Posted by: Yogi's Warrior | March 26, 2008

SOS (Save Our Skipper), Two Arrivals And One Departure Or Not As The Case May Be

Post Chelsea, the fallout is swift to reach the ever-eager ears of the media and to feed their overactive imaginations. And William Gallas was always going to be their chief target. Vilified for his reaction after the award of the last minute penalty as St Andrews, he is now friendless and seemingly on the verge of being stripped of the captaincy.

As is always the case, The Mail kicked it all off by reporting that Gallas had said,

Mates? Well, they are more like acquaintances

This to highlight ‘the remarkable claim that he has no true friends within Arsene Wenger’s squad’. Actually, there is nothing in the slightest bit remarkable in the claims and merely highlights the fact that a football club is no different from any other workplace. During the twenty-odd years I have worked in various places, I would say exactly the same sort of thing; a few true friends but on the whole, I have worked with people that I share a common goal with and am happy to socialise with at the time.

Still it would not segue nicely into the follow up to that about Billy has ‘lost’ the dressing room,

One Arsenal star’s representative said: “William has not behaved the way a captain should and has lost respect among some of the players. He went round all of them in front of the cameras before the Chelsea game trying to gee them up but some think it was a bit phoney

Maybe someone ought to tell them that Tony Adams no longer plays for the club nor is he a ‘player’s representative’. He has friends at the club within the coaching staff and no doubt was genuinely curious about the motivation, as we all are.

It was an interesting comment though particularly given his interest in the science and psychology of football. Geeing up players before a big game is nothing new; Adams did it plenty of times before Arsenal matches. Adams tended to do it ‘mano a mano’ and walk around shaking a clenched fist. Gallas chose to call everyone together and there was an element of stage management for the media, to show a united squad.

Gallas was not everyone’s first choice as Captain but until the Birmingham game, few could question the fact that he was successful in carrying out the role. However, his reaction brought that into question, giving the media the opportunity to invent a slant on the recent events that quite possibly does not exist.

To blame him for the subsequent lapses in concentration on their own are to deflect attention from elsewhere. For example, the culpability for Aliadiere’s goal was shared equally by Gallas and Toure; on Sunday, Belletti’s free kick should have been blocked by someone standing in front of the ball but Eboue’s booking in the first half made the player’s more conscious of being caught blocking the ball. The point is that rather than creating a scapegoat in one player, it has been a collective lapse in defensive concentration that has cost the team dear in recent weeks.

Arsene meanwhile is adamant (or whichever dandy highwayman you want him to be) that the focus will not be switching from the Premier to Champions Leagues’,

We want to do well in the Premier League and not dream about the Champions League. We have to fight back. It is five games now since we have won and we want to come back to winning ways

Not to put too fine a point on it, he is going to have his work cut out on that score, particularly if Liverpool are vanquished comfortably in the first leg.

Moving on from that even, Arsene is reported to have said on French TV that he wants Hatem Ben Arfa from Lyon with a fee of £15m being quoted which begs two questions; firstly would he pay that sort of money when he apparently has his quota of disruptive Frenchmen already and secondly, how loose is the translation into English. This morning’s Sun reckons that the lucky recipient of Arsene’s fluttering eyelashes is Zdravko Kuzmanovic for a fee of £5m which is much more in keeping with his spending patterns and will only take about twenty shirt sales with lettering on them to recoup his fee.

Gilberto wants to prove that he is still worth a place in the Arsenal squad. Whilst it might not be a universally popular decision and the sentiment is not in keeping with other recent comments, the experience that he has would be useful to the squad being one of the few who has actually been at the business end of winning trophies. However, were he to get a new deal unless injuries strike, it is hard to see him playing in the first team other than in the Carling Cup which to me at least, seems to be a sad way for his career to finish.

On which note, I’ll finish. ’til Tomorrow.

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Responses

The media are really doing a hatchet job on poor old WG. The motivational speech prior to the game is nothing new, I’ve seen him do it at many home games this season whether the camera has been there or not. Secondly the mail have misquoted him from an interview in L’Equipe when he was asked about mates in the England team. Are the xenophobes really that afraid of a man showing a bit of emotion? Do they fear he is going to infect the whole nation with his gallic tears. What a crock…

Interesting post Yogi but I think the british media are an embarassment!They are fickle in the extreme changing their allegiences whenever it suits them. This is clearly seen in the “dead man walking taunts” that were coming out of SB prior to Grand Slam Sunday.That Grant is an inept, guttless,fraud…24hours later they couldnt sing his praises enough…a genius, a master , tactition…!

When the real issues where should unsportinglike behaviour from Chelsea continue to go unpunished? How many offside decisions will continue to be awarded to them?Why does the whole world jump when Alex Ferguson says his players get kicked and cant show their skills on the pitch! And when Arsene says it Arsenal are weak and Arsene is a moaner and Taylor is a victim. Fergie says players should stop harranging refs (itself an OT invention) on the eve of a big game, Then on the next day, in a pivotal game a player gets sent off for two pthetic yellow cards that swing the balance and the title towards OT. But the papers aren’t that objective in their perspective are they? There maybe meltdowns to come from OT and SB unless somebody out there has a crystal ball! R we not only six points off the pace after all.I will not for one be part of this media which hunt aimed towars Arsenal at the moment it suits the papers to capitalise on supposed meltdown. Anyway when was the last time the papers said something positive about Arsenal!

I don’t make much of these media generated conflicts in the team. It was clear from the start they wanted to bring Arsenal down on many fronts, our playing style, English players, small squad, not experienced, and now they want to break the unity of the team as the last thing to do to finish your enemy off. It makes it a lot easy when the team is not winning, and results are bad.

I’m beginning to believe Howard when he says that the Media, FA, Referees, Pundits and every one else are targeting Arsenal because we don’t promote or have English players. Although, it may be true…..It is so pathetic from England.
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I posted this question yesterday, Ethan replied to it but I would like more opinions on it if any one interested?

“Why is it that English players are more expensive than foreign players? If you really want to promote your local boys, don’t you think you should sell them at a competitive price? Or even lower than foreign ones?

For example, the mid-class American car here is cheaper than a mid-class Honda, Mazda, Toyota etc., this way the local car is more affordable than a foreign made car. That makes sense.”

Ethan, as a follow up to your reply most of the foreign car brands I mentioned above are made in the USA and not imported from Japan. It takes about 6 months for a foreign player to acclimate himself to English weather, and most of the European ones have similar environments, so I don’t think an English player have that much advantage over a foreign one when it comes to environment, plus foreign players have more technical abilities, talents that English players don’t have and take twice as much time to teach them.

G4E

ah poor william,lets all feel sorry for him.
the guy is a disgrace of our club,we need a strong leader and for awhile this season he was,people question him for what happend at the birmingham game but i put that down to a emotional day.
but since then he has acted like a spoilt child.
because since that game i have seen no heart and no desire from this guy,he’s all talk and no action at the moment.
the way in which he played at chelski was by far the worst display i have seen from arsenal player this season.
i mean he might aswell had a blue shirt on the way he let dider dogbreath walk all over him,would tony adams have lost have of those balls in the air,would patrick have lost half of those 50/50 tackles.
what im trying to say here is that arsenal lack a real leader,someone whose gonna grab this talented team by the bollox and show them the way.
i still belive arsenal have one of the best teams we have everhad,i just think we need a real leader someone the players could really respect not someone who crys and slags players off

G4E

Why is it that English players are more expensive than foreign players?

It is not just in this country that native players are dearer, it is the same in most countries. The reason? Economics - Scarce Resources demand a higher price because the cost base of the purchaser can be estimated and the selling clubs know the markets well.

If you really want to promote your local boys, don’t you think you should sell them at a competitive price? Or even lower than foreign ones?

Therein lies the rub. Cost bases for English Clubs are so high that they know they have to sell for higher than expected values to recoup losses made elsewhere.

English clubs do not care about English football outside of their own sphere. They are worried about how rules might impact them but ultimately, their attitude is “Sod you Jack, I’m alright”.

The question you pose could be asked a different way - what incentive is there for English clubs to promote English talent other than the money they will make from transfer fees? It is a vicious circle because if England won or did well in a tournament, there would be a clamour for native players and the issue be taken more seriously.

As it is, more technically capable players can be scouted at a young age and relocated to the UK to work through the Academies. Theoretically, this should raise standards of English players and improve quality of those that come through although there is no evidence yet that this is the case.

The FA need to take charge but despite their well meaning intentions, no-one has confidence in them to do so. Still it is good to see that the FA are not the only incompetent bunglers with the RFEF being told to knock down their HQ by the Spanish courts as it was built illegally.

YW

As mentioned earlier Gallas often has the team together during the warm up, nobody mentioned it as phoney after the Milan game, why it was inspirational! We must not get upset by the press - lets just hope it gived motivation to the team.

Sent an email to the FA regarding all of the officiating mistakes recently received by Arsenal and had a resonse yesterday that they will respond in the next 10 days! I just wonder if now Arsenal are considered out of the tirle race, Chelsea or United will start to get iffy decisions, could it be another betting scandal or worse or am I just looking for excuses? I know the team have not played to their usual standards recently, but these decisions have genuinely cost enough points to leave us adrift. It doesn’t happen to United because the officials are petrified of upseting Fergie and the FA also bow and scrape to him- what other manager would get away with calling the ref a cheat?

Would also like to comment that I hope Arsenal spend some money in the next transfer window to give the squad some depth. If they do not, having made a profit on transfers last summer, if they then try to put season ticket prices up I am sure I will not be alone in being very unhappy. The money is available now and we pay quite enough for our seats.

Yes G4E
yogi sort of outlined the same reasons as myself
supply Vs demand .. I suppose its like theo walcott .
and john smith .. when clubs like arsenal and spurs and who ever else was interested in him you tend to add a zero or even 2!.. but there are still john smiths out there who are getting transfered to welling united for 1 k .. The English talent that is TALENTED is a limited commodity . Hence you pay more for it .. and its local media hype that helps also .. Stuff like is walcott leaving his club to go to arsenal ??? rumors arsenal are leading the chase .. all this hype puts dollars on the move ..
why because the selling club can ! … its a bidding war most times …

But thats not to say that torres or ben arfa are worth nothing either!!! I think darren bent and the 16 million price tag has done nothing to help this stigma .. But with torres worth 27 mil he wasn’t exactly cheap .. and with cesc worth a packet now
you could argue promising Spanish youth doesn’t come cheap either ..

Yes some players are over rated price tag wise .. and if you looked at cesc’s last 10 games ‘only’ before you were going to buy him , you would also say the price tag is over rated .. for the media hype that surrounds him …

Obviously the buyer at some point saw something in the player to pay that much (bent)

provided all buyers are of similar astutes

I dont think we are out of the title race but we need to definitely WIN the next 5 games in a row to put some pressure back on the man ‘ure boys ..

The topic of discussion should be HOW ?
You know i think the gallas problem will sort itself out,
i also think that this NAMELESS players representative is someone like cesc who is probably eying the position himself .. It happens at work , and on blogs :)
So gallas isnt Mister popular .. so what? when your paid that much to do a job every week personality is OPTIONAL !

Yogi’s Warrior.
I happen to be French and have read the original piece in L’Equipe and the ‘no mates’ quote is an piece of absolute shit-stirring garbage.
The question Gallas was asked was about players in the England team, of which Walcott is the only Arsenal-based, and understandably not the closest to Gallas, partly because of the generation gap, as Gallas points out. And that is all.

So, not for the first time, a Daily Mail fabrication.
Pure bollocks.

Ollie. I am going to France this summer. How do you say “pure bollocks” in French.

bernard

boul …

would cover it !

http://arseblog.com/WP/2008/03/26/more-on-gallas-gilberto-clichy-kuzmanovic-who/

As for this story about Gallas not having any friends at Arsenal - it’s a complete stitch up by the Daily Mail, apparently. He was asked about England players, not friends, hence his remarks.

well said Ollie, was just about to say something similar. Needless to say that Gallas, as captain, would never come out and say to the media that he does not have any friends at Arsenal even if it were true.

Good English players are a scarce resource. the top teams all want English players and to be good enough to play in those teams you literally have to be one of the top 15 English players (ignoring some of the fringe/squad players that is). so 15 men can be considered a scarce resource and when you have bottomless pit chelsea and super spenders man u competing for those players you can see why prices are pushed up so high for the decent english players.
I am not sure why someone like Darren Bent was that much. I think Spurs did pay too much for him, I mean who else wanted him?

English players that move between lower divisions and poor prem clubs dont go for all that much in comparison.

I am still interested to see if Capello, who is a good manager, can get England to play as a cohesive unit. I mean there can be no question that the 15 main England players are good players. they play every week at the highest level in the toughest league in the world and are impressive consistently. they cannot be bad players. but get them all together and its clear how much they miss the contrasting styles of the foreign players around them. the mix of English and foreign is partly what makes the current top 2 so strong.
so can Capello get an England 11 to play in a way that uses their strengths? I think he has more chance than many but if he cant do it then no one can.

Lets face it many of our second stringers have not improved this season, Djouru, Traore, Denilson, Diably, plus Walcott, Bentdner, are marginally better, and Ebuoe is inconsistent compared with Manu who have Nani, Anderson. Tevez, and Hargreaves to come off the bench. Our only pluses are Sagna, EDS, and Song. Thats why this squad needs strengthening, it was pathetic against Manu with Hoyte and Traore as a combination, that s what we have in reserve, and all Wenger says is we have great spirit, and he believes in them.
Part of the fault is Wenger didnt give these alleged miracle youngsters enough playing time and they stagnate, if they are not good enough to rotate then get rid of them, give Song a chance at centre back or to rotate Cesc or Flamini, and all this crap about youngsters is not valid MAnu average was only 2 years more than ours.

sol, you are 100% correct, they will not get enough game time to get them to the level we need them to be. get rid of of half them and bring players that can be rotated without materially affecting the team. if you look at the two biggest successes in the past few years cesc and clichy both were allowed to play week in week out due to cole and PV leaving. No other young player has had that opportunity and thus senderos, djourou, diaby, denilson, bentdner, walcott, hoyte, traore and song, have been unable to make that big step required to become a “regular ” first team player. Wenger is so stuck with the 1st team that players like eboue however rubbish he is every week is still playing EVERY game.

we can not bring them all through at the same time and still be successful full stop.

look at our youngsters like Walcott, Diaby, Djourou and Denilson and you will see that all of them have spent a long time on the treatment table this season. either long lay offs or regular short injuries. they can really have a big impact on your season. hopefully they wont have those injury problems in the future. but it could be that they are injury prone. Injury prone players are the worst kind to have. it prevents the team finding a rhythm when its best players come in for 2 or 3 games then disappear again.

First team injuries are also hurting us badly. the big ones of course are Eduardo, Rosicky and RVP but they have been several other significant injuries that have only served to break up a winning run, such as Toure and Fabregas.

as for the gallas, i think up to the birmingham game he was doing a good job, obviously we have seen a bit of melt down since then. In my opinion the captain should be “arsenal” through and through and Gallas to me will never really be an arsenal man, rather than someone who plays for arsenal. we lack leadership throughout the team and therefore to blame him for the team’s melt down i think is unfair.

gazzap, they are all fit now, we are at the business end of the season, the first team players look mentally and physically shot, we are in the worst run in 9 years and yet wenger still doesn’t play them, that should tell you all you need to know about what he really thinks about them.

Gazzap dont you think Song should be given his chance now,? he played well for the reserves last night and should feature against Bolton, I think Diably may be injury prone since his dreadful injury and also hes not a left winger.RVP and Rosicky have never had a full season and are injury prone. traore hasnt been injured he just has lost his defensive ability and he gets 15k a week for doing very little.

Dan whatever we say makes no difference Wenger is impregnable at Arsenal and its a dictatorship, with Dein around there was someone for him to consult with but not now.Wenger is the best spin doctor in football and a great coach BUT his stubborness in using players after they are over the top like Gilberto, and buying 17 year olds has cost us this season.

correct, clearly no one is listening to us!!!!!!!
i think we will see a much weakened team on saturday, but not song, he will not play him in front of gilberto it is too disrespectful to gilberto. (correctly so in my opinion)

Dan

gallas is uncontrollable ! controversy at chelsea and controversy here before we made him captain . Now
we aren’t top of the table… time to start again . He wants to be a winner and thats fine .. But i think if you take the captaincy away from him , we will be in for a world of pain .. the proverbial loose cannon , if you excuse the pun !
He’s slowing down a bit .. and definitely not perfect but if he gets in the right state of mind he can be solid ! Im sure all this banter will quiet down eventually , i wouldn’t pay much attention too it .. The pundits are looking to hang someone out to dry , but the real problem is as we know .
GOALS! or lack of …

blame the midfield ,blame the defense ..
which my response is warm…. cold … colder ..freezing ..

I just find it ridiculous how Gallas has become our latest villain, demonized and villified all over the place now. In the media, among rival fans and among some gooners. I think the reaction to Gallas’ actions in the Birmingham game has been WAY over the top. I simply cannot get outraged by what he did at Birmingham. Like I’ve said before on this blog, maybe it’s because I’m from Brazil, I don’t know. Certainly his reaction was emotional but SO WHAT? What is this absolute hysteria over a captain momentarily getting emotional about a horrible day? No, it wasn’t a great moment for him, ok, it was temporary, move on.

I didn’t like Wenger choosing Gallas as captain over Gilberto but for the most part, it’s worked out. Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t this the first time out for Gallas as captain of any team? If so, he’s been on a learning curve too in the position. I do have criticisms of him, esp. of his performance at Chelsea. And I wish he wouldn’t make comments to the press like the ones he made about Theo. But I’d still prefer Gallas to the likes of John Terry.

We’re not privy to the player’s thoughts on the subject of course, but from my perspective as a fan and with the benefit of hindsight, Gallas was the wrong choice as captain. He doesn’t inspire me when I hear him speak. He seems to lack the requisite single-mindedness and strength of character and doesn’t appear to inspire others either by his words or deeds.
What he did at Birmingham was inexcusable for the captain of Arsenal. Sure, he was frustrated - we all were- but the captain, at times like this, should lead by example, not stage a one man protest like a spoilt child.
I am not jumping on any bandwagon here, nor looking for a scapegoat after Sunday’s latest disappointment. On form, he is a great player and an asset to any side, but captain? No!
I hope Arsene picks a new captain next season - Flamini would me my choice.

Dan

You’ve lost me on that one. Surely respect has nothing to do with team selection; it is based on form? Song might be a better fit into the style of play than Gilberto who might be a better fit in terms of experience.

In any case, if you are being disrespectful to Gilberto by playing someone else, the opposite holds true with for example, Song being disrespected by playing Gilberto purely on the basis of respect.

Confused? You will be…

YW

YW, i realized i added a sentence before the bit that said i agreed. what i agreed to was playing a second team on saturday, not playing gilberto because of seniority which is what i think he will do. hope that clears. in my mind gilberto should never play again for us. he was wonderful but is completely finished. everyone including him and wenger know he is leaving.

I have always thought the players should be picked on the basis of whichever 11 players give Arsenal the best chance of winning the game on that day. If that means song should be picked ahead of gilberto then so be it. all this respect for elders stuff is crap. Football is not about age, its about winning games.
wenger is not ruthless enough sometimes. If fergie had felt Senderos was playing better than Toure he would have kept his place and there would have been no argument. Wenger bows to established players even when they are showing very poor form.
I agree with the comments that how can we expect our collection of teenagers to turn into world stars when they play about 10 games a year? I think the Reserve league needs to be expanded so they are playing more or less each week rather than every fortnight.

NY marcus

couldnt say it better myself ..
and we will move on from this !
the media just needs a scape goat for arsenals demise at the top of the leader board , in my opinion its misguided , the trouble lays down the other end of the pitch and certainly if we had been winning and scoring more , there would be no comments on gallas to make …

G4E

Why is it that English players are more expensive than foreign players?

Wenger spoke about this recently, it’s actually very simple.

His take was that you pay more because English players don’t have to make any cultural changes to play here.

When you sign a foriegn player there is a greater risk that he may not be able to settle in this country (Reyes, anyone?).

English players=Less risk

Less risk=More money

Love the site Yogi, keep up the good work!!

Ethan, you started talking about snow, rain and cars stalling in English weather and stuff like that buddy. :)

I’ll give credit for saying English players are scarce comodity though :)

===

Thanks for the response YW.

So Wenger is really kind of damned if you do, damned if you don’t. He pays 5 Millions could raise up to 12 in 16 years old Walcott, people say he is crazy. He refuse to pay 16-20 million for Bent or SWP, he is still crazy.

There is not enough good English players, what should we do other than what we are doing? We have Walcott who’s about 2 years away for becoming really something, plus a few English players in the reserves that might make it to the 1st team, or might not.

The reason Arsenal had many English players in the 90s is because English football was not that open wide for foreigners and English players were not “Scarce” and over priced. Now to make the EPL the number one league, and earn all the money they’re earning, they unbalanced the system and then blame it on foreigners.

I say f*ck that, I’m with Wenger and his foreign policy. We can buy young English players, if they make it fine, if they don’t too bad.

watever u say…i am feeling kinda bored by our midfield…..it doesnt look pacy enf…fabregas was never pacy….he is v v intelligent…english players r all sh** and so is media…it seems fans r learning from media….hey ethan…i wonder if u r in “ade hate” mass communication?? :D

CAN SOMEONE TELL ME HOW ROSICKY GETS CALLED UP FOR A FRIENDLY THIS WEEK?????

I can only think NYmarcus its because the management dont want to leave him out.
He is only there to keep dressing room morale up. (we hope)

Yes, just like Eduardo is going to Euro 2008
(Not sure if that was approved by Arsenal yet).

Hleb scores with his national team, how nice is that? Wish that goal came against Chel$ki :)

“Why is it that English players are more expensive than foreign players? If you really want to promote your local boys, don’t you think you should sell them at a competitive price? Or even lower than foreign ones?

For example, the mid-class American car here is cheaper than a mid-class Honda, Mazda, Toyota etc., this way the local car is more affordable than a foreign made car. That makes sense.”

Thats a very interesting point G4E, and I am glad Yogi picked up on it already

I would pick up on the car point G4E makes and apply it almost in reverse to the home grown players we have here.

As far as I am aware the American car market has long, long been protected by what may well be described as anti-competitive practice - in this case import tariffs on foreign vehicles that distort their relative cost disproportionately to their actual value.

The American labour market has long been heavily unionised, the result of a unionised workforce tends to be higher wages, resistance to technological advance for fear of job losses and as a result some would argue lower productivity. The result is a mid level American car costs in excess of the production cost of a Japanese or European car.

Clearly, if Japanese car manufacturers are allowed to import their cars and sell them at their true cost then nobody would buy American cars. American manufacturers would go out of business, people would lose their jobs and the economy would go down the toilet (worse than it is) Hence heavy import tax is imposed on foreign vehicles which is also good long term for foreign manufacturers since it increases the esteem value of their product by making it seem more luxurious.

In short American manufacturing in comparison to its Far Eastern brothers is wholly inefficient and is propped up by protectionist tariffs.

A good example in comparison is the UK, another country with a previously heavily unionised manufacturing industry. Except in the UK we (or rather Thatcher) embraced a full on free market system and did not impose tariffs in the same way as the US. Result? An inefficient manufacturing sector undercut by foreign imports - therefore we no longer manufacture anything in the UK, but we have a service economy in its place.

Now, applying this to football; we can impose quotas that would take the place of trade tariffs which would encourage clubs, presumably, to increase their efforts at home developed players of a higher quality. But as Yogi has already pointed out, top players are a scarce resource.

Thus reducing the availability of cheaper high quality products/players is not going to have a corresponding reduction in the cost of home grown players, rather the reverse because there will be even fewer top quality players available!

The only way to decrease the price of home grown players is to increase supply and have so many top notch home grown players that supply outstrips demand and prices fall. However, this can’t happen in football because unlike cars we cannot just increase the quality of our product as we have a finite talent pool.

The only solution as far as I can see is to clone Arsene Wenger a thousand times and have them train the countries youngsters. That or change the entire ethos surrounding football in this country - but that won’t happen because we love our 100 mile an hour game so much! Catch 22.

Apologies for tedious nature of this post but the subject matter really interested me!

p.s I’m sorry about your manufacturing sector to all of you guys in the US, take my advice dump your dollars and get into the reserve currency of increasing choice - the EURO! (Or gold… ;)

NYmarcus

the reason we are all getting on gallas’s back is because since he threw his hissy fit we aint won a game!! it was a keegan moment and it lost us the psycological battle.

you cant defend him, he should of shown some bravery in adversity! i know it was an emotional afternnoon but he should never have acted the way he did!! he might aswell of said there and then we have lost the title! and so it has proved.

Hey JK, thanks on the economics class mate :) very interesting as much as the question I guess.

I wanted to bring the subject of Local vs. Import. Especially that it proves, it’s not really Wenger or Arsenal’s problem. It’s an England problem and they need to resolve it themselves, not blame it on somebody else. If you don’t have the base and the rules to supply all your clubs with top English players at good prices, don’t come to me crying. (It’s all about the money, and why blame Arsenal for wanting to use their money wisely?).

In the past few years we didn’t have the money to spend $20 - 30 million on a top class English player (For the fun of it) when we can buy at least 4 for the same amount of money from abroad. I don’t think Wenger will ever spend more than 10 - 12 million on any player, even if he was from another planet not just from England.

G4E

Just watched the France v England game. I am glad their are alot of foreign players in the prem league now, because otherwise, I would have to watch all those “good” english players all the time. God they never had a clue how to attack without the long ball. Pure dross.

why the f*** did we not sign ribery!!

i dont think i have been more gutted about the non signing of a player!!! for £15m i think thats a steal!!

dukeGoonem, what makes you think Ribery wanted to play in England or play for Arsenal? Also you need to see more than one good or bad game before you can judge a player’s overall ability and whether they will fit with the team’s style of play.

I have’t watched the game as I’m still at work, but it sound like England played a crappy game, and maybe that’s why Ribery looked good?

Also Like Passenal said, not all players want to play in England or for Arsenal. Maybe his dream was to play for B. Munich?

passenal

im not only talking about tonights game! i have seen some bayern munich games aswell and he looks very good! he has been one of france’s best players and he is class! and he was close to signing for us but he changed agent and the new agent wanted a bigger transfer fee! it was only because of money that he didnt come!

do you not think he would suit our play? he would fit in like a pair of mittens!!

I see, so the new agent wanted to manipulate us for more money and we should’ve give in

no im not saying that G4E. what im saying is i am just gutted we never got him!

Got it Duke, we missed on many good players man. Don’t worry we will get better than him (Hopefully) :)

G4E

I wish i was at work instead of watching that game tonight!

i seriously dont think there is any hope for the england team, the players just dont look like they can be arsed with it, it’s almost like a chore for them! utter bol***ks. or maybe they are just sh**e

It just shows how bad the game was when Duke wishes he had been working instead. :)

Yes G4E
my car analogy was based off of what wenger said
and to suit your example of American cars or whatever …

Wenger spoke about this recently, it’s actually very simple.

His take was that you pay more because English players don’t have to make any cultural changes(snow, rain , climatic conditions) to play here.

When you sign a foriegn player there is a greater risk that he may not be able to settle in this country (Reyes,baptista). hence the Japanese toyota not working well in the USA !
kar-pish ?

English players=Less risk

Less risk=More money

Plus i believe the media who like to be on top of transfer news don’t help ! you know the English press !

YES pas you knob !

He has looked good all season in germany (ribery), wenger also tapped him up like he did to ben arfa 2 days ago , and he definitely didn’t seem angered by the prospect of joining arsene and arsenal ! So i agree with duke ! Also you have a go at me ! then you carry on like a know it all 2 year old ! He’s all class and much needed currently .. he would be a breathe of fresh air just like sagna is to the back !!

very nice posts josef and G4E…really interesting..

Ethan I hate to keep arguing with you, you made a good point.

But to your knowledge, Japanese cars are doing much much better than American cars in America and have a much better re-sale value. I own an American car, I wish I didn’t, although I would love to support anything American.

Bringing the car thing as an example maybe was not the right comparison, but all I meant was the concept of competeing imported vs. local.

Thank you for your input in replying to the question. :)

- Competeing
+ Competing

japanese-korean-asian-european.. regardless my point is exactly what you just said !

Japanese or imported cars (players) cost less
and are more subjected to criticism (like you just did)
compared with your local cars . (or english players)

And like you also just pointed out , you would rather buy locally any day ,dont you think some managers are the same..?!… you answered your own question and ‘you’ stated the banter of cars in relation to Uk players.. I was just trying to relate to your example .maybe effectively or ineffectively as it might of sounded …

It all comes down to cost , and thats probably the reason why Japanese cars or imported players are chosen over the American cars (uk players). GENERALLY as the EPL and the FA are stating .

And id even hazard a guess that local USA made cars are more expensive than imports …

that is the exact same principal , and why UK players cost more ..

Ethan, you got my point totally wrong. I think you mixed up everything again to the point that I don’t think you even read my post at all?

Japanese cars imported in USA (foreign players) are much better than American cars (Local). They’re not open for criticism, they have a better value and the difference is they’re more expensive than American cars (local players). This, makes American cars (local players) more affordable but not better than Imported cars (Foreign players).

So that proves, imported players are better price & value. English “good” players are more expensive because they are Scarce. England need to generate more good players for the price to be more affordable and competitive.

I think I got the answer to my question from Yogi & JK………So thanks mate.

Let’s move on to what happened to England vs. France (imported?)

yawwwwwwwwwnnnnn

english players crap……..
the only reasonable play from them comes from..as they thmselves wud say..”gud old flank play” or “toughen it up” “get in thr”….nnnoooooooooo craft watsover…rooney mayb…but nahhhhhh no one else comes close to playing football they just play a part in the game.

ethan shut up mate, we all know wat u think (tell us how u think wat u think).

not much happened there either ..
just a penalty separating the 2 sides ..
Rooney ineffective as ever and the 45 minutes a game limit that sir alex probably imposed as well as players for chevski ensured that we had to make changes that cost us ..Ferdinand is a good defender but didn’t Marshall the troops..
All in all a pointless exercise .

WTF is your problem sagna fan ??

get a life ..

G4E

So that proves, imported players are better price & value. English “good” players are more expensive because they are Scarce.

thats what i said on my 1st post to you !!!
i thought we’d past that issue !?

great, thanks Ethan.

peace…

really wtf is ur problem sagna_fan…y dont u just keep yawning..thts wat u do best.

These friendlies are so dreadful. I support Brazil of course and always watch their games. But it’s gotten to the point where I watch their games almost as some kind of patriotic obligation because that display v. Sweden was absolutely DREADFUL!!!!! What a lousy game!! BLECCH!!!

The England-France game was also pretty forgettable, tho I found it less dreadful than the one at the Emirates only because I felt the French players did better than Brazil’s. England were thoroughly outclassed by a France squad without some of their regulars.

And I really strongly disagree with anyone who underrates Ribery. I’ve watch the guy since his first days at Marseille. At Bayern this season he’s been absolute MAGIC! It is simply a joy to watch him. You should see how the Germans have taken to him. Bayern are hated throughout Germany but the Germans this season, incl. rival fans, can’t say enuf about Ribery and Toni.

Could he make it in England? I don’t know. I think I’d prefer that he stay out of England because I’d be terrified to see what cloggers like Taylor would do to him.

BTW, here’s the int’l wrap-up for our players, according to the official website:

RVP, Bendtner (who scored), Cesc, Gallas, Gilberto and Hleb all played a full 90 mins.

Senderos played for 74 mins.

Eboue and Kolo also played but they give no info on how long they played.

Fabianski, Theo, Clichy and Flamini did not play.

Lehmann kept a clean sheet in a 4-0 thrashing of Switzerland.

Ribery wanted to join us .. obviously Wenger was 2 stingy to splash out the dosh .. rather buy 2 Rosicky and Hleb’s for the price of one decent player.. same old same old

Ethan just copied and pasted my response to G4Es question into his own post!

Look at 3.43 and 12.42.

Hey Ethan, I don’t mind you quoting me but don’t try to pass it off as yourself!!

England last night were dire. I was gutted at the time not to see Theo play but with hindsight at least he didn’t play and get injured. We (Engalnd)seem so one dimensional, we could have played France for a week and not scored, there is just no creativity in the team.

Also how good was Bentley… I’m sure we are all gutted about losing him after barn storming performances like that!!

PS It was Hleb’s brother that scored for Belarus last night.

Jonny1leg, thanks for the heads up. Yet another “skill” from Ethan the Goon. :)

He is full of skills this guy…right Ethan?

Jonny thanks #2 for the Helb clarification. I didn’t watch any of the internationals (A blessing I guess?)

Maybe we should buy Hleb’s brother? :)

No probs G4e :)

You definitely did well to avoid the England game…

Re: Vyaacheslav Hleb, We’ll have to beat off Heart of Midlothian to get him…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vyacheslav_Hleb :P

jonny1leg

IT WAS WHAT ARSENE QUOTED NOT YOU !
(AND AT TRANSFER WINDOW TIME )

AND IT SAVED ME RE-TYPING IT
I DIDNT KNOW YOU HAD A PATIENT PENDING …
ALSO IT WAS FOR G4E !

Sagna is out for 3 weeks — no Liverpool games or the United game.

What tiny shred of hope I had left has gone now.

sorry brain dead questions needed to be fast tracked!

and i presume the skills your talking about is cut and paste ?

didnt green day write a song about you G4E?

Now Sagna is out Kolo should go back to RB and Song come in at CB giving us a bit more height and speed, at least try it against Bolton. The other choices of Hoyte or Ebuoe are not that great.

what fukking hope .. season is toasted m8
we blew it again .. beware feb/march .. its not as if this is a first
with Wenger’s stingyness, we always get fukked in the run-ins .. no squad, no trophy, yet shiit football the last 10 home games and highest tickets prices .. but we should all be reassured, we are still in transition, or are we??

sol .. Eboue is a decent right back .. whether you like him or not .. leave the fukking team alone with Song/Bong/Gong etc .. aint gonna work .. lets replay the Eboue/Hleb axe as when we achieved the CL final 2 years ago .. Toure’s form is indifferent at best .. no need to put him in a position he knows fukk all about
also benitez will play Crouch against us .. so thats LFC 2 up already from headers as neither Toure nor gallas will cope with it ..
we need ugly arrogant Adebayor to score and if I hear that fukking moron song one more time, I swear I’ll fukking hit somebody at the ground

BB

more like recession :)
You know it does amaze me that for what everyone says about wenger ,master tactician etc..
And then he can be so naive to think injuries wont happen AT ALL , and plan ahead by getting more recruits at the jan transfer window ..IT Wasn’t enough that we had people missing due to the ACN and diarra just left .. with RVP injured and rosicky …

I think we have only wenger to blame really !

Easy Ethan… I’m not having a go at you mate.

I put what Arsene said in my own words and you lifted it verbatum.

Fair enough and I’m glad that you agree but you could at least say “as said above” or whatever.

I dont have my words pateneted but I’m not talking legality just a bit of civility, that’s all.

Why not just admit to lifting the post and say you agreed with what I wrote?

Why come out on the attack?

ethan .. and then he goes on tv and prides himself that he could have resigned Anelka who had “a point to prove” yet prefers not to .. only to go 5 games without a win , ie worst run in 9 years
add to that the 5-1 and 4-0 demolitions by our greatest rivals and you have a top season .. plus homegames that have become a total bore ever since the Prague game .. and please dont forget the 70 quid you got to splash out on tickets
its all wonderful, isnt it??

and Sagna’s injury is exactly the reason why we need Eboue at the club .. guess what happens if Clichy gets injured .. are we gonna play Traore??
or should we rather play Hoyte as a replacement to Sagna.. lets wake up guys ..

jonny 1 leg
Why come out on the attack?

i think that was you .. !
so your saying i should credit you , for copying what wenger said ? oh please …
and i didn’t copy you verbatim i added some bracketed examples . Get a life moron !

BB
i hear ya !
he also came out after the C.C game and said he could of signed berbatov too !

but instead we get ade and diaby !
he’s on a hiding to nothing stating BS stories like that .. It only points out he aint got a clue of what he’s doing !
Its getting depressing , it wouldn’t be so depressing if i wasn’t right about it ..
I wrote 4-5 months ago we were like a young horse in a major race who bolts from the blocks only to be passed in the final 100 yards ..

If i saw it why couldn’t he ??
You know its not like if he buys some players this season ,they would be worth nothing next season .. Infact i think its too his advantage to do so ..
If they dont fit in he’s made some profits within 6 months .. If they do fit in he sells the rejects.

Brain dead questions? Or “dead brain lazy answers” copied from other people?

The “skills” I meant were metaphor for something else.

Even your copy and paste skills need some working on. Like adding “Quoted from” ?

Sorry mates the cork i put in my a&& couple of days ago came off and now i’m talking from my a&& again.

please don’t read my posts until i get the cork back in again

i’ll send a note when i’m ready

I was trying to be nice Ethan!

I didn’t quote Wenger, I put his point into my own words which you took as your own.

In my post I actually say “Wenger spoke about this recently” I didn’t try to pass his idea off as my own.

eg: Wenger didn’t say

English players=Less risk

Less risk=More money

I just took a point that he made and condensed it to make it suitable to be easily and quickly digested on a forum.

You on the other hand took my words and put them forward as your own.

I don’t want to get into a row about this, it’s stupid, but surely you can’t deny copying and pasting my reply?

I haven’t at any stage attacked you so please don’t call me a moron, you don’t even know me.

Apologies to everyone else, I know that this is tiresome but I can’t stand it when people attack me just to save face.

Any back up from people would be very appreciated :P

I feel like I’m going mad…

Jonny, don’t worry about it man. take it this way:

“Ethan” is the price to pay for being a member of Yogi’s great blog.

Cheers G4E, as long as I know it’s not just me…

Oh no, I don’t know the exact numbers but it’s like 1.5 million of us and counting.

if you have the time, I recommend using the Monthly Archives to get an idea.

jonny, you can’t win wit ethan, he is thoroughly incapable of understanding people’s intent. clearly you weren’t attacking him, you were challenging him in a very civil manner, but the only way he knows how to respond is to attack and assume you’re attacking him. there’s no way to engage with him unless you’re in complete agreement with him.

Wow Ethan looks like you have surpassed yourself this time dude…

PS Flamini is defo off that doesn’t bode well for next year.

hhhhhmmm

sagna out for three weeks!!! i think i might f*** off on holiday. I cant stand the pain of getting knocked out of the cl by the scouse to add to the eliminations at the hands of the mancs the yids and chelsea upending our title hopes!! great season!!

Silver Gunner where did you get the info on Flamini leaving?

The injury gods seem to be conspiring against us this season. Everytime we get players fit others get injured. Now we can look forward to Eboue at RB again. I wonder about our medical staff (Gary Lewin aside) as they seem incapable of curing our players of their ills without months on the sick.

jonny1leg

if you bother to look at my very 1st post i said
less risk of the player settling hence more money !!!!!

I said it before you .. and basically every other comment you made ! i just couldnt be bothered going back to the day BEFORE you said it .. to re-write it for the brain dead !!!

its that simple and stop using my nic you fags
By: ethan_goon on March 27, 2008
at 5:29 pm

yogi i want confirmation by I.P who this g#t is so i can abuse him properly

silver gunner

nar man i do a lot of charity work for the retarded
im always prepared to LIFT to new heights !

steve

come on man !
think about it you know arsene and wages…
think about it … kill off all the invincible’s because they earn too much , then flamini holds out for more cash , and parity with cesc .I had this discussion with pat 5 months ago !
. Theres always a HUGE chance that flamini wont re-sign !!
in fact id say AC milan are favorites just due to the fact that WE wont splash the cash and they will !
If you become a free agent some clubs will give you a nice big one off fee for joining them !
then PLUS HIGHER WAGES ! i think at the end of the day , like most of us the money talks ..

Plus we are as weak as puss again this season ..
so i would say it could go either way currently

Ethan no matter what your thoughts on Wenger’s attitude to buying you cannot dispute our injury list has been awful this season. I agree with you on some aspects as to squad strength but with a fit squad (like manure) we would have done better.

Having said that with the players gaining experience (and a few additions in the summer) I think we are a force to be reckoned with.

“Plus we are as weak as puss again this season ..
so i would say it could go either way currently”

How can you say that after you forecast spuds would take our 4th place.

steve
do i have to keep stating i said that AFTER th14 left and wenger said we were NOT going to buy anyone in the transfer window pre season unless he found the correct player for the team to make a difference, he said he was NOT going to add to the team just for the hell of it !!!
At that point i stated my disgust ! and said if we dont replace TH14 we wont even qualify next season ! Look thru the archive if you want to keep mis-quoting me !

weakening our team further .

after that period we got dudu sagna and diarra
plus who knew flamini would of came good ! most of you then were calling for flamini’s head at that time so get your facts straight !!

So think back to then on what 90% of you said also !
But as for spurs , they have beaten chevski in the C.C and drew with them 4 all recently. and nearly beat them !
if it wasnt for martin jol they would be giving liverpool problems this season and possibly us also ! !

and remember the last time we played them they kicked our butts ! so i wasnt too far off the pace !

and i think none of us can discount them next season ! give credit , where credit is due !
Ramos has made them a team to be recond with
in just half a season ! NOT 3 YEARS !!

and steve

our injury problems where the same last year!!! with all the same excuses!, RVP out TH 14 OUT. etc.

If this hasn’t proved my theory correct that our squad lacks depth then what has?

please enlighten me !!!

as you dont hear these sorts of problems with chelsea or man U this season !

as man U smartly learned from last season , by strengthening there squad this season . Also it gives them the ability to compete for all trophies without loosing depth in there squad .
a point that needs to be learned by wenger !

We are having trouble just competing in the title race currently .. Our problems will start coming thick and fast when we pick up more injuries by still being in the C.L race

Also remember who won the EPL last season ?
remember that Man ‘ure had to recruit larrson because of there injury worries …

They really had the depth last season , and they still got several top class additions in july.. That is what we are up against .. We all can see it !

We need a few instant fixes , i don’t doubt that wenger sees ability in all our players , but when is this potential going to turn into production .

It really is a hit and miss mentality ..
And to compare this squad to the invincible’s is just sacrilege! the invincible’s set many records but a 9 game low loosing streak wasn’t one of them !

finally i think i ethan u r hitting the same note as me…finally u came over ade hate campaign and lack of squad depth is just too much apparent to go unnoticed isnt it…all i have been saying and so been others.

the point is….c as an english club u dont get enf young breed of talent rite from the streets..and i doubt our scouting (or even any english club) takes the difficult task in hand to find talent from streets, from schools etc…we and a lot many of english clubs resort to buying players from other clubs’ youth academy…..and wenger and his scouts are very gud(not the best) at spotting talent….

now comes the funnier part….so wats the difference between buying players who are raw talent and very young and those who are established stars????
2 things…
money and risk..always paired..and a bit of more fame to wenger’s already touted capabilities.

young unproven players..high risk ..low cost and add to it the unrest among them to shine asap…makes them easy target…
established stars…low risk…high cost…big responsibilities…on both manager and player to perform at his already known level…

Arsenal run on first case..and have been hugely successfull..
Manu success with the 2nd case….

Please dont compare Arsenal as a club to Manu.Huge differences…Once we start buying players as they do…there wont be “The Arsenal”..

And for ur much needed trophies my dear ethan…they have come with our philosophy in the past…and i dont c any reason y they wont come in the future as well….

U tell that to people who are spending 50 quid a game to see an under 23 team battle against the likes of Man U . and you have to TRY and compare us to man U , because there in the spot where we want to be..

Is their 2 G4E’s ?

if so which one are you ?
i only kept up the ade campaign because you wouldn’t admit your wrong about him ! I still have the same stance on him but you obviously know if you ‘talk him up’ at the moment you will get shot down ! Because he lacks the class to front arsenal !
He lacks everything .. sure he can score goals but he gives as many away in possession lost !And he needs to camp in the 6 yard box to do so ! If he passed off a bit more who knows who else could of made a name for themselves !

But yes you must be the other G4E the new one or you would of understood that ive been on this issue for over 1 season now !!!

the spat fight with ade was from your evil twin . and nacho , who now have both been silenced .

and THE ARSENAL as we remember it when we all had glory and silverware was full of superstars and international players ! We only went this way for the past few years because the stadium killed us and our spending capabilities !

But those times are over ! you must be a young fan to think that we buy ONLY unrecognized talent !

Silenced? We are tired of arguing with a “Wall”. Ade is doing great, and scoring more every season he played which means he is improving a lot. Only the blind can’t see it (You) also only the fool (You) says let’s take 3 penalty goals, and 3 plastic goals against derby off his tally. You will say any crazy thing to prove your fake point.

No double G4E’s, you just can’t believe or comprehend that there are people who don’t think like you. They actually have brains.

Wonder where is yours? Oh, I remember…check your post from 5:29….have you fixed that yet?

Quote from Pink Floyd
“You can hide, hide, hide……Behind paranoid eyes”.

i really dont get it…
u say i am “young fan” and u r seasoned to seeing us win with invincibles and before…u say u pay too much to watch ur team lose….i say just shut the f*** up.

if u have been following Arsenal for centuries…and get pissed off in just 2 seasons…u r not a fan in any sense of the word…

u want ur club to win trophies and money in proportion to how much u spend….i have a few choices for u..
follow..derby(ticket prices mite be much cheaper)
barnsley..(cheaper ticket prices also considering fa cup heroics…altho next season the ticket prices mite even be halved…coz they will be relegated)
join manu(man u will have to spend much more but u will savor the delite of ur team lifting the cup…as per u that is)

I consistently came close to accusing wenger(never did it like u do tho) bcoz of the state we r now…when u wer busy ade whipping….so i unfortunately wud agree on the point….but cork it up soon man…u are all over the place

You have a “One eyed view”…. Does that remind you of something?…read your post from 5:29 again corky.

You say the Invincibles were all Superstars and Internationals, who in the current team we have is not an international, first team or under 21?

They may be not superstars yet because they are young and some of them just making their way to the international teams like Clichy, Flamini etc., you don’t think these can be superstars? We made the most of the superstars you are talking about, and the future will be ours if we keep them all together and keep adding to them (Hopefully you’ll disappear for 3 years this time).

You just want them superstars overnight, you’re throwing a sissy fit because you want it now, you want it easy, no time, no hard work, you just want to buy it now….no daddy no, I want my toy now.

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