Posted by: Yogi's Warrior | May 2, 2008

Ban Injury-Ridden Players From Euro2008, Flamini, DB10 & Edelman

Leading into the Everton game, the thigh of Robin van Persie has struck back with the Dutchman being rested for the match. Given the injuries that he has suffered this season, the thought of him participating at Euro2008 beggars belief. For all of FIFA and UEFA’s protests, the health of the players is the least of their worries. All that they care about is having the ‘stars’ at their events and to hell with club football.

Yet international football is not the lifeblood of the game; it is the cherry on top of the cake. Whilst it is right that injuries are assessed prior to international fixtures, there is no ‘give’ the other way in that a player who has suffered a disrupted season, as van Persie and Rosicky both have, should not be allowed to take their place in an international squad unless their club have agreed to it. If they participate having missed over half of the season through injury, there is a high probability that one or both will suffer a recurrence of their woes, which is disruptive for their employers and disappointing for the fans.

UEFA and FIFA have just about settled their differences with clubs by agreeing a compensation package of sorts but they could take one-step further and implement such a rule. Instead of constant bickering and sniping, the governing bodies might just find that an olive branch offered on this subject gets something in reward for the rest of the international calendar. As it is, they use psychological pressure – ‘the tournament is the pinnacle of the player’s career’ – to induce the players into playing when rest would have more benefits in the long-term.

With a link so tenuous that even Terry Wogan would be scared to use it during a Children In Need appeal, I stumbled across some memorabilia last night, these files are my ticket and a matchday programme of sorts from the trip to Austria for the 1991 European Cup-tie at the Prater Stadium (now the Ernst Happel Stadium where the final of Euro2008 will take place).

The journey was a nightmare and the last time I have taken a coach to a football match. A cobbled together unofficial trip in the days when you did not have to buy a ticket beforehand, it was Arsenal’s first foray onto foreign fields following on from the ban on English clubs following the Heysel Stadium disaster. Suffice to say, we knew we were in trouble when the drivers pulled in to a service station just outside Dover and bought a map of Europe. It took thirty hours to get there, the drivers obsession with turning off the French motorway network became wearing very quickly; the residents of Lille looked totally bemused seeing a coach with Arsenal flags draped over the windows in their backstreets; being refused entry to Germany until we had paid the Border Guards with football badges; bribing our way in and out of Luxembourg with football badges (who knew they would be such a useful currency?) and drinking in Viennese brothels after the game because we could not get into any bars in the city centre. You know when it has been a bad trip when the drivers had a whip-round, bought several slabs of Stella on the ferry on the way back, and gave them to us for directing them back to good Old Blighty. We flew to Lisbon for the next round…

Back to the here and now. Mathieu Flamini is due to return to training today and Arsene has hinted that he might be on the bench on Sunday for the visit of Everton to The Emirates. Given that there is no public indication that he is going to stay at the club, I believe it is time that Arsene planned for next season and for him to exclude his compatriot from this match and the visit to The Stadium Of Light the following weekend. It is not personal but Arsene needs to plan for next season. Denilson should start as he did at Pride Park or if Bacary Sagna is fit, put Toure or Song there.

In this month’s issue of FourFourTwo, Nicolas Anelka answers readers questions. He is hard pushed to say which team was the better, 1998s Double Winners or the current squad whilst asserting that it was his decision to leave and nothing to do with his brothers as Arsene is supposed to have said at the time,

He knows very well that everything was down to me – it was what I wanted. I have no regrets because at that time, what I wanted was to leave…I wanted to go to Real Madrid, who wouldn’t. That said, when you look at what happened afterwards, you can always say, “Ah Well, he should have stayed”, but it is too easy to say that. There’s no point in living with regrets. I’ve always loved Arsenal; the club, the supporters and the players. I don’t have any problem with anyone there but once you’ve turned that page, you’ve turned that page

The magazine also has a double page spread on Dennis Bergkamp’s hat-trick at Filbert Street in 1997, still the only time the same player has had the 1-2-3 in Match of the Day’s Goal of the Month competition. Answering the question, ‘Was the Bergkamp goal to make it 3-2 one of the best you have seen?’, Leicester’s Steve Walsh replied,

One of them. I was only too pleased that he made a fool out of Matt [Elliott] not me! Seriously, there was not a lot any defender could have done. Fortunately, I was on the other side of the defence

Who says it is all for one and one for all in a football team? More like, there but for the grace of God…

And so to Edelman’s departure. Safe Hands Ken Friar returns but it is all of the media this morning that Arsene has won a ‘power struggle’ in the Boardroom and wants a footballing man in situ from now on. Edelman’s focus was right for the time he was at the club, growing the business but if he is not interested in becoming a ‘football man’ then it is right for him to move on. Anyway, you can read The Times, The Guardian, The Sun and The Mirror views and work out where they will fit the club in crisis routines in over the summer. Arseblogger has an interview with Tim Payton of the Arsenal Supporters Trust in this weeks Arsecast where it is discussed.

The upshot of it seems to be the reins being slackened and Martin Samuel makes a persuasive case for signing Michael Johnson or Gareth Barry but shhhh, don’t tell Arsene they are English.

’til Tomorrow.

Responses

Good comments YW, I some how think that Flam has decided to go, best of luck and if Hleb wants to go also bye bye. I’m sorry but i dont have sleepless nights if that is the result. The following article is well worth the read, but I have not checked it out with Howard perhaps you could.

http://www.arsenalinsider.co.uk/arsenal-news /did-flamini-cost-edelman-his-job- and-arise-the-next-arsenal-captain/

Lets really show this lot the title race from our point of view is still not over yet. Go you gunners.

A common misconception that DB’s hat-trick against Leicester was 1-2-3 in Goal of the Month, but actually only the first 2 were; Dennis’ third entry was his goal (I think) against Southampton - and a cracker that was too.

I agree Yogi if Flamini is leaving he shouldnt play Sundya let Song and Denilson show what they can do

These should go:
1. senderos
2. eboue
3. gallas
4. adebayor
5. toure
6. pat rice
7. wenger

you mean to say its either they stay or you… :D

anyways….
everton this weekend… i doubt flamini will play a role…. i think wenger will give song a chance…flamini is well and truly the past now that he hasnt signed since long.

no news on hleb btw… think he is gonna stay.

and if wilshere makes his cc debut next time around…. i think we r all in for a real treat.

I really dont know wat all changes are going to take place in the summer… but i know this for sure… arsenal would lose fans if they dont buy stars… and that would be a dent to the highly successfull move to emirates till now.

edelman put your name on that list and remove 1 to 7 and you have got it right.

has anyone seens wengers interview yet?

Arsenal v Everton
Barclays Premier League
Emirates Stadium
Sun, May 4, 2008, 1.30pm

Arsenal still have an outside chance of lifting the Premier League title. Speaking to TV Online on Friday, Arsène Wenger estimated it to be “five per cent”. Subscribers can find out why in this exclusive interview.

It has been a week full of issues at Arsenal Football Club and Wenger gave the latest news on all of them to the Club’s official website. He spoke about:

the Champions League Semi-Finals
his reaction to Keith Edelman leaving
the Flamini situation
the PFA awards
the Hleb situation
going for the title and winning at Everton
Subscribers can now see this interview now. If you don’t subscribe to TV Online, click on the red button in the gold panel opposite.

Please let us know if you have Arsenal Tv online

hmmm……… strange things happen….funny too ….. even when the season has not ended.

dont forget… without me, there’s no new stadium

edelman a.k.a Joseph the dreamer

Seriously, can the following PLEASE go now?

1 senderos
2 eboue
3 gallas

senderos is the future captain….
eboue is the one who takes a lot of stick from ade’s poor finishing…without him there wud be no ade.
gallas is our captain.

no one goes… velaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa all the way next season.

i think if we win against everton and chelsea and manu lose theirs… it will be really down to those two games against manu and chelsea rightly pointed out by the boss…

Danny boy, dream does come true!! ha ha! arsenal is rich now, .. but maybe wenger prefers cheap young talents.

for the first time i think i understand why a season that went so long so full of promise then, predictably, drained away over the course of a few matches…today’s Guardian piece on Edelman’s departure which for now I choose to believe makes perfect sense, to explain the unexplainable - why an organisation with our resources, our managerial skills entered the new season with a thin squad that was to prove our undoing and absent two or more key players that had been supposedly in Arsene’s sights…

Ribery was the obvious one we all knew about, Pato I had no idea - if true, fascinating…Tevez? Woodgate? Modric? and there were/are others in positions crucial to our ‘gaps’ and depth…who’s going to get Berbatov this summer for instance? his style is our style, he’s a perfect fit, will cost a ton of money but we need him or the likes of him in the few instances they become available to match the Chelsea and Man U squads…they, rightly, go to Moscow and we don’t for only this reason - squad depth and the inclusion of key acquisitions.

If Edelman carried responsibility for missing these opportunities that a Dien did not in the past then tis well he’s gone…our unique and wonderful style of play is not compromised by these type of purchases it is buttressed…it would enable the good guys to be where they belong, at the top, not watching others fight for it…

Arsene must not let his ego deny the absolute need for these infusions of outside top talent…we don’t charge the highest ticket prices in the land to run out of steam when it matters most and let others triumph…the best of both worlds is what we need - our own home grown which is so special plus an occasional very large cheque…maybe Edelman had not the nerve to sign the latter…if so Asimov was right to wave bye bye to him…

LETS WIN NEXT YEAR FOR A CHANGE!!

heard that barazite is the closest thing we have to berbatov!!!

i find it strange how everyone crucified diarra for leaving, even though he went for football reasons and took a huge gamble going to pompey, but flamini who is leaving for financial reasons no one says anything about. he has spent the year saying how he wanted to stay and how he loves arsenal, all in the meantime we lose diarra and ruin gilberto but when push comes to shove he is off for the money!!!!

ck, your comment on brazarite is apropos of what? I actually think that Nick Bendtner looks like he could be a bit of Berbatov: tall, very skilled, aloof, and lazy. He doesn’t have the cool of Berbatov, or the smoking habit (I hope), but that could come with time… he he.

dan, I for one don’t let Flam off the hook. Yeah, yeah, he’s got a right to do what he wants blah blah blah but he’s obviously just a mercenary, it’s not as if the gap between what Milan offered him and what Arsenal offered him is all that huge. At least Diarra left for solid football reasons, he wasn’t after just money.

Here Flamini has risen to become a crucial part of a top 4 team in one of Europe’s biggest leagues, a team that came close to trophies and that he could help actually win one or two next season — and off he goes to a team that may not even be in the CL next season, that can’t even challenge seriously for their own league title.

I have more respect for Diarra than Flamini, frankly.

NY, for once we are in complete agreement. i really hope he isn’t picked again this season.

If all this stuff about the boardroom struggle pitting Arsene v. pennypinching Edelman is true, then I’m certainly glad Arsene’s won the battle. Edelman deserves our thanks but he’s served his purpose.

And on a general football point: given yesterday’s UEFA cup results, I almost feel like giving up entirely on football, at least the major tournaments. It’s not just international football that’s become negative and uninspiring, it’s club football as well in the major tournaments (in Europe at least).

The CL rewards anti-football as a matter of course now. But it was still possible to see some good, adventurous, positive football in the UEFA cup tournament. Last season we had the incredible Sevilla-Espanyol final, which made the Milan-Pool borefest look like the testament to cowardice that it was.

I was looking forward to a Bayern-Fiorentina final. Now we have the depressing prospect of a Zenit-Rangers final.

Almost everywhere you turn now only cowardice on the pitch gets you trohpies. It’s what got Man United into the final after all. Thank god for the Copa Libertadores, where managers and players have the balls to go for it.

we shouldn’t let this week of brilliant, big matches at which we were merely observers pass without some sort of note re TH…that cameo at SB, like the one the week before, was sad bordering on tragic…

from the toast of London to a bench warming irrelevance at Barca …so quick, the change…hubris, shakespearean almost…you pay the price and in his case sooner than later…

played out of position? major health issues? divorce reprecussions? likely some of all but it still hurts to watch him…what a talent, he must hate being where he is now.

Blazon, we’ll probably be saying the same thing about MF this time next season while he picks up splinters on the bench at AC (minus the sympathy)

Copied from vital Arsenal from
salihu.valon
Wenger had initially hoped to discover whether Flamimi intended to leave by the end of April, but today he told Arsenal TV Online: “It is still not sorted out. We should get an answer today or tomorrow.

“I’m always positive because I believe the link he has with the club will be stronger than all the other different attractions that he can have.

“I know that if it’s down to football then he will stay here. If it’s down to football or financial resources he might not stay here.

“He is free to choose a different direction, everybody is free out of contract and you have to respect that.”

Regarding Alexander Hleb, who has also been linked with a move to Serie A, with Inter Milan, whose coach Roberto Mancini has admitted being interested in the Belarussian, Wenger repeated that Arsenal have not yet been contacted by the Italians.

The Arsenal boss also said he’d been taken by surprise when Keith Edelman announced his decision to resign as managing director of the Gunners and seek a “fresh challenge”.

“We didn’t expect that and I don’t know why [he is leaving],” said Wenger. “Does he go somewhere else or has he chosen a different direction? You have to respect that. He has done well in a very difficult period and everybody is conscious of that.”

I agree with dan in that I feel much kinder towards Diarra than I do Flamini. Diarra wanted to play football, simle as that. wenger, having seemingly promised it in August then told him that he could not promise him anything, so he left to play so he could get into the France squad. that all seems fair to me. I dont have a problem with Diarra.
Flam could see this whole situation. He was being dishonest in so far as he could have told wenger that he had no intention of staying if he got a better offer. Flam is moving for money. I cannot respect someone that moves for money when they earn millions every year.
Given that wenger had placed his faith in Flam to the extent of actually selling his only real competition for his place, Flam has not repaid that faith whatsoever and is prepared to leave Arsenal in the lurch both footballing and financially.

Maybe Flam is just trying to annoy the club because it was last summer that we messed him about a bit. But 2 wrongs dont make a right and messing Arsenal around wont do him any favours with the fans.

i am sorry to say it is wengers responsibilty not flam’s, he is the one that continually played flam and not diarra, he is the one that killed gilbertos confidence, he is the one who let diarra leave even though no contract was signed by flam and most importantly he is the one that should have arsenal’s best interest in every decision he makes, he clearly completely ballsed it up. i expect nothing from flam or any player anymore, they don’t care about arsenal and if he can paid more elsewhere i am not in the least bit surprised if he leaves. the manager needs to be a strategic thinker looking at the big picture, and clearly a manager that started the year with flam, diarra and a good gilberto, has probably ended the year with none of them and not much money to spend on replacements let alone strenghtening the team. complete piss poor management whatever anyone says.

With all respect to AW, they have really messed up with the Flamini and Diarra position. Incredible that they had 2 of the best defensive midfielders in French football, and could end up with neither of them. It would have been so simple to argue with Flamini that he tell them his intentions back in December in order that they start to plan for the future (the argument that AW finally used this past month - ie we must get an answer by the end of April (he said the same thing for the end of March as well).
Back in December Flamini should have been politely told to sign or else risk being reserve to Diarra (which would have been entirely fair as Flamini was clearly NOT COMMITTED ie he hadn’t signed).
They let Flamini play (and not sign) and Diarra gets the hump and goes. Incredibly poorly managed.
Diarra is not at fault. Flamini (who studied Law) naturally angles for the best deal he can get (he is either working to get the Arsenal bid up as high as possible and will then sign for Arsenal - or is a total mercenary) Either is possible. And Arsenal fails to manage both options as they should have.

Re Hleb its a bit different. In mid season Hleb was making noises about “Arsenal for life”, and he was obviously in contract extension talks (2 and a bit seasons left on his contract). But something went badly wrong, maybe his valuation of himself or the club’s value for him not meeting expectations. Hence he looks elsewhere. Looks like Arsenal want to run down his last 2 years without significantly upping his pay, so Hleb is threatening to do a Webster on them. Also looks like mis-management and possibly penny pinching. Hleb is a great player and should continue to develop given the chance.

I don’t think you can put all of this down to Edelmen, remember with Dein going Friar took over responsibility for Dein’s job which included negotiations over player contracts. Now Friar has the MD position as well. Is Friar up to it? There is too much on AW’s shoulders and a serious lack of player contract acumen at work here.

Flaminis/Diarra’s don’t grow on trees (look at the money paid for Hargreaves and Mascherano) and Hleb is a unique talent. Sad if they lose them all due to mismanagement/penny pinching.

i don’t buy it that it is edelman’s etc fault, too convinient. the way i see it is wenger gets basically what he wants and if he wanted the club to do whatever it took he would have done.

he obviously rates flam highly but not that highly. besides nothing has changed since january we all knew then what we know now ie how much they would pay him , so it should have been resolved then.

Dan i fail to see how you can blame the manager for flams (seemingly) greedy attitude and to be quite frank, if he is’nt happy earning £40,000 a week and running out to 60,000 adoring fans then f**k him, let him see that the grass is’nt always greener

Hi, YW, hi everyone.

Dan, that assessment of Wenger’s “complete piss poor management” with regard to the Flamini situation is incredibly unfair. He played Flam because Flamini was in form and the partnership with Cesc was working. Gilberto and Diarra were benched because Wenger was ruthless enough to stick with the most successful combination, so he WAS doing what was best for the club. Flam’s form turned out not to be just a flash in the pan, and he has been trying to tie Flamini down since January. The fact is that Flam is a free agent and there is nothing that Wenger or anyone can do about that. If he had offered a budget-busting £60,000-a-week contract back in August to an industrious but hardly stellar utility player, and a player moreover who had stated that he wanted to leave, we would have thought he was mad.
As for Diarra, the guy wanted to play as automatic first choice and players can’t dictate to the manager. Even Henry was benched last year when he got a bit cheeky. Diarra’s a very good player and I wish he was still with us, but he was not consistent - he put in some quite poor stints as well as outstanding ones. He didn’t take his chances the way Flamini did. If Diarra really wanted to go that much, letting him go was the right thing to do - it’s a short career, and modern footballers are not serfs.
Gilberto is still at Arsenal, so unless and until he goes, you can’t blame Wenger for his departure.

Considering that Flamini must have known why Diarra left, and how Gilberto has been feeling, I do think his behaviour has been rather selfish. He has only had the opportunity to shine in midfield because of Wenger’s sense of fairness - Flamini was the player in form, so he was the player who started, ahead of the World Cup winner and the rising star. It’s down to Arsene (rightly) giving him a chance that he’s even got the option of AC Milan instead of Birmingham FC. I don’t blame the guy for trying to get a better deal, he deserves it for his consistently excellent performances on the pitch. But he shouldn’t be keeping the club and Arsene hanging around like this; it’s disrespectful. So I am hacked off with Flam now. And if he is waiting to make a decision about going to AC Milan depending on their result at the weekend, then that’s disrespectful to the Italian club as well.

Flamini asking astronomical wages ? - Mathieu Flamini has told Arsenal they will have to make him one of the country’s highest paid players if they want to keep him next season.

The French midfielder has made the astonishing demand for a deal worth £7.5million-a-year - around £144,000 a week - because he has a similar offer on the table from AC Milan.

Which le Boss wont sanction - At his pre-match press conference on Friday, the manager was asked if the Club could afford to keep a tight wage structure if they want to keep players or attract new ones.

“I would rather take it the other way,” Wenger replied. “We cannot afford not to keep it. It is as simple as that.

“We have to respect that, despite what people say, we have £360 million debt [on Emirates Stadium].

“So we have to respect the wages structure or we will go bust. Therefore it is not that you cannot respect the wages structure, we cannot afford not to do it.”

And Inter & Hleb in trouble - Arsène Wenger will be reporting Inter Milan to FIFA.

The Frenchman revealed on Friday that, in the last week, he had been made aware of developments regarding a reported illegal move for Alex Hleb.

The Arsenal boss stopped short of revealing precisely what it was that had come to light but was clearly angered by what he considered a breach of the rules.

“I will of course do it [report them to FIFA], with Inter Milan especially,” said Wenger. “Because of what they did.

“I now know more about what happened over there [in Milan]. I will keep the information for those who need to know it.

“I don’t want to speak much more on that but it is unfair what happened.”

russ, it is not his fault that flam is greedy (human nature we have all moved for extra money) his job is to plan fro the future seeing the big picture. what wenger/ the club whoever is responsible, knew that they were releasing a good player in diarra even though flam wasn’t committed, we all knew what could have happened and most probably will. therefore from a financial and prudent point of view they were completely short sighted by sticking with flam all along when he wasn’t committed, call it naive if you want but EVERYONE knew there was a chance we would lose both by allowing diarra to leave permanently (they could have loaned him out) and not forcing the issue with flam in januray. i do not understand how someone can not see that they totally screwed it up.

ONCE AGAIN WENGERSPIN AT ITS BEST THERE IS NO 350 MILLION DEBT ON EMIRATES STADIUM 100 MILLION IS ON THE PROPERTY DEVELOPMENT AND BONDS WHICH WILL BE PAID BACK BY NEXT YEAR PLUS 75 MILLION PROFIT. THE LONG TERM DEBT WILL BE 200 MILLION BY NEXT YEAR. BUT ALL THIS BS IS THE EXCUSE WHEN WE NEVER GO FOR PLAYERS LIKE TORRRES .

WHY CANT WE DO LIKE LIVERPOOL AND TRY TO SWAP SEVERAL OF OUR OBSOLETE PLAYERS LIKE SENDEROS. GILBERTO, AS THEY ARE DOING WITH CROUCH FOR BARRY?

JOHN GAZZAP,AND DAN, We all agree Wenger completely screwed up the Diarra situation, what a fiasco, he was boasting we had too many midfielders now we have lost 3 by end of this season

Yogi what are you going to say if Ade demands 75k a week? You say that players can get salary reviews but what are contracts with results bonuses for?

Edelman @ 10:44

you don’t say who gets to leave and who stays because you are history dude :)

edelman @ 11:06

The stadium & you are both history….but for different reasons. You’re history because you’re gone…the stadium is history because it will be there long after you’re gone.

tough situation for the club really….we have to try to win trophies without being too extravagant so be it… we almost did that this time.

And all those who moan abt players demanding wages close to the average market wage structure dont you all do the same most of the times…”…am sick of not winning trophies..”, “…i want trophies..” almost the same….

I have a frnd(chelsea fan) who sleeps before each chelsea match… thinking tht his team loses every time he watches them play….now how cool is that???

dan,

The difference between Flamini & Diarra, is that Flamini fought for 4 years at Arsenal, played wherever the manager wanted him to play and finally got his right position this season.

When my employer leave my contract to run out, it doesn’t tell me that you really care, yet you sign Fabregas for 8 years (The longest contract ever) even though I understand Fabregas is far more important than Flamini.

Diarra, just wanted to play thinking he is better than any one else ahead of him. Diarra didn’t leave for the money, but to be honest…I think his IQ is very bad.

G4L

I think your friend sleeps during his team’ games to save himself the agnoy of watching crap football. :)

as i said i am not in the least bit surprised by flam’s actions, the guy doesn’t give a toss about arsenal (like the overwhelming majority of them). diarra also didn’t care about arsenal but wanted to play football, his reasons for leaving are no less valid than flams. flam has either completely led wenger on, or wenger/the club have been completely naive and managed the situation appallingly badly.

flam sat for 4 years because for the 1st three he was not a 1st choice player and had no other good options. equally he refused to play left back so your comment isn’t true that he played anywhere asked.

big picture even if both are scum for different reasons, the club left themselves open to this outcome and you didn’t have to be a genius to see it coming.

the net result is probably we are going to have to spend 10+m to get a top quality replacement who can hit the ground running. a big chunk of our tranfer fund gone before we have to replace potentialy helb and bring in the 3 or 4 new players we need to strenghten.

as i said the “stratgeic” planning in the club seems very poor for such a big club. as a Chief Financial Officer of my company if i allowed assets to walk out the door for nothing and had such poor long term planning i would be out of a job!!!

true gunner4ever!
i think flamini is a bit of a greedy disloyal pig(didnt left his hometown club marseille in the best fashion either) & diarra’s a bit of an impatient baffoon, jump ship from chelsea, jump ship from arsenal…who does he think he is to expect to play straight away at a top team!…no surprise NO one has come or even hinted interist in him thus far!…id rather have flam in my first team because while diarra’s a more complete player flam makes the rest of the midfield players that 10% better! but whatever happens even with hleb leaving as long as it all happens soon!
wenger will replace them with gems make no mistake!

dan,

I’m not defending Flamini, and I think he is also an idiot for leaving Arsenal if it was only for money.

But, it is a fact Flamini almost played a full season at left back. Not every player would like to be converted into something else. If you want to be an Engineer and I say no you will be a Doctor, you may or may not agree and I can’t fault you either way.

He played wherever we wanted him to play, but we (Manager & Board) didn’t secure his future which tells him we weren’t really sure of him. Now he has the upper hand and using the situation to his advantage, I say he can go wherever or whatever….Arsenal will be Arsenal, he may become a nothing and get lost in history.

G4E, i couldn’t care less what flam, does ,even if he signed now it wouldn’t change my low opinion of him and the rest of them. they don’t love the club like we do and will come and go long before us. my concern is for arsenal football club and i am just disappointed that we have been put in this position as to losing key players at a time when we need to be strengthening and that club have been well and truly left with their pants down!!!

it all backs up my view that constantly signing foreign players only will only lead to more internal unrest than our rivals whose keys players tend to be english.

milan or arsenal to a frenchman? arsenal or inter to a belarussian? irrespective of the cash i think we will always be seen as less attractive to these foreign players.

it has happened over and over again and will continue to do so. let’s be honest how much longer is cesc going to stay with us before he goes home?

I also don’t think that we are retarded strategically, because I think Wenger believes Song would be able to fill Flamini’s spot. He played for Cameroon national team in a major tournament at 19 years old, so he is not far off.

Song actually would be a good replacement for Flamini & Gilberto because he is a combination of both. He can play in midfield, he can play CB, he is faster than Gilberto and more technical than Flamini. Don’t underestimate Wenger or Song.

dan u make a point about poor planning, i think thats part of the reason why Edelman’s leaving! his city background proved very beneficial in securing our stadium loans & making sure it all ran like clockwork & on budget…which it did much credit to him!
However after the stadium, sponsors, & all the commercial/business side of things are sorted we need an MD who is more football orientated! which seems to me one of the reasons he left! i read somewhere that AW was infuriated last post season with some if not all his main targets not being snapped up! including alex PATO who app ’slipped through our fingers’! when i read that my heart sank! what a player!

G4E,

we need experianced players not starting from scratch again with another 19 year old who has played all of 20 games in his career!!!

not saying song doesn’t have the potential but for god sake we are tring to reduce the gap to the top teams not increase it and song is not a top quality centre midfielder for a club aspiring to be the best in england and europe.

He can stay as much as PV4 stayed close to 10 years, he can stay as much as TH14 stayed 8 years, he can stay as much as DB10 stayed 10 years, or he can leave next year….who knows. Nothing is guaranteed, you can sign a contract today and leave tomorrow.

As far as English, we had Cole and he also left for money…he maybe didn’t leave England, but he left Arsenal…his so called boyhood club.

Every one is different dan and no one can predict the future, or we all be rich and happy.

i doubt edelman had anything to do with the flam situation, i am sure wenger sanctions the football side and edelman had nothing tio do with it. today wenger said nothing would cahnge on the football side.

I don’t blame Flamini, Diara, Wenger or Hleb for anything with regards to transfers. We might call the players selfish but we(fans) are also selfish by wanting to keep the players because they are good and nothing else.
Since us, the fans can’t switch allegiances, we are just pandering our own self interests. When I don’t hear fans say “sell this player because he is not good enough for us” then you can convince me that morals and loyalty should trump players’ futures, bearing in mind at the end of last season, Gilberto almost got the player of the season award, but by Dec this season there was too much “Gilberto has to go” crap flying around. As the fans, we are the most disloyal group of people(in general terms) to our players, especially when the form dips

Flamini and Hleb leaving is VERY good to our club. Yes they are sensational(as of now) but what they stand in the way of, is way bigger than they will ever be.

We have see the marginalizations of Denilson, Diaby, Eduardo, RVP, Gilberto and Theo because of them, players who are all way more skilled than Flamini, and deadlier than both Flamini and Hleb.

We are going to see a more deadly arsenal without these two

g4e,

the cole thing was a specific situation. surely you can see english players tend to stay in england and would see playing for arsenal as the pinnacle of a career, not a stepping stone to the euro elite like these young foreign players. ( iam not suggesting just buying english just that these situations are more likely to happen with foreign players)

also if you have a contract you at least get a tranfer fee and the club is protected to a certain point. of course players leave that is the nature of the game but that doesn’t mean you let people walk out for nothing!!!

we should never balme players they are self motivated only, the club needs to protects the clubs best interests which is where good management comes in to play or not as in this case.

taygoon, def fans are fickle!
if we’re more clinical next season we would actually win everything! no joke! we’re that good, but i do have to say while Hleb doesnt score he brings a hell of a lot of other things to the team! & so does Flam, but i trust Denilson/song even diaby if called upon to produce consistently at a top class level nx season!
they’re all capable of the jump flamini made this season no doubt! its part of the growing process..dont forget fabregas, walcott, clichy, everyone under 24-23 is gonna improve nx season! we’ve got a hell of a lot to be optimistic about ppl!

There are some strong statements being bandied about around here when you’ve only got speculation and innuendo to go on. No one knows what really goes on behind the scenes, so have your opinions, but refrain from expressing them like they are fact.

Wenger does not own a crystal ball, he mostly gets things right, but he is human and sometimes makes mistakes like we all do. I don’t think he deserves the slating he is coming in for. This time last season, none of you lamenting the more than likely departure of Flamini cared if he went.

He was considered an okay squad player and no more. Clearly Wenger did not expect him to suddenly blossom into a key member of the team, which is why he was not offered an extended contract. Flamini probably would not have accepted it anyway as he wanted to play regularly in the midfield and that was not guaranteed. He was well motivated this season to prove himself and get what he wants either at Arsenal or elsewhere, so he has exceeded all expectations. But who is to say whether he can sustain that level over the long haul?

I agree there is no justification to bankrupt the club and risk disruption to the team, because if he gets exactly what he wants, all the other players who have stepped up this season will also expect the same. No player is bigger than the club. We survived the departure of a greater player than him and will survive his departure too.

As for Diarra, he is the architect of his own fortune. His priority was playing for France above all else, so there is no blame attached to his departure. He really wasn’t here long enough to be that much of a loss as he had not become a key player.

See you want to capitalize on a player your didn’t pay nothing for in the first place. We didn’t pay anything in Flamini, and we will get nothing for him leaving.

We paid 2 million in Diarra, we got 5 million for selling him.

Got it? We didn’t lose anything in Flamini other than any experience he gained. The real experience he gained was this year only playing in his correct position.
===

I agree, the club’s interest is the only interest to be considered, but you will not always be successful in doing that. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose…just like football?

pass , he was key in the point that i think wenger probably signed him to replace gilberto and then flam started playing well and kept his place. i agree flam has totally surpassed expectations and may never be able to reproduce his early season form again.

i think long term diarra is a better footballer than flam, but we will never know.

g4e, your analysis is wrong, what you pay at the beginning is not that important now, it is a sunk cost. replacement cost is far important at this point, and for that we are nowing going to have pay a lot. i also agree they shouldn’t break the bank for him.

You may think it’s wrong, because you don’t think we have the replacement. But I also think you are wrong because we may already have the replacement.

Beside how can you predict we have to pay something in signing a replacement? The man who got Flamini for free, can still get the replacement for free. You think we have to pay big money, because in your mind you are thinking of big name signing, but Wenger can come up with someone no one heard of, just like Flamini 4 years ago.

It’s all speculations at this point.

it is speculation because he may stay. however the chances of us finding a free transfer centre midfielder who can straight in and do a job is fairly unlikely. i hope to be wrong, do you know of any freebies out there that we are looking at?

as you know we are linked with every tom dick and harry and i haven’t heard of any freebies on the horizon. you are correct i plucked the figure from no where in particular, but any decent player will not come cheap.

as you said above it took flam 4 years to get where he is now, i think we can all agree that we want the transition to end next year, so starting with young kids again in such a key position is not ideal.

Football for players & fans alike is all about self interest.

The fans want to keep their best players & ditch any as soon as they miss-place a couple of passes.

Flamini joined the club on a virtual free, had 3/4 years on the fringes of the side, almost bought out his contract, last summer, because he needed regular 1st team football but opted to give it 1 more go.

Well what a go it was, so he is now well & truly in demand.

He is clearly a bright boy, his form was great & recognised as so. He knew he would be a free agent, so why should he just accept our offer/s, without seeing what alternatives are out there.

None of us know the actual process that has been going on, & who is setting the figures. All the comments have been made without the benefit of any real facts but as usual just assumptions & innuendo.

No doubt Matty has been weighing up his pros & cons, like any of us would in a similar situation.

The difference, I suppose is at the level of earnings these blokes are on what the hell difference does an extra £10k pw make.

The indications are that he is going but let’s wait & see.

We usually keep the players we want to keep. Flamini could be an exception, like Anelka but at least we got a shed load of money for him.

Edu left, I assume because with his injury record, he was not offered sufficient to keep him. He has hardly played for Valencia. Wiltord had served his purpose & was a high earner.

Otherwise our foreign players have been very loyal & certainly no more likely to jump ship than the likes of Cashly & Sol.

dan, thanks for the compliment :) I’m no Arsene Wenger…Although I would wish, I highly respect the man and the human being.

No I don’t know of any free midfielders, just as I didn’t know anything about Flamini, or Eduardo, or Sagna or Diaby, or Fabregas….do you want me to keep going? :)
===

I didn’t say they come cheap but they don’t come that expensive either, a creative playmaker can be expensive, a defensive midfielder would and should not be that expensive or break the bank. The 5 Million we got from Diarra should be enough.

not sure where you get your 5m from, but please name me another top qulaity holding midfielder out there for that figure. eduardo was 8m and sagna 6m (for arhght back), diaby and fab were 18 and 16 when they arrived and not excatly firts team ready.

Why was Diarra for 2 - 5 million then? Or is a similar player is not good enough now to play for Arsenal?

campbell we kicked out and cole is his own story. flint outside of beckam who is finished not one english player of any note plays abroad, it is a fact that english players are more likely to stay in england and the movement between the top 4 clubs is minimal, therefore an english player who plays for us is unlikely to go to our rivals in england and will see being at us as the pinnacle of their career.

you are absolutely correct he was one of the few that fit in to that category and we no longer have him.

I don’t price the players wearing Man Ure & Chelsea glasses dan.

Chelsea would’ve paid 20 million for Sagna, we paid 7 because we have Wenger. Same goes for Eduardo.

I’m also discussing the prospect of buying a new player with you for the sake of debating, but not forgetting that a player like Diaby or Song can just all of a sudden make the step up just exactly as Flamini blew up in our faces this season :)

gunner4ever, you talk a lot but actually you know really nothing at all.

There is a simple answer to that, Dan.

Few English players unfortunately are recognised as good value abroad.

Which of our foreign players have gone directly to our PL rivals?

I can give you quite a few examples of British players who have left us for Man U & Liverpool in the past.

Song is ready to step up next season, with Denilson & Djourou also able play the role. We only need to buy if Gilberto goes & the right player can be found. It is up to someone to do a Flamini & make the position their own.

Matty has been magnificent, I hope he stays, but if he doesn’t Song can add some much needed physique to the position. I cannot forget Essien bouncing off him at the ACN.

I thought Diarra was a very busy player, he would have been useful but physique is something he could not add.

Dan, if you read Wenger’s comments on Arsenal.com, he would like Flamini to stay, but as he says if Flamini goes “we will find a solution, don’t worry”. We may not know who that replacement may be, but you can be sure that Arsene has a few names in mind already.

let’s hope so, I play centre midfield and am playing sunday morning maybe they can come watch me!!!! mind you i am more on the cesc side than flam!!!

Edelman, I’m glad you understand nothing I say. Shouldn’t you be looking for a job now?

G4E

I don’t think we can entrust our midfied to the likes of Diaby. He loses the ball more than any player anytime he plays. Imagine him playing in centre mid, we will just be toast. He better continue to learn his trade at LW till he’s able have full control over the ball.

The only person perhaps with the capability to replace Flam is Song. Denilson is not anything exceptional and his purchase has certainly block the chances of Lansbury, Randall and Gibbs into the first XI.

I think that was the problem with Flamini last year too. We can’t entrust Flamini with our midfield, then he proves us all wrong the next season :)

Although my views about Denilson are different from yours, no one blocks any one. If they prove they’re better than Denilson, they will take his place.

G4E

‘no one blocks any one. If they prove they’re better than Denilson, they will take his place’

How will they prove themseves if they don’t get a chance to be tried. This is the problem I always don’t understand. Why do we bring in average foreign players with their likes in England or the academy?

If we want to bring in a young player then we should look into the academy and see if there are prospects in there. If there are, then there is no need. However, its not so just wholesale importation of anything foreign.

I saw Denilson play in the reserves with some of our academy prospects and he didn’t look exceptional playing in that team. I’ve seen Gibbs, Lansbury and Randall doing better playing with him.

Now, so you have him brought in the first XI but don’t give your acadmy prospects a chance because you have someone unexceptional sitting in there on top of them.

Or is it the case that these lads are being prepared to be sold?

Senderos and Djourou same, not exceptional but were on top of Martin Connolly so eventually Martin got sold; we never had a chance to see Martin play but we’ve seen Senderos and Djourou tried several times and yet not good enough.

Will this policy allow Arsenal academy players to develop?

Jay Simpson has emerged as a very good player both in the youth set up and now in League 1 on loan playing for Millwall. He was selected as the PFA footballer of the year, very good playing on the right wing. Will he get a chance no. Why? we have one of the best RW, Sir Emmanuel Eboue there so no chance.

Bloody hell must have missed a few years are we being relegated? What happen in 2008/2009, 2009 2010. Has the Boss left? That’s what happens when you go for a nap 2/3 years have passed. FOR crying out loud, we are not in danger its just one or two players moving on if they do. I give up, I really do.

what the hell are you talking about OT, we are just discussing what happens if he leaves, maybe the blog should just be empty and no thoughts at all, right at your intellectual level.. not sure why you bother because all you say is why are people discussing anything!!!

very strange.

If Flam & Hleb go I trust AW to either replace them from within the squad or buy suitable replacements. While they`ve both enjoyed good seasons we have more valuable players already at the club.

The Diarra situation frustrated me though. I still don`t understand why he couldn`t have been loaned until the end of the season but nobody seems to know the full facts.

Howard Denilson is a very good player and was captain of the Brazil under 19 team, how can you say he is “not anything exceptional”. The acadamy players you mention are out on loan to learn. If or when they return they will fight for a place in the 1st team if they are good enough. Just like Denilson will have to.

Howard,

Why aren’t Gibbs and Lansbury called up to the English first team then? Denilson was called up to Brazil’s first team.

You somehow can’t admit that English players are behind their international counterparts in development, technical and tactical abilities by at least two years.

If what you say is true about Arsenal selling English supreme talent, why is it they’re sold for peanuts? I didn’t see us making 20 million in Bentley, or Sidwell. They get sold because they’re not good enough. Chelsea took Sidwell, did he make it there? No, Essien and a punch of other 30 year old foreigners are playing because they’re better.

Lansbury, Gibbs, Simpson are players in the making and they take longer than others to develop. Some of them will make it, and some will not. Obviously the good ones like Walcott will make in “time”.

You want Simpson to take Ade’s place, yet you can’t entrust Song with our midfield. Is this a joke or are you serious?

On the last paragraph I misread Emanuel Eboue for Emanuel Adebayor.

The answer is, if Simpson is better and doing so well he will replace Eboue. Arsene just said Wilshere has a chance to play or at least compete for first team…so why not Simpson, Lansbury or Gibbs?

Sorry Dan as usual you are always right. Comments such as
G4E, i couldn’t care less what flam, does ,even if he signed now it wouldn’t change my low opinion of him and the rest of them. they don’t love the club like we do and will come and go long before us. my concern is for arsenal football club and i am just disappointed that we have been put in this position as to losing key players at a time when we need to be strengthening and that club have been well and truly left with their pants down!!!
we are tring to reduce the gap to the top teams not increase it let’s be honest how much longer is cesc going to stay with us before he goes home?
All your tripe moan moan moan.
We are four points behind the top two, a very outside chance of winning the EPL. Only 4 points behind last year we were 21 points behind.
The wailing and moaning is unbelievable. And all the can do is ridicule me by saying ‘right at your intellectual level’. As I’ve said before DAN grow up sonny Jim we all have a right to comment my comment is the world has not ended and we are doing well bloody well.

hn

I would love to see home grown English youngsters coming through & making it just like they used to but they have to be good enough.

Bentley may have made it but lost patience, Sidwell, Harper, Taylor, Muamba etc weren`t top quality & Pennant had his `problems`.

Matt Connolly may make it to the Premiership one day, but not with a top club

I agree with G4E that they tend to develop later than foreign youngsters & chucking the likes of Simpson, Randall, Lansbury into the Premiership at this stage would be asking too much of them.

Apart from Bentley, I don’t see that any English player we let go was or is better than what we currently have. It doesn’t mean this will be the same for Gibbs, Lansbury, or Simpson because I think they are far better players.

If you think that me or some fans are against English players, you are very wrong. If Arsenal plays 11 English players and they can play the kind of football we want to play, who the hell cares? I want my team to play good entertaining football and win trophies English or not.

Did any one see Edelman? I have a job for him

I’ve just finished listening to Denilson’s interview on ATVO and I have to say that he is the type of player we want at Arsenal. He is very motivated by the competition for places, and after training works on his left foot and his heading because he wants to improve his weak areas. I am sure he will be a great player for us next season if he can get through it injury-free.

G4E

You totally misread what I wrote.

Gibbs, Lansbury and Randall are all 18/19. Denilson is 19 and brought in at 18. I’ve seen them play together in the reserves and I can tell you emphatically that Denilson is not better skilled, playing with them.

From what I saw, I’ll pick Lansbury ahead of Denilson in the same CM position. Therefore, no need to bring in a foreign player whose skills are no better or even lower than he local lads (comparing him with Lansbury for example)

I don’t know how they feel but I can imagine the psychological trauma some of them are going through. Playing well and yet at the end of the day seeing the importation of young foreign players placed ahead of them.

Martin Connolly was a good centre back who was sold because they considered that well, we have Senderos and Djourou so why do we keep him.

Martin was never tried or given a chance; just sold to QPR. This is a guy who’s been called into the U21, meaning there is something in him seen by Staurt Pierce.

Now after so many tries, we’re all convinced that Senderos hasn’t got what it takes to be a regular CB for Arsenal. Why not tries fo Connolly too?

I suspect eventually, Gibbs, Simpson, Lansbury and Randall will all be sold while we keep Song, Diaby and Denilson. That has been the predicament of these young lads in the academy for sometime.

“I play centre midfield and am playing sunday morning maybe they can come watch me!!!! mind you i am more on the cesc side than flam!!!”

That’s the trouble Dan, everybody wants to be like Cesc!

Howard you are so predictable in your xenophobia. Give it a rest. Arsene will pick the best players he can afford who can fit into our system regardless of their passport. If you could cool your jets you would know that there are some English players coming through the club with the potential to make it to the first team. Whether they make it or not will be down to whether they are talented enough, not because of their nationality.

Howard alot of the time Gibbs was playing LB in the reserves, so it is difficult to compare him with Denilson.

selling decent english players who are good enough to play as back up players in the squad seems daft when we then fill the squad with average foreigners. I love to see the best foreign players but I dont like to see decent English players leaving when players like Song and Eboue are hardly setting the league alight.

for what its worth, the next generation of English players do look very good. perhaps good enough to be first choice players within a couple of years. I hope that the likes of Simpson are kept, as I say, even if thats just as a squad player and only be sold when they have been given a really good chance at Arsenal. if they turn out to be not good enough then OK sell them but I want to see more effort to keep the English players.

I don’t think I missed the point Howard, if Lansbury is better than Denilson, why was Denilson picked up for Brazil, and Lansbury didn’t for England? I don’t think Brazil didn’t have enough players so they just wanted to make up the numbers.
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You have every right to fight for your local boys, but I think you’re just as hyped up about them as the media, and when they don’t live up to your expectations, the English dreams of winning anything internationally come down crashing and the blame Wenger game starts.

Gazzap,

The problem is mediocre English squad players think they’re better than any first team player and they decide they want to leave to play and of course they end up in Mediocre teams. Tell who left Arsenal and went to a top 4 club other than the drunken driver guy who went to Liverpool via b’ham?

Steve

I’m not comparing Gibbs to Denilson because Gibbs play in a different position. I wonder why we brought in Denilson around the same age as Randall and Landsbury in the same position when he Denilson is no better than them.

Denilson has also had chances while both Randall and Landsbury haven’t had chances.

Steve, I’ve also said that they are in the same age group and I’ve seen them play in the eserves together and from what I saw he’s no better than Landsbury so if we have Landsbury then why import Denilson?

G4E

Senderos is captain of the Swiss national team, is he good enough for Arsenal?

Have you seen Landsbury play? Go and see the reserve play and if you’re lucky to see a game where you have Diaby, Traore and Denilson fighting it out with the English lads then you’ll see my arguement.

You’ll also ask yourself why do we import these when we have so many young English boys doing so well and still keep on importing these foreign lads?

These foreign young players come and sit on top of their equally good young English lads who eventually get sold because they reason that we have too many and so let’s sell some. It ends up that its the English boys who’re always sold.

The sale of Martin Connolly while we kept on holding on to Djourou and Senderos can be describe as a mistake to me.

G4E

Now, so what top club in England can Senderos, Djourou, Eboue, Denilson, Traore play apart from Arsenal?

There is no conspiracy by Arsenal against English players Howard, just as there is no conspiracy against Arsenal by English referees.

The fact of the matter is, if they are as good as let’s say Walcott they’ll get their chance, and we all know how Walcott struggled to live up to the hyped up expectations. He is going to come through, I hope he does. I also hope Lansbury, Gibbs, etc. etc., will make it to the first team as well. If they are good enough, the foreign players will leave just as dan was saying we get them to train them and then they leave. Until England can submerge the PL with young real talented players (not hyped up for money) we will continue to play foreigners because they’re cheaper and their success rate is much much better than English players.

Playing a reserve game is far away from the pressure you get in front of large crowds. Players like Denilson having played as captain for his country means he has more experience in these kind of games. Randall and Lansbury are both good players and I have seen all 3 play. Denilson is a much more mature player at this moment in time but things may change in the future.

The players in the younger age group look even better and I can see a few making the 1st team sooner than expected.

I’ve seen Wilshere play in that clip on You Tube, which makes him look like a 30 million plus player. If we put him against Everton this weekend, do you think he will play the same Howard?

G4E

You’re beating about the bush, not homing in on the issue. If there is a good local player with equal skill then why bring in a foreign player, give him chances and refuse to offer similar chances to the local lad?

I’ll challenge you to go and watch the rserves to disprove me. I’ll also challenge you to have time and watch some of the reserve games, check the abilities of Landsbury, Randall and question yourself why we don’t see them a while in the first XI?

I mean the way Denilson is being offered opportunities why don’t we see the same chances come the way of Landsbury who I think is better than Denilson in the same position and both around the same age?

It’s something that baffles me since I saw both of them play, right?

Howard you see these players in a few brief reserve appearences Wenger sees them all the time and I am sure he can see who is the best at the moment.

Because Denilson has better experience than Lansbury. Denilson was the Brazilian captain for under 15, 17, and 19 and got called to the Brazilian first team, did Lansbury have that? Noooooooooooooooooo

I still think you’re evaluating the two by your heart not your mind. Your heart says English, English, English….man you should be the head of the English player’s union or something :)

G4E

You’re comparing apples with oranges, right? Jack is far younger and only 16. I’m talking about comparing two players of similar age in the same position. One imported, the other local.

The imported one getting chances upon chances, CC, EPl and even CL games. The other local lad good if not better but not even getting to play cc starts let alone EPL or CL.

That’s what I’m saying. I’m being emphatic that the so called local boy without skills because he’s English is more skillful in the same position than the foreign one claimed to be of a higher breed.

I’m saying that give both of them chances and pick the best but you don’t continually offer opportunities to one only and sell the one later for unknown reasons.

G4E

Of course Senderos is captain of the Swiss team so he has the right to play regularly in the CB position even if there’s a better option. That’s your logic, G4E.

Lansbury played in the CC and was injured.

Howard, you are the one talking about Lansbury and Denilson? this is your quote @ 10:56 PM

“I mean the way Denilson is being offered opportunities why don’t we see the same chances come the way of Landsbury who I think is better than Denilson in the same position and both around the same age?”

And I say to that, of course Denilson beats Lansbury at the moment for the reasons I mentioned above? Lansbury may beat Denilson in the future, who long will it take, I don’t know.
====

If you are comapring Senderos to a 23 years old English player not yet proven, and never seen an international game, then yes I would pick Senderos who has much more experience even with his once in awhile mistakes.

Who = how

G4E

How do you prove someone’s capability? Is it not an opportunity on the job?

So why don’t we try Lansbury in the same position for at least one league game? as we have done to several players who even don’t cut it?

Oh! he needs to captain the England team before? Is Eboue also the captain of the Ivorian national team?

Since when captaining a national side became a pre-requisite for getting chances at Arsenal?

You keep changing your examples Howard, I didn’t say he has to be a captain, but yet yes if Eboue played for his National team, and in a world cup and a couple of ACNs, he is better than someone how plays for a reserve team.

And Denilson played and captained his 15 to 19 national teams before we bought him, so he was already proven to be a good prospect. I certainly didn’t hear anything of notice about Lansbury on international or local level.

Denilson was also part of the Sao Paulo side which beat Liverpool to lift the World Club championship in 2005. So he was playing first team football in Brazil before we bought him, where did lansbury play first team football before we bought him?

To wrap it up Howard, if English players were that awesome as you try to portray them….they would be world cup winners, but the reality is, they couldn’t even qualify for Euros, playing against Israel and Croatia…for God Sake man.

England is GREAT, English players are not that great Howard. :)

Lansbury has been at the club since he was about 9 years old. I am sure Lansbury will be part of the CC setup next season.

howard….
“Martin Connolly was a good centre back who was sold because they considered that well, we have Senderos and Djourou so why do we keep him.”

How do you know such inside news of the club… can you please let us all know who we are going to buy this summer….. we all speculate … talk after it has happened…and you are no different

from wht i have seen of denilson… he is going to be a much matured player than randall or Lansbury…

Another reason they are being made to wait is the stupid english media… tout a promising player into the next cantona and ruin his life… those _cunt_s.

Anyways wenger has said that lansbury and randall would be featuring in the CC at least coming season. Its tough howard… can someone here tell me theo has proved everything about himself to play at the highest level… I will tell you he hasnt done anything different other than outpacing the defenders… he does that everytime… nothing different…thats a big big minus.

It wont take much discussion in the opp dressing room to sort him out…. keep 3 yards away frm him all the time… he doesnt have the skills to beat defenders close on…. i bet we will see tht soon… he bcoming frustrated… i think he will last just one season if he doesnt work hard and improve…

And thts the concern Howard media hypes up and saturates the locals and gives no room in the head for improvement… thts why i think wenger is reluctant to play someone like wilshere at the age of fabregas…mayb we will c tht next season…

The general skill level of english players is not as much as you would like.. comparing to spain or france. platini, capello and wenger have directly or indirectly pointed this out before.

But I am looking forward to looking at wilshere more.