The stands at the Camp Nou proudly boast ‘Mes Que Un Club‘, highlighting CF Barcelona’s claim to represent the whole of Catalunya rather than just the postcode of the rundown district their stadium occupies. So, if Barcelona represents the ‘nation’, what does it say about the people? Well, clueless, classless and arrogant would probably be the answer if you do not know any better. As it happens, I can only base my views on that particular subject through meeting my wife’s family; some represent those characteristics, some do not which is true of all national caricatures with small groups used as a sample.
For years, Barcelona as a club have dismissed the regulations regarding ‘tapping up’ of players, seemingly safe in the knowledge that they will not be reported to the highest authorities of football by any club, probably for the most part because they know that they were bigger than the ’selling’ club in terms of wealth. Those days are over as they are no longer substantially wealthier than any club in England, indeed it may well be that there are perhaps three clubs within 10% of the Catalans this past year, if not exceeding them.
Txiki Beguiristain yesterday was quoted, on the subject of Fabregas, as saying,
We cannot pay a great quantity for a homegrown player that decided to leave us. To start with, he would have to show his desire to return
In other words, they want him to come on the cheap and the only way that will happen is if the player agitates for a move. However, the statement shows two things. Firstly, Barcelona are encouraging the player to demand a transfer, thereby ‘tapping up’ a player under contract to another club, a clear breach of FIFA, UEFA, FA and probably RFEF regulations. Will anything happen about this? Probably not which begs the question as to why that should be the case? My guess is two-fold. Firstly, few if any clubs, want to be seen as ‘whisteblowers’ upsetting colleagues in the G-14 cartel and more importantly, risking upsetting a valued player in the process for they would presumably be required to give evidence at some point. The ethos behind it all seems to be ‘it’s not the done thing‘ yet other clubs, including Arsenal, have been reported by the Catalans albeit to no effect. Surely the ethos ought to be in a case such as this, ‘What’s good for the goose…‘? Secondly, having allowed Real Madrid to ‘get away with it’ last summer, is there any reason to believe that Arsenal have a strong enough will to complain? My belief is no, they do not.
The second point to come from the statement is that they want to humiliate Fabregas into returning to the Camp Nou. Such arrogance, and the dismissive attitude shown to Fran Merida, should serve as a salutory warning to Fabregas should he return under such circumstances. He will be welcomed with open arms but you can be sure that the current regime at that club will want him to confess he was wrong to leave, that his upbringing at Arsenal was nowhere near as good as he has previously said, it would have been far better had he stayed in Catalunya. Whether he would be able to resist such requests is unknown but it is all shaping up to be a modern-day Spanish Inquisition with Beguiristain playing the role of Tomás de Torquemada to a tee.
Problematically for Fabregas, all of this has stemmed from comments made by his loose cannon of an Agent, Joseba Diaz. Whilst you cannot blame the player for his representatives mouth, the utterances must surely be embarrassing for him? Cesc has worked hard to build goodwill through his performances yet I know of several who do not entirely trust the lad because of his admission that he met with Real Madrid last summer. It would be naive to expect him to stay for the full length of his contract and I believe he will return to his homeland in the next four years so personally, I will make the most of it whilst he is here.
Talking of Fran Merida, which I did vaguely earlier on, Arsenal.com carries a brief interview with a player rumoured by The People to be on his way out. Unsurprisingly, it did not ask his opinions on the recent court case which is a pity because they would be worth hearing; perhaps the club would be better served allowing more freedom of speech on their site rather than reverting to a Pravda-style of control?
The Sun meanwhile reports on two long standing ‘transfer’ rumours. Well, I say, two but one isn’t just yet. Juventus have apparently decided that they want Gilberto having failed to nab him in the summer and are willing to part with £5m to get their man. Apparently, they have sent a delegation to London in the past but this time are deadly serious about sealing the deal for January. I cannot see it happening then though with, hopefully, the Club still be involved in four competitions at that point. It would be little short of professional suicide on the part of Arsene unless of course, he believes that Diarra, Djourou and Flamini are capable of helping to deliver the silverware. Personally, I would like to see Gilberto stay until next summer – I think his departure is inevitable then – even if he is not in the first team every week, his experience in big games would be invaluable to the squad.
The other ‘news’ that they impart is that Manuel Almunia will start against Bolton. This is apparently the route that will allow the papers to speculate that Jens Lehmann will be sold in January to stop him becoming disruptive, a situation I find hard to believe…
’til Tomorrow.























Joseba Diaz is the new DD and Beguiristain is the new Usmanov!!!
I agree with you Yogi, Fabregas will stay with us for a while but at some point in time, he will have to go back to Spain, especially if either Barca or Madrid start to put on a real show. He was brave enough to avoid the Reyes kind of drama.
By: Mweneni on October 16, 2007
at 6:44 am
Maybe I am an optimist and as far as Arsenal are concerned I am, but I do not believe it is written in stone that Fab will return to play in Spain so soon. Our club as you alluded to, is constantly growing in stature and if Wenger’s latest team blossoms to their full potential with the addition of a strong financial base it may be ourselves doing the muscling both off and on the pitch. The Real or Barca debate may be too complex for this political outcast, so why not Fab stay at the Champions of Europe!!
By: Danny on October 16, 2007
at 7:06 am
Yogi’s Warrior – Please get your facts right. Fran Merida cannot comment because the case has gone to appeal. I also believe that Barca have now shot themselves in the foot where Fran is concerned. How can a 17 year old be fined 3.5 mill euros ha,ha….begs belief!!
If Cesc has any sense which I think he has I cant see him returning to a club that never gave him any encouragement. Both Cesc and Fran would have wilted away in Barca’s reserves.
Barca are not above the law, UEFA should have taken them to task after tapping up Thierry Henry
Mweneni – why will Cesc have to go back to Spain?
By: Sue on October 16, 2007
at 7:27 am
Here’s to Fab staying for years to come.
*lifts his cup of coffe*.
Diaz needs a slap, tho’. Interesting thoughts on tapping up, Yogi. It begs the question whether the rule works if nobody wants to make a complaint.
C
By: Le Bob on October 16, 2007
at 7:27 am
Why is it a freedom of speech issue YW? Perhaps Fran Merida does not want to talk about the court case.
By: Frank on October 16, 2007
at 7:31 am
It wouldn’t do for Arsenal to interview Merida about the Barcelona court case. We are a classy club, not some newsfeed for the tabloid press. Rise above…
By: Exiled on October 16, 2007
at 7:32 am
I agree with Sue and I would add that his current team mates are very important to him.
By: Frank on October 16, 2007
at 7:33 am
It’s interesting that Beguristain uses the same terminology he used before Henry arranged his own transfer… However, if Cesc has got any sense he will think like a professional footballer rather than a fan. At Arsenal he is the star of the team – his name is the first one on the team sheet. If he goes back to Barca he will not have all this – they will make him pay for what they see as his disrespect in leaving them 4 years ago.
At least Merida is one player who will not be agitating for a move back to Barcelona – Does the club think this sordid little affair has helped their image at all?
By: Passenal on October 16, 2007
at 7:42 am
I always thought in the back of my mind that Cesc would float off to Spain one day but I’m not so sure now. In three years time things might look very different when Arsenal have won a few trophies and he’s married to a London girl. One of you ladies will just have to sacrifice yourself.
By: hackajack on October 16, 2007
at 7:43 am
I second or third(if there is such a word for that) what Sue said. Our turnover is already second only Real and we will be one of the biggest club in Europe. With Arsene’s dream slowly coming to fruition we will be bigger than the likes of Barcelona and Real. Cecs will be our captain and lead us to many championship winning seasons. We will have the wherewithal to keep him happy both professionally and financially. He will want to stay. When we are ready to let him go then if Barcelona or Real still wants him may be we will allow him to leave if he wants to join the also rans.
Here is to the vision
Cheers
By: Malaysiangunner on October 16, 2007
at 7:49 am
I volunteer to move to London and take that fate upon myself, hackajack…
By: louisquatorze on October 16, 2007
at 7:55 am
hackajack
See no shortage of takers for our Fab Cesc. He will in time spend enough time in London to love it there
By: Malaysiangunner on October 16, 2007
at 8:11 am
Lousie are you sure, you’re up to the task!!! Now Thierry found himself a proper London stunner, but when Arsenal needed her most. She grew tired of his gallic strops and chucked him.
So you’ve got a be a keeper, three kids quick as you can, horrendous pre-nuptial, give him no choices. Under the thumb, marginalise the mum in law. Simply no messing!
By: Danny on October 16, 2007
at 8:18 am
Don’t worry, Danny, I’ll keep him in London. I want the kids speaking good English, don’t I?
By: louisquatorze on October 16, 2007
at 8:28 am
Mweneni – why will Cesc have to go back to Spain?
Sue, I know I sounded a little sure that he will go but what I actually meant was that there’s a real possibility that this may well just happen.
This boy is so young and very easy to unsettle. A little twist of mind by his Agent – for whatever reason of course – and you will see a different Fabregas. A second sign that the move is likely, is the fact that his Agent doesn’t seems keen to let this golden opportunity to make big money, stroll past him. The question still linger in my head: Why on earth did they meet with Madrid in the summer ? Did you notice how nervous Wengers was around that time? If Arsenal don’t win any significant trophy this season and the next ( I don’t want to sound pessimistic but it’s possible),and Barca ( or Madrid ) start to play ‘football from another planet’, it’s going to be a hell of a battle to keep him.
But I don’t know what will happen in the future. May be he will get a lady like Hackjack suggested. Maybe we will live up to our potential and become real European superpowers, and thus offer him no excuse whatsoever.
TIME WILL TELL.
By: Mweneni on October 16, 2007
at 8:28 am
Danny
I doubt that there are many successful attempts at marginalising a Spanish mother-in-law….As for Cesc, his own words are that he would like to return to Spain to play so I think it is not a million miles off the mark to assume he will.
Sue
Has the case gone to appeal? I read that Diaz said they would given that his tongue is forked, can you believe what he says? However, he can comment on it since all of the information is now in the public domain viz the court papers.
YW
By: Yogi's Warrior on October 16, 2007
at 8:28 am
“clueless, classless and arrogant ”
An almost perfect description, but you left out ‘hypocrites’.
Guess which recently hard done by Catalan giant (who are attempting to sue a 17 year old for leaving at 15) are trying to sign a 14 year-old Argentine striker at the Canary Island club Vecinadario?
What. A. Bunch. Of. Cúnts.
By: G10 on October 16, 2007
at 8:37 am
Yogi,
I never said it would be easy!!!!!!
As for Cesc going to Spain. If he is at a happy harmonious successful club (very successful) and the Spanish calling is an intense debate over whether a young Catalan should play for Real or return to the club he may be perceived as abandoning, then maybe then we can keep a concioius intelligent young man in his current surroundings.
Arsene is a manager in a million for these young men, a father figure and footballing genius. A staunch defender of his players and an understanding shoulder. Cesc leaving despite many a quote is by no means certain. If Cesc is happy with his environment and crucially is winning he may decide for the time being not to end his political exile but to stay in the serene surroundings of London.
By: Danny on October 16, 2007
at 8:39 am
I don’t think the situation is quite as bad as made out to be. It seems the guy isn’t trying to tempt Cesc away and move on the cheap, rather expressing regret how they would have to pay a huge sum of money to get back a player who was in their academy.
Txiki Begiristain quote from FC Barcelona Blog
“Fabregas was once here with us, but he has left. He was nurtured here and so if he’s to return, it will be a difficult thing for us in the sense that we will have to pay big money for him. It wouldn’t be nice paying a very huge amount of money for a player we nurtured and developed. Also, Fabregas has not made any move toward coming back to Barca. As this is the case, we here in Barcelona will not really go after him. He has to be allowed to make his decisions and live by what he believes.”
By: MJW on October 16, 2007
at 8:46 am
MJW
Without wishing to be rude, it is naive to believe that they are not trying to agitate him into a move. It is their tried and tested route for signing players.
YW
By: Yogi's Warrior on October 16, 2007
at 9:13 am
I just read that Mr Tweedy may be out for up to 3 months with ankle damage. Whilst I find this amusing I find it sad that he will miss Chel$ki’s visit to the Grove AGAIN.
By: Steve on October 16, 2007
at 9:34 am
While it is there method to attempt to unsettle players to agitate a move, i still want to judge them on case-by-case basis, and this case might be an example of an exaggeration of recent quotes. I am annoyed as anyone at any attempts to unsettle any of our players, but it seems like this might not be a case of the Barcelona we are used to.
By: MJW on October 16, 2007
at 9:34 am
Just a thought guys. At the moment it looks like Arsenal are taking the moral high ground in the transfer market. However this puts us at a big disadvantage as most of the other big clubs do whatever they like knowing that on the unlikely chance they actually get punished, it’d be just a friendly tap on the wrist.
At times like this I wonder if it is time for us to take off our white robes, roll up our sleeves and jump into the mudpit with the rest of them. It reminds me of earlier this season when Repka was mouthing off about how they were going to kick us off the park. Only for Cesc to give him a healthy dose of his own medicine, maybe it will teach him to keep his filthy hole shut next time (but I doubt it!).
Anyway AW doesn’t go for big transfers so there is no need for us to get dirty just yet. However, when the time comes I certainly wouldn’t mind losing some of our ‘classy’ reputation if it left Barca, Real or Chelski limping, cursing & beaten, just like Repka.
By: Unattractive Man on October 16, 2007
at 10:03 am
I think Cesc wants to be loyal to Arsenal and Arsene, and also to win things whilst at the club.
However, I also think that Cesc wants to keep his options open about a future move/return to Spanish football, and suspect that there is a degree of flirting going on by the player and his agent with the leading clubs in Spain.
The flirting – via the Spanish Press – tends to happen predominantly, but not exclusively, during international breaks.
Today, for example, Cesc is quoted as answering a question about whether he’d like to play alongside Xavi & Iniesta next season at Barcelona by saying “I don’t know, really”.
Now it’s possible that Cesc’s answer was taken out of context and that he is being misquoted.
However, all Cesc had to say in answer to the question was “I am extremely happy at Arsenal and I’ll be at the club next season, for sure, so I will not be in a position to play alongside Xavi & Iniesta next season for Barcelona. I can, of course, continue to play alongside them for the national team if I am selected.”
Cesc is an intelligent young man, his club, Arsenal, are top of the premier league and doing well in all of the competitions that they’ve played in so far.
If, under these circumstances, he is really not sure if he want’s to be at Arsenal next season, then we shouldn’t be at all surprised if he ends up returning to Spanish football well before the end of the remaining 7 years or so on his contract.
But fear not. Let’s enjoy Cesc whilst he’s still at the club, then acknowledge that Arsenal won’t collapse when he eventually departs.
Arsenal was here long before Cesc came along, and it’ll be here long after he’s gone.
By: Magneto on October 16, 2007
at 10:08 am
It would be nice if we didn’t always take the moral high ground. We should agitate some of their players now we’re the richest kid in the playground!
Maybe ask Messi if he’d like the play with Cesc again, and whether he likes bacon sandwiches. And if he does, would he like to eat one in a north london cafe in Holloway road?
Overall though, Barca and Madrid haven’t got to many of our players we wanted to keep. Madrid tried to nab PV04 for years without success, Barca only got Henry because he divorced, Overmars was a flop and they paid hugely over the odds for him, Petit had peaked and Gio was never a big loss.
Don’t forget the below article, the young Spaniard cant be that fickle, can he?
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11827_2752114,00.html
By: Pedro on October 16, 2007
at 10:58 am
There’s a good article on http://www.le-grove.co.uk regarding the transfer speculation of our boys, it’s worth a look.
By: geoff on October 16, 2007
at 11:23 am
Where Arsenal take the moral high ground or not it will not change the way clubs continue to tap up players at every level of the game. I agree with Yogi that we are being silly if we believe that Cesc would be at the club in 4 years time, the guy is Spanish and would like to return home to play in front of his countrymen week in and out. This has been quoted from the player before this speculation so I think it is safe to say that he’ll certainly look to the opportunity at some point, just not next season.
The rules around tapping up seem to be quite complicated and given that few have actually been penalised and when they were it was not exactly a harsh sentence to serve (Chelsea). Actually the going good thing to come out the Cashley saga was that the player was himself hit with a fine, of course he was innocent in the whole affair *cough*. The fact is that unless a club is really penalised it shall never stop, all clubs do it.. some more openly than others (Real & Barca, I could name a few English teams in here too). It would be great to see it penalised but you can see how what the officials are up against when they see vague but coded statements made, and those people argue freedom of speech. Unless, the hand is found in the actually cookie jar the complaint is not going to officialdom.
I think you’ll find that Cesc is more tied to Wenger than people think and there bond like that of TH14 will be more than enough to keep the player in London and our beloved Team.
TG
By: Toronto Gunner on October 16, 2007
at 11:57 am
Pedro, the thing with that article is that Barca were not sniffing around at the time.
But, thinking about it a bit more, it must be hard for Cesc. In London he has the team, his team mates and Arsene Wenger. But in Spain he has his whole life – family, friends (including his girlfriend) as well as his life-long love for Barca. He must be under tremendous pressure and since he does want to return home one day, he does not want to burn all his bridges. Unfortunately, all his vague comments do is fuel the fires and we just have to live with it as long as he is with us.
Toronto Gunner – you’re right tapping up is hard to prove. I also think that Arsenal had their fingers burnt over the Cashley affair. The punishment of Chelsea was nothing and they still got their man anyway, so what was the point?
By: Passenal on October 16, 2007
at 12:19 pm
I don’t really understand where this whole, “He has his family and life back in Spain” stuff comes from?
He is a professional footballer, I am quite sure he has many friends over here as well. He is 20 and he has been over here since he was 15, I doubt he still knocks about with the same crowd he did when he was in Spain. Do any of you still socialise with the friends you had a 15?
He has enough money to fly back to Spain whenever he wants to and his girlfriend lives over here with him.
If he wants to go back to Barca, it will be purely footballing reasons. I am pretty sure that Barca being interested in him was not a shock.
I think he’ll be about for a while yet!
By: Pedro on October 16, 2007
at 12:31 pm
Danny, you said
“Arsene is a manager in a million for these young men, a father figure and footballing genius”.
True that, but you forgot that AW is also not the sort who forces player to stay at the club against their wishes. Vieira, Campel, Henry, Cole, Anelka, Reyes etc are all briliant players who demanded moves and left Arsenal against Wenger’s will. If any player – Cesc included – becomes unsettled and aggitated, there’s little AW can do to keep him. So, that point has little weight as a factor in this matter.
By: Weah9 on October 16, 2007
at 12:39 pm
But fear not. Let’s enjoy Cesc whilst he’s still at the club, then acknowledge that Arsenal won’t collapse when he eventually departs.
Arsenal was here long before Cesc came along, and it’ll be here long after he’s gone.
———-Magneto..well said.
AW’s 3rd wave of players will include players groomed to become world class. In 2-3 years we’ll probably see Merida, Barazite, Vela, etc become important players in a 25-player squad that mind-numbingly rotational with Fab4 as the fulcrum! Who would wanna leave that
My prayer right now is that ALL our players on Int’l duty come back safe & sound so we can beat the sh*te out of Anelkaless Bolton on Sat!
Sammy Lee might get the sack after that game.
By: Aman on October 16, 2007
at 12:39 pm
Concerning tapping up anyone have a reasonable suggestion to which we could offer UEFA or the FA? I would assume that it would need to be able to be enforced by all associations not just England… well I guess that ends that conversation. As much as people may bang on about the top 4 and the rest in England it is far worse in Spain where there is Barca and Real… yup that’s it. I seem to remember that Jaap Stam said he met Sir Red Nose in a hotel room without the approval of his then club? tapping up you bet!! I guess the rules on this issue will remain as enforceable as those governing diving… we know it happens we know it is cheating but we accept it because the officials turn a blind eye or flatly refuse to deal with the issue.
Can someone correct me but is Vieira still the only player in the history of the Premier League to have been sent off for missing a tackle by a yard but showing intent? and I think it was him again that was frog marched for swearing? I bet Manchester United still chuckle at that one given the rantings of one Wayne “Looks like a Mr Potato head” Rooney.
By: Toronto Gunner on October 16, 2007
at 1:23 pm
no, bergkamp once got sent off for intending to foul a player as well.
just like that penalty that Gerrard ‘won’ when the player intended to tackle him on the edge of the box.
or the time the ref said he was watching Senderos’ upper body and ‘assumed’ their legs had clashed.
shame Cole wont play at the Emirates yet again. jammy git.
By: gazzap on October 16, 2007
at 4:22 pm
Weah9, this is where we differ, for i believe in the main, where Wenger wants to keep a player that’s exactly what he does! I believe he was content to see Paddy, Sol and even Thierry move on at the stage of their careers they left. So he maybe did not develop the usual affinity with Reyes and Anelka. This cannot be said about his relationship with Fab. Only a money grabbing pop star dating Englishman forced his way out despite any bond they shared. No surprises there! Fab is not comparable to Cashley!
By: Danny on October 16, 2007
at 4:41 pm
Hi, I’m a supporter of Barcelona and I think you don’t have all the info on the Cesc subject. Let me clear some things up: we here believe that Barça is not too interested in Cesc, the main reason being that the kid left the club in a rush, willing to make money quickly instead of waiting like other players (Iniesta, Messi, so on) and this is not much appreciated around here. Furthermore, we prefer Xavi, Iniesta or Deco in the middle field, and there doesn’t seem to be place for another player in that position. Cesc is clearly a great player, but people here seem to have fallen for Iniesta and they don’t want to hear about replacements.
The sentence you quote was taken out of a local radio interview where the interviewer asked Txiqui if he wanted Cesc back. He said “he’s a good player but if he wants to come back it will have to be for the same price as he left”. Translation? No, we don’t want him, and if it’s true he loves this club so much then I don’t understand why he did what he did.
If I were you I’d be much more scared by the possibility that Madrid comes after him. They desperately need a good player in the middle field, and they are willing to pay what it takes. By the way, if Cesc goes to our great rival, wel… so much for his interest in Barça.
Oh, and just another thing: not all Barcelona supporters are like you portray us in your post. Trust me on that one!
Great blog, by the way.
By: doctorjota on October 16, 2007
at 4:45 pm
Barça is more than a Club and Messi is more than a player. We have more young players so we don’t need Cesc. Try to read about FCBarcelona History and then say your opinion.
Greetings from Barcelona.
By: Moisés on October 16, 2007
at 5:03 pm
Oh yeah, let it roll mate.
What a truckload of crap there man:
“The stands at the Camp Nou proudly boast ‘Mes Que Un Club‘, highlighting CF Barcelona’s claim to represent the whole of Catalunya rather than just the postcode of the rundown district their stadium occupies”
Are you sure you know what “mes que un club means”?
I think not. It means “more than a club”, in the sense of representing not only a football team but also a special feeling for millions of people.
A special feeling very related to the oppression executed by a dictator during 40 years. A feeling of wrath after seeing the catalan people executed and humiliated.
Not the whole of Catalunya, just the portion that feels that way and want to feel harbored by their colors.
So I would attribite the “clueless” and “classless” adectives to someone else, my friend. FCB is an example of how can a culture overcome the most brutal oppression, you should admire them rather than spit on them.
If the rest of the blog is as documented as this half-assed post you won’t see me here again.
By: Capitan Forceps on October 16, 2007
at 5:06 pm
How many english players are in Arsenal??
Think about it.
By: Moisés on October 16, 2007
at 5:10 pm
Do not notice the Catalan supporters of Barcelona Football Club, they believe in possession of the absolute truth on the club.
I believe that you have reason in your opinion about the Catalans, there are thought that they were the only ones that lived through the dictatorship and that were the only ones to those who were chased or executed.
As for Cesc, I do not believe either that the FC Barcelona is interested in his(her,your) contracting, it is a simple false rumour spilt by the press to have something about which to speak during the week
By: Spanish supporter of FCBarcelona on October 16, 2007
at 5:29 pm
Moises – what has that got to do with anything?
Pedro – Cesc has talked about his friends from home and how he keeps in touch with them. Also, his girlfriend was here for 1 year while studying. She is back in Spain now.
By: Passenal on October 16, 2007
at 5:34 pm
wow Yogi i think u missed it there with the whole quotation,its quite refreshing that Barca suopporters are shedding some light from that end that is nit biased in that they know Cesc is a good playa but the way he left made the supporters look down upon him becoz they feel he was after the CASH (remind u of somone thats well hated now for leaving for money) hpefully by the time the fans can take him back he will have given us alot of memories and trophies we will give him a wonderful send off and when we meet them him in the champs league later on that year he would be given a torrid time by Denilson,Barazite,Merida and Diarra and probably more others.Dont get me wrong Cesc is an absolute gem of a playa,but if he doesnt give off the right vibes then he wont play for the badge and at the end of the day,60 000plus fans chant his name because he is a good playa and they love the fact when he scored that goal last season he showed what it meant to him to score for Arsenal once thats gone out of him we would have no need for him
By: Casicky on October 16, 2007
at 5:36 pm
Cesc is a cold chest.
By: Confident on October 16, 2007
at 5:37 pm
Dear man,
I’m a Barcelona supporter too.
Your post exudes hate about all that has to do with Barça. Whether this hate comes from having lost the Champions League Final back in 2006 (despite referee’s help) or from having to pay for the case of Fran Merida I really can’t say, nor I’m interested in.
But before writing such a post, you should clearly state that hate. Let’s call it a ’sentimental’ disclosure.
The way you analyze the words of Begiristain is simply paranoid. He was polite, clear, and treat Cesc and Arsenal with all due respect.
Of particular note is your comment about Spanish Inquisition, too. Oh man… Cromwell would be proud of you.
Take it easy. Cesc is a great player. Just enjoy him in Arsenal and make the most of it.
By: Raimon on October 16, 2007
at 6:34 pm
“Cesc” means “ass” in some catalaani regions.
By: Keksi on October 16, 2007
at 6:48 pm
FC Barcelona? They always tap our players and we always sell them shit. Remember we sold them Petit and Overmars for over 30+ and they were over the hill. We’ve sold Henry who can never be the player we knew again. Cesc will be sold after he’s spent his productive years here.
So they should keep on tapping our players and we’ll always sell them junk. They never learn.
By: Howard on October 16, 2007
at 7:00 pm
It is refreshing to see some FC Barca fans pop in and have there say… I remember a day in the stadium where I watched Barca dismantle Alaves a few years back and the atmosphere was amazing
That being said, YW I feel you are right in your interpretation. Whether those that chose to grace the blog chose to accept it or not TH14 was “tapped up”… it is a tradition amongst certain Spanish clubs it would seem to say what you like but when questioned or queried quickly use denial. Perhaps as more young players are tapped up in Spain from the likes of Madrid (who are actually the biggest club in Spain) and Barca we’ll see more court proceeding involving the “more than a club”. You cannot chose your fights once you open pandora’s box.
By: Toronto Gunner on October 16, 2007
at 7:12 pm
Howard is somewhat correct. I won’t challenge that.
Shoulder-tapping is the name of the game anyhow, so take it easy Yogi.
In any case, I found today’s post enormously disrespectful. I would never dare to call Arsenal, with such a long and glorious history, what you called FCB.
You may be pissed about the alleged conversations with Cesc, which are all bullshit by the way, but your intro has been most inaproppriate.
Best regards anyways.
By: Capitan Forceps on October 16, 2007
at 7:16 pm
@Howard
Oh yes, probably you have the best players in their better years…but you don’t win anything
By: Penélope on October 16, 2007
at 7:16 pm
Yeah right, Toronto, Arsenal never taps nobody’s shoulder or do any irregular thingies, they are the defenders of the UEFA faith, come on!
Many crybabies I am seeing here. You seem to have a problem, seem to live in denial.
This is football, hundres of dirty mercenaries getting paid by hundreds of millionaires, everything financed by the proles like you and me.
You need a reality check fellas.
By: Capitan Forceps on October 16, 2007
at 7:20 pm
Woah FCB fans but particularly Captainforceps
Don’t mix politics and football for one.
Especially when they are as irrelevant to the issue as they are here.
Your club have form in this regard, therefore I think it is pretty reasonable for Arsenal supporters to get twitchy when high ranking members of your club are talking about one of our own.
Have high ranking members of AFC ever talked about one of your players, or indeed anyones? Oh no.
I think you have a ridiculous and pompous degree of self regard, get over your self – what makes you think Arsenal don’t have millions of fans who love the club?
You had better start preparing yourself for some humble pie boyo because Arsenal are here to stay , we have a new stadium, a sound financial base, the richest league in the world, the best manager in the world and we aren’t going to be pushed around by the likes of self aggrandising pompous twats like FCB and Real Madrid any more.
Start conducting FCB like gentlemen and not through the media and maybe you won’t read things you don’t like on opposition blogs.
Yours Sincerely
Stanley Kroenkie
By: Stanley Kroenkie on October 16, 2007
at 7:21 pm
Oh and forceps…
Name one occasion and document it where arsenal have tapped up a player through the media.
Go on I dare you.
By: Stanley Kroenkie on October 16, 2007
at 7:24 pm
We don’t need to sell our t-shirt to a comercial brand like “fly emirates”, “samsung” or “bwin”. We pay money to show “unicef” in our chest.
That’s the difference, my friends. And the fcb suportters elect their president every 4 years.
By: Moisés on October 16, 2007
at 7:27 pm
And FCB is mine, mine and 150,000 more people. I decide on the FCB … Who decides on the Arsenal?
By: alfigem on October 16, 2007
at 7:30 pm
I why I have a comment awaitig moderation??
By: alfigem on October 16, 2007
at 7:32 pm
Moises – I’ll give you that, thats terrific.
You can be assured that we would all love to own a piece of our club too but alas thats not the way our society operates. And again, its beside the point.
By: Stanley Kroenkie on October 16, 2007
at 7:34 pm
Stanley – we all have our points here. Cesc is an excellent player and I’m sure he’s proud of playing with the Gunners. Thing is, right now for us he’s not the top 1 priority: we are very powerful in our middle field and Cesc at this time would be more a nuisance than an asset in Barcelona: too much competition. I’d rather have Deco than him, if you ask me.
That being said, Arsenal may not make announces through the press but the strategy they used to pick Cesc from Barça is somewhat dubious (making his father an offer to work in London so he could take the boy free). But hey! It’s the game and we have to accept it! No regrets now.
Anyway, as someone said here before, I wouldn’t give much credit to this kind of speculation. It’s quite common here in Spain: too many journalists that need to write about something when the players leave with their countries… and, sometimes, all these rumours are nothing but a courtain of smoke. Last year, for instance, in one of these breaks we had a couple of front pages talking about how interested Barça was with Cristiano Ronaldo… In the end it turned out that it was all a strategy of Ronaldo’s agent to try and raise the offer from ManU. Apparently he will pay Barça back through some players exchange… and we, the poor supporters, fight in blogs while they play with our money… soooo sad…
By: doctorjota on October 16, 2007
at 7:50 pm
FCB School is great.
Players like Arteta (Everton) or Nayim was there.
Nayim?? Do you remember??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Scvz8q2Mmi8
A big hug.
Good night folks.
By: Moisés on October 16, 2007
at 7:52 pm
Penelope, we never win anything? Are you sure? How many times did you participate in the champion league to win two? 30 times, I’m sure. Perhaps we can win ten after 30 attempts, better than your record. Does spending huge monies on players make you a big club? I hear you spent Eur30 million on a defender Pepe ( don’t know if the spelling is correct); isn’t that waste of money like when you wasted money on Overmars and Petit? I was shocked to know that your total earnings for 2005/2006 was EUR144 million, does that make you a big club? Arsenal earned more than you for that same period. So you see we can buy the type of players you buy except that Arsenal is better a managed and don’t waste money like you do.
You’ve always lack class and your leaders talking shit about other club’s players. You claim you thought Cesc everything at 15 years? Sure? What arrogance.
By: Howard on October 16, 2007
at 8:02 pm
Fair enough Doc, you make reasonable points also. I wasn’t aware of the Cesc thing, no offence but I seriously doubt that story given what the player himself has said, but hey ho!
The bottom line is this, we love Cesc at Arsenal and I plan on kidnapping him and forcing him to marry my sister. Clearly if FCB are going to get in the way I’m going to get pretty angry! A bit like all evil villains when their dastardly schemes are thwarted!
Regards
By: Stanley Kroenkie on October 16, 2007
at 8:04 pm
Hey, if it’s a family affair I stand out!
Anyway, why everytime two supporters from different teams argue in a blog the thing ens up with a competition to see who has the longest dick? Didn’t you notice? “we win more titles”, “we have the best players”… it’s a macho game, no doubt!
By: doctorjota on October 16, 2007
at 8:09 pm
I think there is a rule with the world of blog.
First someone says something contentious about someone else.
Then someone gets pissed and responds with all guns blazing.
The protagonists exchange a few blows and then kiss, make up and walk off into the sunset holding hands!
Its really very sweet, like infants in the playground…
By: Stanley Kroenkie on October 16, 2007
at 8:23 pm
I’m a Barça supporter. And an Arsenal supporter.
And I’m very happy having Iniesta, Xavi and Deco in Barça, the same way that I’m very happy having Cesc, Rosicky and Hleb in Arsenal.
All the other things said are press rumors, nothing else.
By: alex on October 16, 2007
at 8:30 pm
Howard. Was Real Madrid who spent 30 millions euro in Pepe. Please, don’t try us thah way.
I think that Milito, Abidal, Touré and Henry are very good new Barça players.
Not Pepe, please
By: alex on October 16, 2007
at 8:35 pm
you are right Moises about the shirts, I like that about Barca. Still unlike Spainish clubs if we go to the wall financially we are not baile out with tax payers money.
By: Tornot Gunner on October 16, 2007
at 8:36 pm
when I said “don’t try us that way” I meant “Don’t treat us that way” My english is a little rusty
By: alex on October 16, 2007
at 8:44 pm
I have to say that I am impressed that for the most part the dialogue between fans has been good, not childish… regardless of the Team tapping up exisit yes even with our beloved Arsenal… it is a reality that both countries have media which like to stir the pot… lets see what happens when we meet in the CL
By: Tornot Gunner on October 16, 2007
at 8:44 pm
Tornot, we, catalans, like dialogate a lot.
By: alex on October 16, 2007
at 8:45 pm
I prefer Barca to Madrid every time but both conduct their transfers by unsettling big stars from others clubs via the media that they control. and usually its a constant tapping up, all summer long and even through the season as well. its non stop. in the end the players in questions give in and leave. basically if a big club like Barca asks enough times then players will go there. they know that and thats why they do it. but no one from UEFA gives a damn. we just have to get on with it and fight fire with fire ie take our pick from the Barca youth academy.
Cesc has said he appreciates all the interest from Madrid so clearly he is thinking of going there. I think one day Real is where he will end up.
By: gazzap on October 16, 2007
at 8:48 pm
Gazzap is that really any different than some English clubs? Lets face it both clubs have great tradition, and let their footballing talent do the talking… I would rather watch Arsenal & Barca play football than any other teams. That being said Arsenal still have he better midfield, although I will only by a hair concede the forward line
By: Tornot Gunner on October 16, 2007
at 8:52 pm
well. it seems that at the end, we all think the same way
By: alex on October 16, 2007
at 8:53 pm
For the first theing You complain about our leaders talking other players, but you lack understanding how the press works. There are two papers almost devoted to barcelona, several tv and radio programmes, so you can imagine they just ask things all the time.
It is just a game of names, they ask about players who are the fling of the week and txiki answered like so many other answers he answered that night.
Doctorjota explains it quite well.
It is just a press issue.
However I can’t understand why you would get angry when you got him in exactly the same way.
By: yomama on October 16, 2007
at 8:56 pm
But Gazzap, don’t you think that many of these rumours are started by the press guys themselves, without the consent from the clubs? To sell more papers, I mean. And the clubs shut up to see what happens… Here in Spain this is so clear… You just have to visit Marca.com, for instance, and read the comments from the fans everytime this webpage announces that a big player is coming to Madrid. The majority of the comments plainly laugh at the guy who wrote the article!
Take this golden rule from a guy who has had to learn it the hard way: if the rumour spreads in october, like this one, credibility ZERO. If it starts in june, credibility 10%… sometimes september comes and credibility is below zero (Kaka to Madrid, anyone?)
By: doctorjota on October 16, 2007
at 9:00 pm
The level of the soccer newspapers here in Spain is soooo bad… man, they’re just pamphlets!
I’m sure anyone from Spain reading this comment will agree.
By: doctorjota on October 16, 2007
at 9:02 pm
What Doc says is true. If all the “notices” about Madrid signings that Marca said were true, tey would play with Cesc, Kaká, Iniesta, Xabi Alonso, Buffon, Cristiano Ronaldo, etc.
The sport “press” isn’t press. Except the match reviews, all the other things are rumours
By: alex on October 16, 2007
at 9:04 pm
I knew a guy (we were taking the same German course) who was an intern for Marca. I talked to him about it on a pub crawl and he said that it’s his or the other interns’ jobs to make up the transfer stories…
By: louisquatorze on October 16, 2007
at 9:43 pm
You bet that is true.
As the Doc said, Cesc’s transfer war ethically irregular within UEFA’s regularity. Under Spanish -not FA- regulations, a kid can move “elsewhere” should his dad “find a job” in another town.
The Arsenal scouts, who are sharp as your roster shows, took advantage of that in order to proceed to extorsion FCB.
In the end, they took him for peanuts.
And hey, good for them, for the Arsenal scouters, their did their job alright. That’s what you pay them for, fair play.
Not gonna cry about that but if you spread bullshit in your blog and you get caught, tough luck.
Nobody plays clean here, not you, not me, needless to say R-evil Madrid or ManU, hence let’s stick to the cold facts.
And you know Cesc is going nowhere, NOWHERE.
By: Capitan Forceps on October 16, 2007
at 9:57 pm
A question for you while your here then guys; does it not piss you off that your club has so many stories made up about it, and by papers that are supposedly loyal to Barca? After all it must unsettle your current players to consently read that someone else is coming in in you position?
And if so can it be stopped, or is it just the way it is?
By: Stanley Kroenkie on October 16, 2007
at 10:11 pm
There’s nothing we can do about it, and yes, sadly, it’s just the way it is. Here in Barcelona only:
-7 radio shows (that I know of) start at midnight til 2 A.M. talking about Barça and Madrid
-3 radio shows every evening from 7 p.m. to 9 p.m.
-2 tv shows from 8 p.m to 9 p.m.
-3 t.v. shows on Sunday evening
-2 soccer newspapers for each team + 3/4 newspapers that don’t sell much but try making noise
-2 radio stations dedicated to sports, but mainly soccer
-4 important websites + a bunch of blogs
…and this is just the begining. Can you imagine all these people talking without stop? The things they say?
Johan Cruyff baptized this as “el entorno”, literally the “environment”. He was referring to all the buzz that a club like Barça generates and that eventually plays against him. The term became so popular that even one of the TV shows took it as its name some years ago. Moreover, nowadays when you want to say that someone is intoxicating the club with false rumours you say that he belongs to the “entorno”.
According to Cruyff, all the members of this blog belong to it.
By: doctorjota on October 16, 2007
at 10:20 pm
Our little blog over here at ThirdGen had quite a rant going on about Barca.
Long may that rant continue.
By: jammathon on October 16, 2007
at 10:38 pm
Man, it’s exactly the same as English press. Never seen Sky Sport News? Never read the Sunday papers? In fact, I believe you get more unsubstantiated gossip than anyone else.
Anyway, although I think Cesc would actually fit in present Barça squad, taking Xavi’s place, I also believe, and I don’t mean to be disrespectful, he’s quite an overrated player. That would make it stupid to pay a fortune for him, specially considering he shows such a clear hallmark from Barça youth teams, i.e., he’s exactly the kind of player they don’t need to pay for.
I can’t understand why you English supporters tend to get so nervous with these things. The way you have insulted Barça is clearly out of place. I read a lot of crap about Arsenal going for Eto’o last summer and never heard those harsh words from Barça supporters against Arsenal.
Stop fighting the world, because nobody’s fighting back. Take it easy, fellows.
By: Oldsoulsong on October 16, 2007
at 10:57 pm
Oldsoulsong
Did you hear any Arsenal manager, coach or Chairman commenting about players? They have class of which FC Barcelona lacks.
They should come to Arsenal and be thought decency.
By: Howard on October 17, 2007
at 5:25 am
Well, I can recall Wenger crying about the ref dozens of times, which Rijkaard has never done. Oh, yeah, Frank has class, of which the guys at Arsenal lack.
Some clubs have aggressive, non-honorable executives, and other teams have crying sissy babies as general managers. Not enough reason for the fans to be arguing endlessly through the Internet, I reckon.
Besides, you must have very little knowledge about current Barcelona executives if you’re going to blame them for being aggressive when it comes to signing new players.
Stealing young prospects from other clubs’ youth teams instead of growing up your own, resulting in an English club with no English players, must be a pretty decent policy for you.
By the way, I’m not even a Barcelona supporter, in case you were wondering, but I just can’t understand this arrogance.
By: Oldsoulsong on October 17, 2007
at 7:47 am
Je je, jelou frends.
My name is botarate and I am a Real Madrid suporter, que cojones.
Bueno panda tarugos, por que no les ganateis a estos culés coño la Champiñones Luis,eh, preguntoangustiado?
Ahora no os quejéis panda guiris.
Viva Nayim!
PD: Conoceis a Jose Luis? Pues es Josep Lluis, fale? Gibraltar españó.
By: oscarini on October 17, 2007
at 9:26 am
Oldsoulsong
Wenger complains about referees and some times in the heat of the competition act like a sore loser, and I am also a sore loser. I believe a lot of Arsenal fans do not want him to change an iota. We like the passion.
In the case of Madrid and Barcelona , everthing is done ia a cold calculated way in their tapping of Viera, Anelka , Henry and etc. Even the players get into the act like Eto and Ronaldinho flapping that how wonderful it is to play with Henry. So the unsettling of players they target is systematically done. This is how they start the negotiation process. So they are laying down the groundwork for Cecs is it not?
IT can not compared to what Arsene does so your arguments has no merits.
So flap away plse go back to your own clubs blog
By: Malaysiangunner on October 17, 2007
at 9:47 am
Malaysian:
Be polite dude, we’ll stay as long as we want, accept our apologies if this bothers you.
Remember nobody leaves unless an agreement is reached with the managers, so cut your crap out.
By: Capitan Forceps on October 17, 2007
at 10:46 am
@ Malaysiangunner
You don’t need to be rude.
I think you are really a Chelsky supporter.
By: Moisés on October 17, 2007
at 11:29 am
I am not so sure Henry was not tapped up.
Last year Arsenal were aware at all times about Barcelona wanting to sign him, the whole deal was done, Arsenal allowed Barcelona to come to agreements with the player first. Otherwise they would have said something no doubt. This year it was Henry – informing Wenger first – that he wanted to leave. He himself phoned Txiki to ask if they could bring the deal back on – that said Arsenal were aware at all times about it.
Barcelona actually plays a fair game in transfers, they always inform the club, they are quite honest in that sense.
Which player have they tapped up? I think you are mixing how Madrid operates and how Barcelona operate.
Was Gallas not tapped up?
By: yomama on October 17, 2007
at 11:36 am
If I am deem to be rude it was not meant at those who have valid arguments and adds to the debate. But to compare Wenger to the tapping that is being done is down right disrespectful.
If you come up with valid arguments by all means but to throw innuendos at Arsene intergrity while he is far from perfect he does not resort to the tactics done by some Spanish Clubs who consider themselves giants.
If you call me a Chelski fan again I will really have issue with you
By: Malaysiangunner on October 17, 2007
at 12:46 pm
You gunners, your real problem is that you are every now and then wasting your time expecting to be the center of the universe (which we Barça are, btw), as loong as L’pool, Chelski and ManUtd focus on COMPETITION and don’t pay atention to what you die for (tapping players gently, overadmiring skilful footballers and repudiating the really necessary ones such as Gerrard, Y. Touré, Makélélé and so on)
Regards
By: Subcomm on October 17, 2007
at 1:25 pm
Malaysiangunner,
Yeah, when Ronaldinho and Eto’o claimed that it would be great to play alongside Henry they were playing a dirty nasty trick. What was this then? Was Cesc just showing politeness and Arsenal class?
You’re very kind asking me to go back to my own clubs’ blogs. Arsenal class once again, I guess. I’m a Porto supporter who normally writes his comments in a Barça blog and I have always been welcome. I’d rather cope with their tapping than your class.
By: Oldsoulsong on October 17, 2007
at 1:32 pm
Cesc will not go to Barca if and when he leaves it will be to Real Madrid. Probably after Wengers contract expires. Barcelona had the cheek that they would pay 16 million, thats fine for henry he was 30 and has 2 good years left. But if Cesc leaves it should be around 30 million.
By: solgooner on October 17, 2007
at 2:27 pm
@ Yogi’s warrior,
I’m bored about Cesc “cold chest” and I need a new post.
Big hug and Força Barça.
By: Moisés on October 17, 2007
at 8:21 pm