Posted by: Yogi's Warrior | July 11, 2008

Summer Shake It About: Nasri In, Gilbert Out And So Are The Left & Right Legs

A quiet day yesterday by recent standards. Known facts first, Samir Nasri is now officially an Arsenal player for an undisclosed fee. Presumably this means other transfers can now move ahead but more of them later. Kerrea Gilbert has joined Leicester City on a season long loan which in itself is unusual by Arsene’s standards given that it is Gilbert’s third loan spell away from the exalted atmosphere of Arsenal. I seem to recall reading something about ‘problems’ at both clubs with attitude but that could be my memory playing tricks at the Godforsaken hour that this being typed.

Thierry Henry having praised Dos Santos now turns his attentions to Carlos Vela and believes the youngster will be a success in England,

He showed last year with Osasuna what a good player he is

Milan meanwhile come up with the highly unlikely scenario that Adebayor is worth €30m plus Yoann Gorcuff. It seems improbable simply because Gorcuff is on loan at Bordeaux. Now, it could be that there is something in the regulations or loan deal that says he moves to another club if he is sold by Milan, for Arsene buying a player and not having him for a year seems a strange deal. Yet it does not in many respects, simply because of the example of Vela – a loan through necessity initially. The other fly in that ointment is that Gorcuff may not be able to move to Arsenal this season because FIFA regulations do not allow a player to turn out at more than two clubs in any one season, although whether that requires them to actually take to the field I cannot recall.

It does not really matter because he is going to Barcelona anyway, something that Sport is certain of and now that Joan Laporta has firmly stuck his middle finger up to the Socios – so much for members owning a club; the majority want you out but you treat the place like a personal fiefdom. Mark Ingla continues to clock up the Air Miles in the negotiations but Barcelona are frustrated with the re-emergence of AC Milan and because Arsenal will not reduce the price downwards, sticking firm at €35m. Given Arsenal depart for Austria in ten days, this one wil no doubt shift a long somewhat but if I were Arsene, I would play Adebayor at Barnet to make sure he gets the message that until someone matches the asking price, he is an Arsenal player and will perform when required.

The Spaniards are still banging on about Hleb costing €15m (rising to €18m) which is £1:€1 exchange rate to what the English media are reporting. Oh, hold on, the offer has not been accepted yet by Arsenal.

Meanwhile Nigel Winterburn brings a sense of realism to recent movements in and out of the club. The point I think is that Arsene has been lucky until now. Prior to the past twelve months, the list of those moving when their powers were either peaking or yet to reach those levels was probably Overmars, Anelka and I really struggle after that. With hindsight, and a lot of luck in the latter’s case, Arsene got away with it.

In the past twelve months, Diarra, Flamini and now the Dynamic Duo are bucking that trend. It was always coming that some would leave before their time, a situation no doubt exacerbated by a lack of silverware and the chance to be a big money fish in another pond. The wage structure is set to ensure that Arsenal are not overburdened by their debt and not susceptible to malevolent charms of knights on white chargers that turn out to have been covered by a cheap waterbased paint and reveal themselves to be black underneath.

It is not the scenario that some want but the cloth has been cut and Arsene must use it accordingly. Quite reasonably, there are negative comparisons made with the retention of players over the same period at Old Trafford but Ferguson suffers no less than Wenger. They both make poor signings, good signings, tend to get it right in terms of usefulness of players and are entering a phase were loyalty to contracts means diddly squat. Trophies it seems are secondary to money.

’til Tomorrow.


Responses

  1. I’m hoping that Samir Nasri joining on the day Robert Pires is announced as the 6th Greatest Gunner has some kind of hidden meaning.

  2. Good post as usual Yogi.At last its official. Nasri is an Arsenal Player!Phew!How long did that take?What was with the over zealous photographer on Arsenal.com though? Nasri’s coming throws up the usual questions. Who makes way. Where does he play. Looks like he could play in the middle or the Wing. Making Hlebs departure seem all the more imminent. Nasri appears to be in the Hleb mould but years younger so the potential is there. Who is next?

  3. Nasri has got the 8 shirt, if you to purchase the new shirt and go to select a number and player option he is in there with the 8 ..

  4. “Trophies it seems are secondary to money.”

    In the case of Arsenal of course there haven’t been any trophies since 2005 and that one was achieved in the most un-Arsenal style. Players are by nature highly competitive animals and good ones – the best ones – need their achievements to be recognised either by money, i.e. getting paid in the top salary bracket or trophies, or both of these. Given that we are not delivering on either score it doesn’t suprise that the tide has turned in terms of players wanting to leave the club. Horrible though it is, until we start winning again we are going to have the possibility that others will feel the same way. How long can Cesc show his loyalty without some silverware? At this moment, despite Nasri joining, I think we are weaker than last season and I am not very hopeful of winning the PL (at the moment …).

  5. Nasri isnt just potential, he will play a big part in our squad at least this coming season. From the very little time i see him play for France in the Euro’s he looked very composed on the ball and the ball never seemed to get away from his feet. Very clean technically.

    We still need a striker if Ade stays or goes, we cant rely on him now surely. Theo, Bendner, Vela are not 100% ready also, but maybe we can hold out till Eduardo gets back? Too many question marks for my liking. We must buy a striker to be ready for the season, and Gilberto is leaving, Flaminin has gone, so to will Hleb, we need to replace them.

  6. Chris,

    Don’t forget RVP! I’m sure though that if Ade goes, AW will be in the market for a striker. I also predict that with all the Ade speculation, Nik Bendtner will be out to impress this pre-season.

  7. yeah finally some medicine for transfer heartaches

  8. Thommo,
    There are 19 other clubs in the league and we have no god given right to win it. All of them will be scouring the market for players. All of them will be paying silly money. Some of them have greater resources than us due to their propensity to take on debt (Man U) or financing through dodgy means (You know who). Last season we outcompeted all bar the two aforementioned and we were pretty damn close to them. And that with a frontline decimated through injury. We have lost/are likely to lose a few players but none of them are crucial. Flamini, while being talented is a water carrier. Hleb has severe mental problems when it comes to contributing to the goal tally and Adebayor, while putting in an excellent effort last year is still suspect in front of goal. A return to form and fitness for Risicknote, RVP and Eduardo will provide considerable material to fill that gap. At the same time we have a core squad which is hugely talented and youthful and have the addition now of Nasri along with some talented younger players pushing for first team action (Walcott, Vela being the most prominent). I can’t see any reason not to be hopeful while at the same time not expecting to win the league.
    If players want to move on, that’s fine. There is an inexhaustible well of talent out there, as opposed to the barren wasteland which the self-serving headline writers opf the press would put forward and we have a fantastic setup designed to sift through and pick up that talent. In an era where the head of FIFA is so clearly bent on the destruction of the major clubs not least through encouraging players to regard themselves as slaves (£100k a week – where do I sign for the slaveship?), how sensible is it to pay the kinds of silly money being quoted for a Ronaldo or a Adebayor? Isn’t that money best spent on the internal development of the club and scouting system?

  9. Chrisgoona!!

    I think we can get by without a new striker even if ade goes. The defence is the main problem. For me personally, if we get a good defender in, and maybe a replacement for Flamini, the signings can STOP, even if ade and Hleb leaves!!

  10. El Tommo

    I share your concern in us being weaker than last season, but you look at our squad at the beginning of last season… We had Walcott, Bendtner, Sagna.. etc players we didnt know whether to trust, but they have come good. Fringe players like Denilson, Diaby, Traore are better than last year and are constantly improving. We have a better squad than last year in my eyes as they all are better equipped.

    BUT… are starting 11 is questionable for being better quality. Taking away Hleb, Flamini, & Ade we lose 3 key players. Hleb didnt provide alot of goals but was a certain starter. We lose Flamini’s grit – which can be replaced easily. Ade is a shame tho, because we know he can improve, but he seems to have lost the plot.

    Any way Wenger will find adequate replacements who will score more goals than Hleb.. be as dedicated as Flamini, and not be so wasteful as Ade was on the ball.

  11. Naga…. Ive said it time and time again, i perosnally cant see us signing a defender and if you look at great defences from past teams, they just dont come together over night. If we persist with Gallas & Toure they will only get better, personnel wise in defence we have many options available, if some was bought in like your suggesting then someone has to leave for sure.

    We all know that they are all good enough to make it, Senderos, Djourou, Song, included, we can see their quality, and it will show trust me.

  12. TopGunPires

    We just cant rely on RVP,not with his injury record.Less than 12 starts over the last 2 seasons.And with Eduardo unlikely to be fully fit before christnas.That leaves us just with Bendtner if Ade goes as he will.

    Naga gunner

    Ade scored 30 goals last season yet you say we dont need to replace him if he goes.So where are the goals going to come from then? RVP injury prone,Eduardo not fully fit and Bendtner who has no pace.Of course we need to replace Ade

  13. I’m not saying rely upon him, he just wanst mentioned in the list of strikers at the club.

    As I said, if Ade goes I’m sure AW will bring someone in.

  14. TopGunPires

    Im with Peter Storeys Budgie

    We need a new striker!!.. im not keen on changing personnel all the time, i prefer consistency and would love RvP & Bendner, Walcott, Vela etc to come out all gune blazing. But lets say RvP scores 15 goals by Xmas gets injured, Eduardo comes back and is not the same… we are 2 strikers short and only have Bendtner who isnt even the finished article. Vela is surely going to get limited playing time so we need a proven striker we can rely on.

  15. Chrisgoona!!

    Mate, then surely from your line of reasoning, we dont need a striker either. Attacking wise We have a lot of options too, Bentner, Rvp, eddy, walcott, vela.They can all step up and get better I personally believe if we keep more clean sheets than last season, we will do better. I am not averse to a new striker but I just think defence is our FIRST priority. A few more 1-0’s when thing dont go our way, thats all!!

    Cheers!!!

  16. Great post YW…

    I fail to understand why people still classify Ade as wasteful when the stats show different! Anyhow, I must say, I’m concerned about our prospects next season. Wenger said his # 1 priority was to keep the squad together. With the departure of Flamini, Gilberto, Hleb (possible)and adebayor (possible) there will be no continuity going into the new season. Yes, new signings will come in, but how quickly will the adapt?We need to hit the ground running…

  17. Naga

    Defence we have the quality and we know who should be starting. Defending is a collective issue where we are struggling, i am saying individually they are all proven defenders.. Tour, Gallas, Sagna, Clichy.. We knoe if them 4 players grow a better understanding no1 will get past them.

    Up front is a different story, and there is more pressure on strikers to deliver. Bendtner, Walcott, Vela maybe all fine players, but we cant afford to sit back and wait for the goals to come. A title challenging team needs at least 2 proven quality strikers, and back ups to cover them.

    Even with the days of Henry Bergkamp.. we had Kanu, Wiltord etc there to back them up. When a Wiltord started i dont think fans were as hopeful as to when a Bergkamp started. Proven striker is needed!

  18. why does he keep signing midgets???

  19. Budock

    haha, that is true mate he is a bit on the small side. I dont mind as long as he plays as good as Hleb but actually scores goals!

  20. Peter storey’s budgie!!

    Personally, I am pretty convinced that with the style that we play, we will always get atleast one goal per game with the remaining strike force and the midfield we have, in case Ade goes.If we can improve our defence, then we can make that goal count. In simple words, a few more 1-0’s instead of 2-2’s, a few more 3 points. If our defence can keep the door shut, I feel our strike force even WITHOUT ade, will get us the 3 points which is all important!!

    I am taking into consideration the fact that we are a bit strapped for cash. we need to use the money we have prudently in addressing the MAIN problem areas, which we all know is the defence. And if there is money available after that, then we can go for the striker, No Problem!!

    Cheers!!

    P.S. For the striker I would suggest Santa cruz!!

  21. I fail to understand why people still classify Ade as wasteful when the stats show different!

    It’s the same with most things you hear about Arsenal: The squad is too small, the team lacks quality, we don’t pay players well, we are a selling club.

    No matter what the facts are, people hold on to these false ideas.

  22. Chrisgoona!!

    I dont entirely agree, but I can understand your point. So let us just wait and see what Arsene does and how it pans out!!

    Cheers!!

  23. This is Vela”s first season in England how do we know he will be any good.Reyes and Baptista were good in Spain but flopped badly with Arsenal?Lets wait and see before we start putting pressure on him

    We still need a centre half though

  24. Am I the happiest girl or what! Nasri’s here!!

    Anyway, can somebody help with my question?
    I am really looking forward to seeing Denilson filling in Flam’s shoe on the pitch.

    I read that “Denilson was signed as a defensive midfielder, a long-term replacement for Gilberto Silva. But upon signing he showed that he had a similar passing skill/range to Cesc…………….”.

    Would that pose a problem in denilson being deployed as a DM?

    I passionately follow Arsenal, but my football knowledge does not match my passion, sadly.

    Many thanks in advance!

  25. I think Denilson is a mixture of Cesc and Flamini. He doesnt mind getting stuck in but he certainly has excellent technique and a good passing range.

    But i dont think he can be a real playmaker like Cesc which is actually good because it means in theory they should work together.

  26. comondenilson

    Denilson having good passing skills is not a bad thing logically, but i think he needs to improve his aggressive side to his game. He is still young and needs to bulk up a little bit to become our defensive midfielder. He has the quality but not the stature at the moment.

    I would like the burden to be shared with Diaby also filling in there, Diaby is class through the middle.

  27. Summer wouldn’t be Summer if we weren’t linked with Charles N’Zogbia. I actually think he’d be a half-decent signing – powerful, quick, quality left foot and can give cover at left back.

  28. TopGunPires

    I was looking at that statement he made too. I think Wenger wanted him from ages ago as well, hes a good player who i feel has real quality. Shame hes at a shabby club like Newcastle, would be a good option for us down the left.

  29. I am a bit skeptical about DENILSON, I have to say. I dont really know what his role in the team is. He is a good player no doubt. A bit like Baptista, neither this nor that, in my opinion. He is certainly NOT the answer for the Flamini spot. I can only see one role for both him and diaby and that is, Back-ups for cesc.

    There was a game last season where he played with Diarra in the midfield, carling cup I think… where he simply looked lost. I will leave this to Wenger!!

  30. Goog Morning !!!!!!!!!!

  31. I meant good morning

  32. Others to have left ‘when their powers were either peaking or yet to reach those levels’ could include Edu, Bentley, Reyes, Cole, Pennant, Sidwell, Upson, Silvinho. Problem is that no matter at what age players have left us, more often than not they have left their peak and powers behind. Have Adebayor, Flamini and Hlebs powers already peaked? Have they reached maximum levels? Only time will tell.

  33. Hi, YW
    Finally, we get confirmation on Nasri. Hurray!

    @Nagagunner
    “There was a game last season where he (Denilson) played with Diarra in the midfield, carling cup I think… where he simply looked lost.”
    I know which game you are talking about. It is a worry, but being positive, I put it down to him playing alongside another defensive player, hence not feeling sure of his role. Like when he played alongside Gilberto last season – do you remember? Denilson + a defensive midfielder just doesn’t work.
    Which is why I agree with TopGunPires that “..Denilson is a mixture of Cesc and Flamini. He doesnt mind getting stuck in but he certainly has excellent technique and a good passing range. But I don’t think he can be a real playmaker like Cesc…”

  34. Thank you all for the answers.
    Have a nice day!

  35. “I’m hoping that Samir Nasri joining on the day Robert Pires is announced as the 6th Greatest Gunner has some kind of hidden meaning.”

    Haha. I hope so to.

    Welcome, Nasri. May you prove to be a productive (I choose that word deliberatley, if you know what I mean) signing, and please, oh, pleas don’t be a cunt.

  36. Last season was a backward step for Denilson.He will have a hard job securing a 1st team play next season He didnt look physically strong enough for the premiership

    Forget N”Zogbia we should be looking for a CH things have gone very quiet about Micah Richards this summer cant see him stayng at Citeh.Any chance of him becoming a Gooner?

  37. “Others to have left ‘when their powers were either peaking or yet to reach those levels’ could include Edu”

    Edu’s been mostly injured since he left, so I wouldn’t count him in, much as I liked him as a player (’though, whether Wenger knew that would happen or not, i.e. that he was injury prone, is simply guess work, so…).

  38. Wengers a half wit and his favourite show is hollyoaks

  39. Richards will cost too much and is he really good enough as a CB yet? Remember Ade gave him a torrid time up at Eastlands last year.

    The trouble with buying a CB is, do you break up Kolo/Gallas or just get a monster for the away games up north? I don’t think there are too many decent ones about to be honest and with Senderos, Djourou and Nordveit still at the Club I dont see Wenger going for one unless there is someone outstanding.

    I think last season we missed Gilberto a lot defensively in terms of his aerial ability, alot of the time he’d pick up Drogba for example and leave the Centre Backs spare but we couldnt do that with Cesc and Flam. Diaby or Djourou in CM could improve us a lot in that department.

  40. Anyone remember Villa away last year? Hleb plays the CM role in the absence of Cesc and absolutely shred’s their defense before a really bad tackle puts him out. In Basketball — where players of course come in and out and scores are large– players are sometimes measured by how their teams do when they are on the ‘floor’. +12/-5 would mean the team outscored the opposition with the player in and actually lost points with the player out. my point (yes this probably isn’t the clearest argument) is that Arsenal’s attack seemed much better with Hleb in the game. He is gone and others will step up, but I think people are minimizing his considerable contributions to make it all feel better.

  41. California,

    I agree, irrespective of Hleb’s goal output last season, he was a vital part of our team and crucial to the way we played. Our players were happy to give him the ball anywhere on the pitch, in any situation and knew he would keep it. When players have that trust they are far more likely to make the forward runs off the ball which are the Arsenal trademark.

    Interesting that Arseblogger (hardly Hleb’s biggest fan) suggests that his decsion to leave came about after Eduardo’s injury.

  42. I agree with chris GOONA10’s comment about Denilson.

    You will only really find out about players, when they have had a good long run in the side.

    There is no doubt we will miss the running & power of Flamini & Ade plus the unique ball retention skills of Hleb but in all honesty we have lost better players than them & still come through eventually.

    Don’t forget Cesc, Denilson & Diaby ran rings around the full Chelsea team for an hour at Cardiff, 18 months ago.

    Nasri will replace Hleb. Even from the liittle we saw of him in the Euros it was clearly evident that he is made for Wengerball. How quickly will he settle?

    This season will be one of AW & the genuine support to hold their nerve.

    It is time to decide on the young players, who should now be coming of age.

    We can bed in properly the likes of Denilson, Diaby, Djourou, even Senderos etc., who are all at the age where they should be playing regularly.

    Add to them Walcott, Bentner, Vela & now Ramsey, who are still very young but ready to have spells, in the side together with a few more to be introduced into the CC team.

    I feel our level may drop, but only maybe, for this season, but it could be a price well worth paying for the benefit to be gained in the 5/6 seasons to follow.

    The problem is will the majority of supporters be acceptable to this & can we keep the most important players on board.

    Having said all that , I feel we shall still see 2/3 possibly even 4 quality players coming in. In my opinion we will need another physical forward if Ade does go because Bentner will struggle playing the full 90 mins on a regular basis & what if he got injured.

  43. if traore plays as well as he did at the end of last season we no longer have a left wing problem

  44. 1)get a new striker!!!!
    2)we dont need a new striker!!!!
    1) we do…..
    2)we dont……
    1)why not?
    2) ……..Kos i said so….
    1)whose denilson?
    2) WHO?
    1) WHAT THE HELL IS HAPPENING AT ARSENAL?!!!
    2) Nothing…the usual…
    1) WHat’s all this fuss about players then?
    2) The usual……
    1) We need 5 Good players!!!
    2) we need an injury free season…..

  45. budock,

    Traore is too inconsistent. Whats are goal for next season?

  46. For anyone who wants a Nasri fix, two very tasty clips in the Mirror online article, “10 Things you should know about….”

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2008/07/11/10-things-you-need-to-know-about-arsenal-signing-samir-nasri-89520-20615346/

  47. Completely agree with Budok re: Traore. If he can build on those last couple games he could be the surprise of the season. Very aggressive kid.

  48. For once I agree with DBerg, Traore is too inconsistent at this stage to be a regular for the club. Young Guns seems pretty convinced he’ll be on loan, maybe at Pompey next season.

  49. Good one YW

    Nasri in finally officially. This will keep the hounds at Le Grove at bay may be for 30 secs.

    As to whether Ade needs to be replaced depends on our style of play. But footballing wise he will be missed as his tireless running and muscling creates space for others to play and score. Even after saying that his position has become untenable in our club. He should leave and with the monies we can get another equivalent to vary of attacking options as Torres provides for Spain/Liverpool , Drogba does for Chel$ki etc.
    Bendtner does not have enough speed and muscle like Ade but if he can bulk up a bit he can provide similar role but whta he lacks in speed he is better in the air and has better passing.
    We need mobility/speed and while many shot down the idea, Martins of Newcastle does provide that. In a better team like Arsenal he will flourish with many thru the eye of the needle passes from our Cecs for him to make his runs. He has a great shot in him too.

    Now the CH/CB is absolutely needed. Chris we lost to the Manures by 4 goals for and 8 goals against. That tells a story. Our defense was poor in crucial games , there is no denying that fact.

    Up The Arse!!!!

  50. Interesting that less than two years ago most Gooners would have flogged Adebayor, Flamini, Hleb and Song to the Championship for a bunch of 12 year old prospects. Two years on and we are singing a different tune. The point is that every year players emerge and this year will be no different at the Emirates. Sit back, relax and enjoy the show. Le professeur has some idea what he is doing.

  51. The AKN brigade constantly trashes our club and manager in this way: “look at everyone else and how superior they are than us.” They regularly ridicule our club, board, fans, players and manager, talking as if we’re a laughing stock, as if every other club and manager on the planet conducts their business in a far superior way than we do. Remember these are so-called gooners talking like this: they throw cheap insults at our club and manager as if we’re a bottom of the barrel rickety shack outfit.

    You would think that all the other clubs–esp. the major clubs–had been incredibly active in the transfer market, made successful bids on world class players, and were all set to conquer the world come August. All except for lowly, pathetic Arsenal managed by a pathetic, ridiculous excuse of a manager.

    Let’s look at exactly what has happened during this transfer window thus far. The following BBC links will take you to all transfer activity in the UK for the months of May, June and July thus far:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/gossip_and_transfers/7385883.stm

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/gossip_and_transfers/7431302.stm

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/gossip_and_transfers/7482819.stm

    For various and diverse reasons, these are the transfers that stand out for me:

    5 May – Flamini from Arsenal to Milan on a free
    12 May – Boswinga from Porto to Chelsea for £16.2m

    10 June – Dos Santos from Barca to Tottenham for £4.7m
    13 June – Ramsey from Cardiff to Arsenal for undisclosed fee
    18 June – Riise from Liverpool to Roma for £4m
    27 June – Elmander from Toulouse to Bolton for undisclosed fee
    30 June – Deco from Barca to Chelsea for undisclosed fee

    2 July – Le Tallec from Liverpool to Le Mans for undisclosed fee
    2 July – Jo from CSKA to Man City for undisclosed fee
    2 July – Gutierrez from Real Mallorca to Newcastle for undisclosed fee
    4 July – Dossena from Udinese to Liverpool for undisclosed fee
    4 July – Digard from PSG to Boro for £4m
    4 July – Davies from West Brom to Villa for undisclosed fee
    5 July – Kewell from Liverpool to Galatasaray on a free
    5 July – Geovanni from Man City to Hull on a free
    10 July – Sidwell from Chelsea to Villa for £5m
    10 July – Gilbert from Arsenal to Leicester on loan
    11 July – Nasri from Marseille to Arsenal for undisclosed fee
    11 July – Cavalieri from Palmeiras to Liverpool for undisclosed fee

    Finally, there is the reported completion of Crouch’s transfer to Pompey for what the BBC says “could be up to £11m.”

    If you look at the above and all the other transfers, there’s not a lot to be impressed by. Neither the level nor quality of activity really stands out.

    For me, Dos Santos to Spurs does hurt. Chelsea are getting a fantastic player in Deco but he’s 31, there’s no guarantee he’ll adapt to England. Boswinga’s a good (not great) defender, over 6ft, which we could certainly use.

    But that’s about it that stands out for me (excl. Arsenal activity), tho Cavalieri to Pool does interest me.

    You’ll notice ManU have done almost nothing this transfer window thus far.

    The impatience of the AKN brigade would have you believe that everyone else is active and AW is just twiddling his thumbs taking time off.

    And welcome, FINALLY, to Samir Nasri!

  52. Prophet,

    The price of my season ticket is verging on the ridiculous so the show BETTER be good. Maybenot just pass it up and down the midfield line

  53. Peter Storeys Budgie!

    We need a centre back, but Richards is NOT the answer. He is very similar to Gallas and toure, the “second defender” type. We need someone in the mould of Rodders, a defender with a commanding presence to act as a counterfoil for EITHER Gallas or toure!

    A lot of gunners here say that Gallas and kolo are both quality. Yes I agree, but the problem is not about their quality, its about the TYPE of defenders that they are. If we had Keown in his prime now, we would still have the same problem because even though he is brilliant he is the same type of defender like Gallas and toure. Keown was our “second defender” back in his days, but he was effective because he had Adams as a counterfoil for him. I personally think a centre back is a MUST for the coming season, but some gunners do think differently, so lets see!!

    CALIFORNIA GOONER!

    I absolutely agree, after that villa match wenger said Hleb gave us “technical stability” in the midfield. That is true, I think Hleb was so good for us because he was someone we could trust to hold possession in a chaotic, fast and furious game. Simply based on ball control, I dont think even Cesc could match him. He was such a pure talent, but then its not meant to be and its neither here nor there for us now. I am sad to see him go!

    FUNGUNNER!

    Mate, I have forgotten that Denilson game. Can you tell me who was it against? Maybe I forgot it because I remember it was very dull!

  54. And I have seen the photo of Nasri at the official site. He looks every inch a CHARLTON player!!

    Anyway, all the best Samir!

  55. DOes anyone know last years stats for Nasri? goal and assist tally??

  56. Samir Nasri: 11 goals in 145 appearances for Marseille. A real HLEB replacement!!

  57. Hi Naga
    I THINK it was the CC game v Sheffield, but I couldn’t swear to it. All I remember is that it was a Carling Cup game and it wasn’t Newcastle or Spurs!

  58. Naga – Look at Nasri’s stats for the last 10 games of the season though… after the guy recovered from viral meningitis…

    A goal or an assist in every game….. not too shoddy…..

    By the way – if any of you guys have Arsenal TV Online, there is a little clip of this weeks pre-season training hidden away on there under the club banner….

  59. Naga / FunGunner

    Denilson ran the show against Newcastle & Sheffield United, also scoring an excellent goal in both of those matches.

    He was an effective part of the winning team at Blackburn until he was sent off for the high tackle.

    The CC game he, like everyone else, was poor in was the Spuds at home. He was carrying Gilberto at his lowest point, Djourou’s injury unsettled the team & it was our 2nd string against their pumped up full 1st team.

    I think will will learn a lot more about Denilson this season.

  60. I saw this in telegraph.

    Samir Nasri in Ligue 1 (07/08) Compared to Arsenal Midfield:

    Appearances 30
    Minutes On Pitch 2563

    Goals 6
    Shots 44
    Shooting Accuracy (per cent) 56.80 —– 39.30

    Goal Assists 11
    Total Passes 1246
    Pass Completion (per cent) 82.70 —– 83.60

    Crossing
    Total Crosses 85
    Cross Completion (per cent) 30.60 —– 21.90

    Dribbling
    Dribbles & Runs 101
    Dribble Completion (per cent) 30.70 —– 52.70

    on Arsenal.com
    Cesc’s stats: season 2007-2008
    Appearances 32
    Minutes 2859
    Goals 7
    Assists 19
    Shots on target 45
    Shots off target 37
    Shots blocked 24
    Dribbles made 24
    Dribbles successful 15
    Dribbles unsuccessful 9

    He is quite special.
    I’m so happy to have Nasri on board!!

  61. Thought you guys might like to know that we are already one up on the Spuddies even before the season has begun:

    http://carlosvelanews.wordpress.com/2008/07/11/mexican-fans-prefer-to-watch-arsenals-vela-than-tottenhams-dos-santos/

  62. Just went over to lurk on the gunnerblog board. As usual, a few interesting options but mostly lots of macho posturing and just plain nastiness. Apparently Diaby is shit. While I think we all have reservations — especially around the fact that he seems to hold onto the ball too long– I have this premonition that he will be a monster this coming season. In fact, with all of these changes I am getting excited about the first pre-season games to see how we line up. Traore on the left? Will Rosicky come back and stay healthy? Where will Nasri play? Who will partner Cesc in midfield or might we try a 4-3-3 as Mia suggests? I would have preferred stability since that is a key to winning, but given the amount of talent waiting to break in at Arsenal it is always exciting to see who will make the next step this year and surprise us as Flamini, Ade and Clichy did this last year.

  63. NYmarcus, that’s funny. Planning on buying an oversized Arsenal sombrero?

  64. Holy shit my target Dorin Goian is on the way to Sunderland??

    Sunderland are understood to have made an enquiry about 27-year-old Romania international defender Dorin Goian. They have been quoted a price of around £3.85m. (Press Association)

  65. Saw this in telegraph.

    Joe Hack on Arsenal coverage

    Lies 30
    Minutes in Pub 2563

    Stories

    Bullshit 6
    misquotes 443
    source Accuracy (per cent) 10
    player destination accuracy (per cent) 5
    transfer amount exaggeration (per cent) 80
    plagirisms 234
    total repeats 1246
    on target (per cent) 12

    Originality

    New Story (per cent) 5
    recycled story (per cent) 80

    Litigation

    enquiries 101
    actual Prosecution (per cent) 30.70

    on fleetstreet.com
    season 2007-2008

    Lies (average) 32
    Misquotes 2859
    Source Accurancy (per cent) 7
    player destination accuracy 15
    transfer exaggeration (per cent) 87
    stories on target (per cent) 8

  66. Saw this in telegraph.

    Joe Hack on Arsenal coverage

    Lies 30
    Minutes in Pub 2563

    Stories

    excreta 6
    misquotes 443
    source Accuracy (per cent) 10
    player destination accuracy (per cent) 5
    transfer amount exaggeration (per cent) 80
    plagirisms 234
    total repeats 1246
    on target (per cent) 12

    Originality

    New Story (per cent) 5
    recycled story (per cent) 80

    Litigation

    enquiries 101
    actual Prosecution (per cent) 30.70

    on fleetstreet.com
    season 2007-2008

    Lies (average) 32
    Misquotes 2859
    Source Accurancy (per cent) 7
    player destination accuracy 15
    transfer exaggeration (per cent) 87
    stories on target (per cent) 8

  67. Comondenilson, thanks for those interesting stats, and NYmarcus thanks for the link.

    California, macho posturing on an Arsenal site? You amaze me.

    Just skimming through today’s haul on this one, we have about 8 posts from Naga, as expected since the site is about 80 percent his with occasional quieter intervals. No, I know, not literally; it just looks feels that way because of the capitals and exlamation marks.

    More alarming, Naga’s eight posts are closely followed in terms of numbers by about six from a newcomer, Dberg. These include ‘Wengers a half wit’ – literacy doesn’t seem to be his strong point – a lot of grumbling about something or other, and the thoughtful observation that Traore is inconsistent. Really? Since Traore has been consistently pretty awful DEFENSIVELY at any level beyond the reserves but hasn’t actually played a single game in the Premiership as a left winger, I reckon I’ll be scrolling past Dberg’s observations in future.

    Worry. Well, a bit. Will the Dbergs be allowed to flourish and multiply? Will the site goes the way of most others? Where’s Muppet? Without his tireless work we’d probably have a dozen anti-foreigner rantings as well – blissfully absent today – but I do see he can’t keep going mocking the horrible stuff out of existence day after day.

    That’s my worry. I mean, there must be a tipping point where a site turns into its opposite – e.g. this one into gunnerblog and from there into le grove. Half a dozen more Dbergs and quite a few people will be scrolling past 99 percent of the comments. Or rather they won’t be. They won’t come any more.

    Me, if/when I find I’m skipping 70 percent or more routinely, it’ll be time to give up. That, and racism – a post of Howard’s once drove me back to reading only arsenalamerica for a couple of months. Yes, they have their drawbacks, but racism isn’t one of them. It just wouldn’t be tolerated – even unreasoning expressions of anti-Americanism were actually censored, I think! And they spell better; no one writes in capitals – if someone does, they’re told to stop shouting and they don’t do it again. No one writes ‘Wengers a half wit’. My point is about sites being self-policing. Perhaps Americans do this more easily: the English are just too polite?

  68. Mia,

    Muppet is exhausted from reading the latest batch of incumbents with their ludicrous posts, marvelling at the stamina of people like NYMarcus, Toronto, Naga Gunner and yourself, who seem to be able to fill the day, and wondering where to put the next full stop. Ah yes, back there.

    Sometimes posts are refused. Not sure why. It’s not censorship, but some filtering mechanism.

    Would be nice if the mechanism could filter posts with bad grammar, idiotic comments and abuse. :-)

  69. I totally agree with you Flint. Denilson had a difficult season due to injuries, but he is a very determined young man and totally committed to making it at Arsenal. I expect great things from him next season.

  70. Clockendrider:

    Bang on mate! We were just 4pts short last year, and only scored 6 goals less than Ronaldo, Rooney, Tevez et al.

    From afar, it looks like the English press gets everyone worked up in a lather.

    We’re fine. Take a pill and calm down.

  71. One pill? Some people need a sh*t load of them!

  72. Muppet, dear Muppet, take a well-deserved rest.

    Could there be a filter mechanism? Sure, in theory, though you may need the technology to do it. Some sites definitely do block all posts from email addresses of persistent offenders, and others have a more informal and laborious method. I once looked at one that was getting bombarded by Spurs fans spewing out insults. The site simply deleted them, and after a bit they dried up. Tedious but effective.

    Could you censor the ‘Wenger-knows-shite’ type of post? Should you? I think maybe you have to if they’re getting too numerous because there are hundreds of thousands of those sort of fans out there and they’re not amenable to rational discourse. Politely disagree with them and they’ll just come back for more. And bring all their friends. And spawn millions of offspring. That’s how le grove became what it is. The only thing that’s proven to work is deleting their comments. Yogi may be too liberal for that but I wish he wasn’t. He’s got every right to decide that certain kinds of comment are not what he wants, and to say so, and to remove them if they persist. Why not? It’s his site. How else can its distinctive character be protected?

    Grammar and spelling – that’s strangely easy. You just have to complain a bit and a remarkable improvement ensues. I’ve seen it happen on a Guardian blog as well as Arsenalamerica. And look at Naga’s caps and multiple exclamation marks: a few people suggested it was like someone banging metal dustbin lids together right next to their ears when they’re hungover, and lo and behold they’re diminishing! I no longer need to insert (mental) earplugs when reading his posts except when I’m feeling especially frail. Someone should tell me to read my posts through and fill in all the words I’ve left out – I’d make more of an effort, really I would.

  73. [...] Summer Shake It About: Nasri In, Gilbert Out And So Are The Left & Right Legs A quiet day yesterday by recent standards. Known facts first, Samir Nasri is now officially an Arsenal player for an [...] [...]

  74. Mia, you’re being a bit tough on people and need some perspective. as far as i can see, d-berg writes as if this is a chat — not long paragraphs but justing putting his thoughts out there– and naga, despite his style, is pretty easy going and doesn’t put people down (or does he? i can’t remember!). anyhow, you’re point is well taken, but i don’t think the board here is close to becoming pointless.

  75. 1st u people have to much free time
    2nd mia this is a blog for arsenal fans and arsenal fans who dont agree with ure assessment of arsenal affairs have aright to say so
    if yogi censors it means that hes not willing to reason with people of the arsene knows nothing breed and so do all the other bloggers….i say when someone like that comes alomg we try to reason with him….p.s. u guys need a vacation

  76. Mia

    you can’t go about censoring peoples comments, you have to let people live and die by what they say.

    I don’t think the poster in question even drew a response for his first few comments and was left to resort to attention seeking agent provocateur type multiple postings.

    He’ll get bored soon enough.

  77. Sorry Josef, but people who type like 5 year olds on the internet deserve to be treated like 5 year olds.

    Eye for an eye, etc.

  78. Saw this in telegraph.

    Joe Hack on Arsenal coverage

    Lies 30
    Minutes in Pub 2563

    Stories

    bullshit 6343
    misquotes 443
    source Accuracy (per cent) 10
    player destination accuracy (per cent) 5
    transfer amount exaggeration (per cent) 80
    plagirisms 234
    total repeats 1246
    on target (per cent) 12

    Originality

    New Story (per cent) 5
    recycled story (per cent) 80

    Litigation

    enquiries 101
    actual Prosecution (per cent) 30.70

    on fleetstreet.com
    season 2007-2008

    Lies (average) 32
    Misquotes 2859
    Source Accurancy (per cent) 7
    player destination accuracy 15
    transfer exaggeration (per cent) 87
    stories on target (per cent) 8

  79. Fleet Street OFTA Stats

    Joe Hack on Arsenal coverage

    Lies 30
    Minutes in Pub 2563

    Stories

    bullshit 6343
    misquotes 443
    source Accuracy (per cent) 10
    player destination accuracy (per cent) 5
    transfer amount exaggeration (per cent) 80
    plagirisms 234
    total repeats 1246
    on target (per cent) 12

    Originality

    New Story (per cent) 5
    recycled story (per cent) 80

    Litigation

    enquiries 101
    actual Prosecution (per cent) 30.70

    on fleetstreet.com
    season 2007-2008

    Lies (average) 32
    Misquotes 2859
    Source Accurancy (per cent) 7
    player destination accuracy 15
    transfer exaggeration (per cent) 87
    stories on target (per cent) 8

  80. Fleet Street OFTA Stats

    Lies 398
    Minutes in Pub 2563
    bullshit 6343
    misquotes 443
    source Accuracy (per cent) 10
    player destination accuracy (per cent) 5
    transfer fee exaggeration (per cent) 80
    plagirisms 234
    total repeats 1246
    on target (per cent) 12
    New Story (per cent) 5
    recycled story (per cent) 80
    Litigation – enquiries 101
    Litigation – actual Prosecution (per cent) 30.70

    fleet street average – season 2007-2008
    Lies (average) 32
    Misquotes 2859
    Source Accurancy (per cent) 7
    player destination accuracy 15
    transfer exaggeration (per cent) 87
    stories on target (per cent) 8

  81. I am with MIA with regard with people who show no class or respect on internet. There are the same type of people that in a pub everybody ignore: rude, inconsiderate, arrogant, know-it-all who just show their crass ignorance. There should be away to banish such person from this site.

    In the last couple of game of the season, Armand Traore was often introduced as left winger and was pretty effective. He made some very good crosses including one from which Bentdner scored. So he is an option as a left winger.

    Rosicky will always have muscles issues. His body cannot handle the daily intense training and the sometime twice weekly games (especially the 100m/h unrelenting pace of the premiership). He will be injured again (Hamstring or thigh) and miss half the season.

    Denilson can play a more Flamini aggressive type of play. That was his role when captaining the Brazil U19, however he is trying to adapt to a much more physical game. I remember him very effective in some such as the one against Blackburn (he even got sent off). The same toward the end of the season he was playing very well.

    When AW stated that we were vulnerable against direct ball in the middle, and that he found a solution everybody assume that AW was going to buy a new defender. Later he stated that he was not after a new defender. I believe that his solution is to sometime change system. I think this season AW will alternate between 4-4-2 and 4-5-1 systems.
    The 4-5-1 system will have Bentdner or Adebayor (Adebayor replacement) as lone striker with Cesc-Diaby-Denilson (alterning with Nasri-Ramsey-Randall) in the middle, on the left one of Eduardo-Rosicky-Van Persie and on the right one of Eboue-Walcott-Nasri.

    With Diaby or Ramsey (dspite not being very tall he had played as centre half) in the middle, aerial threat can be deal without having to move one of the central defender leaving us vulnerable on the turn or flick-on See goals against us by Torres and Drogba.

  82. Blackstock Media

    I agree.. I meant that I was opposed to the deleting of comments under any circumstance – it is better to leave them be and allow the blogging community to do its work, a far more effective punishment I’m sure you agree!

    Interesting reports regarding Arsenal dropping their asking price on Adebayor – I wonder if its just AC playing politics again, or if Arsenal are keen to ship him out and get the balling rolling on whomever they have in mind as a replacement. My money is on AC playing politics.

  83. Passenal, Flint
    Please understand I am one of Denilson’s biggest fans. All I was saying was that his off games came when he was paired with a defensive midfielder. So to put it another way, I think he flourishes when paired with attacking/creative midfielders.

    @Valentin
    “When AW stated that we were vulnerable against direct ball in the middle, and that he found a solution everybody assume that AW was going to buy a new defender. Later he stated that he was not after a new defender. I believe that his solution is to sometime change system.”
    Good point.

  84. Re:Arshavin

    His agent is sending a very strong “come-and-get-me” to Gunners. Suppose his price tag comes down to about £15m, would he be a valuable addition to the team? (no way he is £24m!)

    I didn’t see him at all before the semi-final of Uefa cup, and, although he was very impressive in Euro2008, i’m not that interested.

    What do you think?

  85. “Passenal, Flint
    Please understand I am one of Denilson’s biggest fans. All I was saying was that his off games came when he was paired with a defensive midfielder. So to put it another way, I think he flourishes when paired with attacking/creative midfielders.”

    That’s what I think too. He plays better with Cesc than he did with Diarra or Gilberto.

  86. Good point about the defence Valentin, I hadn’t thought about that possibility before, but it makes sense. Because we attack so much and play a high defensive line, it does make us vulnerable to that long ball down the middle, especially when the officials miss the offsides by the opposition.

    ComeonDenilson, there were rumors that Arsenal approached Zenit for Arshavin prior to the Euro’s but were told to come back later. At that point he allegedly had a £10m buy out clause. He would be worth buying for that price, but at £24m Zenit are pricing him out of a sale (certainly to Arsenal). He is 27 and who knows if he could adapt to the PL?

  87. California and others

    Your defence of tolerance is terrific. There’s just one thing you may not be taking into account.

    If you hold the view that all opinions are equally legitimate, equally deserving of space and respect, where does that leave the hundreds of people like me who don’t want to read that ‘Wenger knows shite’? Depressed, is the answer. That, and baffled because I don’t get this tolerance thing.

    I mean, if fancy buying a paper, society allows me a choice – the Mail, the Guardian, the Sun, whatever suits my particular taste? It doesn’t insist I buy all three bound up in a package. So why not the same with arsenal sites? Why, if I’d like to read, say, NYmarcus’s thoughts on Diogo, must I be happy also to read Dberg’s view that Wenger-knows-shite.

    It’s not as though people like me want to censor the Wenger-knows-shite brigade by banning them from EVERY Arsenal site; we’d just like there to be ONE small site they didn’t invade. Like there are different newspapers catering to different kinds of people; like you’re allowed to prefer shredded wheat to cornflakes and don’t have buy them all jumbled up in one box… You get the idea.

    But I bow to the reality. Tolerance extends to the Wenger-must-go brigade, who in one form or another are here to stay, but for those of us who’d like things to be different, it’s a case of tough cookies, take it or leave it. Me, I’ll leave it alas.

  88. Mia, if you were to leave the blog it just helps the idiots win. Far better to stay and state your opinions. You can easily skip the comments that you know are unworthy of any response.

  89. Well, if you compare each Arsenal blog to a newspaper, then it’s no stretch of the imagination to suppose that the comments board is like a correspondence section. If a blog’s to be taken seriously then I think it’s actually obliged – like a paper is – to give a voice to arguments that counter an accepted opinion.

    I think we can all assume that most of the regular bloggers here totally support Wenger at the helm and get behind the team that he puts out, for the time being at least. So if a person wants to come on here and try and convince us otherwise then he or she’s entitled to do so.

    The problem is that, so far, nobody’s managed to do that without resorting to baiting, foul language and personal comments. The worst offenders have moved on to more hospitable environments for their scattershot bile. I remember one regular, who was particularly anti-Adebayor, came on here to gloat about how he “knew Adebayor was crap” minutes after we went out to Liverpool in the CL. BB – I think it was.

    He showed his true colours that night and we haven’t seen him since.

    My laboured point is that if someone who disagrees with the blog comes on here and tries to convince us of his or her opinion in a well-thought-out, clever way, then it will be to the benefit of the site.

    The problem is that I haven’t seen anyone do that yet. From what I’ve seen, most Le Grove readers would struggle to get the bottom of a post by YW. That sounds harsh and horribly smug, but I think it sums up the crux of the matter – at least from my point of view. It probably explains why Le Grove has that simplified, all-encompassing “AKB” vignette and a heavily censored comments section.

    Usually these guys show themselves up for what they are when they come on here. I say let them come.

    Jeez, what a load of waffle. A Saturday night in and I turn into a media commentator.

  90. Ugh. That didn’t make pretty reading.
    Simplification: Let them come. They usually end up making fools of themselves anyway.

  91. It’s the yuk factor. It’s reading something and feeling like someone has dropped a turd in your coffee.

    It’s always the yuk factor, I think, that drives people away. One in a thousand may mention it – ‘lovely blog, shame about some of the comments’ – but most just never come back. How many arsenal blogs have you looked at and instantly rejected as not being for you? Most of them, I bet, because they’re all so alike. How could they not be when every moron out there is given free speech?

    That’s the point I was trying to make to California about tolerance not being quite the kindly thing he imagined it was. Permit, say, racist remarks, and a black person wanting a site where she/he feels comfortable is denied that perfectly reasonable right. Permit morons everywhere and those who don’t want to read their stupidity are left with nowhere to go.

    It’s not a question of differing opinions. I read The Times sometimes and usually profoundly disagree the views that I find there. This is fine. I’m not asking for uniformity or freedom from conflict – quite the opposite: debate is the whole point. What I’m asking for is freedom from the yuk factor, which means a level of discussion a bit above that of the Sun.

    The blogs don’t cater for this, not the open Arsenal ones anyway, they’re all into free speech, presumably the better to draw in the numbers. Trouble is, this leaves huge numbers of other people without a blog to call home. Are the morons the only ones with rights? What about my right not throw up?

    Yogi’s bit is terrific – easily the best; some of the comments are terrific as well. It’s just the yuk factor kicks in a bit too often these days for me.

  92. Whilst agreeing that it is irritating to read some of the frankly moronic comments, on this blog, most of the regular contributors generally have something to say, even if their command of English language or grammar may not be as good as your’s is, Mia.

    We come from many different backgrounds & educations.

    I don’t think there should be any censorship, apart from when someone, who clearly is getting more inebriated with each post, bombards the comments with long, inane & insulting garbage.

    The person most guilty of that is fortunately very happy with his brethren elsewhere. I don’t know if Yogi stopped his comments but he did us all a favour if he did.

    What I look for in a comment is factual accuracy, sincerity & a decent amount of thought, whether I agree with it or not.

  93. I should add, Yogi deserves our support, so let’s all carry on making comments, when we feel we can contribute.

  94. In terms of censorship, the only one that is applied is via Akismet, WordPress’ anti-spam filter. People tend to get caught up in it for no apparent reason and then re-post multiple times, not realising that this is compounding the problem. General rule, if you get caught for Spam or Moderation then wait, do not repost the same comment, and it will be released.

    One thing to bear in mind though is that the admin side of things is dealt with by me and me alone which as I am not always around to keep an eye on things, may mean a wait for it to be cleared up.

    As for the content, that is dealt with on a comment by comment basis but may lead to rebuke. For the most part the comments are self-moderating, ones I think are near to the mark may not be to others, it is a matter of interpretation. If it offends me, comments are quietly removed. If it offends everyone, they are cast as Spam.

    YW

  95. Hey man..

    Could we have a link exchange?

    I’ve already put your blog on my blog links.. please put mine in yours too…

    here it is—-> http://young-arsenal.blogspot.com

    Thanks:D

  96. pnczay npsuzbil kbtislmvh hwnjfqys lpghswifz jxhnlkmt qcyutw


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