Posted by: Yogi's Warrior | October 22, 2007

The Impetuosity Of Youth

Dissension in the ranks is nothing unusual but the lack of sensationalist headlines is. Lassana Diarra gives a frank outlook on his situation which is reported untypically by The Times this morning. I have no doubt that there will be people slapping him down because of one sentence,

If I’m not playing by Christmas I may have to go somewhere else

Yet we should be used to this by now for one by-product of the squad system is that twenty five into sixteen leaves over a third of the squad not playing. Some of those are through injury but the majority of those omitted are not playing because the current incumbents are performing to expectations or even exceeding them. Diarra is remarkably honest and in some respects is backing himself into a corner. He will play against Sheffield United but to get a regular berth in the starting line-up he has to be ahead of at least two players, Gilberto and Flamini. I have no doubt that he feels he is as good, if not better, than the latter. Being selected for his country, he is entitled to have confidence in his abilities.

Diarra acknowledges that he has no right to a regular place, he will have to earn it,

For the moment, everything is going fine and I’m learning, but I cannot stay like this for ever. I’m not going to wait for a year because I changed clubs in order to play. I’m not stupid. If I come to Arsenal and my situation is the same as at Chelsea, then I should have stayed at Chelsea. If I come to Arsenal, it’s to play. In a few months, I’ll have to decide what I want to do

The first sentence is the key issue here. He is still learning; learning his trade and more importantly, the ‘Arsene’ way of playing, totally different and the antithesis of the ‘Chelsea’ way. And therein is the rub for him. He can show this in training but it is a match situation where it counts. At the moment he is denied this due to the form of others.

However, it makes you wonder what was said at the ‘recruitment interview’ he had with Arsene. I would be amazed if he was told he would go straight into the team. It seems an un-Wenger like statement; moreover, it raises the question as to whether Diarra took on board what was said to him then, presumably about taking time to adapt to the Club and style of play which is what I would assume Arsene told him but probably in a more ‘footballistic’ kind of way.

Ironically though, Flamini is the example he should follow; patience is rewarded. Flamini has that and went through the same process that Diarra is going through now. Last summer most of us would not have been surprised nor if we are honest, too disappointed if Flamini had left. Prior to this season, his flirtations with the first team had not been overly impressive, often played out of position, his best spell came at left back. His occasional filling in for Gilberto and co in the centre had shown him to be workmanlike but it seemed as if our weight of expectations were a burden on us, not him; quickly dismissed as a poor man’s version of the Brazilian but it has proven to be wrong. Not that Flamini is better than Gilberto, they are different types of holding midfielders, Gilberto more assured in his positional play, Flamini more direct in taking action.

Diarra is somewhere between the two by all accounts. I’ve only seen him properly in action twice and to be honest, the first time I was not interested in his performance, more concerned with how we played in Cardiff. The Newcastle Carling Cup tie was the first time he was watched in earnest and he performed well, controlling the midfield albeit against somewhat abject Geordie opposition. Sheffield United will be a different kettle of fish for him; they will be in his face, physically strong and sensing an opportunity to take the scalp of Arsenal, even if it is not the first team. The record books won’t show that Arsene fielded a ‘weakened’ team; just the full time score.

A final parallel with Flamini is that the majority of Diarra’s appearances at Chelsea came through being played out of position at right back,

I can’t say I hate playing right back, but I prefer to play in midfield. I want to touch the ball and pass to people. Playing right back is just running up and down.  

If ever Diarra should take heed of Flamini then that statement is it.

Interestingly, and perhaps unsurprisingly, he has more time for Avram Grant than Mourinho – ‘I know Grant well and he’s a good man who helped me when I was there’ – but the best advice he was given is some he would do well to heed now,

[Makelele] taught me to stay confident and believe that anything can happen. When you’re young, you want everything to happen very quickly, but sometimes you have to wait

This may well turn out to be true. Players in central midfield are more prone to be suspended or injured due to their involvement in each match. Diarra could play immediately after the next round of International matches if Flamini were to be suspended and Gilberto jetlagged. Anything can happen. 

’til Tomorrow.


Responses

  1. I knew this was coming. He thought he would walk into the Arsenal team. I got that distinct impression when he came in. His problem is that Arsenal does not rotate like Moaninho did and we have too many excellent players ahead of him. For Cesc’s position, if there were an injury, Rosicky and Hleb would be considered ahead of him as might be Diaby. That’s the problem with buying a Chelsea player. They have a different mentality and approach.

    I hate his arrogance in thinking he can walk into the Arsenal team. He’s yet to prove himself anywhere even for France. If he’s talking like this, what should Gilberto who is the Captain of Brazil and has won everything be saying.

    If I were him, I’d shut up and go to work. He had a chance to come to Arsenal when he went for the big bucks to Chelsea. If he’d come then he’d probably be established by now.

  2. Diarrah must have known when he joined that it would take time to break into the first team, but he should be on the bench or start aginst Prague, and he will start in CC and FA cup games and will beneeded by December, especially when weneed to give Cesc a rest, not allow him to burn out as he did in the last few games last season. Giberto has one more season with us and his place will be up for grabs, solets hope Diarrah wil be patient and show us what he can do tomorrow night,

  3. might be controversial, but Diarra is a better player than Flamini. Cesc and Diarra in the middle would be a very good pairing. gilberto’s days are numbered I feel so only flamini really stands in Diarra’s way.
    Games like Prague tomorrow should be chances to get playes such as Diarra or Bendtner involved. what did flamini do against Bolton? Did Flam have a good game against Sunderland? Not really. I dont think he can say he is an automatic first choice midfielder despite his good games earlier in the season.
    Diaby gets games on the wing and Denilson is still considered too young for anything other than CC and FAC.
    If we had to lose one of Gilberto or Diarra tomorrow, then I’d lose Gilberto and I think Wenger would as well. With his decision about Lehmann, wenger is showing a renewed sense of ruthlessness so dont expect to see any sentimentality creeping into his decisions.

  4. Solgooner and Ole I could not disagree with you more.

    What I posted on another forum:

    A lot of people say this is Gilbertos final season with us but i think Flamini is closer to the exit than he is. I know Flamini is playing very well but if we look at both Flamini and Diarra we find they are very similar with Flamini being a bit more Kamikaze going forward but Diarra being better defensively. Both can actually distribute the ball pretty well. So yeah, I agree Arsenal might go for a bigger more domineering DMF I mean closest youngster is SONG followed by Denilson who I believe ismore a CM than a DMF.

    I think Flamini is going to leave and Diarra will slot in with Gilbertos role being wound down over time, say 2 years.

  5. Seems to me that the reason Arsene bought Diarra, and Diarra decided to come, is that at the time the Arsenal player he most overlaps with, the Flammolator, looked like leaving. And he (Captain Flam) still is not under contract.
    For my money, Diarra is as impressive as Sagna. Two guys who promise years of fluid skills that fit Arsene’s model perfectly.

  6. @ Klon ditto my man. you are a genius!!

  7. what’s clear is that 3 into 1 wont go, but the one player I think is secure of the 3, strangely enough, is Diarra. I think wenger does know what he has got but wenger never gets his new purchases straight into the team. he lets them wait a bit before unleashing them. I think he will do everything to keep Diarra.
    Gilberto has age against him, but has versatility as a defender going for him and experience of winning the title. Flam is versatile across midfield and full back, but we have cover in those positions.
    Flam could still be here in 10 years but Bert definitely wont be. I think wenger will stick with the future and keep flam and ditch Bert. the way he took the captaincy from Bert would suggest he is moving away from using him. If we are being offered big money in jan, I can see him leaving. But we need to see that Diarra can do the business before selling Bert.

  8. Diarra is a damn good player but needs to analyse and understand the situation. How can he expect to walk straight in the team where even seasoned midfielders are benching?

    But I do understand his situation though. If you read how he had to wait, in his earlier days, before eventually given a chance to showcast his talents, he could be forgiven for thinking that its the same situation allover again. Diarra also feels that the time is running out for him to show the world what he’s made of. But all he need to know is that AW really believe in his talents and if he keep humble enough, he will soon get his deserved chance, but it just doesn’t happen overnight .

  9. There is no better defensive midfielder than Diarra at Arsenal at the moment, including Gilberto.
    Ican’t really understand AW, playing doggy Diaby ahead of Diarra week in, week out, although we don’t really look well balanced, Diaby combining with Clichy. Diarra is first team player and he should be given a try instead of benching him all the times. Flamini should be given a rest to allow Diarra some football with the first team. I feel the same with Eduardo who is used to play with desperation.

  10. lc – I’ll trust Arsene’s judgement as to when the time is right for Diarra or Eduardo. If Diarra is too impatient to wait for his opportunity, it will be his loss.

  11. Gilberto has one season after this if he stays then his contract runs out. Flamini is out of contract at the end of the season, ahd would make a lot of money if he signs as a free agent, so Diarrah, willbe the one left, and Im sure will paly a lot more by the end of the year.
    Eduardo still hasnt settled, but look at the improvement in Theo, Ede will do the same by the end of the season, AW says it takes six months to get used to EPL.
    We do need to give Cesc a rest once the 2 big games are over,and maybe he should start on the bench against Prague as well.

  12. Diarra has been patient through his career. he has waited at Le Havre and Chelsea. he is 22 and I think he is impatient now to play. I can understand that. imagine if Wayne rooney had not been allowed to really play for his club until he was 22 or Cesc for that matter. why should a player put 3 or 4 years of their career on hold? I think wenger has to make a decision here and the weight of opinion that I have heard is that most Gooners want Diarra involved in the team.

    what can be said for certain is that we have a very deep and strong squad. we used to have a strong team and a weaker squad but now its swapped round. I think our first 11 is strong but perhaps Ade and RVP are not as good as DB10 and TH14 were or is Rosicky as good as Pires for example. But when we get injuries now we look to players who are no weaker than those playing every week. I think perhaps only the loss of Cesc would see the team visibly shaken, purely because he is so good.

  13. Why didn’t AW do the same with Fabregas then?

  14. Ic, a doggy Diaby?? This is the next Vieira you are talking about man!!

  15. If so many of you guys like Diarra, I don’t know why I was slapped down for asking the likes of Cesc to be rested for the Sunderland game.

    This has been coming, and for me, it’s because of poor use of the squad. Cesc and Flamini have not needed to start every game. There’s getting a settled team and I agree with that, but playing them for every game of any importance, is making them tired, and the other players unhappy.

    We really need to keep Diaby and Denilson happy, we need to keep those talents, and from what we’ve seen of Diarra so far, he also looks excellent. I completely sympathise with Diarra, it’s not fair that a guy wastes his career, and Denilson must be feeling the same. He’s good enough to be playing right now. I felt the same for Djourou too.

    As much as we all rate Flamini, we need to think long and hard about who the biggest talents are at this club, and who we’re willing to lose. I think Arsene has already reluctantly decided to let Gilberto go.

    I feel Flamini’s form has dipped during the last few games, he’s not as involved as he has been – are we now playing this team simply because we’re on a run, or because it’s our best team?

  16. “what did flamini do against Bolton?”
    He smothered Bolton’s attacking options, won numerous balls in the air against Davies & others, spread play & generally kept possession extremely well.

    “Did Flam have a good game against Sunderland?” Yes in a very similar fashion.

    He is not an exciting player like Cesc but then that is not his job.

    We are very fortunate to have so many players capable of playing his position well.

    I think it is a case of the man in possession having to play at his peak to keep it. Flamini continues to play outstandingly well so deserves his place.

    It could be that the contract situation, which we have been given no information about, may affect things, at some point.

    Diarra is probably still learning the Arsenal way but if his performance against Newcastle suggests that he should have a very good future here.

    Injuries or suspensions will provide opportunities but our pre season debates about a thin squad seems a long time ago now.

  17. 777, yes a doggy Diaby and I am telling you why!
    First, he’s got no vision, no passing ability, slow and he is running with the ball like a school boy. No way Diaby should be compared to Viera who’s got all these attributes.
    Football is not all about being able to dribble. Well the only thing I will concede is that he looks like Viera.

  18. Flint, he smothered Bolton’s attacking options? what options. I must have missed all their strikers running about as I only saw defensive players.

    Anyway, I am not saying Flam had a BAD game, I think he had a 6 out of 10 performance but its not enough to say he should play saturday tuesday sunday etc every week without a break. even if he was putting in the sort of performances we saw earlier in the season, where he was our best player, there’s still no need to use a player, we have significant cover for, for 90 minutes a match 3 times a week. Meanwhile you have a couple of very good players threatening to leave. I am with hboy on this issue.
    I WOULD use Flam at Anfield, but I wholely support resting him against prague for either Bert or Diarra. A rested Flam could be an even better player.

  19. Quote from Arsenal site:

    PROGRESS ON RVP INJURY

    The Dutchman has damaged medial knee ligaments and will be out for four to six weeks however there were fears the injury might have been to cruciate ligaments. That would have seen him sidelined for the vast majority of this season.

    “His injury is a medial knee ligament,” said Wenger at Monday’s press conference. “At one stage we were scared it was a cruciate but we had good news and the scan was positive. But it is still a long injury.”

    WE WISH YOU WELL RVP.

    GOD BLESS ARSENALFANS !!!!!!!!!

  20. Sorry Flint, agree with Gazzap, Flamini’s done okay, tidy enough, but not particularly involved. The opposition have had too much of the ball. Flamini has two different types of games for me, one, where he is chasing shadows all over the pitch, and two, recently, where he started to get on the ball and dominate himself. It’s been back to him chasing the opposition for me.

    To say it’s Flamini’s position to lose is too simple to me, we have lots of different players with different charasterics. I love Flamini’s passion and workrate, his morale-boosting crunching tackles. In a game where we need to show character, I’d like him on our side. Gilberto, Diarra or Denilson would have had more influence on the last two matches.

    There’s a media cliche now that Flamini allows Cesc to do his fancy stuff. I don’t buy that at all. Cesc has always done his fair share of chasing and tackling, probably won more tackles than Flamini against Bolton. We have a whole host of midfield players that are happy to both tackle and play the game, we don’t need an out-and-out midfield enforcer in our side.

  21. Gazzap

    I don’t disagree about making a few changes tomorrow or generally utilising the squad, where necessary. I am more than content to trust AW’s judgment on that.

    We spent a lot of time before the season started talking about our defence. What was needed above all was a settled one. Flamini’s position is a crucial in protecting the defence & thus part of it. If it ain’t broke don’t fix it, maybe?

    It does seem that Flamini is still underrated by many on this blog. Bolton did in fact have opportunities on Saturday & Flamini was the chief reason why they could not exploit them.

    For me he was equal with Clichy, behind Hleb, as our man of the match, where a lot of our names took a long time to get going, mainly because of the internationals.

  22. I have to ask Gazzap & Hboy were you at the game?

  23. Come on Ic, Diaby can’t be that bad if he got a ‘Les Blues’ call up man( even he did’nt play). Do you know how many French midfielders playing his position? He eclearly have more potential than Flamini (IMO, that is).

    But depending on your last comment, I dont expect us to agree on this one ( it’s like each one of us watches a different Diaby). So, lets analyse his game very critically once more this season and see if one of us will be convienced otherwise, come end of the season. OK?

  24. I think thats an honest question, and yes I was there. Going by all the player ratings I saw today, most people say he had a steady game but no more.
    He had a decent game but he has had a stronger influence on some games than in his past 2 matches. Its not simply a case of not making mistakes in an unglamerous role. I beleive Gilberto, Diarra and Flamini can still positively influence the creative play when playing a DM role.

    Flam might be very suited to playing away. all that chasing and harrying might be just what we lacked last season. Flam should start at Anfield and then we judge him match by match. With the way the squad is balanced if a central midfielder goes off the boil, he will be replaced quickly. Compare that to say if Toure, clichy, Hleb even Ade goes off the boil, chances are they will still be in the team.

  25. I noticed that diarra is not even in the squad to play prague tomorrow. Eboue and denilson are though. I can see where Diarra is coming from. Jens returns to the squad.

    Talking of rotation or resting players, did you notice that fergie left Ronaldo out of the team that thrashed Villa? It takes some balls to leave out your best player. its like us leaving out fabregas, which wenger would not do. I wont criticise wenger but if united look stronger than us in April/May, decisions like this, might have played a part.

  26. i am not surprised by diarra’s concerns, i think most of us wondered why we signed him in the first place, i assume wenger thought flam was on his way but that still left diaby, denilson fab and gilberto let alone rosicky and helb who can play in the middle. as a 22 year old full international, he seems 6th in the pecking order behind two teenagers in diaby and denilson and his frustrations completely make sense, especially as he is a terrific player with more talent than flam, and more experiance than diaby and denilson. the squad is imbalanced when we have 7 centre midfielders and have eboue, diaby and denilson regularly playing out of positions on the wings. if he is so low in the pecking order and i see he is not even in the squad tomorrow then good luck to him if wants to leave.

  27. It wasn’t that long ago that everyone was lamenting the lack of depth in the squad, now there are too many?

    Diarra knew the score when he came to Arsenal and although he may have some experience he has not played in midfield very much recently as he mainly featured at right back for his previous club and Country. Why don’t we just wait and see what Arsene will do? The season has barely begun.

  28. the lamenting about the depth of the squad was about specific positions not in total, ie sufficient coverage at goalie, centre back, left midfield and forwards.

    i certainly agree that he must have seen who was there already and although it is hard to see wenger making him promises wenger must have addressed the issue with him. he probably thought he would be behind gilberto and cesc only, which is where he should realistically be not 6th in the order.

  29. Flint, don’t bang the i was there drum! I suppose everyone’s imagining that his influence in the last two has waned! No one’s attacking him, he just had played out of his skin previously and the last two performances were less special. Bert has played amazing many a time, some have not forgotten that and feel now is a good time for him to return. No point having 3 great choices if Flamini is going to start every game. Flamini is the lesser of the 3 options, unless playing at his very best!

  30. Flamini will probobly leave as he will be out of contract soon. Gilberto may decide to call it quits and head to spain or italy too. So its no harm in having a player ready made to take their place. Personally id say we will see quite a bit of all our central midfielders. Remember we have 4 competitions to compete in. Id fancy Diarra to be first choice for league cup matches and early fa cup games too.

    League cup team
    Fabianski
    Hoyte Song Senderos Traore
    Eboue Denilson Diarra Diaby
    Theo Bentdner

  31. we may have 4 comps at the moment, one, that may not last, two the league and Champions league teams are not rotated and third a handful of carling and fa cup games is not going to satisfy him. if gilberto and flam are going to leave then he should be playing diarra more often now. as for flam, he has been playing out of skin but that does not and will never change the fact that he is an average player who would not be first choice in any other top team in england let alone europe.

  32. I also think Diarra is a better player than Flamini. The problem Diarra has is that Flamini plays an energetic low risk game so he will never look that bad as long as he puts in the effort, unlike a Diaby or Fabregas who play ambitious passes and dribble the ball.. Consequently this makes him difficult to drop because his bad performances don’t really notice that much.

  33. you do have to wonder that if wenger does have long term plans for him, then why is he being so frozen out at the moment. this is not a 19 year old kid who needs to adjust. he is a full international who although not playing regularly has been in england for a few years playing with two of the best teams in the country. his training alone with chelsea and us should have prepared him to play premier league games let alone the international he has been playing

  34. gazzap

    Denilson will be there to replace Cesc when Cesc is rested so don’t worry. The only problem we have is the centre of defence and Gk. The replacements for the CB position are crap and not up to top club standard and the GK position is also a problem as Almunia is just average. Apart from that, the squad is really good especially in the middle of the field where I believe only MANU can match us.

  35. Attributing our recent success to Flamini being in the team is devaluing how much better a lot of other players have been this season. I’m sorry but in my view he has not even been our best player this season. He has been good, no doubt about that, but then so have most of our players. He has just started with a lower level of expectation than others. It’s simply become the fasion to laud every performance as somehow down to Flamini because there is a perception that he is underrated and people defend him to the excess. I’m afraid there is a significant danger of the opposite happening as a result. He is a cog in the machine and the machine is working very well at the moment. But let’s not get carried away. If Flamini got injured we would not miss him nearly as much as we would several several other players. You are welcome to disagree with me but i know i’m right.

  36. “he is an average player who would not be first choice in any other top team in england let alone europe”

    Well he is 1st choice, at the moment, in 1 of the top teams in world football & Man Utd have just spent, was it £18m, for a player who in my opinion is nowhere near as good as Flamini.

    I am not saying he is better than Diarra or Gilberto, it is just that he has made an outstanding contribution to the team effort & while that continues he deserves his place.

    The point about being at the ground is that it does change your perspective, because you can see a lot more than the camera can capture.

    I obviously have a different opinion to a lot of you about Flamini’s performance, on Saturday, but I do know there are others who also appreciate his contribution.

    Still the grass can always be greener.

  37. Newcastle 3 Spuds 1

    Blimey, would anyone honestly have thought that after the Spuds had played ten games, they would be 18 points behind us and would have played a game more.

    I will be amazed if Jol survives the week. I hope they dont sack him though, it would ruin everything

  38. Well said Flint

  39. Dan

    I am relieved to see you here again.

    I had feared that you had carried out your summer threat to “top” yourself if Flamini was in the team.

    Forgive me if it was someone else.

  40. no it is me been very busy. i must say flam has done much better than anyone would have expected and good on him for showing such committment and resolve to stay and for playing so well. he deserves his place at the moment. all i am saying is that i think we have far better players in that position and although i agree you shouldn’t change a winning team or change players who are doing well, at some point sooner rather than later i would rather see diarra or gilberto (preferably diarra) playing there as a regular. we are obviously going to disagree but i think flam is an average player at best and i stand by my comment about him not getting in to another top team. your comment was yes he was playing for us top of the league etc etc, i realize that which is why i made the comment.


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