best captain for the club and I am not going to argue with his record
It is a well-trodden path to ‘get at’ Gallas and no two leaders are the same. Adams was a rarity in football in that, by all accounts, he was identified as an Arsenal captain at a very early age. Comaprisons between the two are not worth making as they are very different people, very different captains. An interesting comment from him concerned Ashley Cole,
I know they had the situation, if you speak to Arsene, Ashley wanted to go and whatever, but I would have got them in my office and handcuffed them! Even though they weren’t performing. It was just for the transition, all the kids come in and all the kids are there together. Everyone retired together, all the people who knew the club inside out and knew how to be winners, knew what to do
The question is whether he would have kept Cole. Would you keep an openly disruptive player who for all of his experience, might do more damage to the dressing-room? Adams did finish off with compliments about the squad,
All the kids, they are tremendously talented, probably technically better than he has ever had. It is the most technical squad he has ever had but they need to learn to become winners. There is no-one really who has made the transition. The turnover has been really quick. They say the turnover of squads is five years on average, he has turned it in about two I think
Arsene has ‘accepted’ the criticism that came following the Fulham performance,
No matter how good you are in life, players are human beings and have been away for the whole of last week. But I know my squad is good, my team is good, our spirit is good. We are intelligent enough to know we did not play well , but we know as well we have the needed quality to respond. Your desire is to play well and win. No matter how much experience you have, if you don’t play well you have more chances to lose than to win
They also have a quick chance to prove it. Even so, one win from the advantageous position from which they start tonight’s match will not cease the comments as for the most part, they have agreed with the points made by Arsene in the past ten days, even if he is now altering his position. The midfielder he spoke of seems unlikely to be Gorkan Inler, who is apparently remaining with Udinese. It is unlikely to be Barry or Alonso on the basis of buying with no resale value. Those media targets mean the hacks have run out of steam so perhaps he can get on with the purchase he wants in relative peace and quiet, which is the way he likes it.
Anyway, here’s to progress this evening to the Group phase, the ultimate target after all.
’til Tomorrow.























Yogi, you are ‘totally bodacious’ in excellence. A great read. Your Gallas analysis is very refreshing.
By: jammathon on August 27, 2008
at 8:58 am
Let’s hope today’s game is the game where we found our rhythm on our way to a trophy.
G4E
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 9:02 am
Totally agree on Gallas. As with Eboue it appears a large section of fans are now going to games having already decided who is going to be good and who is not. I dont understand why people like RVP are immune from criticism…..
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 9:04 am
TopGun
RvP is probably immune because he has not played much for the last two seasons so people have forgotten what he can do…
YW
By: Yogi's Warrior on August 27, 2008
at 9:13 am
In the end, if Arsene had two Englishmen in the starting 11, the criticism would be down to zero.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 9:21 am
You could be right Yogi but i saw enough in the Euros to think he should be delivering more than he is (i’m including pre-season games). It seems we’re back to the old Van Persie of having to have 5 or 6 touches when 1 or 2 will do.
Hopefully he is still just getting sharp but part of me wonders what he thinks about Ade’s new contract….
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 9:24 am
Ole
Only from the media and some individuals. Most of us couldn’t care less if it was eleven pink marshmallows with yellow spots on so long as they are ‘doing’ their job!.
Anyone who thinks Englishmen are the answer need only look at the national squad to find out why it is a red herring solution.
YW
By: Yogi's Warrior on August 27, 2008
at 9:33 am
Tonight should be a good indicator of where we are. I was tempted to say where these youngsters are, what is in their make up? Are they stung by a loss, but confident and strong enough to get back on track. But then I remembered it is the senior players who have started the season like uninspired soul-less zombies, let it be them that reignite the collective fires. So stand by Vela, Wilshere, Djourou, because if after 45 minutes the procession of lameness continues, the old fools can take a seat.
By: Danny on August 27, 2008
at 9:35 am
Predictions for tonite, anyone? I go for another 2 nil scoreline…
By: KukayaGunner on August 27, 2008
at 9:39 am
I’m really concerned about our CB situation.
And my criticism has not been limited to Gallas at all. In fact, I feel like one of the few Arsenal fans who has had the nerve to be very critical of Toure and his performances. Both our first choice CBs are problematic, even more so when they play together.
At the end of last season Wenger acknowledged that we had defensive problems. He even specifically talked about our inability to deal with the long ball. He also said that fans would be reassured by what we saw over the summer. But nothing has been done to adress this basic issue. In fact, our only out and out CB who can head the ball has been loaned out to Milan.
Forget the captaincy for a moment, Gallas and Toure should not even be given starters for us right now after their dissapointing performance throughout the spring.
And for all the talk of lack of experience, it was our most experienced players that let us down at the end of last season.
By: Nin on August 27, 2008
at 9:40 am
Nin,
Forget what Wenger says, look at what he does. I gave up listening to Wenger ages ago because to put it bluntly, he talks a lot of nonsense. It is frustrating though I fully accept that, but I have also accepted that Wenger’s word is not his bond anymore at least not publically.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 10:02 am
The problem with CB situation is Djourou in my opinion. Physically he is much more imposing than the other, he should be our option of going with a old fashioned stopper but the guy has very little aggression in his game.
Having said that I would like to see him partner Gallas for an extended period of time. Kolo hasnt been right since the ACN in my opinion. And tonight i’d like to see Song and Cesc in the middle and Wilshere get a run out.
And please gooners, no booing tonight!!
3-1 to Arsenal
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 10:06 am
solgooner, Nin,
I’ve got one for you today from Arsene:
“We just look at the right player and if we can get him, we get him. If we don’t, we don’t.
“If nothing is done, it will not limit our ambitions because of it.”
The last part makes me laugh. Is this an admission that we have no ambition to win anything i.e that our ambitions are already limited to not winning and 1 player won’t change this?
Alternatively it’s rubbish as the squad as it is is not strong enough.
Either way I disagree with what is said – not that I care.
This is why I just laugh most of the time now when AW speaks as you will go mad if you don’t.
I used to learn a lot about football from when Wenger used to speak about it. Now I just dismiss most of what he says.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 10:09 am
It’s the Englishmen. Tony Adams saying Arsenal could today be playing with Sol Campbell. What a sorry joke. And we shouldn’t have let Cashley Cunt go.
I think it’s down to that.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 10:19 am
AIC
Wenger is like a politician he never gives a straight answer.THe same bollox “we will sign a DM if we thing they are good enough and if the price is right”
We are 5 days away for the window closing we cannot go to the january window with out signind a DM.Wenger has had all summer to get the player he wants.
By: Arsenal Feeder club on August 27, 2008
at 10:36 am
I think the problem with the CB situation is that there really is no competition for their places, and issues about Gallas’ ability as a captain aside, the very fact that he is the captain gives him a fairly solid guarantee that he’ll be in the side every weekend, so what kind of motivation is that?
It’s just so depressing to have two of the best full backs in the game who’s defensive record is marred by a succession of mistakes by the other two. Perhaps it’s not the individuals but the defensive coaching.
and it’s really messing up my fantasy football stats…
By: drumgiant on August 27, 2008
at 10:41 am
We gotta go with strongest starters tonight, put the tie to bed and then sub players with next game in mind.
Id drop woth Ecour(right back , nothing else) and give Denilson a place on the bench with the intention of replacing Cesc after 60 or 70 mins. Id also drop Kolo, who looks a littly tubby to me.
Almunia
Sagna Song Gallas Clichy
Theo Cesc Djourou Nasri
VanP Ade
By: DeiseGooner on August 27, 2008
at 10:41 am
Arsene doesnt talk rubbish – he talks a lot of sense – but when he is asked about transfers he plays his cards close to his chest or is deliberately cryptic in order to protect the club’s interests. Chelsea, Man U, Liverpool say we must get Berbatov, Robinho, Kaka, Barry in order to please the fans and the price immediately doubles. Which would you prefer?
And if you get depressed, just remember Spurs……
By: Big Johan on August 27, 2008
at 10:42 am
Wenger said after the 1st leg there would be a DM signed before the second leg. Where the F**k is he then.Maybe Arsene is too busy!!!!!!!
By: Arsenal Feeder club on August 27, 2008
at 10:45 am
Big Johan,
I’m sorry but AW talks a lot of cr@p these days from “we deserved to win” when we didn’t, untold rubbish about transfers, the stadium, our expectations, we were close in the CL last season – quarter finals !
Its mostly rubbish I’m afraid.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 10:47 am
Arsenal Feeder Club,
You are wrong about Wenger having all summer. He’s had far longer – Diarra left in January and Flam was all but gone before the end of the season.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 10:49 am
Very good post Yogi, the absolutely most readable Arsenal blog around. Today it was short and sweet, sometimes they can be a bit long, still very enjoyable though.
On your question, Yes i think it was the right time to sell Cashley. And I also believe the got rid of Viera due to his comments reagrding Ashley pay demands. How can you have a Club captain who pushing the palyers to grind out more cash from the club.
Carl Ball
By: Carl Ball on August 27, 2008
at 10:49 am
Our midfielders should collect some yellow cards and show them off with honour. We’re too soft in the centre. Didn’t Wenger coach this into them?
By: Luke on August 27, 2008
at 10:52 am
DeiseGooner,
If you want our strongest starters, on this seasons form Eboue would be well ahead of Theo who did nothing against WBA and even less against Fulham.
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 10:56 am
wenger says, we will buy players if they have the quality bla bla, then he fills the midfield with average players so that in effect we still need to sign a proper DM! So if we sign the DM we need, what happens to Coquelin, Ramsey etc? do they get blocked? Is wenger simply buying several players who MIGHT make it and hoping that one of them is a gem? Thats what it looks like to me, but that strategy still requires time. time we haven’t got.
one of the big problems I think is the fast turnover between the experienced invincibles and the techincal youngsters that Adams alluded to.
what wenger has done is sell off a lot of 25+ players who have won trophies and either brought in or brought through a lot of teenagers.
I dont really have a problem with developing young players and teaching them the right way to play – it means they have an affiliation with Arsenal.
But the gap between the two extremes was not bridged well enough. the young players were not ready and its had the effect of leaving the other players, who are ready now, feeling very frustrated. Unless you put good players around Cesc, for example, he will leave. there’s no point saying, we’ll be ok in 2 years time when these kids are peaking – in 2 years time, some of our experienced players will have given up waiting, then we are back to square 1, trying to replace them. wenger needs to break that vicious circle now by making this team ready to challenge for the title.
You cannot rely on the inconsistent young players who are still learning the game.
In truth Arsenal are not far from having that balance, but the central midfield cannot be left to chance. It so desperately needs a wise old head in there cajouling the team and battling for the right of the team to play. Gilberto was a loss but maybe he wasn’t the type of midfielder wenger now wants. wenger wants a high energy player to partner Cesc.
Central defence is a totally different problem. On paper it seems a very good defence. the ages and experience of the players is exactly what you’d ask for. However, its in practice when you see the Toure/Gallas partnership that you see that something needs changing. I dont blame wenger for that but you can blame wenger for not making a change and reacting quicker. If Silvestre is earmarked for the first team then I guess you could argue he has acted but for now Djourou needs to be in the team.
By: gazzap on August 27, 2008
at 11:07 am
Twente are a second rate Dutch team who luckily beat Ajax to qualify for Europe, beating them tonight is fine but its not like a cold night in Bolton. So Cesc should only play a part time role, Huntelaar who is the leading goal score in Holland would never be that in the PL. EGO needs to assert himself for the first time this season and please no more smiles or wry faces when you miss a sitter or are stupidly offside.
The major first team players should only play 60 minutes once. and if we have a lead, and give Wilshere a chance
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:13 am
What are the chances that Arsene might be looking to change the formation of the team, and the type of football that we play, in order to accomodate a less defemsive midfielder along with Cesc. It could happen that he might stop the back four holding a high line. That might allow Cesc and Denilson/diaby/eboue to play without much need of a defensive midfielder? Ahh…just contemplating what Wenger’s upto.
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 11:18 am
Djourou needs to play at centre back – until he has played often enough to make a few mistakes and then he will be the next player not good enough for Arsenal.
CB’s, like every other player, make mistakes. Duuring his loan spell I remember seeing a couple of howlers from Djourou, including a throw in to the opposition that resulted in a goal.
Kolo is being critisised more often now. But he has still made some excellent recovery tackles. that is what he has always been best at.
Judge players on what they do well, don’t just look at mistakes.
By: JohnN on August 27, 2008
at 11:22 am
ateeb Denislon and Ebuoe? we might as well give up our title hopes now
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:23 am
azzap and Alex, you both know that our manager talks continuous spin, hes been great in the past, but the fans are really restless and this is like the days before the start of the French Revolution. Senderos was always a disaster waiting to happen and I have more confidence in Djouru provided we scrap the policy of playing favourites, Toure and Gallas doesnt work the fans know it but the Manager doesnt.
I have asked a couple of guys I know in the media how to get a mail to the manager just to express my feelings and those of most blogs in the world. In the old days you could mail the press office, and get areal reply
We want a high energy creative midfielder NOW, otherwise at the end of the season otherwise fans will be screaming . WE WANT CHANGE AND WE WANT IT NOW.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:24 am
ALEX The comments of our glorious leader should be made into a book the thoughts of Supremo Wenger.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:26 am
Well, Eboue hasn’t been that bad at the defensive midfielder position, just decent. But yes i would want to see someone else play there.And as far as Denilson is concerned, he was good during the pre-season, and IMO has had just one bad game, at Craven cottage. That too was a collective effort by our star players to squash our title hopes. Denilson has looked good when going forward, rather than defending, which too hasnt been totally abysmall. But a change in tactic in the way we play, might allow Diaby/ Denilson to play alongside cesc. Because clearly, if we’re not buying anyone, and the players we have are not atoned to the flamini mould, than Wenger mght opt to play a different game. For good or for worse? Only time will tell.
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 11:28 am
“The turnover has been really quick. They say the turnover of squads is five years on average, he has turned it in about two I think”
That is what it is all about & what the critics simply do not want to understand.
What has happened since 2005 is that the team had to be replaced, without anywhere near the amount of money that Chelsea or Man U were throwing around. There were no Vieiras or Bergkamps to buy, that those 2 clubs would not hype the price way beyond our means.
Simply replacing with decent but not as good, would have left us in the same situation as all the mid table clubs, we would have joined.
The route we have taken is perilous & remarkable but not certain of success. Indeed the dramatic opposite was & maybe is still possible.
I would ask all those, who seem to have all the answers, what would you prefer-
Mid table obscurity, through piecemeal purchases or an already competitive developing side with players who can become the greats of the next decade?
I have deliberately not read the blogs after Fulham because you don’t need to. I was as pissed off as the next man at the ineptitude, but it is ridiculous to write off a season, after the 1st 3 games. You only get an idea from the 1st 10 games & if we have 16-20 points & playing in the CL then we are competitive.
My own feeling is that a young team often falls back, after a relatively successful season (83 points is successful), to go on, the season after, to reach its full potential. That would bring us to the 5 years Legend is talking about.
Injuries are our biggest problem (& the reason why we need an extra midfielder). If we can get close to putting our best side out for at least half the season, I am still confident we shall do very well.
We need 2 of Cesc,Nasri,Rosicky & Diaby playing in any game. That has not happened yet.
The future of Arsenal could depend on the common sense, patience & realism of the majority of its fans.
We need to get behind this team, regardless of our opinions of who should come or go, or what Arsene has maybe said to put the journos off the track.
By: Flint McCullough on August 27, 2008
at 11:31 am
I do love the way people struggle to give Eboue any credit so far this season!
He’s playing miles out of position with a novice next to him and so far was fine against WBA and easily our best player against Fulham. Whilst i appreciate a lot of people just dont like him, at the moment he should be in team on merit.
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 11:36 am
Good piece by Myles Palmer today.
Interesting that he suggests we have effectively put all our eggs into the Alonso basket in the hope that Barry joins Liverpool on the same day.
I’d be OK with that. I dont see the point of Liverpool doing that though. Alonso is a better player than Barry IMO and he’d cost a bit more. Alonso can tackle and pass and score and he will keep Cesc happy too.
If it does not happen, has wenger decided that no other player will come in instead? I fear that will be the case.
Not quite sure why this deal cannot be done before deadline day though. its not like Villa will use the £17m wisely!!
By: gazzap on August 27, 2008
at 11:40 am
Alex Ice Cream..
The criticism you make of wenger is valid and reasonable. I am with you on this one. We have to get behind our manager, but I think its time for wenger and most of the squad to simply SHUT UP and get down to hard business.
What is extremely annoying is that in the face of our problems I come across headline statements from arsene or one of our players in the order of “we CAN win” the champions league and the championship or this or that. Yes we know…Just freakin shut up and work hard and make a statement at the end of the season in the order of “we HAVE won” this or that.
By: Naga gunner on August 27, 2008
at 11:40 am
Flint, Diably and Rosicky are injury prone, and I am afraid EDS wil be when he first returns and we already have Bischoff, and Silvestre injured before they even start.
Arseblog which has been supportive of the manager really states the facts today, please read it.
I have been supportive of the team for over 50 years BUT if we dont qualify for ECL next year I will be mortified.
The managers comments dont put journalists off track they just add fuel to the flames. His PR is jsut ludicrous its better to say nothing.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:41 am
Gazzap,
It sounds as though Liverpool are going to sign Riera in which case they probably wont go for Barry and therefore keep Alonso, where does that leave us?! Bidding for Barry?
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 11:42 am
Frankly speaking (or writing) the usual suspects who post on this blog continue to spout utter bollocks. Pre-season they rant about the need for big signings and there glee at the departure of Hleb in particular Arsene affirms his faith in his squad and his antipathy to big signings at any price. As it becomes apparent with the new season that Arsene is true to his words and core belief, they resort to belittling the players on the squad (Adebayor, Gallas and Eboue in particular) and eventually the manager himself. The fact that we have had a rocky start at the start of the season only sharpen their venom. Leave it to Steve McLaren, who knows a thing or two about venom, to give the perfect retort:
“I know Arsenal inside out and I know what they’re capable of,” he added. “Whenever a top four team loses a game there’s supposed to be a crisis.
“But, as usual there’s no crisis and I don’t expect Arsene Wenger to think there is one.” .
By: shotta-gunna on August 27, 2008
at 11:43 am
NAGA thats exactly the point Alex and I are making ludicrous statements do no good. It was great to make statements when we were the invincibles but to make exagerated claims now when we have a weak squad is beyond ridiculous
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:44 am
Flint, words of wisdom.
And regarding Arsene’s comments after matches – on Saturday he said we were crap because we were and he needed to give the players a rocket. On other occasions when we have been crap (which are not that frequent fortunately) he may have said we were unlucky in order to boost the confidence of certain players because he judged that was the right way to get the best results long term.
His first job is to get the team to deliver rather than tell the fans exactly what they want to hear after each game!
By: Big Johan on August 27, 2008
at 11:46 am
Yes TGP ,
Eboue & perhaps Nasri were the only 2 who could hold their heads up, after that shambles.
I think Eboue could work well in CM with Cesc.
Song was a revelation crisp passing actually finding a man. He came on about an hour too late, in my opinion.
By: Flint McCullough on August 27, 2008
at 11:46 am
SHOTTA its not the rocky start, its the fact we lost Hleb, Flamini, Gilberto, and we have too many injury prone players,we have to have a stronger squad.
Nobodys talking about massive signings, but Kompany for 8 million was a better buy than Silvestre, and prior to Euro 08 Arshavin was 10 million, we are not talking a load of bollocks, unfortunately you are in the minority if you check all the Arsenal blogs. We all want the team to win but we are pissed off with PR that led us astray
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:50 am
I didn’t expect us to win a trophy last year but, going into the season, I did think we looked strong, easily strong enough to be in the top four in the Premiership and the last sixteen in Europe, thus ensuring the money continued to roll in. This year I don’t. For the first time ever I think we’re couple of injuries away from long-term financial disaster.
As several people pointed out yesterday, drop out of the top four and you’re not just waving goodbye to a large wad of cash for one year – 20 million, 60 million, depending on how far you go – you’re handing that wad of cash to some other club who can use it to strengthen their squad. Drop out of the top four and your best players will go, which in turn makes it harder to attract top-quality new ones. Drop out of the top four and you’ll have a tough task getting back in, however much money you’ve hoarded.
If we can’t panic-buy now, we won’t do it in January either, since finding ‘the right player at the right price’ is usually even more difficult then. A couple of weeks ago I was worrying about Friday’s draw and whether some monstrous god/goddess was going send us Bayern, Juve and Dynamo Kiev. Now, I’m almost thinking an early exit might be a blessing. It would feel like a massive disgrace, and we’d lose a wad of money, we could even lose Cesc, but not being in Europe for the second half of the season might give our thin squad a tiny advantage over whoever is pressing us for fourth in the league. That’s if the players don’t sink into a terminal depression, of course, which they may do.
It just feels like total madness to me. Two panic-buys, even one top-quality panic-buy, and we’d be right back in there again, with the exciting prospect of Wilshere and co coming along for next season. It’s not as though you can’t resell your panic-buys, perhaps even at a profit; it’s not as though we’d be doing a Leeds United and staking everything on the (remote) possibility of Champions League glory. We have the money. Thirty million according to Wenger. It is NOT spending it that could send us crashing into a downward spiral. It is NOT spending that is the huge risk.
By: Mia on August 27, 2008
at 11:53 am
FLINT AS president of the Alex Song fan club since his days at Charlton I agree wholeheartedly with you,and in fairness to the Manager he stuck by him when he was terrible in the Fulham game 2 years ago.
Song should be in the team at CB or DM for most games.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:54 am
Solgooner:
I really really doubt that we have a weak squad. Sure we’ve lost Flamini and Hleb, but on othe fronts we can’t discount the fact that the players have a year more experience. The loss of Gillberto and Lehmann shouldn’t be too much to handle because they hardly played last season. Hleb has been replaced by nasri, who has shown some really good signs that he might be better than Hleb. Still to early to judge, but he’s scored one and made some good passes that Adebayor failed to convert. As far as Flamini is concerned, we might see someone from the squad step up, maybe Diaby if he remains injury free. None of us thought that Flamini would be great at that position last season but he stepped up. Likewise none of us thought that Clichy could play more than 20 games because of his injuries, but the fact is that he did. Let’s just hope that something happens that none of us expects, with regards to injuries to Diaby and Rosiscky, and the younger ones stepping up. We have rosiscky, Eduardo,Cesc and Diaby to return. They will have a gret impact on our team, and Vela might be introduced by January just as Eduardo was last season. The only real concern to me is the RM, because Eboue and Theo, haven’t shown any signs of progress at that position. But then again it’s too early to make judgment calls or discredit the team that had one bad game.
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 11:56 am
MIA Alonso wouldnt be panic buy, and if hes 5 million over the odds who cares, if it means we finish in the top four and Cesc is not exhausted by the end of the season,
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:56 am
ATEEB Nasri is excellent and wil replace Hleb but we have no depth because we have too many injury prone players. Song will step up from the squad but if Cesc is injured we have no creative players, as was obvious Saturday and against Newcastle, and Middlesborough last season.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 11:59 am
Naga, Alex, Mia,
We all agree that saying nothing is better that the rubbish we hear on an almost daily basis.
Another good one from today is:
“I do not know why we are always under pressure to buy £30 or £40m players,”
More lies. I do not know anyone who wants this. Maybe on some other blogs that I don’t read? We want a squad and not superstars.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 12:00 pm
Wenger will do this tonight
Almunia
Sagna Toure Gallas Clichy
Eboue Denilson Cesc Nasri
RVP Bendtner
I would do this
Almunia
Sagna Djourou Gallas Clichy
Eboue Song Cesc Nasri
RVP Bendtner
By: gazzap on August 27, 2008
at 12:01 pm
This idea that it is PR on AW’s part is overlooking the fact that he is simply replying to questions from Jounalists.
He is asked a question and answers it with what he sees as the truth.
He consistantly says he will not mention any names as far as transfers go. This becomes Wenger will not rule out Barry move!
He has consistantly said he is looking for an extra midfielder. He has also said he is looking for quality rather than a big name.
It is the media who turns straight forward answers into stories, it is not pr from AW
By: JohnN on August 27, 2008
at 12:04 pm
AIC,
The 40 million comment, came in response to the media quizzing him about Robinho and Bernabtov’s imminent moves. He wasnt referring to Arsenal fans.
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 12:06 pm
I suspect the Alonso or nobody scenario is correct.
Whoever comes in needs to be a class player, with PL experience, to have an immediate effect. He also needs to be better than what we have.
Alonso fits that bill & I am unable to think of anyone else, who would quite fit the bill & may be available. I like Barry but I am not sure he would fit our style.
Mia,
There are no guarantees, in football, other that at some point in the future Arsenal, Chelsea, Man U & Liverpool will all finish outside the top 4.
If not football truly is dying.
By: Flint McCullough on August 27, 2008
at 12:08 pm
SOlgooner:
Nasri can play in the middle. In the present scenario if rosiscky had been fit, I think Nasri would have played in the middle while rosiscky would have taken the flanks. At the moment we have too many players out due to injuries. And that needs to be rectified.
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 12:13 pm
does anyone know what channel the game is on tonight??
By: blad on August 27, 2008
at 12:21 pm
Would like to see
Alumina
Sagna Toure Djouru Clitchy
Song
Ebue Fabregas Nasri
Adebayor Bentner
Subs: ( Vela, RVP, Gallas, Wilshire, Dennilson)
This should see us win by at least two-nil
By: Confidentgooner on August 27, 2008
at 12:22 pm
Blad, the BBC are showing it on BBC3 tonight.
By: avaris15 on August 27, 2008
at 12:35 pm
JohnN..
Its not about media interpretaion. we are talking about direct quotes from wenger. He has a habit of making these drawn out ridiculous statements, which needs to stop, many fans are just fed up.
I would like to see some signings, but if wenger doesnt, then FINE, He is the manager so what can we say? But quite frankly, he has become a LAUGHING STOCK with regard to some of his statements over the years and he just needs to shut up.
It is a wonder he has still not abandoned his trademark”I havent seen it” statement and when martin jol of totenham used the same statement, wenger called him a liar.
In his tussle with mourinho his statements were just as daft. He said Premier league clubs have a “duty to entertain”. What the deuce is that? Its just sour grapes, and what about the classic cska 0-0 “best performance in europe”.
I say we have to support him as arsenal manager, but he needs to stop delivering these daft statements and trying to become a moral paragon of the football world.
He needs to address arsenals problems and he can do it the way he sees fit, but we, as fans dont want to be treated as fools. His ludicrous statements has to stop, We have ENOUGH problems as it is…
By: Naga gunner on August 27, 2008
at 12:37 pm
A QUOTE FROM ARSEWEB IN REPLY TO WENGER PR
It just seems that the more people suggest to Arsene that we need signings the more reluctant he is to do it. To be fair to him he hasn’t given up on the idea and says:
If I can find one more player before the transfer deadline, I will take him. But one more player will not make that much difference. If we don’t get him, we’re still strong enough to deal with all the competitions.
To be honest I’m amazed at that statement, I really am. Another injury to Cesc and our midfield is essentially decimated. To say we’re strong enough without a signing to cope with the league and the Champions League is just wrong, in my opinion. We weren’t strong enough to cope with Fulham. How are we possibly strong enough to cope with Europe’s elite? And here’s the thing. Nobody has ever said they want Wenger to go out and spend £20m or £30m on any player. We saw last season that you can bring in quality like Sagna and Eduardo at good prices, and those are the kind of signings people would have been more than happy with.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 12:41 pm
It’s on BBC3….
I think my comments yesterday were misunderstood as a knee jerk reaction to Saturdays performance.
In fact, my comments were based on all 3 performances this season, which have been very poor, and comparing the squad to what we had last season.
You can call me negative all you like, but i prefer to think of it as realism.
Without strengthening the midfield, there is no chance of us competing this season.
No chance whatsoever…
It doesnt mean i support my team any less, before any asks me to go and suport someone else.
I just find it frustrating, and i wonder where all of the money goes.
I am not asking AW to go out and sign a superstar, i dont care who it is, or where they come from.
All i want is for him to recognise that we are weak in that area of the squad and do something about it.
I can see it, and AW knows a lot more about football than i do, so why cant he?
By: Matt on August 27, 2008
at 12:45 pm
Matt,
Its obvious that AW can see it but obviously he has decided who he wants and how much he thinks they’re worth. By saying what he has said he is just trying to boost the current players. I’m not much of a fan on Myles Palmer but that is one thing i definately agree on, when Arsene speaks in public it is always directed at his players rather than us.
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 12:53 pm
There seems to be a bit of confusion regarding Denilson. So far this season he has been playing Cesc’s role. So it really isn’t fair to evaluate him as a DM based on those performances when he has been in charge of organizing the offense. He may be very effective when slotted in next to Cesc. In my opinion it is too early to tell. In fact, what those performances did say to me (and others of you, I venture) is that we need an effective back-up for Cesc. Rosicky could work if we knew he were healthy and we haven’t yet seen Diaby play there (his distribution is suspect as is his fitness). However, I’m hoping for Alonso.
By: california gooner on August 27, 2008
at 12:55 pm
Rosicky could easily play in CM for us. As could Nasri. But both would require an anchmorman beside them.
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 12:57 pm
Matt..
wenger will never do things that other people say. That is alright in itself…but I think he doesnt do the things other people say, simply because other people are saying it and not because of whether its right or wrong.
By: Naga gunner on August 27, 2008
at 12:58 pm
We need at least 2 signings. A winger and a DM. But in the absence of that (there may be so many things about the financial situation of the club that we do not know), we need AW to be more tactical and present the best squad. Song and Djoru should feature. Song is best for that DM position now, while Djoru should be a fixture at our backline rotating with Toure/Galllas/.Silvestre.
A Right Midfield of Eboue/Walcot with Ebue starting is always a stronger option than just throwing in Walcot. As much as we slate him, Ebue works well with Sagna and the fo\wards.
By: Confidentgooner on August 27, 2008
at 1:05 pm
Flint
I agree that any great club can have a brief glitch and fall out of Europe. Milan this year, Bayern last year, Juve because of the match-fixing scandal, Real and Liverpool a few years back (though both those two as the previous year’s Champions League winner managed to sneak back in).
But history suggests that the great historic clubs never suffer for more than a season or two. I’d see United and Liverpool as being in that luminous company, but we and Chelsea are not. Chelsea are in a temporary success-bubble (hopefully brief) because of Abramovich; we’re in the same bubble (hopefully for longer) thanks entirely to Wenger.
That’s my worry. Gazzap wondered yesterday whether Wenger would resign if we weren’t in Europe next season and we lost Cesc. God forbid, but I think it’s possible he’d feel honour-bound to. No matter how much money he has hoarded to give his successor the best chance, I can’t see anyone doing better than him. That’s why I’m so frantic. Please, please let him discard the frugal, principled habits of a lifetime, just for this year.
Of course it’s better to Wenger-buy than panic-buy. But if Wenger-buying has foundered for once – Silva didn’t want to join us? Inler held out for impossible terms? – then for God’s sake let him dip into the cash at his disposal. He’s hoarded it and he’s earned it – around 20-24 million profit on transfers over the past 15 months; an annual wad of around 20 million from the Champions League, plus a lot more for the final two years back.
By: Mia on August 27, 2008
at 1:09 pm
I actually think all of this stuff about Wenger doing ‘PR’ or not listening, etc. are a total misreading of the man. Wenger has more integrity than any other coach I can think of. For the most part, he has been remarkably consistent: he believes in developing his players and that the players he has are as good as any ‘names’ that are being tossed about. Of course that vision sometime bumps up against reality, which creates doubts about the best course for the future: stay the course with a young player or bring in a veteran? This is where pretty much ALL the discussion is generated. Wenger’s evaluations differ from those of many fans (who tend to favor established players over new ones), and sometimes even he changes his mind. Of course he has to engage PR since he has to please different interest-groups who want to hear different things while maintaining his ability to act autonomously. However, this idea that he is the Great Deceiver strikes me as utter tosh. Nothing could be further from the truth.
By: california gooner on August 27, 2008
at 1:11 pm
Mia, in all three cases mentioned above the clubs have been spending big money to get back in the CL, and they are all such established brands they have little problem attracting talent (my impression is that Juve has suffered the most…but for obvious reasons). So, a little spending now to sure up the squad could be the economically wise course and not simply a way to shut-up uneasy fans.
By: california gooner on August 27, 2008
at 1:28 pm
I acutually think the comment by California gunner is spot on concerning AW.
Many times some of the answers come out the way they do cos he is answering a particular sometimes leading question from reporters
By: team spirit on August 27, 2008
at 1:28 pm
Gulleaum Ballaug WHO IS CLOSE TO ALONSOWROTE THE FOLLOWING
In spite of reports, Arsenal have not yet made an approach to Liverpool for Xabi Alonso.
I have the impression that the player would be more than happy to play under Wenger at the Emirates, and it would be a great signing to appease a number of players in the Arsenal dressing room who are growing disenchanted with the lack of quality recruits this summer.
Arsenal desperately need an injection of quality in the centre of midfield and surely must replace some of those who have departed: if they are to mount a serious challenge for the title, or even maintain their position in the top four. However, as someone from Xabi’s inner circle said, following Arsenal’s poor showing at Fulham, Alonso fears that if Wenger does not make a move for him now, then he never will.
As far as Liverpool are concerned, they do not need to sell Alonso in order to obtain the funds for further transfers this summer. However, if Arsenal were to make an offer in the region of £15-16 million, then it is one that would be accepted by Rafa Benitez.
FOR 15 MILLION LETS DO IT. PLEASE
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 1:37 pm
Wenger should maybe just buy one £20 million player, a big name to satisfy the hounds. When he does, if, he should say; I hope you’re satisfied now? Now, please shut the feck up and let me run my club, the way I know, and I an fecking good at assembling squads brimming with outrageous quality on a shoestring.
Can you feckers just let him do his damn job?
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 1:42 pm
Ole, why the insults? Instead of denigrating people, why not change the topic with a post or some questions that you regard more interesting and appropriate?
By: california gooner on August 27, 2008
at 1:48 pm
Wenger made me laugh regarding his comments about not caring about names.
Now dont get me wrong he has unearthed some gems that no one heard of but now they are ‘names’. It is insane for the guy not to reconise that the majority of player that are regarded as names in football are the best players because they have earnt having a name and a reputation by playing good football. So wenger is either saying, I am going to buy someone with potential (which he keeps doing with the youngster) or he is going to unearth some gem from somewhere that is going to fit right into the premier league on day one. Both of those scenarios dont fill me with much hope for some reason at the moment. It is clear we need some inspiration.
I believe both the player and the fans need a name to give them a bit of confidence. Our Fulham performance was not a blip, it was a team that doesnt believe in their own ability. I think the team is loosing faith in itself.
I never thought I would say it but we do need a big signing to boost or season. Arsenal football club feels depressed by both what they are doing on the pitch and what is goin on behind the scenes.
By: Marcus Field on August 27, 2008
at 2:02 pm
I think this is going too far, really. All this hysteria is undermining the club, and most of it is ridiculous. It’s obvious to me that Wenger wants to buy. All this hysteria prevents Wenger from dealing in the market the way he’s always done.
It’d be a different thing if Wenger had actually once failed to buy quality.
Last year, he got Sagna, Eduardo & Diarra when nobody expected it, all for less than Alonso’s going price.
One year later, hysteria has set in, and he’s having troubles bringing people in.
You know why, folks? The media hysteria. It drives the price of players up, and prevents deals from happening quickly that would otherwise have passed through.
What is there in Wenger’s record that suggests he won’t strengthen his squad? He has always done so.
What he has never done is spend big. So if you want that, he should do the £20 m purchase and make a point of it.
Arsenal can not compete with Chelsea on price, and we’ve never outspent United. But we’ve always competed with them under Arsene. We should be looking to strengthen his ability to do what he does best, not to force him into something we’ve simply never succeeded at doing.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 2:04 pm
tonight:
Fabianski.
Sagna – Gallas – Djourou -Clichy.
Eboue- Song.
Fabregas.
Wilshere- Vela – Nasri. 4-3-3.
3-1
No Ade, RVP and Kolo, please!
By: lc on August 27, 2008
at 2:10 pm
**Now dont get me wrong he has unearthed some gems that no one heard of but now they are ‘names’. It is insane for the guy not to reconise that the majority of player that are regarded as names in football are the best players because they have earnt having a name and a reputation by playing good football.**
It’s an obvious point really. Reputations are often oversized. Example: Henry. He has much less of a reputation than David Beckham, but has been a much better player.
What you’re implying is that if you don’t have the reputation, you’re not quality. If that’s not what you’re saying, then you’re making a silly argument. Sagna is the best right back in the Premier League today. Pure quality. He didn’t have a big name.
It’s daft to think that a quality player doesn’t have quality until he his hyped.
And even if you were correct that reputation predicts quality, what about if it’s the wrong player for the wrong team. Sheva is sheer quality, but he’s flopped at Chelsea.
Even when players have a reputation, it does not predict their future performance.
The genius of Wenger is that he has many ways, thorough, proven ways of measuring quality and predicting future performance.
He knows that Sagna is quality even before he comes to the Premier League and develops a reputation.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 2:18 pm
Ole thats not what I am saying at all, I am making the point that players with reputations are more often than not good player.
Yes Wenger has unearthed some gems that were not big names before he signed them but you cant dismiss buying a player just because they have a reputation in football already. If they fit our system and are a good player and have a reputation we should still go for them. Wenger doesnt, he discounts them if they already have a reputation even if they would fit and improve the team.
Also you can not hold that argument as a reference against one player ‘Sagna’…I am agreeing with you that Sagna is one of those Gems, but for each on of the gems there are 3 more players that still need further development, Walcott, Ramsey, Denilson for example. We dont have time to wait, so we need a player who we know can play in the premiership and therefore by definition will have a reputation. We cant take a gamble on an unknown.
Ohh and one thing, since when in the eyes of people who know anything about football which we are obviously talking about…..ever thought Henry has a lesser reputation that Beckham? Beckhams reputation is as a result of a global marketing campaign conducted by the Beckham family to the global media. Yes, “Hello” readers may know more about Beckham but we are talking about football here on a blog dedicated and read by people who know about football. He may be more marketable but he does not have a greater reputation in football.
By: Marcus Field on August 27, 2008
at 2:31 pm
Ole – One other thing…..Did you actually read what I wrote.
I said…..
“Now dont get me wrong he has unearthed some gems that no one heard of but now they are ‘names”…
You replied…..
“What you’re implying is that if you don’t have the reputation, you’re not quality. ”
How is that what I am saying at all????
By: Marcus Field on August 27, 2008
at 2:33 pm
Yes, why the insults – hounds, feckers – and who are they directed against? (Probably me and Sol, despite the fact we’ve both, in different ways, been consistently admiring of Wenger, over the last few days.)
California, I agree. In the worst-case scenario – if we’re out of Europe and Wenger felt honour-bound to resign – we’d have not just a massive financial task trying to big-spend our way back into the top four, but we’d be faced with an image problem as well
As Flint implies, there have always casulties among the big clubs. Where are Forest now? Where are Red Star Belgrade? Entire countries have fallen out of the reckoning – Portugal, Holland, the whole of Eastern Europe – mainly because of the financial might of England, Italy and Spain. But that said, the great historic clubs have been around – and winning – for over fifty years. Liverpool, United, Barca, Milan, Real, Inter, Juve, Bayern – we’re not in their league. If we often imagine we are, it’s because we’ve been on the brink of moving into the top tier since Wenger arrived. Before him, we’ve never even made the final 16.
Arsenal, as a top European club, IS the Arsenal of Wenger. Without him, we’re at best a Villa or Spurs. If he left in failure, his successor would need more than the 30 million he’s hoarded and stuffed into our piggy bank to attract the right players in. He’d need Abramovich-sized funding and there isn’t another Abramovich out there, even supposing you wanted one. Which I don’t.
By: Mia on August 27, 2008
at 2:34 pm
Alex IC, your and sol’s constant quotation of AW’s more questionable quotes bigging up his squad only shows your incredible naivete.
I fully agree with the criticisms about his promises (starting from the end of last season) about bringing players in within 3 weeks, bringing in a CB, bringing in a player before the 2nd leg CL game tonight, etc. I’m tired of hearing these promises from him and they’re very disheartening to AW admirers like myself because they keep cropping up. I wish he’d just STFU on that score.
However, as to his quotes about believing in his squad, that they can compete in all competitions, stuff like “If nothing is done, it will not limit our ambitions because of it” — I’m surprised a knowledgeable fan like you (and others here) don’t understand where quotes like that come from. All over the Arsenal blogs, fans point to these quotes and ridicule them or complain about them—magnifying them all out of proportion, demonstrating a total ignorance and misunderstanding as to what AW is doing when he says such things.
It’s amazing I even have to explain it, it’s so obvious.
Anyone who’s read AW’s various biographies, who’s read the various testimonies from those who’ve worked with him knows what his absolute, unwavering, fanatical #1 priority is: instilling absolute belief in his players, defending them at all costs.
Fans and the media really don’t enter into his head at all when he makes these comments. He really couldn’t care less about our reaction to them.
HIS PLAYERS–their confidence and self-belief–is his #1 focus at all times as a football manager, it is the biggest reason why so many players praise him to the skies: the 24/7 support, dedication and belief he provides them. You cannot understand AW as a football manager without understanding how central that is to his approach, and always has been.
He doesn’t give a DAMN about how fans and the media react to what he says or does — what matters is HIS PLAYERS. That is what informs everything he says and does.
It is absolutely ludicrous to take such comments like “If nothing is done, it will not limit our ambitions because of it” as more than what they’re intended to be: HE IS TALKING TO HIS PLAYERS, not you. Not the media. Not the fans.
The media are asking him questions about the strength and competitiveness of his team after a bad loss to a mediocre team, in the face of intense media and fan criticism. He has to face those questions, and he knows full well that his players have to face all of it as well, he knows how they’re feeling.
He wants them to bounce back from the loss and show the pundits and fans they’re worthy of his belief. He knows his players want to show HIM that he is right to believe in them.
It’s called man-management.
If you expect him to say “No I don’t think my team can compete” then you’re clearly naive and have no idea of what it means to manage players, esp. a young inexperienced squad that is under intense media and fan criticism.
AW knows exactly what he’s doing when he makes comments like that, and he’s not talking to you or the media. He’s telling his players that he continues to believe in them, that he expects them to improve and perform, and to prove him right.
You laugh at AW’s comments bigging up his squad? I laugh at your inability to understand what he’s doing when he makes such comments. Esp. because it doesn’t take a genius to figure out just what the hell he’s doing.
All of the above is separate from the debate about what many of us feel is the lack of competitiveness of his current team. You and Sol say you don’t pay any attention to AW’s comments anymore but in fact both of you hang onto his every word while the rest of us realists just slough off such comments because we know who he’s talking to, and it’s not us or the media.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 2:43 pm
Sorry for calling people feckers. I apologise.
I am getting frustrated by the situation of things. I don’t understand why we as Gooners are undermining our team. 9/10 of the pundits hate Wenger and/or Arsenal. They’re mostly the ones pushing a lot of this crap.
Really, what in Wenger’s record suggests he has to be pushed to buy class. The same guy who bought, Vieira, Anelka, Petit, Henry, Kanu, Overmars, Campbell, Gilberto, Van Persie, Cesc, Sagna, Gallas, Toure, Wiltord….etc etc? Did it take fecking blogs and Alan stupid Hansen to tell him before he did it?
And Marcus,
I think you were ridiculing a profoundly wise comment. Wenger made us competitive by realising that reputation lags quality. A player can be quality for 10 years before he gets recognition and a big name. The fact that he doesn’t have a big name doesn’t mean he’s crap. And most of his top buys have been quality players who didn’t have a name yet.
I think we as Arsenal fans should realise that and seek to leverage that genius, rather than trying to outChelsea Chelsea. We have never outspent Man United. Never. But under Wenger we have competed against them. To ridicule the very thing that gave us success just undermines the club.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 3:00 pm
@NYMarcus,
It’s amazing that you have to spell this out.
The other point is that fills me with incredulity is the almost teenage like reaction that we get from all these posts. Not only are they keen to deride what AW is saying, but it’s followed by a ridiculously smug “And he thinks we are all fools… ha ha ha… well… who do you think you are kidding Mr Wenger”.
This has gone too far.
It’s a bandwagon occupied by uncharitable people who seem to be waiting for AW post match reactions, cherry picking those comments they feel is worthy of criticism and blowing it out of all proportion. An unbalanced, unconvincing and childishly self serving analysis then ensues, with some asinine comment like ‘Isn’t it obvious ? Or we’ve been spun again.’
The massive irony is that the Wenger is one of the best coaches in world football. Don’t ask a gooner. Ask any respected football coach in world football. His methods are a blueprint for success and are being copied worldwide. He has been offered a kings ransom for the England Job, the Real Madrid job, the French job.
I am tired of these people who are now dissecting Wenger’s comments and seeking to ridicule. The joke is on them. They clearly haven’t got a clue. They are armchair managers, who, if given some players to manage, wouldn’t have the first idea about what to do. They remind me of the people that come onto the X Factor, convinced that they are going to win the competition and cannot sing a single note and sound like a strangled cat. This is exactly the camp they would fall into if they had a team to manage.
By: Muppet on August 27, 2008
at 3:08 pm
What on earth is a fecker?
By: Frank on August 27, 2008
at 3:14 pm
Muppet,
You should copy and paste that on every arsenal blog in cyberspace. Absolutely spot on.
By: TopGunPires on August 27, 2008
at 3:16 pm
Again, Muppet, I wish I could have come up with that.
Very much hits the nail on the head.
By: Flint McCullough on August 27, 2008
at 3:22 pm
Nymarcus,
I know exactly why AW makes those comments and I have said the same “he can’t say that we are rubbish” line to other people on this blog.
I am just taking the mickey out of this as quite often what is said is laughable. I, like many others have found these statements annoying but I don’t get upset about them. I either ignore them (the vast majority) or pick out a few to have a chuckle over. That’s all. Some of us wish Wenger said nothing on occasions such as “the fans will be pleased with our signings – Bishoff and Silvestre!”
Some people get annoyed because what is said is a joke. This one about being under pressure to spend £40m on a player. Who said this? How is this talking to his team? How is lying to his team that we were close in the CL when all we did is reach the quarter finals going to help?
If we had real strength Wenger wouldn’t need to keep saying that we have great strength and saying it after a performance like Fulham makes his words sound very hollow. I think he protests too much.
Do you really think that real strength is built by a few cliches at press conferences? If you do, its you who is naive. You think that real strength comes from a few words? Anyway, I thought that managers spoke to players in private.
Once again you choose to launch an attack on me and make it personal. Why do you do this? You call me naive but not only is this untrue but it is also irrelevant.
I actually like your posts generally and you are obviously not an idiot but you do let your anger get the better of you and it comes through on your posts. I would just relax and stop getting wound up for nothing.
AW is not a god and he is not beyond criticism of a joke at his expense.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 3:28 pm
Muppet I agree his methods are the blue print for success and have been the foundation of modern football. The problem is we have not been sucessful in winning anything for three years now and that is my concern. It is either his coaching method failing (which we are dismissing as he is the blue print of success) so therefore it must be the players, which in my eyes are not as good as they should be at a club like Arsenal…As for anyone in life, you can not live in past glories and unless something changes and we sort it out it is going to be four years without success.
I hope to god that is not the case but when are we allowed to critisise in your eyes?
By: Marcus Field on August 27, 2008
at 3:29 pm
Nymarcus & Mia:
Totally aggree with you on the issue of Wenger’s comment. And Mia I won’t question Wengers contribution to AFC, but your belief that the club will collapse as soon as Wenger or Cesc leaves, is quite hollow. What Wenger has done over the years is errected a system that would continue to run even if he’s not there to oversee the proceeding. If you’re of the belief that Wenger personally goes to unearth the so called diamonds(players), than you’re wrong. It’s the scouts all over the world, that go about doing their job and report back to people in which Wenger is at the top of the hierarchy. A good manager would always be able to tell apart good from bad players. And ours is not the only club that play beautiful football, you have the likes of Roma in Italy, and Barca in Spain, that play free flowing football. The point I’m trying to make is that AFC would continue to run even when Wenger leaves, and quite sucessfullly at that. As far as Cesc is concerned, no doubting his abilities, but we’d still continue to find and recruit better players. Isn’t Cesc better than Viera? The performance against Fulham, has brough out the pessimistic side in all of you. FFS it was just 1 game. The one thing we all should have learned from last few years is never to doubt the ability of whatever squad Wenger errects, despite it’s lack of world famous stars or big name signings.
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 3:29 pm
Exactly Muppet.
It’s these fans who deserve to be laughed at because of their hilariously childish, incredibly NAIVE understanding of what a football manager’s job entails and what AW has to do when confronted with media questions about his team. It’s baffling that people don’t understand such a basic, essential part of AW’s job.
I’ve asked solgooner with his schoolboy “wengerspin” nonsense before and have never gotten an answer: WHAT DO YOU EXPECT HIM TO SAY? Alex IC, do you have an answer?
I’m specifically referring to what he has to say to media scrutiny after a game like Fulham.
If you say “nothing” then you clearly have zero undersanding of the demands and requirements of his job. You’d be miserable candidates for the job yourselves.
Should he just cancel the press conference and say “no comment” to all media questions and fan criticisms after a game like Fulham?
What message does that give to his players, and their confidence and hopes after such an awful performance, in the midst of intense public and fan criticism?
Do you think that publicly supporting his team’s competitiveness is so unimportant?
IT IS ARSENE WENGER’S PRINCIPLE JOB TO INSTILL BELIEF IN HIS PLAYERS — not to mollify fans with comments they think he should say. This is especially true after a bad loss and intense public criticism.
I’m THANKFUL that AW is there to act publicly to assure our players that they DO have the ability to bounce back, improve and play well. He is the only public brake between media/fan trashing of the team and the players themselves.
I would have thought that genuine Arsenal supporters would be GRATEFUL that AW makes such public comments declaring absolute confidence in his squad–he’s the only one out there to help our players work on improving their attitude and performance.
Certainly the media aren’t doing it. And certainly fans who condemn AW for publicly declaring his belief in his squad are not interested in helping our players bounce back. Otherwise they’d APPLAUD AW for those comments.
Why do you think AW is constantly condemned for never publicly criticizing his players? He’s forever saddled with the “I didn’t see it” jokes, they never end. He willingly and gladly takes on all this criticism for years on end because he never, ever wavers from his fanatical focus on SHOWING PUBLIC SUPPORT FOR AND BELIEF IN HIS PLAYERS.
That’s what his comments signify — nothing more, nothing less. He’s not treating the media or the fans like a bunch of idiots, he’s talking to his players — he doesn’t give a damn about our reaction to what he says.
I suppose solgooner’s and Alex IC’s recipe for man-management after such a media PR disaster as the Fulham loss would be to cancel the press conference? Or come out and say “no we can’t compete”?
That’s the definition of a crap football manager. Good thing that such have never tried for the job: they’d be fired even before their first press conference.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 3:33 pm
@Marcus Field
Look, I repeat again, I am not some kind of censor of criticism. That would be incredibly pretentious. Read the post. If somebody wants to criticise – fine. A well reasoned argument, backed up by facts would do it.
What we have here are not well reasoned arguments, just a general seizing of some of Wenger’s comments followed by some ridiculous – ‘who does he think he is trying to fool…’, usually followed by absolutely nothing constructive whatsoever – ok – maybe followed by – we need to sign player x.
That doesn’t mean that I’m not happy about going 3 years without a trophy, but the amount of disdain that Wenger is getting for somebody who has brought us 2 doubles, a CL final and qualification for 10 CL competitions is just beyond belief.
By: Muppet on August 27, 2008
at 3:39 pm
***If we had real strength Wenger wouldn’t need to keep saying that we have great strength and saying it after a performance like Fulham makes his words sound very hollow. I think he protests too much.***
If the media keep telling him his team has no quality, what is he supposed to say?
We’re crap! You’re right.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 3:41 pm
I agree with Muppet.
By: Frank on August 27, 2008
at 3:42 pm
Muppet – Thats fine!! Just wanted to be sure you were not saying that because of his past record critisism was not allowed. I agree the comments about how Wenger deals with the media are absurd. Wenger deals with the press far better than any other manager in the world because he actually has a brain.
By: Marcus Field on August 27, 2008
at 3:46 pm
Barry is staying with Villa. That’s good news because we won’t be getting him. However that might also mean that Alonso might not leave livpool. Unless Riera is a replacement for Alonso, or unless RAfa sells Alonso to buy Jenas for 25 m.
http://m.goal.com/goal_news.php?a=836763&PHPSESSID=99f924d1bf71e984c6a68495ff0227a0
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 3:51 pm
Alex, I just find that sometimes your comments show a bit of naivete:
“This one about being under pressure to spend £40m on a player. Who said this? How is this talking to his team?”
Did you see the press conference? He was asked about Robinho going to Chelsea, he was asked if he was worried about such a big name player going to a rival worried him. That’s where the 40m figure came from.
“How is lying to his team that we were close in the CL when all we did is reach the quarter finals going to help?”
I don’t want to insult you but I just shake my head at that question. The answer’s obvious to me. It’s a very young squad that came very close to getting to the semis with a fantastic comeback at Anfield. To YOU it’s “lying” — to the players who were on the pitch in the game on that day, to say they were “close” is not at all a lie. You presume to think the players think like you do.
“If we had real strength Wenger wouldn’t need to keep saying that we have great strength and saying it after a performance like Fulham makes his words sound very hollow. I think he protests too much.”
Again, this just baffles me. Alex, he said it ONCE — at a press conference where he was repeatedly asked about his team’s strength. I presume that AW has spoken to his players at length after the Fulham game to get their heads back on track, to re-instill that belief in them, to tell them he still has faith in them, that he believes they can bounce back. I presume he does this every day. He then faces the media who saturates him with questions about his squad’s failings and he gives the media that message–further reassuring his players publicly. “Protest too much”? One time at a press conference hardly qualifies.
“Do you really think that real strength is built by a few cliches at press conferences? If you do, its you who is naive. You think that real strength comes from a few words? Anyway, I thought that managers spoke to players in private.”
OF COURSE managers speak to players in private! Why do you think the one precludes the other??? And if you don’t think that a young team like ours that has just suffered a bad loss and is the focus of intense public scrutiny doesn’t take heart by seeing the manager face the media and tell them he believes in his players then I’m very glad you’re not Arsenal’s football manager.
I’m sorry if I’m making this personal but there’s no way around it: by constantly making an issue of AW’s public declarations of belief in his team, esp. after Fulham and the aftermath, you bring it on yourself. My criticism rests on my reaction to your failure to appreciate what AW is doing. It’s an approach that has universal acclaim from multiple generations of his players. Forgive me if I think that holds a lot more water than the ridicule of some fans who don’t know anything about football management or the needs and feelings of Arsenal’s players firsthand.
And btw, you don’t know our players personally, you don’t work with them every day. You have no idea what they need to hear. So forgive me if I take AW’s PROVEN man-management approach to his players with a bit more credibility.
And don’t resort to that endless, cheap, boring jibe about fans like me not being willing to hear criticisms about AW — that’s such a massive cop-out. I am criticizing one specific thing only: some fans’ fixation on and ridicule of AW’s public declarations of belief in his team. Not other criticisms of AW, some of which I fully agree with.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 3:53 pm
I agree with NYMarcus….except the last sentence.
By: Frank on August 27, 2008
at 3:56 pm
Nymarcus,
Once again you misunderstand a number of issues and launch into hysteria and not for the first time.
I agree that he has to say something but not always. As I said above many of the quotes that I have mentioned have nothing to do with confidence building. Try reading the previous post.
He has also trotted out the strength cliche weekly for the last 3 years during which time his team have not proved his words as true as they have won nothing.
Last year they lacked “strength” when it mattered yet they are still strong enough. It is untrue even if designed to boost the team. I know he can’t say “we are crap and need a new team” Do you think I am that stupid? He just doesn’t need to go on and on as his words lose authority after a while. AW never said this as often before. Why? He didnt need to.
If I want to have a laugh at AW’s expense with solgooner or anyone else, so what? I laugh at my own expense as well. You should try laughing at yourself once in a while – it might calm you down.
As a fan I do not want to hear “Yes we will do something before Wednesday (ie today)” and then we buy no-one. There is no need to say this and build false expecation.
Please stop going on about others not understanding when you obviously are incapable of understanding other points of view and are unable to grasp the simple fact that AW is not perfect and never was.
I don’t think you even read my last post. I even agree with some of your points and made similar ones yesterday. Disagree fine but you obviously are incapable of debating issues in a mature way.
You have no sense of humour either and consistently get personal with other bloggers whose beliefs, thankfully, are not as mired in anger as yours.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 3:58 pm
Marcus, Another thing about reputation is that it’s often dictated by some key pundits. I can’t believe how much influence raving idiot Alan Hansen has over conventional wisdom.
If Alan Hansen likes a player, suddenly he has a big reputation.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 4:02 pm
MUPPET, NYMARCUS, FLINT AND CO… keep up the good work of less moaning and more support for the team, they need it surely
By: team spirit on August 27, 2008
at 4:07 pm
Did anyone see the Gallas interview on ATVO. I’m waiting to hear his first intelligent interview. The guy sounds extremely stupid. Never heard him say something intelligent.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 4:14 pm
I agree with Team Spirit.
By: Frank on August 27, 2008
at 4:16 pm
Not a very intelligent comment, Ole Gunner, or was it meant to be ironic?
By: Frank on August 27, 2008
at 4:18 pm
Nymarcus,
Just seen your last post:
AW is not under pressure to buy 1 player of £40m nearly a world record. Never has been under this pressure.
We were close to the semis in the CL. That is a long way from being very close to winning it. How is deluding players that a QF is the same as close to winning going to help?
The strength thing has been repeated on a loop for a number of years now. I can understand why you stopped listening though.
As I said I ignore most of it. I just laugh about a few quotes.
I don’t think that AW is a bad man-manager.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 4:19 pm
Ole – I disagree, I dont believe reputation in the football world and amoungst people in the sport has anything to do with Alan Hanson! This again is refering to your Hello Magazine readers comment that Beckham has got a better reputation than Henry!
By: Marcus Field on August 27, 2008
at 4:20 pm
ha ha ha..
NYmarcus/Alex Ice Cream and all,
Guys, The summer is getting to all of us. We are ALL losing it now. There is a divide among us gooners and the way the issues are being SO COLOURFULLY and furiously debated is scintillating and most enjoyable.
I am happy to see such passion from both parties. It shows arsenal is indeed a truly special club.
I myself have a lot of doubts about our beloved club this season and have scaled down MY EXPECTATIONS to: f.a. cup champions, league 4th place , UCL 2nd round and a youngsters long shot at the league cup. I will support arsenal with all my heart.
And yes, let us restrain from calling fellow gunners, (whoever they maybe or however we disagree with them) names like idiots, “feckers” etc.. Because whatever we say we are going to have to support arsenal even if the club gets relegated or win the UCL.
cheers all… and UP THE GUNS (please dont use “come on you reds” because it could mean, liverpool, boro, manure etc…..)
Man, its good to be a gooner…
By: Naga gunner on August 27, 2008
at 4:22 pm
i understand wenger is a business man, but why does he keep on insisting on getting players with resale value? doesn’t he ever think that getting a player with a price tag on him will bring the team greater value if they win a few titles. why worrying about selling the player in 2 or 3 years. when you keep the player for 4 or 5 years and get a cup or 2 or 3 in that time. the player will pay off for himself with cash brought in from happy fans, from wins, from cups and whatnot. wenger is toooooo shrewd for his on good sometimes. just splash a little cash and have a good solid team, then see the value in that..
up the ARSE.
By: mo on August 27, 2008
at 4:26 pm
“AW never said this as often before. Why? He didnt need to.”
Alex, he keeps saying it because THE MEDIA KEEPS ASKING HIM ABOUT IT endlessly. Why can’t you grasp something so simple? As I asked many times before, what do you expect him to say when the media keep this intense repetitive questioning of his team’s strength???
Now, you can say that it’s AW’s fault that the media keep asking him about it because of his player selections, failure to buy, etc. Fair enuf. But that doesn’t change the fact that his policy is making him subject to continuous media questioning, so he has to put up a public face of confidence and belief. Again, this is so basic that I don’t understand why I have to explain it.
“As a fan I do not want to hear “Yes we will do something before Wednesday (ie today)” and then we buy no-one. There is no need to say this and build false expecation.”
You berate me about not reading your posts yet you obviously didn’t read mine — where I’ve said that I AGREE with the complaints about those kind of comments. You bring other sets of AW’s quotes, when I clearly emphasized that I am focusing ONLY on AW’s comments regarding his belief in his team. I don’t want to hear AW make any more promises about players coming in ever again.
“are unable to grasp the simple fact that AW is not perfect and never was”
Again, this is a cheap, very lazy cop-out and you know very well it is untrue because I have often demonstrated quite the reverse. When you do this, you are consigning your critics to a nice little box that you can just dismiss.
I happen to make specific criticisms of your opinions, focusing on limited, specific issues. On other issues I quite often agree with you.
However, just because I don’t agree with everything YOU say, just because I have genuine criticisms of YOUR opinions, I therefore am labelled as someone who thinks AW is flawless.
Seems like black-and-white thinking to me on your part.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 4:29 pm
bad news about Barry staying at Villa, it means Alonso wont be coming to us.
and then there was one…Appiah!!!
If you write a letter to wenger about the team it gets ignored. if you write a letter about something else one of his admin team writes back and Arsene always signs it. class.
By: gazzap on August 27, 2008
at 4:31 pm
Olegunner
If the team had beaten West Brom and Fulham convincingly , well, no one will argue with AW’s judgement. Now we can not even put up a decent fight, it is Ok to lose in my opinion as these things happens, but the playing was worse than shit against what… ? Fulham, a relegation fodder.
I will say it again AW because of his fantastic history for the Arsenal , he should be allowed till end of this season to proof himself and vindicate his decisions. He has more than earned it. But as a club beloved by all of us if we continue to play like the way we did against Fulham and West Brom, we need to seriously reconsider AW’s tenure with the club. NO one is bigger than the club, not even AW. And I will be sad as all good things do come to an end.
Up The Arse!!!!
But it is only 3 games into the season, he earned his leeway.
By: Malaysiangunner on August 27, 2008
at 4:32 pm
BTW, Alex your last post to me makes the exact same straw man argument you accuse AW of making, with his 40m quote.
You bring in AW’s comments about promises to bring in players — which are totally irrelevant to my point. We are not in disagreement about those comments.
Then you draw a picture of me as someone who can’t handle criticisms of AW just because I challenge you on your understanding of his media PR in relation to his quotes regarding his team’s strength.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 4:32 pm
to prove himself
By: Malaysiangunner on August 27, 2008
at 4:33 pm
I think people have been listening more closely to AW the longer we have gone without making signings this summer.
Normally it would come in to one ear & go straight out of the other just like the vast majority of manager`s hot air does, but his continued diffidence on the subject of transfers has made this difficult.
I don`t agree that media pressure has delayed signing though. He`s had months to put things in place & if he`s been too busy he needs some help with transfers , simple as that.
As for any late incomings, I see Milner wants away from Newcastle. He`s young, rarely injured & has a lot of prem experience for his age , plus he can play wide right or left. Any takers ?
BTW – Ole, fecker is a GREAT word
By: Paulie Walnuts on August 27, 2008
at 4:34 pm
Nymarcus,
Ok. I accept that your commments only relate to those about the team. I do read you posts but I was speed reading as believe it or not I am at work and have spent too long on this blog today!
I did miss that point however, so I hold my hands up and say its my mistake.
I have also made the same points about the team though – about not being able to say we are rubbish (which we are not). I just think he overplays it and again I am having a bit of a laugh.
Its the other quotes which are often about transfers as you say that wind us up or cause us to laugh.
I still dislike that very close stuff about the CL though.
My lack of accurate reading did spark some deabte though!
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 4:43 pm
OK….. As i am one of the so called hysterical posters, denegrating AW, i ask you all one question…
Do any of you think we can win anything this season without strengthening our midfield before Monday?
Simple question, and i am interested to see what you have to say.
By: Matt on August 27, 2008
at 4:48 pm
Anyway – back to football.
Milner has put in a transfer request.
Any takers ? Good young player, rugged, english, would benefit from AW tutelage ? Or am I off my rocker ?
By: Muppet on August 27, 2008
at 4:49 pm
Paulie,
It does. It does. There’s a reason Arsenal do their transfer business quietly. That’s how they get bargains.
When the press comesout saying Arsenal have to buy, it makes it harder for them to find the right player for the right price.
Do you knwo how long it took him to get any of the players he bought. Nobody was scrutinising and holding their breath till it happened
Marcus,
Alan Hansen, IMHO, is the setter of football conventional wisdom in this country. Just watch MOTD saturday night, and then read the dailies on Sunday, and you’d find sentences lifted from him almost word for word.
Strength in depth: This thing everyone now says is all that determines success in football. He coined it.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 4:53 pm
NEWYORKMARCUS In deference to your sensibilities I have not said the dreaded Wengersxxx for 2 days.
Having been slagged off by you for Alex Mia and I telling the truth I have been reading all the other web blogs compared with them we are angels, the discontent is everywhere, I have said for the last says that the manager should stop making so many comments you say its too help the players, how did it motivate them when he said there would be anew player before the Twente game.
Read Arsweb and some of the other normally favourable blogs and see the trend of opinion
The crux of what we were saying is that we need a stronger squad and that Cesc doesnt have to play 55 games without relief, I consider if we lose Cesc next season it would be more of a blow than losing the manger as he has only 2 years on his contract
and we need Cesc for at least 7 years
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 5:00 pm
@Ole Gunner,
The problem with Alan Hansen last season was that his praise of Manchester United and Chelsea, combined with his criticism of Arsenal was wildly disproportionate.
At any one time, Manchester United were going to win the league because they had ‘mental strength’, ’strength in depth’, ‘experience’, ‘courage’ etc etc
The same applied to Chelsea.
Arsenal on the other hand, ‘fantastic going forward, but spineless’, ‘weak’ ete ete..
A 2 point and 4 point gap might as well have been a 20 and 40 point gap in Hansen’s eyes. The chelsea and manchester united players were elevated to such an extent that not a single Arsenal player was included in his team of the season, even though Arsenal had 4 players voted by the PFA !! Not only that, but we were competitive until mid april and played arguably the best football.
No mention was made of either luck or injuries in his one eyed analysis of the situation.
By: Muppet on August 27, 2008
at 5:05 pm
Matt,
Yes. I think we’re stronger now than Liverpool were when they won the Champs League, and we have more experience of winning things too.
I think we can win even the League. I think we won’t win the league because I thought last season, that we had to win. We were the best team, and it was the right time. Now we’re starting the cycle again in a way. But we can win the Champions League for fecking sure. But at the very least, even if we don’t buy now, we have enough quality to take us at least to the next transfer window.
I have no doubt that Wenger will buy players to strengthen the team, he just needs whiners off his back.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 5:09 pm
AIC, If Wenger tries to get a player and it doesnt go through, it does not all mean he is not ambitious. I think he wants to get only players who he thinks will fit his current style, you think? He is confident in who he has if he doesnt get the addition he wants. I would do the same thing, unless you are saying he should just buy a player just because?
I really do believe we are making a mountain out of a mole hill.
Did you see that Barcelona lost yesterday? do you they are a team in trouble based on that?
Blessings!
By: Paul N on August 27, 2008
at 5:13 pm
Muppet,
I’ve always hated Hansen. What disgusts me most is that the guy’s so influential. Most people don’t realise it.
I remember folks like Archie McPherson, Martin Samuel, Guillem Ballague etc who know so much more about football than he does.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 5:17 pm
*sigh*
“Having been slagged off by you for Alex Mia and I telling the truth”
Think very highly of yourself, don’t you, oh great truth-teller looking down on the rest of us poor idiot slobs.
You still don’t get it.
Gee, we need a stronger squad. Headline breaking news, that. Can you tell me where I’ve ever disagreed with you on that?
I’ve noticed this constant refrain: criticize a point made by AW’s critics, and you’re guilty of criticizing the entirety of the argument.
sol, I know very well you and Alex are the absolute LEAST of the critics among gooners all over the net. Hell, you’re pussycats!
As I have said, I am only focusing on what I believe to be the silly expectations of AW’s comments about his team.
See — the difference is this: I listen to AW with a selective ear. When he answers a shareholders Q&A, the discussion is likely to be much more interesting than a press conference. I listen with more careful attention to his comments and find him quite interesting. When I listen to him react to a game, I know what to expect: the same stuff about “quality” “resilience” yadayadayada. He often uses the same lines and they’re boring. It’s hard to come up with different stuff to say game after game year after year. I just slough it off. I don’t EXPECT him to say anything earth shattering or even interesting.
When he faces the press, esp. after a poor performance, I expect him to put on a brave face and not publicly criticize his players. Which is why the few times he does (like after Fulham), I take note of his comments far more than if it were just his normal refusal to blame his players.
I always EXPECT him to declare his belief in his team regardless of the reality on the pitch. I just shrug my shoulders and ignore the absolute positive spin he puts forth for what it is.
I DON’T like his promises to bring in players, strengthen the squad, etc. — and fail to fulfill them. Completely puts me off.
I don’t dissect his every word, I don’t expect even honesty in his public utterances. Often he has to do damage control. He HAS to do PR. I just shrug off much of what he says as necessary PR. What I don’t do is expect him to speak to my concerns as a fan–that may be harsh but I’m a realist. I know that all he thinks about is his players. That’s all that matters to him.
Alex, yes I know, the quotes about transfer often grate. Better for him to say nothing — tho it can be hard with the media constantly on his case. But, again, the media wouldn’t be on his case if he just BROUGHT SOMEONE IN ALREADY!!!
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 5:18 pm
Ole,
I don’t understand how you can rationally think that we can win though.
We were not good enough last year, and our squad is now weaker.
How does that make us good enough?
Anyway – enough so called doom and gloom from me, i am off to the 12 pins for a beer before the game.
By: Matt on August 27, 2008
at 5:20 pm
Paul N,
No I don’t think ke should buy anyone. We need players, AW has had time and not (yet) delivered -rightly,wrongly or for whatever reason and this puts our season at risk.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 5:21 pm
Matt,
I am often in the 12 Pins as is Peter Story’s Budgie I think. I won’t be there tonight but maybe some other time?
I don’t think we can win CL or Prem either by the way. Here’s to being proved wrong!
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 5:25 pm
I keep reading we have brought in 3 players, but its more than that.
Nasri, Silvestre, Bischoff, Ramsey, Coqeulin (same age as Ramsey) and Vela. thats 6 players.
we have lost Lehmann, Hoyte, Senderos, Gilberto, Flamini and Hleb. Thats 6 players.
we have loaned out Barazite, Traore, Gilbert and Nortdveit. If these players are any good they will come to Arsenal better players – you cannot say we have lost them! even if they were here they would at best be carling cup players. so talking of 10 players out is misleading.
point is the big loss of Flamini has only been replaced by 3 players who are not ready yet (Ramsey, Bischoff and Coquelin). 2 years down the line all 3 of these players could be superstars. But that doesn’t help when we are losing to Fulham.
For me the stop gap should be Song, not Eboue or Denilson.
If you want my honest opinion, I dont think wenger will sign anyone before the window shuts.
Gooners everywhere will be throwing themselves under buses.
anyway, off to the match now. see ya.
By: gazzap on August 27, 2008
at 5:29 pm
Matt,
I thought we were very good last year. 4 players in the team of the year. Brilliant football all through. I thought we were certainly better last year than we were when we got to the Champions League final and could have won it. That was the year the Spuds almost overtook us.
I don’t take my judgements from the pundits.
Are we weaker this season? I don’t know. Really, there’s a cloud over the team. In attack we’re certainly stronger. And we’ve lost two players that did quite much influence how we played. So we have to evolve again.
But do I think we have a weak squad. Not by any means.
Here’s how I see it, and it’s simple really:
The squad we have, and even our 2nd string can beat any team outside the Top 4. If we won most of the games against those teams, we’re at >80 points already. If we hold our own against the Top 4, we’re good to win the league.
Look, it’s less mystical than you think. Beat the teams you’re stronger than, and hold your own against your equals, and you’re competitive.
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 5:35 pm
From reading all the blogs here, it is absolutely clear to me that any of you can replace Wenger immediately with no problems.
Fortunately for Arsenal Football Club, you can only replace him on your play station sets….
So……. RANT RANT……… MOAN…MOAN…WHINE..WHINE….that’s all what you’re good at.
By: Fools_Scout on August 27, 2008
at 5:43 pm
MARCUS. We all want a winning team and silverware, this blog is an oasis of serenity compared toGooners Forum which also has a lot of old time supporters like me, they are really up in arms.
I would rather the board made a clarifying statement saying we mad a mistake in calculating the costs of the stadium and we have a very small budget unless we sell players, not Snob Wood saying we have ample money then at least we have to sit back grin and bear it and if we have a really bad season arrange a mass suicide in May.
I am sure that tonight the Fulham fiasco will be forgotten as was EGOS summer antics
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 5:44 pm
Yes, Muppet, you’ve flipped. Possibly seeing that post about cricket and the Olympics last night was what did for your brain.
By: Mia on August 27, 2008
at 5:47 pm
solgooner,
I agree that there’s a whole army of irate fans out there. I just find it all extremely weird.
I don’t see the basis of the crisis though. It’s all a trumped up crisis.
Well we haven’t won anything in how many years was it again?
By: Ole Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 5:52 pm
sol, I agree, I would just prefer it if the Board would come clean with us — but that would require the type of public honesty that corporate entities are incapable of.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 5:59 pm
I don’t like to fall in with the doom monger’s. Last season we were all told that if we didn’t bring in a backer we were finished and we were unlucky not to win the league.
Some people are never happy and enjoy being pissed off but I’ve got to admit I am getting worried. In the early close season I had a really confident feeling about the forth coming season. I wasn’t worried about Hleb going. Looked great but not enough end product. Flamini’s exit was a disappointment but he had decided to go and there was nothing we could do about it no matter what anyone says.
But I did think we would bring in a least one ready made replacement for CM with the usual addition of a couple of youngsters. We replaced Hleb with a player that I am convinced will be a far superior player once he has settled in. But if we go up against a strong or motivated team our midfield even with Cesc is going to get overran.
We could easily drop a lot of points against teams lilke Villa or the Spuds let alone Man U or Chelsea.
We must make a CM signing even if it is a short term solution.
By: Marc on August 27, 2008
at 6:02 pm
Ole Gunner, for some fans it is the silverware. Not me. However, for the rest of us less demanding fans, it is 1. watching the league slip away in the last two months because of a tired/thin squad and 2. watching the champions league semis slip as well combined with 3. losing Hleb and Flamini (and Gilberto, who’s influence was waning, of course) combined with 4. Three straight games in which our midfield is overrun and our defense look vulnerable. Had we simply lost a game, no big deal. But after last year everyone is anxious to see the problems being addressed, so early bad news is enough to set us on edge — even me, and I’m one of the less demanding fans. GOOD on you for staying calm, of course.
By: california gooner on August 27, 2008
at 6:04 pm
BTW, I really hope that Senderos comes back. I expect Milan to be a great place for him to learn how to defend and hopefully to rebuild his confidence. The problem is, of course, that should that happen he will more than likely be happy there and prefer to stay.
By: california gooner on August 27, 2008
at 6:06 pm
MARCUS WELL SAID I WISH THEY HAD TO COMPLY WITH SORBANES OXLEY THEN WE WOULD KNOW THE TRUTH.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 6:07 pm
CALIFORNIA I hope he succeeds and we get 10 million for him
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 6:08 pm
OLE theres no crisis at Arsenal the crisis is in the minds of unhappy fans. We all want to put one over on MANU Chelski and Lpol and we worry about a weak squad.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 6:11 pm
Ice Cream
For you to call NYMarcus “hysterical” betrays the self-knowledge of Zsa Zsa Gabor.
I was worried about reading this blog today, such has been the avalanche of negativity based on one loss.
I do think it is far, far easier to wail and gnash teeth than to try and be positive about things. I also worry about how the general negativity that is constantly repeated in posts by the same people, day in and day out can seep into otherwise balanced supporters and affect the actual support they are able to offer the team. Surely this is the last thing we need given the callow nature of our squad?
I too have my concerns, but can’t see the benefit of bitching about it incessantly. We can’t assume that all our fears will be realised and beat Wenger over the head with it when the transfer window is not even closed yet and we are so far from the end of the season.
How many will put their hands up and admit that they had doom and gloomed us out of the UCL this time last year?
Maybe not all of this angst is fully Arsenal’s?
By: Akbty on August 27, 2008
at 6:50 pm
http:// http://www.telegraph.co.uk/ sport/football/leagues/premierleague/ arsenal/2630779/Emmanuel-Adebayor-to-be-dropped-for-Arsenals-Champions-League-qualifier—Football.html
Emmanuel Adebayor to be dropped for Arsenal’s Champions League qualifier
Adebayor has started poorly following a summer of uncertainty over his future. AC Milan and Barcelona were both interested in the Togo international, and though he eventually signed a new deal at Arsenal it is widely reported he will make way for Nicklas Bendtner against Twente this evening.
Adebayor scored in the first leg in Holland, but has disappointed in his first two Premier League games of the season and currently looks a shadow of the player who scored six goals in his first four League games last term.
Adebayor is far from alone in underperforming however, and Wenger admits he pulled no punches with his side following the defeat against Fulham.
“I don’t remember being that angry after a game,” said Wenger. “I was furious because we didn’t create a lot.
“That can happen when you are 1-0 down on a set-piece, but the way we conceded it. It was a special game where we knew it was important not to concede a goal on a set-piece.
“And we didn’t manage to come back, which is unusual for us.”
(The rest of the article goes on to quote Gallas saying how much the team needs to bounce back and perform in today’s game)
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 6:51 pm
Akbty,
I don’t base my views on 1 game. See my numerous posts over the last few weeks.
I am not hysterical and if you think that I am, fine, its your view.
I was quite optimistic last year and I thought that we would surprise people. If we had kept Hleb and Flam and added to the squad I would be more optimistic.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 7:02 pm
Nymarcus,
I don’t have a problem about us disagreeing (less that I thought by the way) I just don’t like being called naive for my views.
Re your Ade article I would like to see if RvP plays as he has been horrible so far this season.
I have learnt my lesson about speed reading posts at work though!
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 7:08 pm
NYMarcus great comment on Wenger and his use of the media earlier. Basic but clearly misunderstood. I’m expecting a response for the manager tonight!
By: Danny on August 27, 2008
at 7:18 pm
Alex IC – I concede I’m insensitive and more combative — I get called names on blogs all the time, I just shrug it off, it doesn’t bother me. I’ve spent too much time arguing and debating in Brazil and in Brooklyn bars and we call each other names all the time, and then start the next round of drinks. There are posters on Arsenal blogs who REALLY throw out personal insults, guess I’m using them as my standard — a standard not to match, that is.
Maybe it would’ve been better for me to say “that’s a naive argument” or somesuch.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 7:22 pm
RANT……RANT
MOAM……MOAN
WHINE……WHINE
Pathetic…………
By: Fools_Scout on August 27, 2008
at 7:30 pm
Oh my GOD, I just found out we are 14th in the table we gonna get relegated….Sack the French, let’s get the umbrella guy back he can save us from relegation.
Fish & Ships….Fish & Ships….Fish & Ships.
By: Fools_Scout on August 27, 2008
at 7:38 pm
WE have to wait till 1 September then all unite… Lets hope we get more strength if not lets hope the wounded all return and Bischoff, and Coquelin become stars.
By: solgooner on August 27, 2008
at 7:41 pm
Nymarcus,
I am here to talk about football and no matter how vehement the diasgreement there is no need to make it personal that’s all.
I’ll take your combative nature into account in future!
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 7:46 pm
sol,
Well said. We all need to be behind the team.
Hopefully we’ll have something to be pleased about by September 1
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 7:50 pm
TEAM NEWS:
Ade’s on the bench. Bendtner and RVP to start.
Djourou to start, Toure on the bench.
McLaren’s missing a key striker due to injury.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 7:57 pm
Cesc, Theo, Denilson are starting
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:06 pm
any one has the link to Just-in please? I’m at work and don’t have it
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 8:11 pm
I don’t know if Yogi will let this e-mail thru because of rights issues, but here you go G4E:
http:// http://www.justin.tv/ gindilla
I’ve broken the link deliberately – just make sure you close up the spaces when you try it on your browser.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:14 pm
oops, sorry about the double “http://”
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:15 pm
Awesome, thanks NYmarcus
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 8:15 pm
AARRGGHH!!! Cesc creates a perfect opportunity for RVP to score, RVP’s unmarked right in front of goal and he volleys over to the next town! Geezus, when the hell is he ever going to score for us again??
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:28 pm
NASRI JUST SCORED!!!!!
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:32 pm
Bye Bye Hleb, Hello Nasri….and he scores goals.
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 8:36 pm
Dammit, the link is down!
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:36 pm
I know it’s not working for me now too NYm
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 8:40 pm
Just to fill you guys in…
Denilson had a shot on goal and could have scored.
Nasri did a brilliant run down the wing and crossed, but it was cleared.
Twente are fouling Arsenal pretty consistently. Two yellow cards so far.
By: Muppet on August 27, 2008
at 8:42 pm
Thx Muppet
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 8:43 pm
Van Persie just missed an absolute sitter fro mthe edge of the box. Guy needs a goal.
By: Muppet on August 27, 2008
at 8:44 pm
Nasri scored???!!!
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 8:44 pm
yup – 1-0
By: Muppet on August 27, 2008
at 8:46 pm
Try this ………http://livefooty.doctor-serv.com/wed27.8/Arsenal_Twente2.html
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 8:46 pm
Another yellow card for Twente. Foul on Fabregas.
By: Muppet on August 27, 2008
at 8:46 pm
Yes, Nasri scored. The team is playing better than on Saturday, no question. Denilson’s playing well. Theo keeps getting kicked all over the park. RVP, tho, just can’t buy a goal. Also, Djourou tried for a goal but it went wide. Nice to see him go for goal at least. Unfortunately I haven’t seen the last 10-15 mins as the link is down! Two yellow cards to Twente players.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:47 pm
That link doesn’t work either, Muppet!
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:52 pm
At least I can follow the audio commentary on the official site.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:52 pm
Half-time. The Guardian’s Paul Doyle is doing the minute-by-minute report and he’s using every opportunity to insult our players, the guy’s an ass.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 8:54 pm
PSN 2 is working now on Just In but maybe because it’s half time?
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 8:55 pm
Hi everyone,
Links are hard to come by tonight. This one’s working for me: http://www.justin.tv/psn_2
…But not for my brother in Dubai. I think you have to refresh ad infinitum to get it to work. It’s one of those rare nights when being abroad actually makes it harder to watch Arsenal on TV!
Also following the commentary on the Guardian. Paul Doyle is slating the “hilariously awkward” Bendtner again – remember he’s the one who described him as gauche. He’s really got it in for the lad.
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 9:00 pm
NYmarcus,
Put live footy doctor into Google and try that way. The link can change from time to time so best to find it through google. You’ll have to download some software but this site is usually reliable. You might have to find the link a bit though.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 9:00 pm
NYmarcus
http://livefooty.doctor-serv.com/. Download the software – Sopcast and then choose the screen.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 9:06 pm
ok, Alex, thanks for the tip.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:06 pm
Yes, the PS2 link works! Eboue’s on. Just behave yourself, Manu, please.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:08 pm
why take off nasri?
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:09 pm
Pool still can’t score against Liege
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:12 pm
Not sure,
Hope he’s not injured.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 9:13 pm
GALLAS JUST SCORED FROM A BENDTNER CROSS!!!
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:15 pm
What will Paul Doyle say about Bendtner’s touch for that second goal?!
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 9:16 pm
It was good work from Gallas as he started the move as well
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 9:16 pm
F*** Paul Doyle. Who cares what he thinks. Who is he anyway?
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 9:17 pm
Just in working?
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 9:21 pm
True enuf, Alex, I vainly hope that some pundit will surprise me and cover an Arsenal game without the sneering condescension Doyle shows every time he writes about us.
You can now call me NAIVE!
Big Al, check out what he said about Bendtner in that move — he compared him unfavorably with what Henry would’ve done.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:21 pm
Just a journo. Doing the text commentary tonight, but I just noticed that he never misses a chance to snipe at Nicklas.
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 9:21 pm
Yeah NY – but he ignores the fact that he got himself into that position with a great touch.
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 9:23 pm
Nice to see Djourou and Gallas embracing in celebration of Gallas’ goal.
True enuf, Big Al. He’s got some weird fixation about Bendtner.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:26 pm
What the hell was Almunia doing???
Theo just scored!! Great finish!
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:30 pm
Not sure what Almunia was doing. Maybe he was cold due to lack of activity and needed to move.
Song on – in midfield
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 9:32 pm
Thank god Cesc’s off – he played for about an hour.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:34 pm
Guys, have a look at the Guardian now – see what I mean. I think Doyle’s got a crush – he’s protesting too much!
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 9:34 pm
And Pool STILL can’t score against Liege!!!
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:35 pm
Wish AW would give Vela some minutes.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:40 pm
Wonderful. Denilson’s injured.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:41 pm
Is it just me..or is Guy Mowbray commentating on BBC3 taking every single opportunity to have a niggle at Arsenal?
By: Ian Dolent on August 27, 2008
at 9:41 pm
And he scores! Have that!
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 9:52 pm
Ade PASSED TO BENDTNER — and Bendtner scored!!!
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:53 pm
Well it was a pretty easy game, Twente gave them SO MUCH SPACE! Still, it does help to come back so emphatically after Fulham.
Pool – Liege into extra time.
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 9:57 pm
Yeah, good assist from Denilson. A real nice back flip for Bentdner to burry.
Liverpool still at nil-nil, now going to extra time.
By: Ateeb on August 27, 2008
at 9:59 pm
4 different scorers is a good thing too. Did Fabregas play good? I didn’t see this part of the game.
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 10:01 pm
G4E
Some good passes from Cesc but he’s not match sharp yet.
By: Alex Ice Cream on August 27, 2008
at 10:02 pm
You can’t really take much from a game like that. I guess it’s good for confidence. RvP still needs to find some form as well.
Anyway…
Come on Standard Liege – ah, the CWC memories come flooding back!
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 10:30 pm
Oh crap. I jinxed them.
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 10:31 pm
Well OF COURSE Pool finally got a goal (Kuyt).
By: NYmarcus on August 27, 2008
at 10:34 pm
Thanks Alex, yeah I hope he will get up there because we need him for PL games.
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 10:35 pm
well one thing i will say and that is to all those who were slagging off theo the other day coz there were quite a few, is that it is plane to see that the guy is a blatant natural STRIKER/PREDATOR!
why doesnt wenger play him upfront? its really pissing me off! he will score goals!
By: dukeGoonem on August 27, 2008
at 10:40 pm
Wenger is a dictator Dukegoonem, he likes to torture us, the players, and ultimately himself
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 10:51 pm
Walcott right now reminds me a little bit of Freddie Ljungberg during his first couple of seasons at the club. He seems to panic at crucial moments. Everyone used to complain that Freddie had no end product. Then something clicked.
Theo will never be a really creative player; he’s not made that way, but when he’s on form – and has the right players to support him – he’ll do damage to any team…in my opinion of course.
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 11:03 pm
Big Al
you said it mate….theo will never be a creative player! your right, we know that!! he isnt meant to be!! . he is the player on the end of the move taking the last man and scoring!!!
that the point im making! you put owen out wide and what have you got? thats coz owen is deadly upfront and so will theo be!!
By: dukeGoonem on August 27, 2008
at 11:12 pm
I’m glad some people standing up for Walcott now. So this is how it feels when every one blames a specific player for our defeats or losing a title?
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 11:13 pm
i wil say i was disgusted that people were slagging off theo last week.
there are not many people that can actually even take on players in this league but theo can do it on a regular basis. the problem he has got is his decision making, and that is coz he should be bearing down on goal not looking to pick out a killer pass!!!
By: dukeGoonem on August 27, 2008
at 11:21 pm
DG – Maybe he’ll make that transition this season. But like I implied, Ljungberg was never a particularly creative player. The best thing about his game was the runs he made into the box to get on the end of other players’ good work. I think that’s the role that Wenger sees Theo filling for now. What do you reckon?
Anyway, football fans are fickle, aren’t they G4E. Or are Arsenal fans even more fickle than most?
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 11:32 pm
It’s all part of the learning process Duke. He has to be a well versed player…he has to score and he has to find the killer pass or cross. I think he has what it takes to do it, if we give him the time.
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 11:34 pm
Maybe it’s because the Arsenal side’s so young. It’s a classic sign of inexperience: A promising young player can look absolutely hopeless one day, then light up the stadium one match later. Perhaps a bit more faith and encouragement is required from the fans.
By: Big Al on August 27, 2008
at 11:35 pm
WE expect a lot from our young players because we feel they’re all what we have Big Al. We forget that these young players are playing for a huge club, on a very big stage that even the oldest players get weak at the knees thinking about. We need to be patient, but it’s hard to do after a game like Fulham. Human nature I guess?
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 11:37 pm
Agreed i would love to seem him upfront he would score goals for fun with our creative play. But then there is RVP who we can all agree hasn’t found his form yet but at least he is not injured…………..
By: Silver Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 11:39 pm
did anyone watch the game on bbc 3 i wanted to kill hansen just kept finding ways to be critical of theo when he was head and shoulders the best player on the pitch
By: Silver Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 11:40 pm
Don’t jinx him Silver Gunner
it’s great to have them all fit. Imagine when Rosicky, Diaby come back too…we will have some options.
By: Gunner4Ever on August 27, 2008
at 11:42 pm
Silver Gunner
I turn the sound off when Hansen, Shearer and the ex spud muppet start talking.
Did you notice all the empty seats during the game? Must have been the lowest ever at the grove.
By: Steve on August 27, 2008
at 11:44 pm
Gunner4Ever I have had this debate with fellow arsenal supporters about Diaby but where is his best position? I am of the opinion it is as an attacking midfielder.
By: Silver Gunner on August 27, 2008
at 11:48 pm
Bid Al
That was our problem last week, we had too many youngsters in the middle and they were non exhistent! so it wasnt any of their fault even though we as fans automatically blamed all of them!
By: dukeGoonem on August 27, 2008
at 11:54 pm
The Guardian minute by minute writers take the piss out of EVERYONE. Relax.
By: Mats Viktorsson on August 27, 2008
at 11:57 pm
I think right now he seems more into gowing forward and attacking. I really believe as he grows, he can do both defend & get the ball back when we lose it and join the attack when he can. Viera used to do that, I think Viera just had a stronger mentality than Diaby does…at least for now.
By: Gunner4Ever on August 28, 2008
at 12:03 am
FC TWENTE!!! THE NETHERLANDS RULESS!!
By: bertbami on August 28, 2008
at 2:40 am
A much better performance but our Cesc was there. He kept the flow and the rhythm intact the as the meter of the team. As 3 games a season does not make neither is the fourth but we built confidence today and hopefully we stop the near term slide. Newcastle will be an acid test and I am glad we are at home for this one after the CL night.
We still need another Cesc like playmaker and maybe Nasri can do the job but he is class. The composure in front of goal is Pires like and he is well worth the 12 million we paid. He will score as many as Pires I hope and believe.
We hope to buy two more of similar quality at the same price and we may still be challenging but Newcastle awaits.
Up The Arse!!!
By: Malaysiangunner on August 28, 2008
at 4:24 am
So Barry’s staying at Villa. That means Alonso’s off. Which means we won’t sign anybody.
Collective oh-shit, everyone?
By: crafty bison on August 28, 2008
at 6:29 am